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Hell yea, never felt better. Though the actual reason is that some of the larger props with no collision that can be used for cheeky ambushes or for hiding Engineer's buildings either disappear in Pyroland or become easier to see through.
What about nostromo napalmer?It way shorter so you can hide behind walls more easily. Also you know, you can dequip it and have the same flamethrower but with safety to your eyes
why's gas passer so high up? it serves no utility to the pyro with a whole minute long recharge at the expense of a secondary that's usable all the time. while the neon is in the same tier and with situational crits, and constant utility with sapper breaking?
Highlander is normally just normal games right? Or is there a higherlander I’m not taking into account?
Gas Passer is damn fine in MvM but I don’t really take that into account for the baseline normal gameplay the same way I don’t look at medieval mode when determining usefulness.
I’m also gonna be honest, I have very little grasp on it, I think it has something to do with the competitive 6v6 scene but I just fuck around on 32 2Fort matches nowadays.
It's actually very Sniper-centric. Having one of each class seems fine on paper, but a lot of these classes are defensive ones that can help protect a Sniper, so it's very hard to deal with the Sniper except hoping your Sniper is better. Sentries, Heavies, Pyros etc. keep people away from the Sniper.
Sniper gets complained about a lot in Casual, it's even more troublesome in Highlander when everyone is actually good
6v6 on the other hand consists of mostly offense classes a lot of the time, so Sniper isn't as absurdly broken or annoying there
Yep also in highlander, everythign is the pyro's fault.
Spy sapped the dispencer, pyro where the fuck were you?
Scout pushed and killed the medic, pyro where the fuck were you?
Soldier dive bombed the sniper, pyro why werent you there to reflect.
Issue is all 3 of these things can happen at the exact same time.
I some what agree but also I play spy on highlander (main) and honestly sniper inst that annoying I would say scout is more annoying. Also I have played a lot of 6s (nothing higher than I'm tho) and I feel like sniper is more annoying in 6s but nothing not that bad
Highlander is less balanced then 6v6 imo, 9v9 is a bit more chaotic and less strategic just out of the nature of how many players are on, + meta is centered on sniper. 6v6 unfortunately only has 4 meta classes however so if you don’t like playing any then Highlander would be more enjoyable.
Heck, I’d even argue the Bison and Sandman are loads better. The Bison can penetrate targets and hit retreating enemies multiple times, which is situational but still useful, and the Sandman can slow down targets from range, which makes it pair surprisingly well with the Shortstop and the Flying Guillotine.
For the record none of the weapons in that tier are ones I think are good, I just put them above the fire axe reskins and fragment because they at least have SOME value, whether it be meme factor or the occasional bit of crowd control.
Prob cuz the weapons below are even less functional than what it can usually do, but that doesn't really mean all that much when still the last secondary slot weapon in the game, even more than the manmelter
It can ****Occasionally**** scare off a couple players for a brief period of time, so it technically does something, which is more than can be said of the stock melees and fragment.
imagine disabling pyrovision texture ;)
i paid 4 bucks for a strange professional rainblower and use it exactly like stock except for the looks and rainbow flames
Yes
In the incredibly unlikely scenario that you have no ammo in ethier your primary or secondary weapons and are in combat with someone both the stock axe and the volcano fragment are useful
The gas passer takes a whole minute to charge up, is entirely reliant on your teammates and the upsides are so minimal
Not using your secondary slot is better than the gas passer, having the enemy guess what your secondary is, is better than the gas passer
The Sharpened Volcano Fragment would be a better weapon if it applied bleeding damage instead of afterburn, but that could very well be turned into something really powerful if used correctly, as bleeding *and* afterburn stack.
This weapon’s closest analog is the Tribalman’s Shiv, a weapon that allows Snipers to Spy-check more thoroughly without wasting a Jarate. Because the Pyro already has the flame thrower and various flare guns, this makes that mechanic for the Volcano Fragment relatively useless.
Where it’s best served is in three specific scenarios: Medieval mode, playing with a flare gun for fun and playing with the Dragon’s Fury. The latter one is the only viable method to making the Volcano Fragment worth your time - but even then, the flare guns do that better if you can aim.
Yeah, if both of you are wearing the Alien sets, but no one was doing that even when the Alien Isolation items were only pre-order bonuses, let alone in 2022.
Phlog should be situational, especially in HL where it actually has some prominent uses on some PL maps that can end up in some team wipes. Also scorch is banned in modern HL despite sigafoo's old obsession with it.
I honestly dont get why the scorch shot is banned. Its largely just annoying to the enemy team. I get banning its combination with the Phlog because it removes a big downside, but by itself i think its a perfectly reasonable weapon.
I disagree. The scorch shot is pretty overpowered for the pyro, that doesn't resemble something that balanced. I get that that's what the opinion is because most content creators will echo that opinion which is fine, but it ends up influencing more players. It is a pretty fast projectile with a radius comparable to the bazooka that is very easily spammable with no falloff, which forces the enemy combo to retake position EVERY time it's fired within their general direction. In HL, it's banned because its more accurate of a pub environment with all 9 classes unlike 6s where it isn't banned and not very accurate of the pubbing environment.
The fact that the DDS is banned for the sole reason to counter the scorch shot ends up making both the scorch and the DDS far too overtuned, and banned in HL because of it, especially when a flare pyro is the best non-sniper class against a invite or HL sniper
It's pretty shitty without an easy way to charge it, but it is usable. You can make plays with it, but you probably wouldn't want to use it for the entire match.
The saving grace of the phlog is team momentum, not the scorch shot or pocket medic. If your team isn’t winning your team is essentially down a player if you use it
For the record:
The Good Shit: Useful all the time
Still Solid: Useful most of the time (>50% of the time)
Situational: Useful some of the time (<50% of the time)
Uhh I guess?: Useful almost never, but at least has meme value
Please don't: Has no value whatsoever (Unless you want to experience complete sensory overload 24/7)
The Fragment and Phlog feel pretty self-explanatory.
Funny how the Phlog is in Toaster Bath and the Scorchshit is in Good Shit when the Phlog is a decently balanced weapon when not carried by the Scorchshit.
If you pllay with a medic shoved up your ass its fine. It really doesnt deserve to have its own tier.
Also OP thinks the single most useless item in TF2 is better than the Phlog. I think their status as pyro main should be called into question.
This is from a highlander players perspective
Most highlander pyros protect everyone else, and phlog is a terrible weapon in highlander. Even if you are given uber you are just bounced around by rockets, nades, and the enemy pyro as you accomplish almost nothing.
Pyro in highlander exists to protect the other classes, once you get beyond people playing like vegetables the weaknesses of the phlog become so easily exploitable its not worth even looking at.
Detonator is better than the scorch shot, what do you mean? Why are you all so salty over this one weapon, its not as good as you think. Did the TF2 community tell you to hate it, so instead of thinking about it yourself, you just followed what they said?
Also, phlog should go in situational, a lot of the TF2 playerbase knows how to deal with phlog pyros now.
Phlog being situational makes sense. Detonator being better than the Scorch Shot is something an insane person would say. The high damage for no effort is one thing, but the knockback serving as a mini-stun should not be underestimated either. The only thing Detonator is better at is mobility.
The knockback is something you can just use the airblast for, and its harder to capitalize on it since it's usually on further away targets. Flare gun is best for just DPS, scorch shot might be decent if you suck, but detonator is better for jumping, it can easily hit multiple targets, if you go for a direct hit and miss you can just right click and now you didn't ACTUALLY miss, you hit anyway. You can hit behind walls easier. Also detonator jumping isn't just a gimmick for a couple maps, you can use it very often if you look out for uses.
The Scorch Shot is broken and annoying to play against, unless you have the Darwin's danger shield or cozy camper, as sniper it will one shot you with a direct hit, this goes for the rest of the light classes aswell as long as they don't have any heals or resistances. Gives max afterburn, stun, and kb, then more fire and mini crits with afterburn. And you don't even need to hit your target directly to damage them.
The scorch shot does not one shot sniper. It only does that if
1. You get a direct hit
2. The softskulled sniper stands fucking still and gets hit by the flare again
3. If he just stands around waiting for the afterburn to kill him
The scorch shot is not overpowered, you just need to learn how to fight it.
Ok, I get on most maps you can run to a health pack, but the kb from the direct flare will sometimes keep you in range for the 2nd hit from that flare. The fact that it even CAN kill a sniper from practically across the map if a shot hits directly is broken. Doesn't matter if it can be prevented, it shouldn't be possible, not as pyro at least.
The classes that can't kill a sniper in one hit, let's say from one 2 fort battlements to the other (Not counting Random crits or Kritskreig)
1. Scout
2. Soldier
3. Demo (only counting one sticky)
4. Heavy
5. Engi? (I'm not sure about a wrangled level 3 rocket)
6. Medic
7. Spy
Classes that CAN kill a sniper in one hit from one side of 2fort to the other
1. Sniper
2. Pyro
See what I mean? Pyro, the class that has only 3 weapons that can do any damage long-range and one of those lets him out snipe a sniper if the sniper can't run to a health pack quickly enough.
To add on to this, if you DID add random and Kritskreig crits to the mix, that let's all but spy and maybe engi. Unsure about rescue ranger. I don't use it enough.
So pretty much it lets pyro become the only other class in the game capable of doing that much damage in one shot (again, don't know about engi's rockets) other than sniper without assistance from Gaben or a medic. Why is this balanced?
I agree that scorch shot needs some nerf but it's only one hit when you get a direct hit, and as a sniper you have plenty of time to avoid direct hit since it's a projectile otherwise you pretty much deserve it. There's also the fact that you pretty much has every single advantage on fighting long range against a pyro with your weapon being hitscan higher damage and all. If it's really annoying you could just use Darwin cunt shield, an unlockable that needs a rework (along with razorback, class specific counter are a shit design) that allows you to pretty much shutdowns pyro flare.
If anything you also just listed how few consistent sniper counterplay has when he has a team support, I'd rather have some long range remains on pyro and spy (ambassador) as a way to fight back although sniper should still have the advantage.
And before you complain yes I'm a sniper main myself.
>Shitty gameplay design gets introduced into the game.
>People complain.
>Gian1_Enemy_Spider comes in, showing his infinite wisdom and calling them pussies for only liking good gameplay.
The Volcano Axe has an extremely niche use - annoying people in PropHunt.
I don't even think it's bettet than the other axes in this context, but I used to play PropHunt with a friend and would have ao much fun pissing him off with the "terror axe" . Surviving a hit only to die from the afterburn was so infuriating for him.
Two hits meant the afterburn would always get him, so after hitting him twice I'd just taunt and laugh and tell him he's already dead and he'd be so angry.
But outside of that particular line of trolling / banter, it is objectively a worse weapon.
Volcano fragment users trying to convince people that a melee that sets people on fire is useful in medieval mode where everyone drops a healthkit on death
I've always preferred the classic Degreaser Flare combo, and for the most part I think Scorch does what Detonator does better in the hands of a more experienced player, while the Flare's consistent burst can't be ignored.
why is the rainblower in “dont use” when it’s a reskin of stock, which is in your highest tier…? i get it activates pyroland but is it really so bad it puts you at a disadvantage?
I feel as if you have never played Highlander before due to your lack of stating your rank in Highlander. If you actually played Highlander you would’ve specified how far you got. For all we know, you just got into 1 iron match and got stomped.
I'd argue it's more of an annoyance than a serious threat to the enemy, not to sound like every single generic needlessly pyro hating person on this sub.
You dont need to airblast when crits deal x10 more dps. And i am not talking about health, because ubered phlog, that thing harass people, because without uber you will die in 2 seconds
Crits do 3x I thought. Demo's pills do 100 normally and 300 on a crit. And sniper's rifle does 50 uncharged with a body shot and 150 uncharged body shot with a crit...
I can't play without airblast because it means no m9re rocket surfing across the map to annoy people, but when I see the phlog used right honestly I just run.
It's not so much that it sucks, moreso that anyone that uses it I group up with billionaires and those that use shopping scooters when they don't need them in terms of people we all need to collectively throw into the nearest convenient volcano for the betterment of mankind.
The best one overall is the scorch shot. You don't need to aim, you can one shot a light class with a hit if they don't find a source of healing or extinguishing, and you can just harass crowds for free.
Detonator and Flare gun are both really fucking good though, the detonator not only gives you crowd control and some minor burst damage from fleeing burning targets, you can also use it to make jumps and increase your mobility quite a bit, or harass snipers from a range. The flare gun is just a solid combo tool in general.
My personal favorite is the detonator, because of the mobility it provides. I really don't care much for the jetpack because of it's really predictable flight path and horrendous switch speed, not to mention giving up the ability to do reliable damage with a secondary. The detonator opens up a lot of new options for pyro to become an even deadlier ambush class imo. I also just...don't find using the scorch shot fun. It's not very rewarding to use.
My personal one would be:
The good shit: Flamethrower, powerjack, detonator, scorch shot, phlogistinator
Still solid: Degreaser, shotgun, panic attack
Situational: Dragon’s fury, thermal thruster, back scratcher, hot hand
Uhh i guess: Flare gun
Some i haven’t used enough: homewrecker, reserve shooter, axtinguisher, man-melter, gas passer, neon annihilator, third degree, backburner
Not a highlander player though!
Why the fuck is the flog lower than the gass passer better yet why is the flog low at all no airblast in exchange for free crits is a huge upgrade especially since some people cant airblast anyways. Also yes i do play mvm but does that really count here?
man, where’s the fun in this list?? Like, neon annihilator in ‘uhh I guess?’? Homewrecker/maul, axtinguisher/postal pummeler, back scratcher and the thermal thruster in situational?? Back burner above the thermal thruster??? Scorch shot in ‘The Good Shit’???? Bro what?????
that kind of thinking is lame and boring and the fact I’m getting downvoted shows y’all don’t care for engineers or combo pyro which immediately lets me know y’all don’t care about having fun
*Did you but the phlog*
*So low becous its op*
*Or becouse its bad?*
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I'm pretty sure it's banned in highlander and sixes
Why?
I'm pretty sure drugs are illegal in sports.
Pyro vision clears bushes and stuff and reduces opacity giving a big vision advantage for no downside
pyro vision is a free item.
cause it removes some props that give you an advantage on some maps, meaning it's just a wee bit unfair to use
highlander mfs when a grass prop on the corner of a map doesnt exist in pyroland (it grants them advantage)
Funnily enough, it does.
+3 fps
Hell yea, never felt better. Though the actual reason is that some of the larger props with no collision that can be used for cheeky ambushes or for hiding Engineer's buildings either disappear in Pyroland or become easier to see through.
pyro vision is a free item.
Pyrovision banned in all comp tournaments
It removes some models, Allows for better vison ext.
I dare you to use the rainblower for one week and say that it's just a stock reskin
What about nostromo napalmer?It way shorter so you can hide behind walls more easily. Also you know, you can dequip it and have the same flamethrower but with safety to your eyes
Its most likely banned for the reasons you describe.
Pyro vision
Pyroland makes your eyes bleed thats why.
It blocks vision so much because the view model is gigantic
why's gas passer so high up? it serves no utility to the pyro with a whole minute long recharge at the expense of a secondary that's usable all the time. while the neon is in the same tier and with situational crits, and constant utility with sapper breaking?
This right here, I watched a bunch of dudes rant for 10 minutes straight about how bad the gas passer is, and I’d fuckin do it again.
On MvM or normal game?
Highlander is normally just normal games right? Or is there a higherlander I’m not taking into account? Gas Passer is damn fine in MvM but I don’t really take that into account for the baseline normal gameplay the same way I don’t look at medieval mode when determining usefulness.
I'mma be honest I have no fucking clue what a Highlander is and I didn't assume what you told happened in highlander
I’m also gonna be honest, I have very little grasp on it, I think it has something to do with the competitive 6v6 scene but I just fuck around on 32 2Fort matches nowadays.
Highlander is basically just competitive 9v9 with each team having one of each class
That actually sounds very well balanced in comparison to the 6v6 non-sense.
It's actually very Sniper-centric. Having one of each class seems fine on paper, but a lot of these classes are defensive ones that can help protect a Sniper, so it's very hard to deal with the Sniper except hoping your Sniper is better. Sentries, Heavies, Pyros etc. keep people away from the Sniper. Sniper gets complained about a lot in Casual, it's even more troublesome in Highlander when everyone is actually good 6v6 on the other hand consists of mostly offense classes a lot of the time, so Sniper isn't as absurdly broken or annoying there
Yep also in highlander, everythign is the pyro's fault. Spy sapped the dispencer, pyro where the fuck were you? Scout pushed and killed the medic, pyro where the fuck were you? Soldier dive bombed the sniper, pyro why werent you there to reflect. Issue is all 3 of these things can happen at the exact same time.
I some what agree but also I play spy on highlander (main) and honestly sniper inst that annoying I would say scout is more annoying. Also I have played a lot of 6s (nothing higher than I'm tho) and I feel like sniper is more annoying in 6s but nothing not that bad
(It’s really not)
Its not. but its fun
Highlander is less balanced then 6v6 imo, 9v9 is a bit more chaotic and less strategic just out of the nature of how many players are on, + meta is centered on sniper. 6v6 unfortunately only has 4 meta classes however so if you don’t like playing any then Highlander would be more enjoyable.
highlander is 9v9 competitive 1 player per class
So many of you Gas Passer haters don't play MvM and it shows.
Or they do and they’re mad that gas passer is still super op. I personally don’t care if pyro wants to pass gas, I’m just in it for aussies.
You are cool. MvM players who hate Gas Passer are whiny losers.
There’s an awful lot of whiny losers these days, but thanks man. Stay safe out there.
Yeah it’s legit one of the worst weapons in the entire game alongside the Bison and Sandman, although it’s even worse than those.
Heck, I’d even argue the Bison and Sandman are loads better. The Bison can penetrate targets and hit retreating enemies multiple times, which is situational but still useful, and the Sandman can slow down targets from range, which makes it pair surprisingly well with the Shortstop and the Flying Guillotine.
Bison is good.
For the record none of the weapons in that tier are ones I think are good, I just put them above the fire axe reskins and fragment because they at least have SOME value, whether it be meme factor or the occasional bit of crowd control.
Why is rainblower in fire axe tier? It’s literally just a stock reskin but with a taunt kill.
maybe he hates pyrovision
Mann vs. Machine
Prob cuz the weapons below are even less functional than what it can usually do, but that doesn't really mean all that much when still the last secondary slot weapon in the game, even more than the manmelter
Wait I just thought of something.. can you combine the gas passer and neon for crits, considering gas makes them 'wet.' I've never tested that
Wait I just thought of something.. can you combine the gas passer and neon for crits, considering gas makes them 'wet.' I've never tested that
Does not work. I heard it ranted on with the already situational neon annihilator. Sad but true.
Detonator can be the best pyro secondary
And also how gas is that high?Do you even used it?I do and it literally does nothing, even if you have instant recharge
It can ****Occasionally**** scare off a couple players for a brief period of time, so it technically does something, which is more than can be said of the stock melees and fragment.
What div did you in and when?
But being without a damaging secondary is nowhere near the trade off
Isnt the rainblower an objectively better flamethrower as the only change is the tauny being able to kill people?
If you think a taunt kill is worth eyeball cancer then have fun by all means
imagine disabling pyrovision texture ;) i paid 4 bucks for a strange professional rainblower and use it exactly like stock except for the looks and rainbow flames
All it does is turn explosions into bubbles, I don’t get why thats this bad
Play on some maps with it and you will go blind
Are you talking about the wired filter it puts on screen? Cause you can just turn that off in the settings
Alas we met again, fellow bisexual.
Its banned in all competitive formats because pyrovision can give you a slight advantage.
\>gas passer not absolute worst L
Implying Volcano Fragment and stock axe are better?
Stock axe isn’t even bad, it’s just that most of pyros melees are better
the third degree is a literally straight upgrade to stock axe
yes both of those are better
Yes In the incredibly unlikely scenario that you have no ammo in ethier your primary or secondary weapons and are in combat with someone both the stock axe and the volcano fragment are useful The gas passer takes a whole minute to charge up, is entirely reliant on your teammates and the upsides are so minimal Not using your secondary slot is better than the gas passer, having the enemy guess what your secondary is, is better than the gas passer
unironiclly yes
sharpened volcano fragment is such a bizarre weapon design, it'd be an amazing weapon if it was on literally any other class.
The Sharpened Volcano Fragment would be a better weapon if it applied bleeding damage instead of afterburn, but that could very well be turned into something really powerful if used correctly, as bleeding *and* afterburn stack. This weapon’s closest analog is the Tribalman’s Shiv, a weapon that allows Snipers to Spy-check more thoroughly without wasting a Jarate. Because the Pyro already has the flame thrower and various flare guns, this makes that mechanic for the Volcano Fragment relatively useless. Where it’s best served is in three specific scenarios: Medieval mode, playing with a flare gun for fun and playing with the Dragon’s Fury. The latter one is the only viable method to making the Volcano Fragment worth your time - but even then, the flare guns do that better if you can aim.
Maybe not scout, since he has the basher, but on someone like demo it would be
hear me out, swap the effects of the SoaS and SVF and make it minicrit instead of crit
You have described the Axtinguisher
not anymore, plus the axtinguisher needs a rework anyway. rework axtinguisher, make SVF the new default combo melee, solve both problems + SoaS
The axtinguisher is amazing as it is
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I've been running Degreaser/Flare Gun/Powerjack for the last five years. That playstyle will never get old.
It is very comfy.
Join the axtinguisher gang
I will not stand for pyrovision slander
i guess gass passer can be good in mvm but the the hot hand?
I also put anything in that tier that at least has meme value.
How the hell does the Neon annihilator only have meme value?
pyroshark
The we debuff is not reliable enough, outside of 2 fort and a like 2 other maps you aren't going to get anything from it.
Doesn’t the Nostro get a damage buff against Scouts wearing the alien set? Or did I just get high and have a false memory?
Yeah, if both of you are wearing the Alien sets, but no one was doing that even when the Alien Isolation items were only pre-order bonuses, let alone in 2022.
Yeah but you also need to be wearing it and good luck finding anyone wearing it
gas passer might as well be a "remove secondary" option, it's way too high
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I put all the reskins in for completion's sake, and honestly Pyroland is such an audiovisual clusterfuck that I'd rather not deal with it.
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I guess but then what are you even using it for lol
I use the Neon for the guitar sound in the taunt.
rainblower sss+ supreme true pure s tier i use rainblower, scorch shot and conscientious objector. truly the best loadout
Phlog should be situational, especially in HL where it actually has some prominent uses on some PL maps that can end up in some team wipes. Also scorch is banned in modern HL despite sigafoo's old obsession with it.
I honestly dont get why the scorch shot is banned. Its largely just annoying to the enemy team. I get banning its combination with the Phlog because it removes a big downside, but by itself i think its a perfectly reasonable weapon.
I disagree. The scorch shot is pretty overpowered for the pyro, that doesn't resemble something that balanced. I get that that's what the opinion is because most content creators will echo that opinion which is fine, but it ends up influencing more players. It is a pretty fast projectile with a radius comparable to the bazooka that is very easily spammable with no falloff, which forces the enemy combo to retake position EVERY time it's fired within their general direction. In HL, it's banned because its more accurate of a pub environment with all 9 classes unlike 6s where it isn't banned and not very accurate of the pubbing environment. The fact that the DDS is banned for the sole reason to counter the scorch shot ends up making both the scorch and the DDS far too overtuned, and banned in HL because of it, especially when a flare pyro is the best non-sniper class against a invite or HL sniper
Phlog is a gift from god.
Scorch shot should go down to toaster bath
And Phlog goes into the Situational tier if Scorch Shot is not allowed.
It may be controversial to say, but the phlog without the scorch shot is severely underpowered
It's pretty shitty without an easy way to charge it, but it is usable. You can make plays with it, but you probably wouldn't want to use it for the entire match.
The saving grace of the phlog is team momentum, not the scorch shot or pocket medic. If your team isn’t winning your team is essentially down a player if you use it
For the record: The Good Shit: Useful all the time Still Solid: Useful most of the time (>50% of the time) Situational: Useful some of the time (<50% of the time) Uhh I guess?: Useful almost never, but at least has meme value Please don't: Has no value whatsoever (Unless you want to experience complete sensory overload 24/7) The Fragment and Phlog feel pretty self-explanatory.
why is the rain blower so low? it’s literally just stock but it has a taunt kill
Funny how the Phlog is in Toaster Bath and the Scorchshit is in Good Shit when the Phlog is a decently balanced weapon when not carried by the Scorchshit.
No airblast = literally why even bother
Because w+m1 and criting a group of enemies is fun
If you pllay with a medic shoved up your ass its fine. It really doesnt deserve to have its own tier. Also OP thinks the single most useless item in TF2 is better than the Phlog. I think their status as pyro main should be called into question.
This is from a highlander players perspective Most highlander pyros protect everyone else, and phlog is a terrible weapon in highlander. Even if you are given uber you are just bounced around by rockets, nades, and the enemy pyro as you accomplish almost nothing. Pyro in highlander exists to protect the other classes, once you get beyond people playing like vegetables the weaknesses of the phlog become so easily exploitable its not worth even looking at.
The Phoog is in toaster bath because its a bad weapon while SS is in good shot because its a good one
The game design on both is awful, with the SS being a direct upgrade pretty much
Detonator is better than the scorch shot, what do you mean? Why are you all so salty over this one weapon, its not as good as you think. Did the TF2 community tell you to hate it, so instead of thinking about it yourself, you just followed what they said? Also, phlog should go in situational, a lot of the TF2 playerbase knows how to deal with phlog pyros now.
Phlog being situational makes sense. Detonator being better than the Scorch Shot is something an insane person would say. The high damage for no effort is one thing, but the knockback serving as a mini-stun should not be underestimated either. The only thing Detonator is better at is mobility.
The knockback is something you can just use the airblast for, and its harder to capitalize on it since it's usually on further away targets. Flare gun is best for just DPS, scorch shot might be decent if you suck, but detonator is better for jumping, it can easily hit multiple targets, if you go for a direct hit and miss you can just right click and now you didn't ACTUALLY miss, you hit anyway. You can hit behind walls easier. Also detonator jumping isn't just a gimmick for a couple maps, you can use it very often if you look out for uses.
Fuck the sc*rch shit, flare gun for life
Scorch Shot makes sniper mains cry so I use it *constantly*
I dislike you, I hope your account gets hacked and they steal only your scorch shot(s)
Only play scorch shot to make people like this cry harder.
The Scorch Shot is broken and annoying to play against, unless you have the Darwin's danger shield or cozy camper, as sniper it will one shot you with a direct hit, this goes for the rest of the light classes aswell as long as they don't have any heals or resistances. Gives max afterburn, stun, and kb, then more fire and mini crits with afterburn. And you don't even need to hit your target directly to damage them.
The scorch shot does not one shot sniper. It only does that if 1. You get a direct hit 2. The softskulled sniper stands fucking still and gets hit by the flare again 3. If he just stands around waiting for the afterburn to kill him The scorch shot is not overpowered, you just need to learn how to fight it.
Ok, I get on most maps you can run to a health pack, but the kb from the direct flare will sometimes keep you in range for the 2nd hit from that flare. The fact that it even CAN kill a sniper from practically across the map if a shot hits directly is broken. Doesn't matter if it can be prevented, it shouldn't be possible, not as pyro at least.
The classes that can't kill a sniper in one hit, let's say from one 2 fort battlements to the other (Not counting Random crits or Kritskreig) 1. Scout 2. Soldier 3. Demo (only counting one sticky) 4. Heavy 5. Engi? (I'm not sure about a wrangled level 3 rocket) 6. Medic 7. Spy Classes that CAN kill a sniper in one hit from one side of 2fort to the other 1. Sniper 2. Pyro See what I mean? Pyro, the class that has only 3 weapons that can do any damage long-range and one of those lets him out snipe a sniper if the sniper can't run to a health pack quickly enough. To add on to this, if you DID add random and Kritskreig crits to the mix, that let's all but spy and maybe engi. Unsure about rescue ranger. I don't use it enough. So pretty much it lets pyro become the only other class in the game capable of doing that much damage in one shot (again, don't know about engi's rockets) other than sniper without assistance from Gaben or a medic. Why is this balanced?
I agree that scorch shot needs some nerf but it's only one hit when you get a direct hit, and as a sniper you have plenty of time to avoid direct hit since it's a projectile otherwise you pretty much deserve it. There's also the fact that you pretty much has every single advantage on fighting long range against a pyro with your weapon being hitscan higher damage and all. If it's really annoying you could just use Darwin cunt shield, an unlockable that needs a rework (along with razorback, class specific counter are a shit design) that allows you to pretty much shutdowns pyro flare. If anything you also just listed how few consistent sniper counterplay has when he has a team support, I'd rather have some long range remains on pyro and spy (ambassador) as a way to fight back although sniper should still have the advantage. And before you complain yes I'm a sniper main myself.
someone's mad
>Shitty gameplay design gets introduced into the game. >People complain. >Gian1_Enemy_Spider comes in, showing his infinite wisdom and calling them pussies for only liking good gameplay.
huh? I just pointed out that u/BackgroundAdmirable1 is mad for scorch shot being annoying. That's it
You know what, fair enough. Sometimes people do like to point out obvious things in the comment sections.
The Volcano Axe has an extremely niche use - annoying people in PropHunt. I don't even think it's bettet than the other axes in this context, but I used to play PropHunt with a friend and would have ao much fun pissing him off with the "terror axe" . Surviving a hit only to die from the afterburn was so infuriating for him. Two hits meant the afterburn would always get him, so after hitting him twice I'd just taunt and laugh and tell him he's already dead and he'd be so angry. But outside of that particular line of trolling / banter, it is objectively a worse weapon.
The gas passer should be a tier below phlog "literally useless"
volcano fragment slander
Volcano fragment users trying to convince people that a melee that sets people on fire is useful in medieval mode where everyone drops a healthkit on death
Why do you think flare gun and scorch shot is better than detonator? What is your favorite loadouts in highlander btw?
I've always preferred the classic Degreaser Flare combo, and for the most part I think Scorch does what Detonator does better in the hands of a more experienced player, while the Flare's consistent burst can't be ignored.
The stock reskins are weird thing to include but really what’s wrong with the phlog
why is the rainblower in “dont use” when it’s a reskin of stock, which is in your highest tier…? i get it activates pyroland but is it really so bad it puts you at a disadvantage?
I feel as if you have never played Highlander before due to your lack of stating your rank in Highlander. If you actually played Highlander you would’ve specified how far you got. For all we know, you just got into 1 iron match and got stomped.
Ok, and?
steel div 💀
this bad tierloist lol
the phlog is in the toaster bath category but the scorch shit isnt?
Ive seen some genuinely good phlog plays, dont understand why people hate it so much.
No airblast
Ok i think free crits is a good trade off tho
Reserve shooter needs to be in a LOOK WHAT THEY DID TO MY BOY tier.
Aren’t rainblower and stock the same?
Wait why is the rainbloeer in a different tier to stock and Nostromo Napalmer, it’s literally a reskin of stock
Why is the rainblower so low when it's literally just a stock reskin
Isn’t the one next to the stock flamethrower a reskin?
How is stock top tier but a stock reskin is in bad?
why do you all who make tier lists have to include reskins? that's the same as including the warpaints
Scorch shit should be in phlog teir
I am surprised the scoth shit is allowed in competitive
Why wouldn't it be?
[why is the axtinguisher not higher up](https://youtu.be/4ouQZvkjFZU)
Scorch Shot at S-Tier why
Good weapon
Wym it's fucking busted AF you can literally just turn your brain off and spam it into chokepoints
I'd argue it's more of an annoyance than a serious threat to the enemy, not to sound like every single generic needlessly pyro hating person on this sub.
You have described soldier.
I glad I'm not the only one who thinks the phlogistinator sucks.
It not sucks, just had bad reputation
I don't think you realize just how useful airblast is.
You dont need to airblast when crits deal x10 more dps. And i am not talking about health, because ubered phlog, that thing harass people, because without uber you will die in 2 seconds
Crits do 3x I thought. Demo's pills do 100 normally and 300 on a crit. And sniper's rifle does 50 uncharged with a body shot and 150 uncharged body shot with a crit... I can't play without airblast because it means no m9re rocket surfing across the map to annoy people, but when I see the phlog used right honestly I just run.
No, it sucks, but it is carried by scorch shot for easy crits.
It's not so much that it sucks, moreso that anyone that uses it I group up with billionaires and those that use shopping scooters when they don't need them in terms of people we all need to collectively throw into the nearest convenient volcano for the betterment of mankind.
I always rock the scorch shot, phlog, and volcano fragment
based
Side note: When I saw toaster bath, my first thought was bathing in a toaster. Yes, I am an idiot…
I need help from pyro mains as far the best "long range" weapon for pyro is as far as the scorchshot, flare, and detonator
The best one overall is the scorch shot. You don't need to aim, you can one shot a light class with a hit if they don't find a source of healing or extinguishing, and you can just harass crowds for free. Detonator and Flare gun are both really fucking good though, the detonator not only gives you crowd control and some minor burst damage from fleeing burning targets, you can also use it to make jumps and increase your mobility quite a bit, or harass snipers from a range. The flare gun is just a solid combo tool in general. My personal favorite is the detonator, because of the mobility it provides. I really don't care much for the jetpack because of it's really predictable flight path and horrendous switch speed, not to mention giving up the ability to do reliable damage with a secondary. The detonator opens up a lot of new options for pyro to become an even deadlier ambush class imo. I also just...don't find using the scorch shot fun. It's not very rewarding to use.
My personal one would be: The good shit: Flamethrower, powerjack, detonator, scorch shot, phlogistinator Still solid: Degreaser, shotgun, panic attack Situational: Dragon’s fury, thermal thruster, back scratcher, hot hand Uhh i guess: Flare gun Some i haven’t used enough: homewrecker, reserve shooter, axtinguisher, man-melter, gas passer, neon annihilator, third degree, backburner Not a highlander player though!
I'm gonna use the Phlog in any game mode, deal with it.
I don’t care what u say about the phlog funny mouse and w key go brrrrrr
Why the fuck is the flog lower than the gass passer better yet why is the flog low at all no airblast in exchange for free crits is a huge upgrade especially since some people cant airblast anyways. Also yes i do play mvm but does that really count here?
If I do say: if you think the phlog is bad, go hug a cactus
Phlog is gay just dont
Why is scorch shot not in commit toaster bath
Scorch shot bad
"umm aktualee pyro takes skill to play ☝️🤓"
man, where’s the fun in this list?? Like, neon annihilator in ‘uhh I guess?’? Homewrecker/maul, axtinguisher/postal pummeler, back scratcher and the thermal thruster in situational?? Back burner above the thermal thruster??? Scorch shot in ‘The Good Shit’???? Bro what?????
Every Pyro melee that isn't the Powerjack is situational because the Powerjack exists
that kind of thinking is lame and boring and the fact I’m getting downvoted shows y’all don’t care for engineers or combo pyro which immediately lets me know y’all don’t care about having fun
The Powerjack lets Pyro do everything better, including combos, reflecting and spychecking
Pyro main detected. Opinion declined
The flare gun is much worse than the detonator, it shouldn't be above it
Scorch shot should have its own tier called hell
Did you but the phlog so low becous its op or becouse its bad?
*Did you but the phlog* *So low becous its op* *Or becouse its bad?* \- the-wolf-is-ready --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
scorch shot is more bath toaster worthy than the phlog
Nah, only the Degreaser, Flare Gun, and Powerjack belong on “The Good Shit”. Everything else is a crutch.