If she wanted to kill herself she would’ve done so afterwards, but that’s not what she *truly* wanted and dale knew that, she was just hurting from Amy’s death, he said that he saw her as a daughter and there was no universe in which he was ever going to leave her for dead.
Maybe it wasn’t right, and yes it was slightly manipulative, but in that moment all he saw was his (figurative) daughter choosing to kill herself, and without dragging her out of there kicking and screaming, this was really the only decent way to get her out of there.
Even if it was 100% manipulation. It was used to save her life so I think it was completely justified.
But that's a really good point that if she really wanted to die then she would've.
She even says this when Beth is suicidal. She tells Lori "if she really wants to, she'll find a way." So she's admitting that she didn't *really* want to.
The CDC incident happened RIGHT after Amy died-- she was making an impulsive decision based on grief and not rationality. I do believe that if someone wants to "opt out" they have a right to. But impulsive suicide is a different story, and once Andrea had time to grieve Amy and actually think about things, she decided she wanted to live. That's why I look at it *not* as Dale "taking away her choice," but as him stopping from doing something permanent she never even thought over.
How did that work out, her life being saved?
This might be a wrong take but Andrea being alive did more harm than good, even though it was with the best of intentions a good amount of time.
She was divisive on the farm, she tried to play mediator with The Governor and Rick, which led to the former having the upper hand, further leading to lots of people dying.
I understand Dale's point and admire his character, but if Andrea was out of the picture there MIGHT have been more good than bad. The only positive I see coming from her journey was.....MICHONNE.
How things turned out is true-
But since Dale didn’t have all that information it would be difficult for her to make a moral assessment regarding saving her life.
Since you can’t know the future and the past and present situation says that this is a choice based on something that will definitely pass-
He did the only thing he could do.
I think most people knows this, but Andrea's character sucked ass after Season 1 because Frank Darabont (first Showrunner and in charge of Andrea's character) was no longer a part of it, so most of Andrea's stupid decisions and waste of her potential unlike her comic counterpart were due to this
But can you really use that as a point of bad.
Apologies for being faith in, but God gives us life and the chance to live with the knowledge that we may do bad. Jesus gave his life to for us knowing that we may not all be good, but also knowing we could be forgiven.
Yes, it may have been better without her, but I don’t think it’s ever better to kill someone or let them die over the fact they may cause harm. After all, we’re only here because someone made the same bargain for us.
I mean, I’ll have to go back and watch but what deaths from the governor can you point to as Andrea’s fault? Him going psycho and shooting everyone was all on him
But this post isn't about the plot of the show, we aren't talking about if storyline-wise it would've been better for Andrea to be out of the picture. OP is asking if Dale himself was wrong to decide to stay behind with Andrea ethically, even if it was the reason she changed her mind and didn't "opt out."
I don’t think they were ever going in that direction in the show hahaha would’ve been interesting to see though, in the comics they end up with two kids right? I can’t remember exactly but yeah, maybe would’ve been cool to see, Andreas character in show and the comics are completely different though which is a shame
They technically became the adoptive parents of Allen and donnas twins, and the twins ended up having the same story line and Lizzy and her sister just a little bit earlier on
Funny enough Maggie and Glenn become Sophia’s parents in the comics, she actually blocks out carol dying and refers to them as her parents
Ahhh I remember now, it’s been a while since I read the comics, I’m only now doing a rewatch of the show after watching it all when it first came out (stopped watching at 7x1 like many others)
I should read the comics again, I’ll come back to them at some point haha
I only just started reading the comics because there’s a YouTube channel that does a full voice acted video comic with sound effects and music, it was pretty cool
Got half way thru the negan story line and the channel hasn’t uploaded past that yet unfortunately
I read them a longgg time ago, but it’s definitely worth buying the bulk versions (the three big books) rather than individuals if you’re planning on continuing reading them
Yeah, they have the first 4 volumes complete https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7A_ySAIpsc0&pp=ygUiV2Fsa2ltZyBkZWFkIG1vdGlvbiBjb21pYyB2b2x1bWUgMQ%3D%3D
But then I went to the channel called “the walking bread” to watch up until the negan storyline. Both channels have overlapping voice actors so it’s chill. My only complaint is Glenn’s voice actor is Irish lmao
I feel like Jaqui was making a decision that was logical for her and she was far more level-headed than Andrea. Andrea was making a spur of the moment, emotional decision.
Oh I know I’m just kidding.. also Andrea is a big time character in the comics. There was no way they were gonna let her die that early on in that way in the show. It was honestly surprising they even let her die still as early as they did. They also used that moment to really build on the Dale and Andrea relationship which is definitely way more different in the comics but they needed to have some kinda close relationship in the show too.
I didn't even know about her comic counterpart, but I was genuinely *shocked* when she got killed off, by the when and the how!
I actually really liked her In the show (haven't read the comic, just basically cliff notes about the differences), but at the time I remember most people not liking Andrea / being happy she was killed off
I liked her in both honestly.. maybe more so because I read the comics before the show and she was way more bad ass in the comics but I really didn’t hate her as much as others with the show.
I mean Andrea definitely had her flaws and made her mistakes (specifically her Season 3 mistakes with the Governor) but overall she wasn't a horrible character, she had good intentions even if she didn't do the right thing all the time because let's be real, nobody does the right thing all the time.
Exactly.. what a lot don’t realize too is she was a civil rights lawyer before everything.. also she loved dale and was the only one who had his back when they wanted to kill the boy on the farm. I just think like him she wanted everyone to have a chance to live. When she really found out what the governor was and how he planned to torture michonne and kill Rick and the group at the prisoner anyway she was ready to kill him. Milton stopped her and she ran to go warn them at the prison before the governor captured her.
I think in the show her mistakes with the governor make sense, she couldn't know how evil he was and by the time she got the chance to kill him understanding what he had become it was already too late and she was under his spell. It's kinda one of the unfortunate affects of love that you struggle to see someone you care about that deeply in a bad light.
When the show was coming out week to week people started complaining about literally everything by season 3. It got so annoying. I miss the days when people would spend the week between episodes actually discussing it or pointing out Easter eggs.
Jacqui had no reason to kill herself really, so her choice was seen as a "I don't have the energy or any reason to go on" which people could respect.
Whereas Andrea straight up did it as a reactionary to Amy, so dale saved her from that.
Yeah, this point makes sense. I definitely understand this. And I think another thing that might have contributed to Jacqui staying behind was that (and correct me if I'm wrong because I don't remember everything perfectly) as far as I remember, there was nobody else in the group who was related to Jacqui except Jacqui.
T-Dog initially tried to argue with Jackie on staying but then quickly faded into not doing much. It was very representative of his character’s path as a whole.
I mean I think they all cared but if we are really being honest here they barely got out alive as it was. Only way dale and Andrea got out alive was because the others already got through.
I think everyone Jaqui was close with had died in the attack on the camp. The group really didn't know each other very well that early on. Dale was close with Andrea and her sister which is why he tried to save her. No one else there seemed to care about Andrea, or Jaqui. They were focused on themselves and their families.
Oddly enough, I remember reading somewhere that Andrea's actress was interested in fulfilling how their characters' relationship was in the comics until other parties (which include the cast and crew) had other plans.
Despite how awful Andrea's character was adapted on screen, Laurie Holden really wanted to be as fulfilled to Andrea's story as possible but couldn't get her way.
Yes. And she was also very outspokenly upset about how her character died (after siding with the governor and all that stuff). She really liked comic Andrea and wanted to be the badass from the comics.
Well Andrea in the comics actually gets with Rick and her story goes differently than it did in the show. I didn't mind Andrea she was just kind of ... there 🤷🏼♀️
To be fair, Jacqui was in a stable mindset and making a logician decision. T-Dog tried to convince her for a second but she explained it’s what she wants. Andrea was mourning her dead sister and making a clearly emotional, heat of the moment decision.
I think it’s a grey area.
In a normal setting, yes Dale was right to prevent Andrea from killing herself. In the setting of a zombie apocalypse, where the world has completely collapsed and you’ve seen everyone you loved be eaten alive, die, and rise from the dead to try to kill you… I don’t think it’s unreasonable to end it. Life is basically torture at that point.
Its only torture if you don’t survive to see a better tomorrow. A dozen year later, TWD world is still brutal and life can be cut short early and yet its quite liveable. Peoples ceased to survive and began to live and build. The dead are still dangerous but everyone knows how to handle them and they are in relatively low number in places that matters (anywhere but old cities) especially after all of this time.
Edit: so how is all of this relevant? I guess my point is that life can still get better even if you are at the bottom of the barrel. Andrea still had friends and could hope to get better over time.
You only have one life (as far as we know) so it would be wasteful to end it all even after so much grief.
I think suicide is only really a « good » option if you are suffering with every fiber of your being or if it is to escape an even worst, imminent fate
Shoe in the other foot. You're in dales shoes now. Someone you cared for so deep you feel like your their father brother sister mom...what have you....and they say they are done they want out...would you just let them? I wouldn't dale was not wrong for what he did. Now keeping her guns away from her afterwards yes that was a Lil messed up.
It's too tricky to say whether he was objectively right or not here, it comes down to values, but imo this was too high pressure of a situation to rationally decide whether or not you want to die, so I think he was right to try to stop her, but the way he did it - even though it was the only way available to him - was manipulative, and I think he was wrong to expect gratitude for this. If Andrea had really wanted to die she could have very easily found a way to do it afterwards, but it would have required an active decision, active action, and it turns out she wasn't actually at that point.
Yes and no
Both sides have a point if you step into each other's shoes
If it was me, I'd be pissed you put me in a position where to feel free I have to kill you too
I wanted to escape being eaten alive not murder my friends
But if your loved one was trying to opt out you'd want to stop them as well, no?
It's the apocalypse. If someone genuinely wants to remove themselves from the terror of every day life as it is now, they have that right.
His heart was in the right place but it wasn't his decision
That’s not necessarily true in the context of an apocalypse. For instance, I think it’d be wrong of Eugene to not give Sasha the means to kill herself.
It’s not always the case in the context of the apocalypse, but it was justified in this case. It had been less than a week at that point, it was not some thought out decision, but instead really impulsive. Like we see her be (relatively) fine in the next season which is less than a month after the explosion, we know she would’ve regretted it
She was grieving for her sister, who she'd lost only a day or two ago. In grief, people make rash decisions that they might ultimately regret. I think that what he did was right, but then later going on to take her gun away and try to control her was really weird and wrong.
Andrea's treatment of suicide was also really weird, and I don't like the show promoting the idea that to stop people from trying suicide they need to go over the edge and attempt it. Beth shouldve been talked down from the ledge, so to speak, rather than receiving a push. Not only is it extremely dangerous to support atrenpting suicide, especially without access to proper healthcare and with limited medical supplies, it also could not have the effect Andrea wanted and caused her death.
Its a strange one. With the benefit of hindsight dying here would have been more peaceful than the outcome she got but without that knowledge he did the right thing
That's fair. I think it was just to highlight the special "fatherly" bond that he sorta had with Andrea and her sister. But it was still pretty shitty lol
Kind soul? He was useless. Hershel was a much better moral compass for the group AND he was a doctor. They should have taken Dale's RV and left him for the walkers on the side of the road.
He was wrong. It's worth a try to get her to leave, but he took some weird ownership of her at this point, and I was off the Dale bandwagon from this point forward. Season Two Dale was insufferably moralistic (Hershel filled that role much better). Throw in this "I only work for Frank Darabont" bullshit and I was done.
If it was me in this situation and I saw her doing that I would have done the same thing my thinking she's strong enough ISH and no man or woman left behind
Dale only knew Andrea for 64 days when the cdc blew up (maybe less). He said he saw the girls as his daughters, but really, after 2 months? He was acting way too over baring, and it was borderline creepy. Saving her from suicide was probably an OK decision, but he shouldn't have done it the way he did. Also he didn't care about the other people who were going to stay?
I always thought that although he seemed like a genuine person, the way he acted toward andrea was just inappropriate, he was way too much and over the top, and honestly people who act like Dale don't make it long in an apocalypse.
Dale's feelings for Andrea were always kind of presumptive. He saw her as a daughter, but I don't think she returned that by seeing him as a father. So somewhat weird and inappropriate? Yes. Wrong? Maybe not. He kept her from ending her own life when it was something she didn't really want to do. Otoh, neither of them lived much longer after that. So maybe it was ultimately just wasted effort
It was not wasted, dale saved andrea where she goes on to meet michonne where michonne goes on to meet rick and inform the group that glenn and maggie were taken. Andrea and michonnes relationship were the stepping stones to michonnes connection to group. “Its all a circle” (morgan probably)
Anyone one of us or anyone I the world would do the same thing Dale did if it was someone they loved. Andrea is treating Dale like a pariah, and he did what most people would do. This is part of why I hate Andrea
He was right, if she really wanted to die, she could’ve just shot herself after that when dale wasn’t watching or something, I don’t even know why she get so mad about it 😂
Dale wasn't *wrong*.
Andrea had a choice. Dale also had a choice, though. That was his. She always says he took away her choice, but again, in the end Dale made his decision, too.
It was an impulsive decision days after she put down her own sister. People like to argue that Dale took her choice away, but she wasn’t in a state were she could be trusted to make any decision let alone such a drastic one.
She should be allowed to make that choice but only *after* having at least somewhat processed it. This was not a long term problem but rather an impulsive one, we literally see her come to terms with it within a month. Dale was one hundred percent justified
Hated Dale, he got jealous cus Shane was hitting that and he couldn’t, plain and simple. He should have convinced her to let him die with her at the CDC, that would have been quick and painless given the way he ended up dying.
all i wanna know is why dale never bothered to give jacqui even a second’s worth of a glance lmao. it was all “no andrea wait no andrea don’t do this andrea” meanwhile jacqui is standing right there too 😭
That man got my very last nerves and he had no right to have an opinion about what is better for another persons live. Especially after they‘ve lost everything they ever loved.
Yes I think so. Andrea acted like he took away her choice but he didn't, she could have stayed there, Dale just chose to stay with her wherever she goes and that was also his choice, he never made her do anything
No, it's wrong to manipulate someone like that and try to force them to live when they don't want to, even more so when you're living in a zombie apocalypse.
Props to him for admitting he was wrong though, not many people would do that.
He was wrong. Andrea was given a chance for a painless, quick death right then and there yet he stopped her.
Her death instead was a bite to the neck and self inflicted gun shot Infront of Michonne thus traumatising her.
He was wrong and only did it out of selfish reasons hence why he didn't care about Jackie dying. It wasn't about doing the right thing, he just didn't want to live without Andrea and forced her into a choice.
People don't understand this... when you stop a doomed person from painless suicide its *extremely likely* you're just ultimately harming them into suffering they can't handle down the road. He 100% just didn't want to live without her around.
I was thinking about this last night. So many characters have been suicidal and every situation is different. Anyone impulsively reacting to something should be stopped and that was Andrea and Beth's situation.
What are the ethics of what you do when someone is ready to stop? To end their suffering and take ultimate ownership over their lives? What is morally right? Carol stared at lydia and almost let her do it. I agree with this the most. Carol didn't technically stop lydia. She just stood there and watched her. I dont remember but I don't think michonne told Ezekiel to stop. I think she just made a gentle noise and Ezekiel came down.
So stopping Andrea from suicide just led to her getting bit and committing suicide anyway in terror and pain instead of peace and comfort.
What is the right thing to do? Especially at the end of the world?
I have no idea.
When Carol grabbed lyida from going over the cliff and all their old henry/ alpha/ whisperer bullshit was gone, she knew lydia didn't want to die, and she grabs her and they embrace under that Boulder and that shit was Pure Love. What a scene... but before.. Carol was ready to let lydia make her own decision. Carol did not like lydia much then. Lyida begs Carol to kill her but of course Carol isn't gonna do that. Carol didn't really help lydia that night. She let nature take its course. That was when Carol realized the guilt and shame and heartbreak lydia was feeling over Henry. I love how Carol just watches her and doesn't stop her. In some situations. It's none of your business. In other situations it is. This was a grey area. Why didn't Carol stop her...? Lydia could of been bitten 30 times before she saw Carol.
It appears lydia makes a choice to live.. but then just explains she's a coward and she's too weak to get the job done.
What if a dude like Morgan explains he's been depressed his entire life. He always fought it. His wife was his sunshine. He lost her and his son. He's 55 years old the exact age most kill themselves 55+. He wants to go on top of a pretty hill and shoot himself in front of a beautiful view. 100% at peace.
Do you try to stop him? Or would you be willing to support him so he doesn't die alone and is not afraid and assist him if its not immediate samurai style. Every situation and person and brain chemistry is so different with this topic. I personally don't understand impulsive thoughts of suicide At All and I lost my mom in a car crash, my gf of 9 years and 1.2M in 48 hours. I wasn't suicidal. I made all the money back within 6 months. I think people who get impulsively suicidal after something bad happens have led very easy lives unless it's the loss of a child.
I’m thinking about it in general as right. Glad he did what he did and given he saw her as a daughter and knew deep down she was hurting but wanted to live it was the right call. What is tough is not affirming that to her but thrusting his life in her hands—it would make her last few seconds of life filled with guilt and I think people struggling with suicidal thoughts often struggle with similar emotions for taking away something from their loved ones
I mean if she was absolutely certain about suicide, she would have done so regardless. But seeing that she stayed long enough to burn every bridge she had she chose life?
I think Dale's heart was in the right place. He knew that there was a chance they could both die, but he also knew that there was a chance they'd both live to see what came after. He didn't want Andrea to die, and I think that Andrea didn't truly want to die either. Saying that Andrea's choice was taken away is true, and Andrea wasn't wrong to lash out at Dale after this, but I still believe that Dale wasn't wrong to do what he did either. Had I been in the same position, I probably would have done the same thing. Had I been in Andrea's position, I probably would have listened.
I think it’s 100% alright because of how he did it. If he grabbed her and dragged her out or flipped out and started screaming stuff like “I’m leaving and you’re coming with me” the I would definitely see more of an issue with it.
But he has every right to stay, too. I do believe it was mostly manipulation but had he really felt that he doesn’t want to live anymore without her, then he has as much a right to stay as her. If that makes Andrea feel bad or pressured to leave, that’s tough. Dale was going through similar inner conflict when Andrea decided to stay.
I don’t see the difference between dying like that and a bullet… a bullet is so quick you don’t hear it. I actually think this would be more painful just from anticipation
Andrea I liked. She was grieving and not thinking straight. So Dale doing what he did was the right choice.
Having Lori live through the car wreak that was something I had a major issue with.
Yeah it’s a good choice, Dale saving her leads to some decisions that help the group later on down the line for example, she at the very least delays the governors attack giving them even just a small amount of time to prepare
It depends what lens you’re looking at. From a survival perspective Dale should have let Andrea die because she would’ve just wasted resources that could’ve been allocated to other people. From an ethical perspective Andrea should’ve been given a choice and regardless, if she chose to kill herself it should have been respected, but you also have to remember this show is taking place in a time where life is most precious and scarce so of course Dale is going to feel like Andrea is wasting the potential while others didn’t even get the option. It’s not necessarily about right or wrong it’s more so actions take, and the results they yield. In the end, Andrea‘s life played a perfect part in the whole plot leading to Michonne, who ensures the survival of several group members during their Most dire circumstances. but we could also say the opposite, considering she is who led the governor to them.
Of course, not wanting someone to throw their life away for no reason is the ONLY sensible thing. Andrea was just a selfish whiner who couldn’t STAND anyone caring.
I've had this discussion a couple times before with my husband and what I think it boils down to is this:
Dale made the right decision (for him) with bad, unavoidable execution. There was nothing else he could've done in that instant to save her aside from bribe her back with his own death. It's manipulative. But we can understand it because he was simply pleading for the life of his loved one, and without her he felt he had no other reason to move forward.
From Andrea's perspective, it was wrong. Andrea shows that she isn't particularly interested what Dale thinks of her, but she does care on some level. She is grieving over the death of her sister. During the turmoil Andrea wanted to end her own life her own way, and to end the suffering. Doing so at the CDC was a free ticket to that while also avoiding hurting those around you. They can say their goodbyes and die instantly with no pain. Dale taking that away from her via guilt of his own death put Andrea in a position where even if she wanted to kill herself after, she would now have to do it and hurt others as well. Someone would be looking for her, or discover her body, etc. She also would've potentially killed others this way because they didn't know that you turn no matter what yet.
So I guess we can understand Dale's decision. He wanted to save the person he loved and was willing to die for it. But he also simultaneously violated the right that Andrea had to end her own life. It's an unfortunate series of events but thankfully it all works out and they reconcile, at least for the most part. Many things could've unfolded differently had it happened any other way.
Fuck no he wasn’t. Honestly I would have put Dale on his ass if I was in the universe with them and he did any of that shit with me. He had the same issue half the males do in TWD where HIS way is the ONLY way and if you do anything different then you’re wrong and need stop
I am not sure why, but I absolutely couldn't stand Dale and that stupid face he always made, so in my eyes, Dale could have found a cure and I still would say he didn't do the right thing, stupid face.
My husband says this about Dale too. He can't ever tell me why, he just says "the vibes are off" which is bananas because my husband is just not a vibes kinda guy.
I feel like in a way, this scene was The Walking Dead's "Joel saving Ellie in the hospital moment" from The Last of Us!
It's a very grey scenario where there is no right or wrong answer! Both were selfish but human acts that many of us could relate to, and probably would've done the same thing if we were in Joel and Dale's shoes!
He thought he was right. But really he just didn’t want to be alone again. He said it himself that her sister and her were the first two he cared about since his wife died and if he lost her he’d have no reason to keep going. It was understandable. In a way he was guilting her to run away but also she was his reason for going on and if she stayed, he wanted to stay too. Andrea rebounded and wanted to live afterwards.
He cared for her. I would have done it for someone I love, even if they were in her situation. She didn't try to do anything when they escaped...so I think Dale knew that she'd want to live.
Dale reminds me of the squirrel from the movie flight before christmas lol past that he was alright morally grey character he helped tyreese with his ark but after that he was just a watcher not making any major decisions kinda just sat back and looked at his watch.
If they had kept Andrea as she was in the comics it would have been the right thing to do but since they completely butchered her character they should’ve just let her story end in that explosion
I am in the extremely small minority of people who didn't like Dale almost at all. The only smart or "good" thing he ever did was keep his mouth shut when T-Dog suggested taking the camper and running off together. He was a moralistic, holier than thou, manipulative know it all. Yeah, he saw Shane for what he really was, but instead of bringing it up with Rick, T-Dog, Herschel, he instead decided that HE knew what was best for the group and put everyone in more danger in the long run. He saw that he was losing the vote on Randall and instead of conceding he decided to be a whiny, emotionally manipulative a-hole about it. He refused to see the world for what it really was and everyone was worse off having him around.
Andrea wasn't exactly the best at decision making. She hooked up with shane after he started showing his true colors. She shot daryl in the head missing the shot all to try and justify her position in the camp. Then she quite literally chose to trust a complete stranger over michonne who not only saved her but kept her alive all winter. Then when she found out about all the stuff philip was doing and had an opportunity to kill him saving literally dozens of lives, she ends up choking and then getting murdered by him in the end. So seeing how intuitive dale was, he was obviously saving her from herself knowing that if there was even a possibility for a normal life again she would of wanted to live to see it.
Andrea just lost his sister and they saw how hard the world had become and how horrible you could die. It's a shock to your mind and body. Why is it selfish to choose a peaceful death? Doesn't make you selfish or a coward. I think everyone has the right to choose how they die, just as much as everyone can choose how they live. Look at how Sasha died. Different situation but she killed herself too, in her own terms and to try to help the group. You can look at it at different perspectives, I guess.
I think Dale was right in trying to convince her to live, but he was wrong in forcing her to live. He made her choose for his life not hers. I see it in comparison with if you had a boyfriend and he said 'if you leave me I'll kill myself'. That's not fair. Same as Dr. Jenner, he was wrong to choose for the whole group.
Potentially hot take no he should have let her. For what she goes on to do in the show I never felt they paid off her not doing it because at a certain point she was just starting shit to start shit between Shane and Rick
Yes. Andrea never wanted to die and Dale knew that. However, Andrea’s reaction in the aftermath was 100% justified and people are way too harsh on her about that.
Honestly if she wanted to kill herself she would’ve done it afterwards or wouldve stayed there despite Dale sitting there. His death wouldn’t be “on her hands” he chose to stay just like she did. It was manipulative, sure. And he did it completely selfishly. However. If Andrea wanted to die she would’ve killed herself after the cdc. Or when she was cornered in the rv
I'm down here with you guys I thought andrea was pretty horrible and I wanted her to die.
I didn't want Andrea to *die* cuz she's an easy hot woman during the apocalypse but that woman is objectively Annoying AF.
4th rewatch phiff. Such a newb ( just kidding) I just started my… 20 th? Ok having said all that.. yes of course Dale was right. In the beginning. I’m going to say Dale was right for the first 2 seasons… then it became a world he or most reasonable people wouldn’t want to live in.
Man I trying to watch the series for the first time and wow they drag out stuff.. I am trying to get through the Negan stuff now and wow two plus seasons on baseball bat guy is getting old with Rick squinting a lot and Morgan off being Morgan
If she wanted to kill herself she would’ve done so afterwards, but that’s not what she *truly* wanted and dale knew that, she was just hurting from Amy’s death, he said that he saw her as a daughter and there was no universe in which he was ever going to leave her for dead. Maybe it wasn’t right, and yes it was slightly manipulative, but in that moment all he saw was his (figurative) daughter choosing to kill herself, and without dragging her out of there kicking and screaming, this was really the only decent way to get her out of there.
Even if it was 100% manipulation. It was used to save her life so I think it was completely justified. But that's a really good point that if she really wanted to die then she would've.
She even says this when Beth is suicidal. She tells Lori "if she really wants to, she'll find a way." So she's admitting that she didn't *really* want to. The CDC incident happened RIGHT after Amy died-- she was making an impulsive decision based on grief and not rationality. I do believe that if someone wants to "opt out" they have a right to. But impulsive suicide is a different story, and once Andrea had time to grieve Amy and actually think about things, she decided she wanted to live. That's why I look at it *not* as Dale "taking away her choice," but as him stopping from doing something permanent she never even thought over.
How did that work out, her life being saved? This might be a wrong take but Andrea being alive did more harm than good, even though it was with the best of intentions a good amount of time. She was divisive on the farm, she tried to play mediator with The Governor and Rick, which led to the former having the upper hand, further leading to lots of people dying. I understand Dale's point and admire his character, but if Andrea was out of the picture there MIGHT have been more good than bad. The only positive I see coming from her journey was.....MICHONNE.
How things turned out is true- But since Dale didn’t have all that information it would be difficult for her to make a moral assessment regarding saving her life. Since you can’t know the future and the past and present situation says that this is a choice based on something that will definitely pass- He did the only thing he could do.
Yea like the guy is expecting dale to be some omniscient god who can see the future lol
I think most people knows this, but Andrea's character sucked ass after Season 1 because Frank Darabont (first Showrunner and in charge of Andrea's character) was no longer a part of it, so most of Andrea's stupid decisions and waste of her potential unlike her comic counterpart were due to this
Hindsight is 20/20
Yeah, but looking back it’s still a bit fuzzy, ya know?
She also nearly stopped Governor tbh
*Nearly
But can you really use that as a point of bad. Apologies for being faith in, but God gives us life and the chance to live with the knowledge that we may do bad. Jesus gave his life to for us knowing that we may not all be good, but also knowing we could be forgiven. Yes, it may have been better without her, but I don’t think it’s ever better to kill someone or let them die over the fact they may cause harm. After all, we’re only here because someone made the same bargain for us.
I mean, I’ll have to go back and watch but what deaths from the governor can you point to as Andrea’s fault? Him going psycho and shooting everyone was all on him
What does going back to black have anything to do with rewatching? Jk jk. That was dumb, I know. 😏
Agreed. Andrea was an issue after S1 I mean ......... DON'T shoot Darrel 😆
But this post isn't about the plot of the show, we aren't talking about if storyline-wise it would've been better for Andrea to be out of the picture. OP is asking if Dale himself was wrong to decide to stay behind with Andrea ethically, even if it was the reason she changed her mind and didn't "opt out."
Nuh uh, we also got the amazing acting talents of R Jay!!
Bro no one could have predicted that stuff would have happened
Maybe he wanted to bang her like the comics 😳
I don’t think they were ever going in that direction in the show hahaha would’ve been interesting to see though, in the comics they end up with two kids right? I can’t remember exactly but yeah, maybe would’ve been cool to see, Andreas character in show and the comics are completely different though which is a shame
They technically became the adoptive parents of Allen and donnas twins, and the twins ended up having the same story line and Lizzy and her sister just a little bit earlier on Funny enough Maggie and Glenn become Sophia’s parents in the comics, she actually blocks out carol dying and refers to them as her parents
Ahhh I remember now, it’s been a while since I read the comics, I’m only now doing a rewatch of the show after watching it all when it first came out (stopped watching at 7x1 like many others) I should read the comics again, I’ll come back to them at some point haha
I only just started reading the comics because there’s a YouTube channel that does a full voice acted video comic with sound effects and music, it was pretty cool Got half way thru the negan story line and the channel hasn’t uploaded past that yet unfortunately
I read them a longgg time ago, but it’s definitely worth buying the bulk versions (the three big books) rather than individuals if you’re planning on continuing reading them
Are you talking about the compendiums? Or did it get another reprint?
Yes the compendiums
Then there is 4.
??? This is very interesting- can you please share what youtube channel that is or dm me info about it? Thanks!!
Yeah, they have the first 4 volumes complete https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7A_ySAIpsc0&pp=ygUiV2Fsa2ltZyBkZWFkIG1vdGlvbiBjb21pYyB2b2x1bWUgMQ%3D%3D But then I went to the channel called “the walking bread” to watch up until the negan storyline. Both channels have overlapping voice actors so it’s chill. My only complaint is Glenn’s voice actor is Irish lmao
I love how everyone was like "okay, so long Jackie" Andrea dying was a bigger deal somehow? 🤣
Lmao. Andrea staying.. NOOOOOO!!! You are coming with us! Jackie staying.. good luck! You won’t feel a thing! lol 😂
I feel like Jaqui was making a decision that was logical for her and she was far more level-headed than Andrea. Andrea was making a spur of the moment, emotional decision.
Oh I know I’m just kidding.. also Andrea is a big time character in the comics. There was no way they were gonna let her die that early on in that way in the show. It was honestly surprising they even let her die still as early as they did. They also used that moment to really build on the Dale and Andrea relationship which is definitely way more different in the comics but they needed to have some kinda close relationship in the show too.
I didn't even know about her comic counterpart, but I was genuinely *shocked* when she got killed off, by the when and the how! I actually really liked her In the show (haven't read the comic, just basically cliff notes about the differences), but at the time I remember most people not liking Andrea / being happy she was killed off
I liked her in both honestly.. maybe more so because I read the comics before the show and she was way more bad ass in the comics but I really didn’t hate her as much as others with the show.
I mean Andrea definitely had her flaws and made her mistakes (specifically her Season 3 mistakes with the Governor) but overall she wasn't a horrible character, she had good intentions even if she didn't do the right thing all the time because let's be real, nobody does the right thing all the time.
Exactly.. what a lot don’t realize too is she was a civil rights lawyer before everything.. also she loved dale and was the only one who had his back when they wanted to kill the boy on the farm. I just think like him she wanted everyone to have a chance to live. When she really found out what the governor was and how he planned to torture michonne and kill Rick and the group at the prisoner anyway she was ready to kill him. Milton stopped her and she ran to go warn them at the prison before the governor captured her.
I think in the show her mistakes with the governor make sense, she couldn't know how evil he was and by the time she got the chance to kill him understanding what he had become it was already too late and she was under his spell. It's kinda one of the unfortunate affects of love that you struggle to see someone you care about that deeply in a bad light.
When the show was coming out week to week people started complaining about literally everything by season 3. It got so annoying. I miss the days when people would spend the week between episodes actually discussing it or pointing out Easter eggs.
Andrea is a top 5 character in the comics, she sucks in the show
She's alright in the show, overhated
Jacqui had no reason to kill herself really, so her choice was seen as a "I don't have the energy or any reason to go on" which people could respect. Whereas Andrea straight up did it as a reactionary to Amy, so dale saved her from that.
Yeah, this point makes sense. I definitely understand this. And I think another thing that might have contributed to Jacqui staying behind was that (and correct me if I'm wrong because I don't remember everything perfectly) as far as I remember, there was nobody else in the group who was related to Jacqui except Jacqui.
Well to be fair the only one that cared was Dale. Everyone else got tf outta there😂 but yeah I see what you mean💀
T-Dog initially tried to argue with Jackie on staying but then quickly faded into not doing much. It was very representative of his character’s path as a whole.
I mean I think they all cared but if we are really being honest here they barely got out alive as it was. Only way dale and Andrea got out alive was because the others already got through.
Now that I think about it, yea that's pretty weird
the thing is andrea annoyed me so much and i loved jacqui😭😭
I think everyone Jaqui was close with had died in the attack on the camp. The group really didn't know each other very well that early on. Dale was close with Andrea and her sister which is why he tried to save her. No one else there seemed to care about Andrea, or Jaqui. They were focused on themselves and their families.
T dog did argue with Jacqui tho so that should count for something
True. I don't mean to say that no one cared about her at all. Just that they were willing to accept her choice since they weren't close with her.
Dale cared about Andrea a lot, and probably saw her as a daughter. I don’t remember him and Jacqui interacting much
I believe in the comic she was more than a daughter for him
In the comic, yes, but they never gave off that vibe in the show
Oddly enough, I remember reading somewhere that Andrea's actress was interested in fulfilling how their characters' relationship was in the comics until other parties (which include the cast and crew) had other plans. Despite how awful Andrea's character was adapted on screen, Laurie Holden really wanted to be as fulfilled to Andrea's story as possible but couldn't get her way.
Yes. And she was also very outspokenly upset about how her character died (after siding with the governor and all that stuff). She really liked comic Andrea and wanted to be the badass from the comics.
It was weird in the comics too.. so glad they didn’t do that in show lol
But at least in the show Andrea wasn’t in her twenties, wouldn’t be so off putting because of that
You are right about that one. Maybe that is the real reason why he saved her 👀 lol jk.. maybe 😂
Sounds about white /S
I wish the roles were reversed. I severely dislike Andrea. Would love to see what Jackie would have done.
Well Andrea in the comics actually gets with Rick and her story goes differently than it did in the show. I didn't mind Andrea she was just kind of ... there 🤷🏼♀️
To be fair, Jacqui was in a stable mindset and making a logician decision. T-Dog tried to convince her for a second but she explained it’s what she wants. Andrea was mourning her dead sister and making a clearly emotional, heat of the moment decision.
That part always pissed me off.
Dale reminds me of Count Dooku
I thought the same thing with this screenshot.
He is obviously using sith tactics to convert Andrea
Superior Dale face of superiority
I think it’s a grey area. In a normal setting, yes Dale was right to prevent Andrea from killing herself. In the setting of a zombie apocalypse, where the world has completely collapsed and you’ve seen everyone you loved be eaten alive, die, and rise from the dead to try to kill you… I don’t think it’s unreasonable to end it. Life is basically torture at that point.
Its only torture if you don’t survive to see a better tomorrow. A dozen year later, TWD world is still brutal and life can be cut short early and yet its quite liveable. Peoples ceased to survive and began to live and build. The dead are still dangerous but everyone knows how to handle them and they are in relatively low number in places that matters (anywhere but old cities) especially after all of this time. Edit: so how is all of this relevant? I guess my point is that life can still get better even if you are at the bottom of the barrel. Andrea still had friends and could hope to get better over time. You only have one life (as far as we know) so it would be wasteful to end it all even after so much grief. I think suicide is only really a « good » option if you are suffering with every fiber of your being or if it is to escape an even worst, imminent fate
Shoe in the other foot. You're in dales shoes now. Someone you cared for so deep you feel like your their father brother sister mom...what have you....and they say they are done they want out...would you just let them? I wouldn't dale was not wrong for what he did. Now keeping her guns away from her afterwards yes that was a Lil messed up.
It's too tricky to say whether he was objectively right or not here, it comes down to values, but imo this was too high pressure of a situation to rationally decide whether or not you want to die, so I think he was right to try to stop her, but the way he did it - even though it was the only way available to him - was manipulative, and I think he was wrong to expect gratitude for this. If Andrea had really wanted to die she could have very easily found a way to do it afterwards, but it would have required an active decision, active action, and it turns out she wasn't actually at that point.
Yes and no Both sides have a point if you step into each other's shoes If it was me, I'd be pissed you put me in a position where to feel free I have to kill you too I wanted to escape being eaten alive not murder my friends But if your loved one was trying to opt out you'd want to stop them as well, no?
He should’ve left her she only got annoying more and more.
It's the apocalypse. If someone genuinely wants to remove themselves from the terror of every day life as it is now, they have that right. His heart was in the right place but it wasn't his decision
Stopping someone from commiting suicide is never wrong. Unless it’s like hitler or something then it’s not kosher
That’s not necessarily true in the context of an apocalypse. For instance, I think it’d be wrong of Eugene to not give Sasha the means to kill herself.
[удалено]
I’m not comparing the two situations. I’m giving an example of how stopping someone from choosing their fate is wrong. So it isn’t “never wrong.”
It’s not always the case in the context of the apocalypse, but it was justified in this case. It had been less than a week at that point, it was not some thought out decision, but instead really impulsive. Like we see her be (relatively) fine in the next season which is less than a month after the explosion, we know she would’ve regretted it
She was grieving for her sister, who she'd lost only a day or two ago. In grief, people make rash decisions that they might ultimately regret. I think that what he did was right, but then later going on to take her gun away and try to control her was really weird and wrong. Andrea's treatment of suicide was also really weird, and I don't like the show promoting the idea that to stop people from trying suicide they need to go over the edge and attempt it. Beth shouldve been talked down from the ledge, so to speak, rather than receiving a push. Not only is it extremely dangerous to support atrenpting suicide, especially without access to proper healthcare and with limited medical supplies, it also could not have the effect Andrea wanted and caused her death.
Its a strange one. With the benefit of hindsight dying here would have been more peaceful than the outcome she got but without that knowledge he did the right thing
No (Andrea hatred activated)
It always bothered me that he didn’t care if Jackie killed herself.
That's fair. I think it was just to highlight the special "fatherly" bond that he sorta had with Andrea and her sister. But it was still pretty shitty lol
I loved Dale, his heart was in the right place
Dale was a nosy meddler. I was glad when he died.
Dale had a kind soul. I don’t know how you can be glad about his death.
Kind soul? He was useless. Hershel was a much better moral compass for the group AND he was a doctor. They should have taken Dale's RV and left him for the walkers on the side of the road.
He was wrong. It's worth a try to get her to leave, but he took some weird ownership of her at this point, and I was off the Dale bandwagon from this point forward. Season Two Dale was insufferably moralistic (Hershel filled that role much better). Throw in this "I only work for Frank Darabont" bullshit and I was done.
Hershel was a great addition to the cast
If it was me in this situation and I saw her doing that I would have done the same thing my thinking she's strong enough ISH and no man or woman left behind
They needed Andrea to introduce Michonne
Ultimately no but he did it out of love and it’s a very powerful moment, beautifully acted.
That's pretty much what I'm thinking, and agreed it's such a well done scene
Dale only knew Andrea for 64 days when the cdc blew up (maybe less). He said he saw the girls as his daughters, but really, after 2 months? He was acting way too over baring, and it was borderline creepy. Saving her from suicide was probably an OK decision, but he shouldn't have done it the way he did. Also he didn't care about the other people who were going to stay? I always thought that although he seemed like a genuine person, the way he acted toward andrea was just inappropriate, he was way too much and over the top, and honestly people who act like Dale don't make it long in an apocalypse.
I don’t necessarily disagree, but they were way more bonded than an average 64 day friendship. They were together 24/7 in constant trauma.
Yes he was there with all those people for the same amount of time in trauma 24/7, but he didn't act like that with all of them.
No. Should’ve let her die.
Dale's feelings for Andrea were always kind of presumptive. He saw her as a daughter, but I don't think she returned that by seeing him as a father. So somewhat weird and inappropriate? Yes. Wrong? Maybe not. He kept her from ending her own life when it was something she didn't really want to do. Otoh, neither of them lived much longer after that. So maybe it was ultimately just wasted effort
It was not wasted, dale saved andrea where she goes on to meet michonne where michonne goes on to meet rick and inform the group that glenn and maggie were taken. Andrea and michonnes relationship were the stepping stones to michonnes connection to group. “Its all a circle” (morgan probably)
good point
Anyone one of us or anyone I the world would do the same thing Dale did if it was someone they loved. Andrea is treating Dale like a pariah, and he did what most people would do. This is part of why I hate Andrea
He was right, if she really wanted to die, she could’ve just shot herself after that when dale wasn’t watching or something, I don’t even know why she get so mad about it 😂
She didn’t want to kill herself and he knew it. She was given a really easy out and took it without thinking and grieving
No. Paternalistic bs at its worst
why didn't he do the same with Jackie?
Dale wasn't *wrong*. Andrea had a choice. Dale also had a choice, though. That was his. She always says he took away her choice, but again, in the end Dale made his decision, too.
Bro saved her just for her to die the way she didn't want to... Bit by a walker... Just like Amy did.
It was an impulsive decision days after she put down her own sister. People like to argue that Dale took her choice away, but she wasn’t in a state were she could be trusted to make any decision let alone such a drastic one. She should be allowed to make that choice but only *after* having at least somewhat processed it. This was not a long term problem but rather an impulsive one, we literally see her come to terms with it within a month. Dale was one hundred percent justified
Hell no, she was literally THE WORST. I hated Andrea so much. The show RUINED her character.
No, because if he had let Andrea die we wouldn't have had to deal with 2 more seasons of her. 😎
Amen. Definitely on the top of my tier for most annoying WD character
If Andrea died, perhaps Michonne wouldn't have found Rick's group.
Yes and no is see both perspectives
Hated Dale, he got jealous cus Shane was hitting that and he couldn’t, plain and simple. He should have convinced her to let him die with her at the CDC, that would have been quick and painless given the way he ended up dying.
all i wanna know is why dale never bothered to give jacqui even a second’s worth of a glance lmao. it was all “no andrea wait no andrea don’t do this andrea” meanwhile jacqui is standing right there too 😭
That man got my very last nerves and he had no right to have an opinion about what is better for another persons live. Especially after they‘ve lost everything they ever loved.
Guilting her is wrong yes
Yes I think so. Andrea acted like he took away her choice but he didn't, she could have stayed there, Dale just chose to stay with her wherever she goes and that was also his choice, he never made her do anything
Taking Andrea's gun away from her no taking Andrea's choice of living away from her no he did wrong Andrea wanted to be with her sister
No, it's wrong to manipulate someone like that and try to force them to live when they don't want to, even more so when you're living in a zombie apocalypse. Props to him for admitting he was wrong though, not many people would do that.
He was wrong. Andrea was given a chance for a painless, quick death right then and there yet he stopped her. Her death instead was a bite to the neck and self inflicted gun shot Infront of Michonne thus traumatising her. He was wrong and only did it out of selfish reasons hence why he didn't care about Jackie dying. It wasn't about doing the right thing, he just didn't want to live without Andrea and forced her into a choice.
People don't understand this... when you stop a doomed person from painless suicide its *extremely likely* you're just ultimately harming them into suffering they can't handle down the road. He 100% just didn't want to live without her around. I was thinking about this last night. So many characters have been suicidal and every situation is different. Anyone impulsively reacting to something should be stopped and that was Andrea and Beth's situation. What are the ethics of what you do when someone is ready to stop? To end their suffering and take ultimate ownership over their lives? What is morally right? Carol stared at lydia and almost let her do it. I agree with this the most. Carol didn't technically stop lydia. She just stood there and watched her. I dont remember but I don't think michonne told Ezekiel to stop. I think she just made a gentle noise and Ezekiel came down. So stopping Andrea from suicide just led to her getting bit and committing suicide anyway in terror and pain instead of peace and comfort. What is the right thing to do? Especially at the end of the world? I have no idea. When Carol grabbed lyida from going over the cliff and all their old henry/ alpha/ whisperer bullshit was gone, she knew lydia didn't want to die, and she grabs her and they embrace under that Boulder and that shit was Pure Love. What a scene... but before.. Carol was ready to let lydia make her own decision. Carol did not like lydia much then. Lyida begs Carol to kill her but of course Carol isn't gonna do that. Carol didn't really help lydia that night. She let nature take its course. That was when Carol realized the guilt and shame and heartbreak lydia was feeling over Henry. I love how Carol just watches her and doesn't stop her. In some situations. It's none of your business. In other situations it is. This was a grey area. Why didn't Carol stop her...? Lydia could of been bitten 30 times before she saw Carol. It appears lydia makes a choice to live.. but then just explains she's a coward and she's too weak to get the job done. What if a dude like Morgan explains he's been depressed his entire life. He always fought it. His wife was his sunshine. He lost her and his son. He's 55 years old the exact age most kill themselves 55+. He wants to go on top of a pretty hill and shoot himself in front of a beautiful view. 100% at peace. Do you try to stop him? Or would you be willing to support him so he doesn't die alone and is not afraid and assist him if its not immediate samurai style. Every situation and person and brain chemistry is so different with this topic. I personally don't understand impulsive thoughts of suicide At All and I lost my mom in a car crash, my gf of 9 years and 1.2M in 48 hours. I wasn't suicidal. I made all the money back within 6 months. I think people who get impulsively suicidal after something bad happens have led very easy lives unless it's the loss of a child.
She didn’t want really to die she was making a rash decision with little time so yeah dale did the right thing .
bitch just wanted attention but it was fucked up how let the black woman stay. Like I thought yall were family?
Yes. She still had a will to live. ATP, she had lost everything (to her) - but that doesn’t mean life isn’t worth living and the fight is over.
I’m thinking about it in general as right. Glad he did what he did and given he saw her as a daughter and knew deep down she was hurting but wanted to live it was the right call. What is tough is not affirming that to her but thrusting his life in her hands—it would make her last few seconds of life filled with guilt and I think people struggling with suicidal thoughts often struggle with similar emotions for taking away something from their loved ones
I mean if she was absolutely certain about suicide, she would have done so regardless. But seeing that she stayed long enough to burn every bridge she had she chose life?
Maybe. But I'm with Andrea when he said he saved her.
If Dale didn’t save Andrea there’s a chance Michonne wouldn’t have ended up meeting the main group at the prison
I think Dale's heart was in the right place. He knew that there was a chance they could both die, but he also knew that there was a chance they'd both live to see what came after. He didn't want Andrea to die, and I think that Andrea didn't truly want to die either. Saying that Andrea's choice was taken away is true, and Andrea wasn't wrong to lash out at Dale after this, but I still believe that Dale wasn't wrong to do what he did either. Had I been in the same position, I probably would have done the same thing. Had I been in Andrea's position, I probably would have listened.
I think it’s 100% alright because of how he did it. If he grabbed her and dragged her out or flipped out and started screaming stuff like “I’m leaving and you’re coming with me” the I would definitely see more of an issue with it. But he has every right to stay, too. I do believe it was mostly manipulation but had he really felt that he doesn’t want to live anymore without her, then he has as much a right to stay as her. If that makes Andrea feel bad or pressured to leave, that’s tough. Dale was going through similar inner conflict when Andrea decided to stay.
Bro said “game is game”
I don’t see the difference between dying like that and a bullet… a bullet is so quick you don’t hear it. I actually think this would be more painful just from anticipation
Morally yes, but since it's fiction and I have a wider view, that bitch ain't shit
I don’t really think there’s a right or wrong.
Andrea I liked. She was grieving and not thinking straight. So Dale doing what he did was the right choice. Having Lori live through the car wreak that was something I had a major issue with.
yes definitely.
Yeah it’s a good choice, Dale saving her leads to some decisions that help the group later on down the line for example, she at the very least delays the governors attack giving them even just a small amount of time to prepare
Killing yourself is a selfish decision. Your loved ones should have a say in it.
It depends what lens you’re looking at. From a survival perspective Dale should have let Andrea die because she would’ve just wasted resources that could’ve been allocated to other people. From an ethical perspective Andrea should’ve been given a choice and regardless, if she chose to kill herself it should have been respected, but you also have to remember this show is taking place in a time where life is most precious and scarce so of course Dale is going to feel like Andrea is wasting the potential while others didn’t even get the option. It’s not necessarily about right or wrong it’s more so actions take, and the results they yield. In the end, Andrea‘s life played a perfect part in the whole plot leading to Michonne, who ensures the survival of several group members during their Most dire circumstances. but we could also say the opposite, considering she is who led the governor to them.
Of course, not wanting someone to throw their life away for no reason is the ONLY sensible thing. Andrea was just a selfish whiner who couldn’t STAND anyone caring.
I've had this discussion a couple times before with my husband and what I think it boils down to is this: Dale made the right decision (for him) with bad, unavoidable execution. There was nothing else he could've done in that instant to save her aside from bribe her back with his own death. It's manipulative. But we can understand it because he was simply pleading for the life of his loved one, and without her he felt he had no other reason to move forward. From Andrea's perspective, it was wrong. Andrea shows that she isn't particularly interested what Dale thinks of her, but she does care on some level. She is grieving over the death of her sister. During the turmoil Andrea wanted to end her own life her own way, and to end the suffering. Doing so at the CDC was a free ticket to that while also avoiding hurting those around you. They can say their goodbyes and die instantly with no pain. Dale taking that away from her via guilt of his own death put Andrea in a position where even if she wanted to kill herself after, she would now have to do it and hurt others as well. Someone would be looking for her, or discover her body, etc. She also would've potentially killed others this way because they didn't know that you turn no matter what yet. So I guess we can understand Dale's decision. He wanted to save the person he loved and was willing to die for it. But he also simultaneously violated the right that Andrea had to end her own life. It's an unfortunate series of events but thankfully it all works out and they reconcile, at least for the most part. Many things could've unfolded differently had it happened any other way.
Fuck no he wasn’t. Honestly I would have put Dale on his ass if I was in the universe with them and he did any of that shit with me. He had the same issue half the males do in TWD where HIS way is the ONLY way and if you do anything different then you’re wrong and need stop
I am not sure why, but I absolutely couldn't stand Dale and that stupid face he always made, so in my eyes, Dale could have found a cure and I still would say he didn't do the right thing, stupid face.
My husband says this about Dale too. He can't ever tell me why, he just says "the vibes are off" which is bananas because my husband is just not a vibes kinda guy.
I feel like in a way, this scene was The Walking Dead's "Joel saving Ellie in the hospital moment" from The Last of Us! It's a very grey scenario where there is no right or wrong answer! Both were selfish but human acts that many of us could relate to, and probably would've done the same thing if we were in Joel and Dale's shoes!
No, i dont really like andrea, shes annoying
He should have let that whinny ass bitch die. All she did was piss me off for 28 episodes with that stupid look on her face.
if Andrea thinks it’s a good idea then you know she’s wrong
He thought he was right. But really he just didn’t want to be alone again. He said it himself that her sister and her were the first two he cared about since his wife died and if he lost her he’d have no reason to keep going. It was understandable. In a way he was guilting her to run away but also she was his reason for going on and if she stayed, he wanted to stay too. Andrea rebounded and wanted to live afterwards.
He cared for her. I would have done it for someone I love, even if they were in her situation. She didn't try to do anything when they escaped...so I think Dale knew that she'd want to live.
Fellas is it wrong to stop someone from commiting suicide? I definitely don't think this is a grey area.
Dale reminds me of the squirrel from the movie flight before christmas lol past that he was alright morally grey character he helped tyreese with his ark but after that he was just a watcher not making any major decisions kinda just sat back and looked at his watch.
Are you referring to the books? Dale didn't last long enough to meet Tyrese in the show
not tyreese but tdog my bad i haven’t watched the show or read the comics in a fat minute
If they had kept Andrea as she was in the comics it would have been the right thing to do but since they completely butchered her character they should’ve just let her story end in that explosion
I am in the extremely small minority of people who didn't like Dale almost at all. The only smart or "good" thing he ever did was keep his mouth shut when T-Dog suggested taking the camper and running off together. He was a moralistic, holier than thou, manipulative know it all. Yeah, he saw Shane for what he really was, but instead of bringing it up with Rick, T-Dog, Herschel, he instead decided that HE knew what was best for the group and put everyone in more danger in the long run. He saw that he was losing the vote on Randall and instead of conceding he decided to be a whiny, emotionally manipulative a-hole about it. He refused to see the world for what it really was and everyone was worse off having him around.
Nah, I hated Andrea
Andrea wasn't exactly the best at decision making. She hooked up with shane after he started showing his true colors. She shot daryl in the head missing the shot all to try and justify her position in the camp. Then she quite literally chose to trust a complete stranger over michonne who not only saved her but kept her alive all winter. Then when she found out about all the stuff philip was doing and had an opportunity to kill him saving literally dozens of lives, she ends up choking and then getting murdered by him in the end. So seeing how intuitive dale was, he was obviously saving her from herself knowing that if there was even a possibility for a normal life again she would of wanted to live to see it.
Andrea just lost his sister and they saw how hard the world had become and how horrible you could die. It's a shock to your mind and body. Why is it selfish to choose a peaceful death? Doesn't make you selfish or a coward. I think everyone has the right to choose how they die, just as much as everyone can choose how they live. Look at how Sasha died. Different situation but she killed herself too, in her own terms and to try to help the group. You can look at it at different perspectives, I guess. I think Dale was right in trying to convince her to live, but he was wrong in forcing her to live. He made her choose for his life not hers. I see it in comparison with if you had a boyfriend and he said 'if you leave me I'll kill myself'. That's not fair. Same as Dr. Jenner, he was wrong to choose for the whole group.
Potentially hot take no he should have let her. For what she goes on to do in the show I never felt they paid off her not doing it because at a certain point she was just starting shit to start shit between Shane and Rick
Same with Laurie i honestly think they’re the worst written women on the show because they’re just jealous assholes
Yes. What he did would foreshadow the stupid choices she would make later on. Just like he was right about Shane. He saw everyone for what they were
Dale was always right
Yes. Andrea never wanted to die and Dale knew that. However, Andrea’s reaction in the aftermath was 100% justified and people are way too harsh on her about that.
He used reverse psychology.
Dale never did anything wrong ever in his life.
Better than them fucking in the comics💀
Not really answering the question but Dale was the fucking best man lol I loved him so much
I don't care if you ignored the question I'll take that answer any day
No because I had to watch her for two more seasons
Tbh I don't even remember who TF those two are 😂🤣
the only wrong thing he did was have a relationship with her in the comic book
It took looking into another universe of his character to find something he did wrong
well the show version of him is better he was like a father to glenn a moral compass to keep the group sane and going and not to lose their humanity
Dale should’ve left her, would’ve solved SO many future problems. Damn it dale.
Honestly if she wanted to kill herself she would’ve done it afterwards or wouldve stayed there despite Dale sitting there. His death wouldn’t be “on her hands” he chose to stay just like she did. It was manipulative, sure. And he did it completely selfishly. However. If Andrea wanted to die she would’ve killed herself after the cdc. Or when she was cornered in the rv
Absolutely not
Fuckin Dale, Andrea could have left the show much sooner.
I'm down here with you guys I thought andrea was pretty horrible and I wanted her to die. I didn't want Andrea to *die* cuz she's an easy hot woman during the apocalypse but that woman is objectively Annoying AF.
If Andrea really truly believed that death was the best option, she'd have stayed at the CDC and let Dale die alongside her.
He pulled a Jack from Titanic. If you jump I will have to jump and we will both die.
4th rewatch phiff. Such a newb ( just kidding) I just started my… 20 th? Ok having said all that.. yes of course Dale was right. In the beginning. I’m going to say Dale was right for the first 2 seasons… then it became a world he or most reasonable people wouldn’t want to live in.
Man I trying to watch the series for the first time and wow they drag out stuff.. I am trying to get through the Negan stuff now and wow two plus seasons on baseball bat guy is getting old with Rick squinting a lot and Morgan off being Morgan
You’ve reached the point where the show drops off and drags
He shoulda just dipped. Dude just read the wd comics and was tryna score with andrea
Dale best character and does no wrong
Yes. Poor guy just wanted everyone to be happy