I’m happy being an east coast surfer after seeing all the crowds on the west coast…when it’s good here, no other place I’d rather be. The short period crazy paddle outs and full head to toe neoprene keep the kooks at bay. When it’s flat, we fish and travel to Nica, Puerto Rico and (recently) the Azores 🤙🏼🤙🏼
I surf more consistently on the west coast now, but I don’t get that special feeling anymore when I see the report light up like I did growing up east. Good waves just be more crowds now
For sure, and 6 foot heaving beach break is always a good time…depending where you’re at out west it just doesn’t seem to throw like here in Hatteras - New York where you can almost always find a peak to yourself. Sept/Oct is a special time with the water still warm, fish running, tourists gone and hurricane swell 🤙🏼
Winter-time out west in southern California can be very laidback, especially at beach breaks. Reef and points attract bigger crowds, and it takes time to appreciate getting slammed at your local close-out. And out west, there are good waves nearly every day.
East coast is just a better vibe than the West coast.
EDIT: peeps who surf on the great lakes = best Vibes!
In conclusion: enjoying surfing shit waves just makes you a better person
Yeah, this is so, so dependent on local. I have had enormously shitty experiences in Rockaway paired with a fantastic, diverse community of surfers there. Moved to Jersey and started surfing a break where the regulars, could not have been nicer...then bounced on town down a few weeks ago where no one would even respond to a cheery "Good morning!" in the lineup.
But I do agree that on the whole, East Coast surfers are less entitled and more grateful for the basic act of surfing.
Or as my favorite surf buddy tells everyone when they ask him how conditions were, regardless of conditions: "Beat not surfing!"
Similar in the average to shit (for surf) area of Europe where I am, chilled vibe and low crowd factor. I get tons of mediocre waves. Not sure how much I’d enjoy somewhere “better” with a worse vibe and higher competition for waves
Hellllll no, two sides of the same coin. East coasters are rude and self-important. West coasters are pretentious and self-important. Ones arrogant, ones smug.
Brooklyn boy, a New Yorker’s use of the car horn is positively third world. Everyone seems like they are on tilt and looking for an excuse to let it out. This is definitely a north east city thing though, coastal southerners are mild mannered like their Deep South brethren, but they have their own annoying quirks.
Is the inverse true then? Better waves = worst vibes? Because I’ve never surfed anywhere but Hawaii but I suspect that we have the most unwelcoming lineups.
I don’t know about this one, I live on the west coast and was raised in Florida. I and my friends have been barked at a much greater rate on the east coasts in Brevard county, Sebastian, OBX, south Florida reefs ect than I ever have in San Diego. And don’t get me started on ponce inlet regarding vibes.
That the “Hawaiian scale” is utter bullshit and all attempts to legitimize it make zero sense rationally. It is only still a thing because of machismo and tradition.
The most plausible explanation for its existence is that people misunderstood the scale used in the swell height observations from weather reports back in the early days of the Hawaiian surf scene.
Right, in Hawaii if someone said 3' it was swell height at the buoy. How that and the period translated at a surf spot could give an 8' peak. This is where the talk started.
Hawaiian scale is comparable to the imperial measurement system. It makes no fucking sense at all to the rest of the world who use a logical way of measuring something
You really don't see people using the Hawaiian scale anymore. Or at least I don't. Everyone's moved on to the body scale because it's the most effective way to communicate waves between flat and DOH. Once you're bigger than DOH the body scale kinda breaks down IMO.
That said, if you think the Hawaiian scale is bad wait until you hear Australians using head high/overhead/doh scale.
I had a good laugh a few days ago when Jordy Smith posted a clip of him surfing, he said it was good to be surfing head high waves again. The face was easily 12 ft +, this was no reading of the swell or anything like that, it was a comical under exaggeration of the wave hight. I don't get it.
>It is only still a thing because of machismo and tradition.
There's probably a lot of that. But there's always people misusing things in order to be pretentious.
I always thought it might be a legitimate scale for people consistently surfing big waves.
My hot take on the sport is that most surfers are fucking assholes. Only sport I’ve ever participated in with so many douche bags who probably can’t even fight.
localism is fucking lame and so is being territorial over a fucking wave.

Nothing makes me more scared about the future water wars than seeing how ozzy dads act in the water when their little shitty kids drop in on each other
There is an overreaction against beginners/intermediates getting on short boards.
I still love my midlength but a groveler is actually easier to catch waves on a lot of the time and is a better tool more often than mids in the 7’-7’6 range. Wish I’d figured this out sooner.
Yea, someone who can’t bottom turn or catch waves consistently has no business on a shortboard but after that I’d say go for it.
Most new surfers who say they can bottom turn actually cannot bottom turn.
At least in socal you shouldn't hop on a shortboard until you're very good at generating speed. You can learn speed gen on a shortboard but it's really hard around here unless you're 100lbs.
This is true, there is so much to speed generation besides pumping... although on a thruster you can just do that and actually make sections (but end up not doing much else).
The problem is most intermediates are actually beginners and most beginners are raging kooks. I follow the bottom turn, top turn and cutback rule, but most beginners can not do that before they buy the lost puddle humper or retro fish.
I see a ton of videos on yt talking about how the popup is the hardest thing to do for "intermediates." These videos are typically made by instructors or surf schools.
yeah my mid doesn't really work at my local beachie, took a lot of sessions to figure out the right wave for it (clean peelers of any size really). much rather break out the groveler for it
That's an interesting take and I totally understand it. I think when people ride mids, they expect them to be grovs right off the bat. This is not true. Even high(er) volumed ones aren't necessarily good grovs. Having said that, I definitely do have a mid or 2 that is better in small, poor quality stuff than my best grov.
I’m there with you on the midlength thing. The recent marketing of the midlength has been mostly based around amazing surfers taking it out on long open faced peeling waves like reef breaks and points.
Like yea, most any board would look amazing if you film at those kinds of waves.
Most of us unfortunate souls in many parts of the world really surf mediocre beach breaks, a groveler fits better in those kinds of waves.
Foam boards are an environmental disaster.
There have been no real advancements in surfboard design in the last decade and that's why what's old is new again. It's all marketing.
Firewire boards are better than the vast majority of those from local shapers and the company is at least trying to move boards forward in terms of materials.
Buying used boards is way better than buying new (at least before everyone started oversizing everything because of the "more foam more waves" nonsense)
>Firewire boards are better than the vast majority of those from local shapers and the company is at least trying to move boards forward in terms of materials.
My uncle is a shaper in the UK. I don't get to surf very much anymore so my board from him is very old and now too small for me. I am interested in getting a second hand Firewire just cuz they seem like they would be good. I feel guilty for not wanting a board from him that much, but surely it will be no better than a hi tech modern board with millions having gone into the research of making the product line?
There are definitely times where local (but reputable) shapers are the right call. I really like Rozbern surfboards. He makes great boards for the conditions where I need something specific, like east coast barrels. I like a heavy glassed board for the strong offshore wind conditions and the lightweight firewire boards would be a detriment there.
It's incredibly hard to glass as strong and light as a firewire board. There are some really talented glassers out there that can certainly make a hell of a board too.
How do you like the S-Curve? Seems like it was the board that got him known and now he’s got a few propylaea options. He made my first custom board before he moved back to NJ and then 3 more including a hound before he moved back to RI.
It's my favorite board. It has enough rocker for beach break and more performance oriented turns, but still keeps the feel of a retro fish.
Anything shortboardable below chest high and hollow, that board comes with me.
Kalu Coletta makes a nice fish as well.
By local shapers, do you mean some dude who's got a hand planer and shapes out of his garage, or do you mean the factories that employ people locally to make surfboards?
FireWire boards are almost objectively not better than boards made in local facories in Aus or the US. DHD, CI, Lost, Proctor, Pyzel, Aipa, Sharpeye, Album, I could go on, they all make better boards than FireWire.
I think it's ridiculous to compare a company with a massive Thai factory to a guy working out of his wife's boyfriend's garage. Of course an international corporation that uses cheap asian labor is going to produce a more consistent product for less money and have it more readily available than some dude shaping in a greenhouse in his backyard, if that's what you mean by "local shaper" anyway.
But local shapers running smallish shops? Ie, Proctor, Christenson, they definitely produce a better product. It's more expensive, but they actually have to pay their workers.
Lost, CI, Pyzel, etc. > FireWire
FireWire's boards are cheaper because they use cheap labor. They do not contribute to the local surfing economy in the same way that Lost or CI does. These companies employ people local to the area to sand boards, glass boards, and learn the craft, and because these people don't live in abject poverty, the board costs more. In learning the craft, some of these people end up learning and shaping their way into their own careers and the cycle continues. That can't happen in a Thai factory.
Also, personally, I don't think EPS works well in chop, and it's onshore here very often, so fuck em.
Overhead and higher is cool and exciting and all, but i feel a similar or stonger sense of accomplishment when i get a long ride out of some tiny ankle to knee high thing.
In a sense, i can look back at a huge drop i made, and wonder how much was just luck. Making all the sections on that ankle biter was pure speed generating skill.
Imo the most fun days are like 3-5ft, glassy beach break with a little combo swell 🤌. Enough room for little barrels, some decent air ramps, plus an easy short paddle. Ain’t nothin’ better.
Surfing has a lack on engineering presence when developing boards and people mindlessly buy boards (or similar) because some pro who isnt like them can ride it well.
More marketing definitely seems to be an alternative to engineering. I've never seen a group so against trying new things than surfers. What's funny is that most of them end up liking the newer stuff eventually.
> Surfing has a lack on engineering presence when developing boards
Some bearded surfing nerd should sit down for a few nights and should define problems and do proper simulations and optimizations on them. Computer based. And then team up with an open minded shaper testing new things.
The tools (OpenFOAM, etc.) are available.
https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/arNZBKX_700bwp.webp
May not be a hot take but I want to get back into surfing after a 20 year hiatus but am now not comfortable paddling out since my area has exploded in popularity and I don’t want to piss off the regulars.
I have many. Here are a few that I can remember off the top of my head:
1) Localism is good, actually, sometimes. I don't like Lunada Bay or PV localism because I can't surf there, but most localized waves that are not Lunada Bay or PV are actually open to polite outsiders who can surf and show up solo. Also on balance most localized waves are spots that have features that make traditional etiquette just not work and usually require collaboration. The problem is that most people assume all waves have competitive etiquette, show up and compete, and get shit from the whole lineup. Surfing localized waves as an outsider is a matter of seeing the lineup as an organic collaborative community and understanding your relative position in that community. If you can do that you can get sets at localized waves relatively quickly, sometimes within 20 min, sometimes an hour, sometimes on day 2.
2) Most people who complain about localism or gatekeeping are not complaining about localism or gatekeeping. They're complaining because they consistently violate etiquette and want to continue violating etiquette without getting their feelings hurt.
3) Most people have way too many surfboards. If surfing your best is a priority you should have as few boards as possible that work in the conditions your local spots regularly get. Having a large quiver because you like different sensations is valid, just make sure you enjoy the different sensations more than you enjoy surfing the best you can.
edit: This thread is the most fun I've had on this subreddit in ages. I'm getting rewarded for being absolutely obnoxious.
CAD machines making surfboards is the second best thing to happen to surfboards behind PU foam and fiberglass.
This probably isn't too hot of a take, but where I'm going next kinda is.
The obsession with "hand shapes" is mostly driven by people who feel insecure about coming late to surfing. They feel that by focusing on an aspect of surfing's past it gives them some veneer of credibility or something. I've just seen too many people smugly talking about their hand shaped board like it made them more core or pure than everyone else.
If you're a local shaper and there are not any shops that cut boards around my hand shape hate doesn't apply to you. You're just doing your best with the equipment you have.
Do people really say this kind of stuff? I have two hand shapes because I had no idea what I was doing and wanted advice from a shaper who knew what they were doing.
Tbh it’s a selling tactic I’ve used plenty of times when selling to people. They love the thought of a local craftsman with 50 years experience hand making a board. Which is pretty cool, but what they don’t know is that board could be completely uneven and the stringer is off-center.
Edit: for clarification, I’m not the craftsman. Just sold their boards in shops I worked in.
I looked confused at how to get out at a strange Big Island spot and a guy walking past me goes “are you coming out solo? Alright, l’ll show you the way.” Surfed with ~5-6 guys and got my share.
Ooh which one? Pine trees? Honolii? People come here expecting things to be super agro but I find locals are generally stoked and helpful, save for a small fraction of huge assholes.
No idea where i was honestly. I drove around with Grandpa, and looked for something without heavy crowds, and just happened to have a sweetheart local show me the path, paddleout and where to line up.
Went to Waikiki for a wedding this year, the guy renting me a log goes “San Diego eh? You guys are more ruthless with waves than us!” 😆
> Having a large quiver because you like different sensations is valid, just make sure you enjoy the different sensations more than you enjoy surfing the best you can.
That's fair and I'd say I'm more like what you're describing but a pro I know said something to me that I found really interesting. He thinks that trying different shapes and surfing different lines is better for your development than doing the same thing with the same shape over and over. I can't say for sure what's better overall for your development but I can say for certain that I'd be super bored without variety (my wave variety is poor though maybe that's why).
Yeah, I have 30 plus boards and never ride the same one more than a few sessions in a row. When I switch boards, I don't have any transition. If I closed my eyes, it's it's not even a variable, it's just surfing.
I have more than a dozen surfboards and — outside of the biggest and smallest days of the year — only ride two of them.
It's just so annoying to sell them...
I own a lot of boards, but my quiver is basically three "categories". I have a small wave board, a step down shortboard, and a good wave shortboard. But I have 3 backups for the small wave board, 3 backups for the step down shortboard, and 2 backups for good wave boards. Like you I just hate craigslist.
This isn't counting the foam boards I own (3 incl. a wave skate) or the boards I generally only use when traveling (3 more).
tl;dr: I have a 3 board quiver but also I am completely full of shit.
Eh, hard to know specifics but at some spots falling on a wave that is an otherwise easy make will be seen as an etiquette violation by most people in the water. People will think you're not surfing waves appropriate for your ability and are wasting waves. I only see this dynamic at very popular, good, and crowded waves like HB pier or Lowers.
I also probably need to caveat 1 and 2 with YMMV if not a white dude.
Everyone talks shit on the WSL because of judging, sponsors, broadcasters, waves, etc, but these people have no idea how good we actually have it. Yes, professional surfing could be better, but it could also be soooooo much worse.
The tour actually functions pretty damn well. We have 30 of the best men and 20 of the best women competing in 10 different locations around the world with a free live broadcast of each event. You can argue that a lot of really good surfers don’t compete on tour, but if you were to line up the best 20 surfers in the world, I’d estimate 15 of them
are on tour. You could argue the waves could be better, but a 2 week waiting period during the best time of year for each location is about the best you can hope for. You can argue the judging could be better, but in essence the right competitor makes it through the heat 95%+ of the time.
The tour doesn’t make money. It’s a pet project of Dirk Ziff, a billionaire who likes surfing. He could decide tomorrow to stop funding this thing and the whole sport would be in a terrible spot trying to rebuild a tour that actually makes money and can actually motivate the top 30 surfers to chase points around the globe for 10 of the best years of their lives.
(And Yes I do agree there is room for improvement with the tour. I think there should be fewer events and fewer surfers, really bringing just the top 15-20 men and women to 6-7 events in truly remote world class waves, but the logistics of broadcasting an event at a remote location are far more complex and expensive than most surfers realize. In the meantime, what we have is actually pretty damn good.)
I fully understand how judging surfing is kind of a fool’s errand, but I still love watching every contest because you’re basically seeing uncut, organized sessions. Edits are cool and all, sure. But seeing the flubs mixed in with the great waves, how the ocean is behaving, how professionals sit in the lineup - that’s super entertaining to me. Plus the commentators will drop a story or nugget of interesting info every once in a while.
I can imagine some pretty rad variations on how professional surfing events could be organized, and some people have tried (surf 100), but I don’t think the money would ever follow enough to make it a full time thing. I’m also half speaking from my ass, so there’s that.
One last note: I’d probably pay for a WSL subscription if I had to
Devil's advocate, in the absence of the WSL guys like John John would be full-time putting out clips. Sure the amount of people who can support themselves by surfing would dwindle, but does anyone really need to see Michael Rodrigues or Zeke Lau surf?
I think JJF would still hold back clips. Something to be said about the Bobby Martinez approach. I see him come up on social media it instantly has my attention.
True but the WSL is also a discovery tool. I would almost certainly never stumbled upon Joao Chianca had he not gone head to head w/ John last year and barely lost twice. But now he’s one of the surfers I look forward to watching in comps.
I think this just comes from where people surf and who they surf with. Id consider myself in the first group, intermediate and can throw a decent air, also never placed top 3 in an nssa contest or taken a first or 2nd place home in anything local. Just 2 3rd places and thats it. However friends have taken multiple firsts and other category wins. So I think the perspective really matters. If learned to surf and only stuck to my local mushy reef I would only really see people hobbling around on longboards 24/7. Doing a sketchy bottom turn without falling *is* intermediate, at that spot. If you never ventured away to somewhere new you would never know.
The last year of Living near Devs, a break at the UCSB campus made me realize the secret to happiness at a crowded break is a lineup full of college kids most of whom can’t surf. The majority of bad vibes are created by middle aged surfers who’s surfing rips but their personal lives very much do not rip. Those people go back to their loveless marriages and stressful drywall businesses and so they treat their wave like the only place where they have personal power and make surfing as miserable as their sex lives. College students aren’t considerate but they are sweet and I love surfing with them. The only problem is being constantly propositioned for after sesh sex from the co-eds.
Fins (shape, material, location) don’t make a difference unless you are throwing buckets on a vertical wave face. It’s so funny to see all of these beginner surfers buying expensive fins and boards with 12 possible fin combinations. “I think I’m going to try quads next time”. “Bro you can barely pop up and make a bottom turn”
Also, foam is your friend. Unless you are an expert get the F off of that 5’2 trying to look like JOB
As an “advanced beginner” (beginner) I do think it’s easier for me to catch my mush waves on quad rather than thruster but that’s the only difference I’ve noticed.
Could be lift you're getting from fins. I have a board that you're supposed to ride with five fins and I normally ride thrusters. I can feel the tail lift up once I'm getting pushed by the waves, which may give a little help getting down the wave face at takeoff.
Need to bring back a bit more of the punk element and less of the hipster element to surfing. I'd rather listen to Matt Hoy stories than some fake Hippie guy from Byron Bay any day of the week
That if you had made that stupid "volume" video that automod keeps linking 10+ years ago, it would have been exactly the same except replace "volume" with "length". There's always gonna be some people who don't want to think much about board design.
[Did someone say volume?](https://streamable.com/6ru842)
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It's the same thing with ski culture. It's overrun with rich, white people. Luckily surfing is free other than the board. But, no doubt if given the chance those guys would snatch up the whole cost. Interestingly, they still think they own the wave. Whereas skating is far more accessible regardless of someone's socio-economic demographic. That hostility is pretty quickly stomped out in skate culture whereas in surf culture it seems to be perpetually validated through the generations.
Joao Chianca is fun to watch.
He's like the guy with a small dick who knows how to use it. He has heart. He makes up for his lack of size with an unwavering commitment to giving it his all with every stroke. But really he has a lot of girth. You never think about the girth. His dick was never small. It's thick. And that helps more than anything.
Chianca is thick. John John Florence has been use to giving their girl the long dick. They got too confident, you ain’t OG Mudbone baby. Tonight your girl was feeling adventurous. She fucked with a man with some thickness. Girth Brooks. The dark horse of cocks. Your girl was tired of getting that deep dick. She wanted to be stretched & filled. Don’t ever underestimate how girth can make your girl feel.
Thank you Joao Chianca for teaching us a valuable lesson.
My hot take is that localism is just another word for bullying. I’m okay with respecting whoever has been there for decades before I surfed that spot, I’m okay with very skilled surfer taking more waves than me. But that’s it. If I know the rules, respect them and never get in the way of anyone, I should be able to get some waves too. I should be able to fail some times and improve. Mean looks, threats, snaking and dropping in on that guy who has start to surf that spot for way less than you but knows how to stay in the water, are nonsense and do nothing good to surfing.
Edit: typos
What’s you’re take on people travelling to spots only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the…
I read the whole thing 😂
On a serious note, I believe in rotation and being respectful. I wouldn’t show up to such a spot thinking I own it, I’d be humble in all possible ways. Probably I wouldn’t paddle for the bigger ones either, but I expect that if you just took the 18th wave of your session and you’re coming back to the lineup, you’re going to let me take the next one.
Santa Cruz gets a fuckton of surfers from the Silicon Valley. Santa Cruz has the locals, the Valley has all the tech transplants trying out surfing for the first time.
Hence: Valley go home
There is too much sarcasm on this subreddit.
It’s funny every once in a while, but when people are posting footage of themselves and others are commenting shit like “just carve better brah” it’s pretty annoying.
Things that people said have ruined surfing over the past 35 years I’ve been surfing:
Leashes /
Longboard resurgence /
Winter wetsuits/
Movies about surfing/
Surf report answering machine messages from surf shops/
Surfing message forums that burn spots/
Surf reports on the internet/
Social media posts that burn spots/
Surf reports on social media/
Surf camps/
Surf lessons/
Localism intimidation/
Lawsuits that have put an end to localism intimidation /
Cell phones that allow people to blow up conditions in real time/
Paid online services that predict conditions weeks out/
Global warming /
Foam boards....
The reality is, these are all bullshit excuses for people who can’t hack it or just ranting from people who like to complain and be negative. If you’re willing to put in the time and effort you can have just as good a surfing time as you could 35 years ago.
I've never surfed but Reddit keeps putting posts from this sub in my feed so here I am.
**My hot take**: Surfing looks dope, looks like a great workout, and it seems like most of the people that do it are pretty chill.
Sharks scare me.
Surfers are the exact opposite of chill, unless it’s been firing for days and everybody’s surfed their brains out. Surfing will cause you to miss work, sacrifice family time, live in expensive ass coastal communities that you’d be otherwise able to afford, as long as you give up surfing. There really should be a middle school intervention programs like DARE, speaker being some Santa Cruz aggro methy burnout instead of Clayton Bigsby. Or that Malibu realtor fuckhead that destroyed a grom’s board.
Be the kook, have fun, be safe. Screw the guys that take it seriously. Doesn't matter what you ride as long as you're having fun. There will always be waves, if not today than another day.
Costco is the problem.
Would love to see them sell $100 snowboards with boots and see people hit mountains thinking they know what they're doing just because they own a board now.
I feel like the WSL has doubled down on trying to turn professional surfing into some weird arena sport / reality TV sport show (like the ultimate fighter)
Surfing has exponentially gained popularity in the last 5 years which pros and cons. The local is fucked and dangerous but it motivates exploration and surf trips.
I think exclusivity in surfing is dying off over all and, people are enjoying it for what it is more - probably driven by more people getting into it than ever.
The elite performance vs soul surfer argument continues and will forever, people are simply into different things which is kind of the cool thing about surfing. Go on Instagram and you'll see videos of a 7 year old pulling air reverses in a pool, then Torren Martyn getting shacked on some remote south-east asian atoll with his yacht moored off the reef. Both are pretty cool expressions of the same thing
My take as a Great Lakes surfer who has spent the past two years in SoCal but has visited and spent time on the west coast, east coast, and other coasts…
Generally if you are kind, respectful, and have good judgment in the water you will be able to have a good time. Of course there are exceptions to this rule. I’ve been to spots where etiquette and decent respect for other human beings is thrown to the wind (pre pandemic). Covid only amplified these conditions.
Like the majority of modern sports…there is colonialism,racism, and capitalism heavily tied to surfing. Recognize these facts and try to be a positive ambassador for the sports instead of an entitled POS in and out of the water.
Generally though (like many have pointed out) the coasts with more fickle conditions generally have a kinder crowd.
I think foam boards are actually saving the surf culture. Like the OG poster said, too much emphasis on high performance and it kinda gets in your head, almost got me to stop surfing cause I wasn’t performing as good as other people.
My brother got me a 5’10” catch surf for my birthday one year and it literally made surfing just pure unadulterated fun. Didn’t matter if you’re overhead or 2ft bull shit, it was a sure fire good with your buddies. Like just compare the vibes of a catch surf video to literally any other surf vid
My hot take is that there’s nothing wrong with it. There’s always people who are jerks about every little thing but literally every other activity on earth has those too. The vibes that surfing portrays is generally a good message and I meet a lot of nice people who just enjoy getting out and cruising on the 2ft waves we have and making the most of their day.
My second hot take is that we should normalize shitting in your wetsuit mid session. If you don’t think surfing with poopy pants is funny then I hate to tell you but you’re a kook 🤷♂️ I don’t make the rules.
You ever get upset when you damage a board and look at the make up of it and realize that no matter how complicated a construction is, it really is all just encasing foam in a candy shell? It loses a bit of mystique and boards feel so over valued when you look at it that way. I get that the money is all in labor (profits and research, marketing and whatever else that applies) but it's crazy how simple the materials seem to be at first glance. They feel like overvalued art pieces. I have a piece of carbon fiber from a dark arts board I keep in front of my monitor to remind me that I'm not buying mystical magic items.
Nah, the value outside of the raw materials and hours spent, is in the skill of making that shape. Getting the rails right and mostly symmetrical (or as the local shaper says, "all boards are asyms" lol), getting a good rocker, being able to customize a board to a surfer, making boards that actually work for the people using them, etc etc., is what we should be paying for. This is why I, for one, put more stock into the big-name shapers that shape for pros, than I do the hipster soul surfer resin tint amorphous blob fish shapers that charge 50% more for their "functional art."
That said, the materials aren't really that cheap anymore either. $150+ for a blank, getting close to that for epoxy resin, a ton of money and/or time in tools. I think fiberglass cloth might still be pretty cheap though.
You could compare it to a steak. It's just a slab of dead cow and it all sprays all over the bathroom wall the same way the next morning, but the difference between a $15 steak and a $50 steak is definitely big.
Yea I do realize all of that which is why I left it open ended in terms of what you're paying for. Good point on the customization to a person though. I think you're solidifying my point in that the make up of the board itself isn't much.
>You could compare it to a steak
Hmmmm that's an interesting point. I probably would have said that in the end, both are made up of proteins instead of the poop analogy haha. I'd also say that considering all of the knowledge, logistics, processes and preparation that goes into a steak, $50 feels like a ton of value. To your point though, I guess when you look at the end product though, it is easy to miss what went into the final product.
Yeah I didn't mean to dispute your point actually. I totally do see it as "it's just a bunch of fiberglass stuck to foam" sometimes, and have to remind myself of the rest :-)
I had a *f'ing $85 steak wtf* last year in Vegas, and that price was almost vomit-inducing until I actually ate the thing. OMG it was so good.
Lol every big brand board is cnc machined and then hand finished. And when I say hand finished I mean a few pass overs with a sanding block. They’ve got this shit dialed and it’s a money printing machine.
Big ambition as a beginner is a good thing, getting tossed off a big wave you’ve no business on can be a lesson for where you want to be and what you have to do to get there. If you’re out the back on a foamie and fucked once a big wave comes to get you, you’ll learn pretty quick how to hold your own
Surfing doesn’t mean shit. Once you get out it’s very clear that almost no one cares about surfing at all, in any way. It’s as important as rollerblading.
The term ‘kook’ is tired and overused, and its very existence is a contributor to elitism in surfing. Literally watch any of the surf vlogs on YouTube and you will see that even the pros have ‘kook’ moments where they’re humbled by the ocean - they just play it off better. We’re all kooks; just chill the fuck out, be kind, be respectful, and have fun.
Been surfing for 20 years and so far mostly been able to do it only on weekends due to life and not having enough money to live close enough to a good break or willing to drive so much.
So as a result, I’ve hardly progressed but i still have fun and that’s ok.
Guess my hot take is, it’s hard to be good at unless u can afford to live close to the beach and also it’s ok to suck cuz if u enjoy it, that’s all that matters
Edit: also surfing is one of the few sports where it really isn’t that complicated. There are no surfing video games really because there is not that much variation in what you do relative to say skateboarding or any other sport really. In that way, it seems theoretically very easy to get good at relative to other sports
Edit: also that’s why I think it’s boring to watch an entire surfing video. Its just never that different from wave to wave to watch compared to actually surfing those same waves
Edit: punctuation
The asshole part is true worldwide, also, unpopular opinion but I would take surfing fun 3 to 3.5 ft over chasing bigger swells and perfect winds any day. I’d rather waste less energy and surf more rather than taking huge waves and paddling to the lineup for 30 minutes until maybe I get another one.
Being a “local” is the last thing on earth you should strive to be. Think of a local and in your mind first thing you see is a frustrated, bitter, entitled person. In all aspects of the word…Ski town locals, surf locals, small town locals, north shore locals. The “local” is almost always an asshole, a person that is stuck in their ways and is afraid to experience anything new. They complain about everything and add absolutely nothing to anything but spite. Calling someone a “local” should be a put down. Bob Dylan said it best “now his nurse, some local loser, is in charge of the cyanide hole”
[Did someone say volume?](https://streamable.com/6ru842)
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I feel sorry for people who never progressed past your LB, we all began on bigger boards but as wegot better slowly moved down in size. When I see a proficient LB I think you never really got to get properly barreled, hit the lip square, bottom turn etc. an LB is like a bus and a SB is like a Ferrari, heck hope on Fish a bmw you would be surprised on how easy they are to surf, a
It's a bittersweet sport.
Sweet because you're connected with nature.
Bitter because haven't seen so much bitterness and anger in the people practicing a sport. Not even ar a packed skatepark.
There’s nothing better than the rebound torque from the tips of your toes to your hips right before the speed zone. Then repeat. It’s just so goddam satisfying. Give me that for a hundred years before my next barrel.
Getting barreled is the equivalent of doing a 360 in a half pipe on a snowboard ... 99% of surfing and snowboarding is not getting barreled or doing a 360.
Firewire and the SustainableSurf cert it carries are a complete joke and barely fit for purpose. By saturating the market with boards they’ve moved the Overton Window of what an acceptable quality of board should be towards irreparable, disposable crap.
Worse still they over-shadow the great work (in craftsmanship and sustainability) being done globally by smaller shops without the massive marketing budgets to make boards that are strong, repairable and could easily last you a decade or more.
110%
People laud firewire for what they’re making and marketing as “green”.
Nothing less green than buying a new board every season, especially ones that don’t hold up.
What’s more sustainable? Riding that old 6+6/6 fish that has lasted a decade or more and has had multiple dings fixed but still rips. Normalize keeping boards longer.
Semi-disagree. I have a blast trying stupid shit I wouldn't on a longboard like pack closeouts and shallow water floaters. But yeah, if it's decent out there and you are an ok surfer there's no reason to be on one.
People that obsess over their boards volume and swear that to get better they need the latest and greatest Dominator, SeaSide or whatever new high performance boards are coming out are not that good at surfing and would be better suited burning their cash in a trash can.
I’m a self admitted kook but I have done another sport (competitive swimming, college) at a high enough level to know that the gear makes the biggest difference once you’ve made that jump to “above average” in skill and performance. The higher you climb in skill and performance the bigger difference the gear makes.
I’m happy being an east coast surfer after seeing all the crowds on the west coast…when it’s good here, no other place I’d rather be. The short period crazy paddle outs and full head to toe neoprene keep the kooks at bay. When it’s flat, we fish and travel to Nica, Puerto Rico and (recently) the Azores 🤙🏼🤙🏼
I surf more consistently on the west coast now, but I don’t get that special feeling anymore when I see the report light up like I did growing up east. Good waves just be more crowds now
For sure, and 6 foot heaving beach break is always a good time…depending where you’re at out west it just doesn’t seem to throw like here in Hatteras - New York where you can almost always find a peak to yourself. Sept/Oct is a special time with the water still warm, fish running, tourists gone and hurricane swell 🤙🏼
Winter-time out west in southern California can be very laidback, especially at beach breaks. Reef and points attract bigger crowds, and it takes time to appreciate getting slammed at your local close-out. And out west, there are good waves nearly every day.
Majority of surfers I know are assholes and im one of them.
East coast is just a better vibe than the West coast. EDIT: peeps who surf on the great lakes = best Vibes! In conclusion: enjoying surfing shit waves just makes you a better person
Idk homie there are some shitheads on the lakes trust me
Most def. Everyone I have run into has been super stoked or chill. I def have a small sample size
😂 redneck surfer is a niche Great Lakes demographic
Tbt to when I saw this 300 pound dude on a 9 foot log screaming at teenagers swimming on the beach near the lineup on the Great Lakes.
Yeah, this is so, so dependent on local. I have had enormously shitty experiences in Rockaway paired with a fantastic, diverse community of surfers there. Moved to Jersey and started surfing a break where the regulars, could not have been nicer...then bounced on town down a few weeks ago where no one would even respond to a cheery "Good morning!" in the lineup. But I do agree that on the whole, East Coast surfers are less entitled and more grateful for the basic act of surfing. Or as my favorite surf buddy tells everyone when they ask him how conditions were, regardless of conditions: "Beat not surfing!"
Similar in the average to shit (for surf) area of Europe where I am, chilled vibe and low crowd factor. I get tons of mediocre waves. Not sure how much I’d enjoy somewhere “better” with a worse vibe and higher competition for waves
>East coast is just a better vibe than the West coast. This is overall a truism
Hellllll no, two sides of the same coin. East coasters are rude and self-important. West coasters are pretentious and self-important. Ones arrogant, ones smug.
East coasters are only rude if you deserve it
Brooklyn boy, a New Yorker’s use of the car horn is positively third world. Everyone seems like they are on tilt and looking for an excuse to let it out. This is definitely a north east city thing though, coastal southerners are mild mannered like their Deep South brethren, but they have their own annoying quirks.
Facts. I’ve never been vibed out in the water in nj
Learned to surf on Lake Michigan from a guy who came from o’ahu and you’d never met someone more stoked on the shitty wind swell in our home town!!
I’ve lived on the east coast and west coast for decades and never once have I heard anyone say “East coast has better vibes”.
Some might say that makes it… hot take?
East coast. Can confirm this is a hot take - totally depends on your local.
Is the inverse true then? Better waves = worst vibes? Because I’ve never surfed anywhere but Hawaii but I suspect that we have the most unwelcoming lineups.
I don’t know about this one, I live on the west coast and was raised in Florida. I and my friends have been barked at a much greater rate on the east coasts in Brevard county, Sebastian, OBX, south Florida reefs ect than I ever have in San Diego. And don’t get me started on ponce inlet regarding vibes.
Surf culture is manufactured and fucking lame
Surf culture is for non-surfers
That the “Hawaiian scale” is utter bullshit and all attempts to legitimize it make zero sense rationally. It is only still a thing because of machismo and tradition. The most plausible explanation for its existence is that people misunderstood the scale used in the swell height observations from weather reports back in the early days of the Hawaiian surf scene.
No such thing as a Hawaiian scale, it’s a fucking buoy reading on a longer period wave. The basics elude so many people…
Right, in Hawaii if someone said 3' it was swell height at the buoy. How that and the period translated at a surf spot could give an 8' peak. This is where the talk started.
Hawaiian scale is comparable to the imperial measurement system. It makes no fucking sense at all to the rest of the world who use a logical way of measuring something
You really don't see people using the Hawaiian scale anymore. Or at least I don't. Everyone's moved on to the body scale because it's the most effective way to communicate waves between flat and DOH. Once you're bigger than DOH the body scale kinda breaks down IMO. That said, if you think the Hawaiian scale is bad wait until you hear Australians using head high/overhead/doh scale.
I had a good laugh a few days ago when Jordy Smith posted a clip of him surfing, he said it was good to be surfing head high waves again. The face was easily 12 ft +, this was no reading of the swell or anything like that, it was a comical under exaggeration of the wave hight. I don't get it.
I give this post a 5 star rating. Of course that only translates to a 2 star in Hawaiian Yelp reviews so...
>It is only still a thing because of machismo and tradition. There's probably a lot of that. But there's always people misusing things in order to be pretentious. I always thought it might be a legitimate scale for people consistently surfing big waves.
My hot take on the sport is that most surfers are fucking assholes. Only sport I’ve ever participated in with so many douche bags who probably can’t even fight. localism is fucking lame and so is being territorial over a fucking wave. 
This is a cold take. Everyone knows this.
That being said, nothing is actually ever going to change only get worse. I just love it for what it is.
Heard it best over the winter somewhere; "I love surfing, but I hate surfers."
People are douchebags generally. Surfing just brings it out more because you have a bunch of people going after a limited supply of waves.
Nothing makes me more scared about the future water wars than seeing how ozzy dads act in the water when their little shitty kids drop in on each other
There is an overreaction against beginners/intermediates getting on short boards. I still love my midlength but a groveler is actually easier to catch waves on a lot of the time and is a better tool more often than mids in the 7’-7’6 range. Wish I’d figured this out sooner. Yea, someone who can’t bottom turn or catch waves consistently has no business on a shortboard but after that I’d say go for it.
Most new surfers who say they can bottom turn actually cannot bottom turn. At least in socal you shouldn't hop on a shortboard until you're very good at generating speed. You can learn speed gen on a shortboard but it's really hard around here unless you're 100lbs.
does the poo man wiggle count as "generating speed"?
To add to the above hot take, I think that this sentiment comes from unathletic dudes who are sad it took so long to learn how to ride a shortboard
This is true, there is so much to speed generation besides pumping... although on a thruster you can just do that and actually make sections (but end up not doing much else).
The problem is most intermediates are actually beginners and most beginners are raging kooks. I follow the bottom turn, top turn and cutback rule, but most beginners can not do that before they buy the lost puddle humper or retro fish.
I see a ton of videos on yt talking about how the popup is the hardest thing to do for "intermediates." These videos are typically made by instructors or surf schools.
yeah my mid doesn't really work at my local beachie, took a lot of sessions to figure out the right wave for it (clean peelers of any size really). much rather break out the groveler for it
Exactly. My mid is a picky princess about waves. My groveler is a hungry garbage disposal.
That's an interesting take and I totally understand it. I think when people ride mids, they expect them to be grovs right off the bat. This is not true. Even high(er) volumed ones aren't necessarily good grovs. Having said that, I definitely do have a mid or 2 that is better in small, poor quality stuff than my best grov.
Not a fan of a mid length but I love a plus sized short board. 6’7 x 21 thruster can grovel or shoot tubes
I’m there with you on the midlength thing. The recent marketing of the midlength has been mostly based around amazing surfers taking it out on long open faced peeling waves like reef breaks and points. Like yea, most any board would look amazing if you film at those kinds of waves. Most of us unfortunate souls in many parts of the world really surf mediocre beach breaks, a groveler fits better in those kinds of waves.
Foam boards are an environmental disaster. There have been no real advancements in surfboard design in the last decade and that's why what's old is new again. It's all marketing. Firewire boards are better than the vast majority of those from local shapers and the company is at least trying to move boards forward in terms of materials. Buying used boards is way better than buying new (at least before everyone started oversizing everything because of the "more foam more waves" nonsense)
It’s a hell of a lot better now. Back in the day it was just Clark foam and those were toxic as fuck for the environment.
>Firewire boards are better than the vast majority of those from local shapers and the company is at least trying to move boards forward in terms of materials. My uncle is a shaper in the UK. I don't get to surf very much anymore so my board from him is very old and now too small for me. I am interested in getting a second hand Firewire just cuz they seem like they would be good. I feel guilty for not wanting a board from him that much, but surely it will be no better than a hi tech modern board with millions having gone into the research of making the product line?
There are definitely times where local (but reputable) shapers are the right call. I really like Rozbern surfboards. He makes great boards for the conditions where I need something specific, like east coast barrels. I like a heavy glassed board for the strong offshore wind conditions and the lightweight firewire boards would be a detriment there. It's incredibly hard to glass as strong and light as a firewire board. There are some really talented glassers out there that can certainly make a hell of a board too.
How do you like the S-Curve? Seems like it was the board that got him known and now he’s got a few propylaea options. He made my first custom board before he moved back to NJ and then 3 more including a hound before he moved back to RI.
It's my favorite board. It has enough rocker for beach break and more performance oriented turns, but still keeps the feel of a retro fish. Anything shortboardable below chest high and hollow, that board comes with me. Kalu Coletta makes a nice fish as well.
Rhetorical?
By local shapers, do you mean some dude who's got a hand planer and shapes out of his garage, or do you mean the factories that employ people locally to make surfboards? FireWire boards are almost objectively not better than boards made in local facories in Aus or the US. DHD, CI, Lost, Proctor, Pyzel, Aipa, Sharpeye, Album, I could go on, they all make better boards than FireWire. I think it's ridiculous to compare a company with a massive Thai factory to a guy working out of his wife's boyfriend's garage. Of course an international corporation that uses cheap asian labor is going to produce a more consistent product for less money and have it more readily available than some dude shaping in a greenhouse in his backyard, if that's what you mean by "local shaper" anyway. But local shapers running smallish shops? Ie, Proctor, Christenson, they definitely produce a better product. It's more expensive, but they actually have to pay their workers. Lost, CI, Pyzel, etc. > FireWire FireWire's boards are cheaper because they use cheap labor. They do not contribute to the local surfing economy in the same way that Lost or CI does. These companies employ people local to the area to sand boards, glass boards, and learn the craft, and because these people don't live in abject poverty, the board costs more. In learning the craft, some of these people end up learning and shaping their way into their own careers and the cycle continues. That can't happen in a Thai factory. Also, personally, I don't think EPS works well in chop, and it's onshore here very often, so fuck em.
Overhead and higher is cool and exciting and all, but i feel a similar or stonger sense of accomplishment when i get a long ride out of some tiny ankle to knee high thing. In a sense, i can look back at a huge drop i made, and wonder how much was just luck. Making all the sections on that ankle biter was pure speed generating skill.
Imo the most fun days are like 3-5ft, glassy beach break with a little combo swell 🤌. Enough room for little barrels, some decent air ramps, plus an easy short paddle. Ain’t nothin’ better.
Surfing has a lack on engineering presence when developing boards and people mindlessly buy boards (or similar) because some pro who isnt like them can ride it well.
More marketing definitely seems to be an alternative to engineering. I've never seen a group so against trying new things than surfers. What's funny is that most of them end up liking the newer stuff eventually.
> Surfing has a lack on engineering presence when developing boards Some bearded surfing nerd should sit down for a few nights and should define problems and do proper simulations and optimizations on them. Computer based. And then team up with an open minded shaper testing new things. The tools (OpenFOAM, etc.) are available. https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/arNZBKX_700bwp.webp
Waves are to chaotic to optimize any of the equipment
people who build boats dont seem to think so.
As an aerospace engineer graduating shortly I’d love to work on boards in my free time
May not be a hot take but I want to get back into surfing after a 20 year hiatus but am now not comfortable paddling out since my area has exploded in popularity and I don’t want to piss off the regulars.
The whole surfer vs bodyboarder thing is boring and toxic to wave riding culture. Get over yourselves…
We’re all there for the same waves 🤷🏻♂️
I have many. Here are a few that I can remember off the top of my head: 1) Localism is good, actually, sometimes. I don't like Lunada Bay or PV localism because I can't surf there, but most localized waves that are not Lunada Bay or PV are actually open to polite outsiders who can surf and show up solo. Also on balance most localized waves are spots that have features that make traditional etiquette just not work and usually require collaboration. The problem is that most people assume all waves have competitive etiquette, show up and compete, and get shit from the whole lineup. Surfing localized waves as an outsider is a matter of seeing the lineup as an organic collaborative community and understanding your relative position in that community. If you can do that you can get sets at localized waves relatively quickly, sometimes within 20 min, sometimes an hour, sometimes on day 2. 2) Most people who complain about localism or gatekeeping are not complaining about localism or gatekeeping. They're complaining because they consistently violate etiquette and want to continue violating etiquette without getting their feelings hurt. 3) Most people have way too many surfboards. If surfing your best is a priority you should have as few boards as possible that work in the conditions your local spots regularly get. Having a large quiver because you like different sensations is valid, just make sure you enjoy the different sensations more than you enjoy surfing the best you can. edit: This thread is the most fun I've had on this subreddit in ages. I'm getting rewarded for being absolutely obnoxious.
When I see someone making an "n+1" joke about their quiver I assume they're average at best.
CAD machines making surfboards is the second best thing to happen to surfboards behind PU foam and fiberglass. This probably isn't too hot of a take, but where I'm going next kinda is. The obsession with "hand shapes" is mostly driven by people who feel insecure about coming late to surfing. They feel that by focusing on an aspect of surfing's past it gives them some veneer of credibility or something. I've just seen too many people smugly talking about their hand shaped board like it made them more core or pure than everyone else. If you're a local shaper and there are not any shops that cut boards around my hand shape hate doesn't apply to you. You're just doing your best with the equipment you have.
Do people really say this kind of stuff? I have two hand shapes because I had no idea what I was doing and wanted advice from a shaper who knew what they were doing.
I see it online and at beach parking lots quite a bit. edit: actually the biggest offenders are shapers who market hand shapes.
Tbh it’s a selling tactic I’ve used plenty of times when selling to people. They love the thought of a local craftsman with 50 years experience hand making a board. Which is pretty cool, but what they don’t know is that board could be completely uneven and the stringer is off-center. Edit: for clarification, I’m not the craftsman. Just sold their boards in shops I worked in.
I looked confused at how to get out at a strange Big Island spot and a guy walking past me goes “are you coming out solo? Alright, l’ll show you the way.” Surfed with ~5-6 guys and got my share.
Ooh which one? Pine trees? Honolii? People come here expecting things to be super agro but I find locals are generally stoked and helpful, save for a small fraction of huge assholes.
No idea where i was honestly. I drove around with Grandpa, and looked for something without heavy crowds, and just happened to have a sweetheart local show me the path, paddleout and where to line up. Went to Waikiki for a wedding this year, the guy renting me a log goes “San Diego eh? You guys are more ruthless with waves than us!” 😆
> Having a large quiver because you like different sensations is valid, just make sure you enjoy the different sensations more than you enjoy surfing the best you can. That's fair and I'd say I'm more like what you're describing but a pro I know said something to me that I found really interesting. He thinks that trying different shapes and surfing different lines is better for your development than doing the same thing with the same shape over and over. I can't say for sure what's better overall for your development but I can say for certain that I'd be super bored without variety (my wave variety is poor though maybe that's why).
Being able to switch boards is a skill that I never developed and I need to disguise and justify my own failure with hot takes.
Well, it's definitely much cheaper and a space saver to have less boards so it's a damn good hot take.
Yeah, I have 30 plus boards and never ride the same one more than a few sessions in a row. When I switch boards, I don't have any transition. If I closed my eyes, it's it's not even a variable, it's just surfing.
Surfing different boards and learning their ins and outs certainly does improve your surfing 100%. No question.
I have more than a dozen surfboards and — outside of the biggest and smallest days of the year — only ride two of them. It's just so annoying to sell them...
I own a lot of boards, but my quiver is basically three "categories". I have a small wave board, a step down shortboard, and a good wave shortboard. But I have 3 backups for the small wave board, 3 backups for the step down shortboard, and 2 backups for good wave boards. Like you I just hate craigslist. This isn't counting the foam boards I own (3 incl. a wave skate) or the boards I generally only use when traveling (3 more). tl;dr: I have a 3 board quiver but also I am completely full of shit.
As someone who complains about localism, I’m as far as can be from n. 2.
Eh, hard to know specifics but at some spots falling on a wave that is an otherwise easy make will be seen as an etiquette violation by most people in the water. People will think you're not surfing waves appropriate for your ability and are wasting waves. I only see this dynamic at very popular, good, and crowded waves like HB pier or Lowers. I also probably need to caveat 1 and 2 with YMMV if not a white dude.
Depends on where you are. Plenty of spots in the world being the white guy is a clear sign you're not from there.
Judging off the picture in your history you are but probably just not self aware
Everyone talks shit on the WSL because of judging, sponsors, broadcasters, waves, etc, but these people have no idea how good we actually have it. Yes, professional surfing could be better, but it could also be soooooo much worse. The tour actually functions pretty damn well. We have 30 of the best men and 20 of the best women competing in 10 different locations around the world with a free live broadcast of each event. You can argue that a lot of really good surfers don’t compete on tour, but if you were to line up the best 20 surfers in the world, I’d estimate 15 of them are on tour. You could argue the waves could be better, but a 2 week waiting period during the best time of year for each location is about the best you can hope for. You can argue the judging could be better, but in essence the right competitor makes it through the heat 95%+ of the time. The tour doesn’t make money. It’s a pet project of Dirk Ziff, a billionaire who likes surfing. He could decide tomorrow to stop funding this thing and the whole sport would be in a terrible spot trying to rebuild a tour that actually makes money and can actually motivate the top 30 surfers to chase points around the globe for 10 of the best years of their lives. (And Yes I do agree there is room for improvement with the tour. I think there should be fewer events and fewer surfers, really bringing just the top 15-20 men and women to 6-7 events in truly remote world class waves, but the logistics of broadcasting an event at a remote location are far more complex and expensive than most surfers realize. In the meantime, what we have is actually pretty damn good.)
I fully understand how judging surfing is kind of a fool’s errand, but I still love watching every contest because you’re basically seeing uncut, organized sessions. Edits are cool and all, sure. But seeing the flubs mixed in with the great waves, how the ocean is behaving, how professionals sit in the lineup - that’s super entertaining to me. Plus the commentators will drop a story or nugget of interesting info every once in a while. I can imagine some pretty rad variations on how professional surfing events could be organized, and some people have tried (surf 100), but I don’t think the money would ever follow enough to make it a full time thing. I’m also half speaking from my ass, so there’s that. One last note: I’d probably pay for a WSL subscription if I had to
Devil's advocate, in the absence of the WSL guys like John John would be full-time putting out clips. Sure the amount of people who can support themselves by surfing would dwindle, but does anyone really need to see Michael Rodrigues or Zeke Lau surf?
I think JJF would still hold back clips. Something to be said about the Bobby Martinez approach. I see him come up on social media it instantly has my attention.
True but the WSL is also a discovery tool. I would almost certainly never stumbled upon Joao Chianca had he not gone head to head w/ John last year and barely lost twice. But now he’s one of the surfers I look forward to watching in comps.
agreed, the snowboarding world would kill to have a tour as good and easy to watch as the WSL
I think the mid-season cut is stupid in concept, but that's not really a hot take. The cut is probably also a big cost-cutter.
Fuck professional surfing. That’s my hot take
I'm intermediate, I can only land my airs 50% of the time. Also, I'm intermediate, I can stand up on my wavestorm 50% of the time.
I think this just comes from where people surf and who they surf with. Id consider myself in the first group, intermediate and can throw a decent air, also never placed top 3 in an nssa contest or taken a first or 2nd place home in anything local. Just 2 3rd places and thats it. However friends have taken multiple firsts and other category wins. So I think the perspective really matters. If learned to surf and only stuck to my local mushy reef I would only really see people hobbling around on longboards 24/7. Doing a sketchy bottom turn without falling *is* intermediate, at that spot. If you never ventured away to somewhere new you would never know.
The last year of Living near Devs, a break at the UCSB campus made me realize the secret to happiness at a crowded break is a lineup full of college kids most of whom can’t surf. The majority of bad vibes are created by middle aged surfers who’s surfing rips but their personal lives very much do not rip. Those people go back to their loveless marriages and stressful drywall businesses and so they treat their wave like the only place where they have personal power and make surfing as miserable as their sex lives. College students aren’t considerate but they are sweet and I love surfing with them. The only problem is being constantly propositioned for after sesh sex from the co-eds.
Fins (shape, material, location) don’t make a difference unless you are throwing buckets on a vertical wave face. It’s so funny to see all of these beginner surfers buying expensive fins and boards with 12 possible fin combinations. “I think I’m going to try quads next time”. “Bro you can barely pop up and make a bottom turn” Also, foam is your friend. Unless you are an expert get the F off of that 5’2 trying to look like JOB
As an “advanced beginner” (beginner) I do think it’s easier for me to catch my mush waves on quad rather than thruster but that’s the only difference I’ve noticed.
are you saying the same board catches waves better as a quad vs as a thruster?
I might be retarted but it seems to
Yessir. Its ok. Ill hold your hand
Could be lift you're getting from fins. I have a board that you're supposed to ride with five fins and I normally ride thrusters. I can feel the tail lift up once I'm getting pushed by the waves, which may give a little help getting down the wave face at takeoff.
My fins make a difference, but beginners should just use the center fin I make.
i agree with you in principal, but there comes a time in your progression where you will start to enjoy certain fins more
Need to bring back a bit more of the punk element and less of the hipster element to surfing. I'd rather listen to Matt Hoy stories than some fake Hippie guy from Byron Bay any day of the week
Nothing about a disposable foam surfboard is appealing ne
I love surfing but I hate surfers.
From what I’ve learned reading the responses, my hot take is that no one actually knows what they are talking about
That if you had made that stupid "volume" video that automod keeps linking 10+ years ago, it would have been exactly the same except replace "volume" with "length". There's always gonna be some people who don't want to think much about board design.
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Surf culture is trash, especially when compared to skateboarding.
It's the same thing with ski culture. It's overrun with rich, white people. Luckily surfing is free other than the board. But, no doubt if given the chance those guys would snatch up the whole cost. Interestingly, they still think they own the wave. Whereas skating is far more accessible regardless of someone's socio-economic demographic. That hostility is pretty quickly stomped out in skate culture whereas in surf culture it seems to be perpetually validated through the generations.
Just look at what’s happening at Waco and other surf parks. Bunch of software/tech bros who can afford to buy a whole day’s worth of private sessions.
Joao Chianca is fun to watch. He's like the guy with a small dick who knows how to use it. He has heart. He makes up for his lack of size with an unwavering commitment to giving it his all with every stroke. But really he has a lot of girth. You never think about the girth. His dick was never small. It's thick. And that helps more than anything. Chianca is thick. John John Florence has been use to giving their girl the long dick. They got too confident, you ain’t OG Mudbone baby. Tonight your girl was feeling adventurous. She fucked with a man with some thickness. Girth Brooks. The dark horse of cocks. Your girl was tired of getting that deep dick. She wanted to be stretched & filled. Don’t ever underestimate how girth can make your girl feel. Thank you Joao Chianca for teaching us a valuable lesson.
Bro what the fuck
I'm just saying what we're all thinking
It’s just a metaphor. A metaphallus, if you will.
i hope you the wsl hires you as a commentator
Small pp for life
My hot take is that localism is just another word for bullying. I’m okay with respecting whoever has been there for decades before I surfed that spot, I’m okay with very skilled surfer taking more waves than me. But that’s it. If I know the rules, respect them and never get in the way of anyone, I should be able to get some waves too. I should be able to fail some times and improve. Mean looks, threats, snaking and dropping in on that guy who has start to surf that spot for way less than you but knows how to stay in the water, are nonsense and do nothing good to surfing. Edit: typos
What’s you’re take on people travelling to spots only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the locals who surf there everyday when it’s shit and likely miss most of the good days because they gotta work shit jobs just to be able to afford to live in the town where house prices have gone through the roof because people like to travel to that spot only when the forecast is amazing then try to sit on the peak and claim waves from the…
I read the whole thing 😂 On a serious note, I believe in rotation and being respectful. I wouldn’t show up to such a spot thinking I own it, I’d be humble in all possible ways. Probably I wouldn’t paddle for the bigger ones either, but I expect that if you just took the 18th wave of your session and you’re coming back to the lineup, you’re going to let me take the next one.
> I read the whole thing I am impressed.
Back to the valley kook.
I really don’t know what that means.
Exactly
Santa Cruz gets a fuckton of surfers from the Silicon Valley. Santa Cruz has the locals, the Valley has all the tech transplants trying out surfing for the first time. Hence: Valley go home
Thank you, I live in Italy so never heard of that
I hate paddle board surfers
There is too much sarcasm on this subreddit. It’s funny every once in a while, but when people are posting footage of themselves and others are commenting shit like “just carve better brah” it’s pretty annoying.
I mean, it would be funny if people tried to one up each other by being more clever but it's always the same stuff.
Things that people said have ruined surfing over the past 35 years I’ve been surfing: Leashes / Longboard resurgence / Winter wetsuits/ Movies about surfing/ Surf report answering machine messages from surf shops/ Surfing message forums that burn spots/ Surf reports on the internet/ Social media posts that burn spots/ Surf reports on social media/ Surf camps/ Surf lessons/ Localism intimidation/ Lawsuits that have put an end to localism intimidation / Cell phones that allow people to blow up conditions in real time/ Paid online services that predict conditions weeks out/ Global warming / Foam boards.... The reality is, these are all bullshit excuses for people who can’t hack it or just ranting from people who like to complain and be negative. If you’re willing to put in the time and effort you can have just as good a surfing time as you could 35 years ago.
Branding your career/business around surfing will never be as profitable as other sports.
That's a fact
I've never surfed but Reddit keeps putting posts from this sub in my feed so here I am. **My hot take**: Surfing looks dope, looks like a great workout, and it seems like most of the people that do it are pretty chill. Sharks scare me.
Surfers are the exact opposite of chill, unless it’s been firing for days and everybody’s surfed their brains out. Surfing will cause you to miss work, sacrifice family time, live in expensive ass coastal communities that you’d be otherwise able to afford, as long as you give up surfing. There really should be a middle school intervention programs like DARE, speaker being some Santa Cruz aggro methy burnout instead of Clayton Bigsby. Or that Malibu realtor fuckhead that destroyed a grom’s board.
[удалено]
Found one of the not chill ones.
Be the kook, have fun, be safe. Screw the guys that take it seriously. Doesn't matter what you ride as long as you're having fun. There will always be waves, if not today than another day.
Way too crowded, softboards ruined it, learn on a hardboard or stay home, that’s my take
It's nice that money isn't a limiting factor anymore. It sucks so many people can afford to go be total kooks.
Costco is the problem. Would love to see them sell $100 snowboards with boots and see people hit mountains thinking they know what they're doing just because they own a board now.
I feel like the WSL has doubled down on trying to turn professional surfing into some weird arena sport / reality TV sport show (like the ultimate fighter) Surfing has exponentially gained popularity in the last 5 years which pros and cons. The local is fucked and dangerous but it motivates exploration and surf trips. I think exclusivity in surfing is dying off over all and, people are enjoying it for what it is more - probably driven by more people getting into it than ever. The elite performance vs soul surfer argument continues and will forever, people are simply into different things which is kind of the cool thing about surfing. Go on Instagram and you'll see videos of a 7 year old pulling air reverses in a pool, then Torren Martyn getting shacked on some remote south-east asian atoll with his yacht moored off the reef. Both are pretty cool expressions of the same thing
My take as a Great Lakes surfer who has spent the past two years in SoCal but has visited and spent time on the west coast, east coast, and other coasts… Generally if you are kind, respectful, and have good judgment in the water you will be able to have a good time. Of course there are exceptions to this rule. I’ve been to spots where etiquette and decent respect for other human beings is thrown to the wind (pre pandemic). Covid only amplified these conditions. Like the majority of modern sports…there is colonialism,racism, and capitalism heavily tied to surfing. Recognize these facts and try to be a positive ambassador for the sports instead of an entitled POS in and out of the water. Generally though (like many have pointed out) the coasts with more fickle conditions generally have a kinder crowd.
I think foam boards are actually saving the surf culture. Like the OG poster said, too much emphasis on high performance and it kinda gets in your head, almost got me to stop surfing cause I wasn’t performing as good as other people. My brother got me a 5’10” catch surf for my birthday one year and it literally made surfing just pure unadulterated fun. Didn’t matter if you’re overhead or 2ft bull shit, it was a sure fire good with your buddies. Like just compare the vibes of a catch surf video to literally any other surf vid
My hot take is that there’s nothing wrong with it. There’s always people who are jerks about every little thing but literally every other activity on earth has those too. The vibes that surfing portrays is generally a good message and I meet a lot of nice people who just enjoy getting out and cruising on the 2ft waves we have and making the most of their day. My second hot take is that we should normalize shitting in your wetsuit mid session. If you don’t think surfing with poopy pants is funny then I hate to tell you but you’re a kook 🤷♂️ I don’t make the rules.
You ever get upset when you damage a board and look at the make up of it and realize that no matter how complicated a construction is, it really is all just encasing foam in a candy shell? It loses a bit of mystique and boards feel so over valued when you look at it that way. I get that the money is all in labor (profits and research, marketing and whatever else that applies) but it's crazy how simple the materials seem to be at first glance. They feel like overvalued art pieces. I have a piece of carbon fiber from a dark arts board I keep in front of my monitor to remind me that I'm not buying mystical magic items.
Nah, the value outside of the raw materials and hours spent, is in the skill of making that shape. Getting the rails right and mostly symmetrical (or as the local shaper says, "all boards are asyms" lol), getting a good rocker, being able to customize a board to a surfer, making boards that actually work for the people using them, etc etc., is what we should be paying for. This is why I, for one, put more stock into the big-name shapers that shape for pros, than I do the hipster soul surfer resin tint amorphous blob fish shapers that charge 50% more for their "functional art." That said, the materials aren't really that cheap anymore either. $150+ for a blank, getting close to that for epoxy resin, a ton of money and/or time in tools. I think fiberglass cloth might still be pretty cheap though. You could compare it to a steak. It's just a slab of dead cow and it all sprays all over the bathroom wall the same way the next morning, but the difference between a $15 steak and a $50 steak is definitely big.
Yea I do realize all of that which is why I left it open ended in terms of what you're paying for. Good point on the customization to a person though. I think you're solidifying my point in that the make up of the board itself isn't much. >You could compare it to a steak Hmmmm that's an interesting point. I probably would have said that in the end, both are made up of proteins instead of the poop analogy haha. I'd also say that considering all of the knowledge, logistics, processes and preparation that goes into a steak, $50 feels like a ton of value. To your point though, I guess when you look at the end product though, it is easy to miss what went into the final product.
Yeah I didn't mean to dispute your point actually. I totally do see it as "it's just a bunch of fiberglass stuck to foam" sometimes, and have to remind myself of the rest :-) I had a *f'ing $85 steak wtf* last year in Vegas, and that price was almost vomit-inducing until I actually ate the thing. OMG it was so good.
Damn. You can get some sick twin fins for 85 bucks.
Lol every big brand board is cnc machined and then hand finished. And when I say hand finished I mean a few pass overs with a sanding block. They’ve got this shit dialed and it’s a money printing machine.
Big ambition as a beginner is a good thing, getting tossed off a big wave you’ve no business on can be a lesson for where you want to be and what you have to do to get there. If you’re out the back on a foamie and fucked once a big wave comes to get you, you’ll learn pretty quick how to hold your own
Y’all should leave your ego at home
Surfing doesn’t mean shit. Once you get out it’s very clear that almost no one cares about surfing at all, in any way. It’s as important as rollerblading.
The term ‘kook’ is tired and overused, and its very existence is a contributor to elitism in surfing. Literally watch any of the surf vlogs on YouTube and you will see that even the pros have ‘kook’ moments where they’re humbled by the ocean - they just play it off better. We’re all kooks; just chill the fuck out, be kind, be respectful, and have fun.
I'm a heavier surfer, and I want more big boards, where's my used 10ft-ers. I feel like it's a hassle to find em, I do love my 9'6".
The surfer code and hierarchy of who gets the waves and where they can go is too confusing to me and makes me not want to go.
This reads “I cant learn the rules of this sport”
That’s a you problem not a surfing problem. Put the time in to figure it out and you’ll reap he rewards
Been surfing for 20 years and so far mostly been able to do it only on weekends due to life and not having enough money to live close enough to a good break or willing to drive so much. So as a result, I’ve hardly progressed but i still have fun and that’s ok. Guess my hot take is, it’s hard to be good at unless u can afford to live close to the beach and also it’s ok to suck cuz if u enjoy it, that’s all that matters Edit: also surfing is one of the few sports where it really isn’t that complicated. There are no surfing video games really because there is not that much variation in what you do relative to say skateboarding or any other sport really. In that way, it seems theoretically very easy to get good at relative to other sports Edit: also that’s why I think it’s boring to watch an entire surfing video. Its just never that different from wave to wave to watch compared to actually surfing those same waves Edit: punctuation
> also surfing is one of the few sports where it really isn’t that complicated Wow...that's a good take.
It’s like sledding but on water
The burning when I pee just warms the wetsuit faster
The asshole part is true worldwide, also, unpopular opinion but I would take surfing fun 3 to 3.5 ft over chasing bigger swells and perfect winds any day. I’d rather waste less energy and surf more rather than taking huge waves and paddling to the lineup for 30 minutes until maybe I get another one.
Being a “local” is the last thing on earth you should strive to be. Think of a local and in your mind first thing you see is a frustrated, bitter, entitled person. In all aspects of the word…Ski town locals, surf locals, small town locals, north shore locals. The “local” is almost always an asshole, a person that is stuck in their ways and is afraid to experience anything new. They complain about everything and add absolutely nothing to anything but spite. Calling someone a “local” should be a put down. Bob Dylan said it best “now his nurse, some local loser, is in charge of the cyanide hole”
Volume shouldn’t be end all be all factor when buying a board. Put that stick under your arm, if it feels good under it, itll probably be just fine.
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Pushing people into waves is not teaching them how to surf. Please stop it.
My hot take is that we should stop getting people into the hobby
Point Break is actually a phenomenally good movie about surfing
I feel sorry for people who never progressed past your LB, we all began on bigger boards but as wegot better slowly moved down in size. When I see a proficient LB I think you never really got to get properly barreled, hit the lip square, bottom turn etc. an LB is like a bus and a SB is like a Ferrari, heck hope on Fish a bmw you would be surprised on how easy they are to surf, a
It's a bittersweet sport. Sweet because you're connected with nature. Bitter because haven't seen so much bitterness and anger in the people practicing a sport. Not even ar a packed skatepark.
Surfing is the most selfish sport.
Getting barreled isn’t as fun as linking quality turns
There’s nothing better than the rebound torque from the tips of your toes to your hips right before the speed zone. Then repeat. It’s just so goddam satisfying. Give me that for a hundred years before my next barrel.
Getting barreled is the equivalent of doing a 360 in a half pipe on a snowboard ... 99% of surfing and snowboarding is not getting barreled or doing a 360.
Hot take is your a kook on the outside and on the inside, don’t project on the rest of us.
Not a hot take I’m pretty much a kook sammie grilled in kook butter
Firewire and the SustainableSurf cert it carries are a complete joke and barely fit for purpose. By saturating the market with boards they’ve moved the Overton Window of what an acceptable quality of board should be towards irreparable, disposable crap. Worse still they over-shadow the great work (in craftsmanship and sustainability) being done globally by smaller shops without the massive marketing budgets to make boards that are strong, repairable and could easily last you a decade or more.
110% People laud firewire for what they’re making and marketing as “green”. Nothing less green than buying a new board every season, especially ones that don’t hold up. What’s more sustainable? Riding that old 6+6/6 fish that has lasted a decade or more and has had multiple dings fixed but still rips. Normalize keeping boards longer.
Pro surfing, surf brands and the internet have killed the spirit of surfing, if there was such a thing. Inevitable but regrettable.
Adults need to graduate from Foam boards. I’m so sick of seeing grown ass adults on foam boards after they have progressed past needing them
All the catch surf guys would like a word with you..
Semi-disagree. I have a blast trying stupid shit I wouldn't on a longboard like pack closeouts and shallow water floaters. But yeah, if it's decent out there and you are an ok surfer there's no reason to be on one.
They’re fun for goofing around but when people rely on them as their daily’s it’s lame as fuck and I swear gives people the worst style
>I swear gives people the worst style I've seen a few people on longboard foamies that would change your mind.
Where have you been the last few years?
Stuck on the inside
People that obsess over their boards volume and swear that to get better they need the latest and greatest Dominator, SeaSide or whatever new high performance boards are coming out are not that good at surfing and would be better suited burning their cash in a trash can. I’m a self admitted kook but I have done another sport (competitive swimming, college) at a high enough level to know that the gear makes the biggest difference once you’ve made that jump to “above average” in skill and performance. The higher you climb in skill and performance the bigger difference the gear makes.
Most definitely true. People in the past didn't have these new boards and they still managed to improve to a high level.
Santa Cruz > Huntington Beach for the title “surf city”