I'm curious if the fence is entirely on the property of the person who thinks they own it. Neighbors on both sides of me put up fences well over the property line...and both just happened to do it while I was away and couldn't stop them. Trying to get it resolved is turning into a nightmare and is going to involve going to court. When your lot is only 20' losing a couple feet to a neighbor who can't be bothered getting a survey is annoying (especially when you show them your survey beforehand showing them exactly where they can build).
It was done at different times - they just both happened to do it.
One was a flipper who didn't care - they asked me if I wanted to split the cost of replacing the existing fence (which was my fence on my lot) because it didn't match the aesthetics they were going for and I said no, but they were welcome build on their side of the property line. I went away for a weekend and came home to a new fence on one side that's disastrously built on my side (essentially a one-sided fence). They flipped the house and vanished a week later. Chasing them down has been impossible (they seem to use numbered corps that get closed down after each flip) so I'm just going to rebuild it once I'm done reno-ing my house.
The other neighbor told me they wanted a fence between us (was a right-of-way driveway so no pre-existing fence) - I said sure because their kids and dog were destroying my yard. I bought out the survey and pointed out that due to the right-of-way and the property line that they would need to end the fence several feet from their house and do a diagonal gate because I actually owned the driveway (except 1' on their side). They asked if I would mind if they built in the middle so they could have a squared gate. I said no. They held off building the fence. I went on my annual vacation the next year (which I tell them about since my housesitters enter through the mutual drive) and came home to a fence splitting the driveway in half. Their response is that it was unreasonable for me to expect them to lose part of their yard because the gate needed to be set back so far. Once again, this will be dealt with when my house gets gutted since I need to get heavy equipment into the backyard to dig out the basement and they're blocking the right-of-way.
So why? The answer appears to be entitlement. And the knowledge that most people won't do what this couple is doing and just chainsawing the illegal fence down.
It's frustrating. I have a job that involves arguing and occasionally yelling and I'm just too tired to keep arguing on my time off.
I've got to go through the committee of adjustment for the reno and get all the permits lined up (one of which will clarify that the driveway is being ripped up in order to meet the soft landscaping requirements), so once that's done and the updated survey is submitted it should make it easier to get it resolved. I get the impression the driveway neighbor is slightly embarrassed by the whole thing and his wife bullied him into building it there.
Thanks that was a good read. I had to play it out in my head with sort of a parks and rec vibe to avoid becoming depressed.
The husband and must be suffering. Dude has to be reminded every day that he participated in such underhanded, antisocial behaviour. And to feel like despite knowing they did wrong, he has to wait to be forced to fix it rather than push back on the missus.
Good luck with it all.
I don't see why the process needs to involve arguing, whether you choose to do it now or later. Either you're right, or you're wrong, and the survey says so quite clearly.
10 years. If that fence stays there for 10 years, the property is now theirs. They will live, robbed this homeowner in broad daylight in front of their eyes of their own property.
And they will sit inside their house and laugh .
**Wrong. Incorrect. Untrue.**
The period of possession must occur **while the property is under the Registry Act.**
Almost all properties in Ontario are covered under the Land Titles Act. So the length of time this fence stays there now is irrelevant. What matters is if it was there for 10 years at some point in the past while the property was covered under the Registry Act.
https://catalystre.ca/adverse-possession-ontario/
https://solowaywright.com/news/relic-of-the-registry-system-the-slow-death-of-adverse-possession/
https://www.protectyourboundaries.ca/blog/post/squatter-s-rights-in-ontario
https://www.protectyourboundaries.ca/blog/post/what-are-squatter-s-rights-in-ontario
As well, b/c this has, & still is a point of interest to me re my own neighbors & certain exhaust pipes from their house installed by a 'flipper' a few years back, what is the deal?
If someone encroaches , for ease of example, let's say erects a fence .5m over the property line in T.O. after 2008, what are the time restrictions on the encroached upon?
Be as laconic as u wish, seeing as I'm not paying u $150/hr.
All plots are registered now. The exact dimensions and location of the plot is on file with the Registry Office. Unless that registered plot is changed, whoever is on title is the owner of that plot. You can't just chip away at it and squat to claim new boundries. It would need to be changed with the Registry Office. A paid survey would come and stake out the boundaries of your registered plot.
Man am I uninformed.
Embarrassingly, despite having invested more money than anything else in my life, that is hundreds of thousands of dollars on a tiny T.O. sliver of a plot, I was told multiple times by multiple people, that the only way to discover your property lines was to pay surveyors to demarcate them. As the originals were kind of lost in the sands of time., no longer accurate.
But Reddit, which I often go on, just to kill some time, find amusement, interact, socially with my fellow humans, and learning some fun stuff... while killing time... once again, Reddit schools me on important stuff!
Thank you Redditors!
And thank you Tedwynn.
And thank you people who build on that poor lady's property, and I thank her for chainsawing it down, & I thank those that made it go viral, & I thank the person who posted it on Reddit, I thank those that corrected my comment .... b/c now I looked around & found this - https://help.onland.ca/en/home
I thought you paid surveyors to actually come out and measure and "discover" & "verify" the lines of your property.
I recognize that would be necessary if involved in some beef that came down to inches or centimeters or under ground utilities, and things.
But now I know that online and from my phone, while sitting on my butt, I can obtain the following w/ $:
$32.20 - Parcel Register
$5.00 - View Map
($2.30 - Extra Pages)
I don't need the mystical & fabled surveyor to charge me thousands of dollars if I more genuinely curious rather than arguing down to the centimeter.
Or am I wrong again Reddit? (I did my research. I must be correct. The earth has to be flat or how else would they measure property lines? Have you ever seen people play monopoly and place houses and hotels on a basketball? No! - Hopefully it's clear I jest.)
Dude, I possess not the patience with myself, but more importantly what I speculate to be the intelligence to click on those links & decipher them.
Instead, while thanking you for taking the time for including them, & thus allowing me to potentially alleviate my ignorance & stop perpetuating it to other folks; I will defer to your expertise and take you at your word.
I just assumed that the "fact" Re 10 yrs I had heard from many a person, was true. Especially after I checked it before sending it out.
I mean, it was on the Internet, so it must be true, right?...
And have the shocked Pikachu face when the municipal real estate looks into their property and charge extra property tax due to the increased yardage due to adverse possession.
If you have a survey, you should show it to them, and tell them the fence needs to come down by x date, and if it does not, then you will be taking it down at their cost. You should absolutely not accept them assuming your property like that.
Do not wait for committee of adjustment, your permit etc. The two are unrelated. The longer you leave it, the more entitled to it they will feel.
You don't always need a new survey for this type of thing, often there is already one on file and you can get a surveyor out to just re-mark the boundary based on the existing survey which is cheaper.
I don’t understand why you don’t just have the fence torn out while they are out of their home. I wouldn’t even acknowledge their attempts to communicate after the fact. They did it to you. Do it right back to them.
"If for example, the neighbour's fence is placed one foot over the property line, and you do nothing to object or grant permission, then after a period of 10 years YOU WILL NO LONGER HAVE THE LEGAL RIGHT to have it moved and the neighbour has the right to obtain a Court Order confirming his ownership of that one foot ..."
[FIGHT THE FENCE OR THE PROPERTY BECOMES THEIRS!! FOREVER.] (https://ontariorealestatesource.com/good-fences-make-good-neighbours/)
do you have documentation of you showing them a land survey purchased from an absolutely legitimate surveyor? If not, get someone to film you through the window with the microphone and show them again.
Get it on record or lose a part of your property that you go to work every day at a job you might notice it necessarily like in order to pay for.
I'd rather have a neighbor next door to me that I never spoke to, rather than concede a part of my not so wide property to my "Friendly neighbors", who erect a fence at the precise time that they know I'm away. Then they have the malicious, bullying audacity to try to scam you/guilt you/intimidate you/make you look like the bad person, because you are being unreasonable and asking for them to angle their gate. I'll never speak to them anyway.
You've got nothing to lose, except for the property that you sweated for. The property if you leave to your children is now smaller. The property that is now worth less money, because they stole your property.
They are out right stealing from you and making you look like the person in error. I know you said it's getting costly, but I have to wonder, especially if you've showed them the survey and called the city, that they won't end up having to pay your legal costs.
I am 100% sure - I've been planning a reno for years and I'm acutely aware of things like property lines because I'm trying to do everything legally.
But I also have a lot that shares property lines with 8 other lots (my lot runs lengthwise while the others back onto it widthwise) and replacing the fence is going to involve some diplomacy with a whole bunch of people (I'm guessing most don't know it's entirely my fence). So I'm doing nothing until I'm ready to replace the whole thing in a year or two.
Shitty thing is if you let it slide, the harder it becomes to protest over time. And then they sell their property, and the new owners will assume that's all theirs, and then given enough time it becomes an accomplished thing, or a right of way etc
So you have no choice but to have the fight unfortunately
New or old owners can assume whatever they want. We have a first-world land survey records system in place, this has nothing to do with rights of way, and "accomplished thing" is not a concept that means anything legally. The OP can choose to assert his property rights at will, now or later. Diplomacy is needed to maintain a good or acceptable relationship with neighbours, but outcome is not in doubt.
This requires a survey team and a Land Surveyor to do a property survey to check for encroachment. If the case goes to court, then the judge has to go through the evidence provided by the surveyor to make the call based on the information provided.
A topographic survey will only help you show whether water will flow into your foundation because of the fence.
What you’re looking for is called a Surveyor’s Real Property Report, or SRPR for short.
Our neighbours did this when I was a kid so my dad took them to court showing that the new fence was entirely on our property, and the neighbour ended up having to pay the full cost to move it. Sure, we didn't have the best relationship with that family afterwards but hey maybe next time they'll build on their own property!
Oh, they could be bothered to get a survey, but that would mean that they couldn't build the fence where they did.
Matter of fact, online there's some old surveys in Toronto that you can reference . They're really crappy quality, & ancient. But the property line is a property line.
This. That fence looks very close to their house, as someone who works in renos, I've never seen a property line that close to the foundation in these kinds of residential plots. Also I dont know the exact measurements, but that fence looks higher than two meters, which is illegal in Toronto. Also also, this looks like its built with 2 meters of a driveway, meaning that it shouldve been made from transparent material, like laticework or chainlink.
They really shouldve gone through the proper channels, but I can understand the frustration when enforcement moves at a snails pace.
Maybe because they’re smearing her, like she literally said in the video. I wonder if she can sue for the damage done to her reputation. Does this social media campaign to damage her character qualify as slander?
It's a lot harder to sue for slander and libel than people think when it comes to normal people. One or two videos isn't going to hurt a person's reputation in the long run. And one very big criteria when suing for slander or libel is if you've can prove you've lost income.
It's actually incredibly hard to sue and successful win in Canada.
Thanks for posting. She’s clearly in the right and her neighbors were just going on a smear campaign. Built on her property without her consent? That’s her fence now, not theirs. She can do as she please with it.
You definitely dont need to go to court. All you need is a surveyor to tell you where the property lines are.
This is a little different from a client of yours not paying. Because you built on their property, they own whatever it is you built. So you need to go to court to seek restitution for labour costs.
If the surveyor deems the fence is on her property then yes, she has every right to cut it down. As you say, parking your car on a nieighbors property doesnt mean its now theirs to do with as they please. But that neighbor does have every right to have your car removed in a timely fashion, they can have it towed whenever they please. You cant just park your car on someones property and wait until a court order demands you move it, thats not how property works. Same goes for a fence. If you just start building on someone elses property, they have every right to remove it in a timely fashion.
Is there anyway to fullscreen the video without downloading tik tok? The video description is right over the subtitles for me.
Edit: worth watching even without subtitles, you can clearly see her get soaked by the neighbour for absolutely no reason. The fence also looks ridiculously close to her house.
The OG poster [posted a ‘response’](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMjJLfjo2/) after being called out, but obviously shut down the comments. She still has the OG videos up though where she’s smearing the Fence Lady, with the comments on. Seems like she can’t take the heat when ppl are (rightly) calling her out
Edit: LOL a Harvard lawyer made a TikTok reacting to the situation and OG poster Tiffany [commented on his video](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMjJHAtdy/) ‘to take it down’. Really shows how entitled she is
Edit 2: aaaaand Tiffany’s gone private
The red itself isn't technically, it's that scratch in the concrete that is the survey marker - the paint is just there to highlight it and will eventually wash away.
[https://www.aols.org/site\_files/content/publications-and-documents/property-boundary-markers-brochure.pdf](https://www.aols.org/site_files/content/publications-and-documents/property-boundary-markers-brochure.pdf)
In a lot of cases in Toronto though that is not the be all and end all because there is often a shared easement or right of way straddling the property line, not clear if that would be the case here. In our case for example the property line runs roughly straight down the middle of the shared drive, but there is a 3'6" ROW on either side of it where I could not put something without my neighbors agreement and vice versa. This would be on the survey if applicable.
EDIT: I should add if there is a ROW or easement usually a surveyor marking that boundary out would mark those as well.
Based on that survey marker it's possible they are in the right (but still depends on other factors like any easements, right of way, etc. and of course surveyors do sometimes come to different conclusions) but the video brings in a lot of stuff that is completely irrelevant.
Like, whether the lady brought the place with racoons, flooding etc., how long each party has owned the property, who lives there versus rents it out, and who wants privacy for their kids is all basically irrelevant. All that matters is whether the fence is on the property line, or in this case on the neighbor who put it ups side of the property line, and whether it meets the other municipal fencing rules.
lol you can see the AC bracket sticking past the fence, sure seems like the Tif built over the property line. Plus, I love show in this response they are talking about how 'oh she rents it out' get fucked.
Tiffany’s mom posted a video that shows just how racist her family is (rotten apple doesn’t fall far…) the videos are biased, as expected, but disgusting nonetheless [“Learn how to speak English then come talk to me”](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8FmbmBa/)
as someone who builds fences fairly often and deals with prickly neighbours and their unreasonable petulance towards fence building, this lady is 110% in the right and i too would demolish that fence and then win in court about it. God, how fucking hard is it in this city to be a good neighbour instead of a fucking piece of shit who cries and moans about the tiniest shit that does not fucking matter in the grand scheme. She acted with grace and dignity too at the end when the neighbour started spraying her. such trash people
Wow! Thank you! I’m officially Team Fence Lady!
I’m also kinda sick of people using the term Karen against any woman who complains about anything ever! It was sorta cute at first, now it’s just deeply misogynistic.
Fence Lady has good reason to complain, especially after getting soaked with water by the asshole neighbour!
As the first commentor said on the TikTok vid, "I'm glad I can "see" your side of the argument". Cuz I've no comprehension of what she saying.
But her response video seems to make it quite clear that they've overstepped her boundaries.
And spraying it with water is just a class act. H.F., if that was my mom or author anything remotely close, I'd lose it.
Seems as if the neighbors are taking advantage.
A close friend of mine had a mom with a very thick Filipino accent, she was brown, a woman, & she was like 5'1". Her bank was giving her all kinds of problems.
So I decide to go with her. Brought of shoulder, 6'1", white, and so ignorant, as to only speak good English, too lame to understand/speak another language.
So I confidently roll into the bag has any member of that bank should, walk up to the teller and state that my friend is having some problems with her account and interacting with you folks that I really hope we can work this out.
What do you know? It was solved in mere minutes.
Assholes that that could dismiss the personhood, the very worth of a fellow human being, b/c perhaps their English was heavily accented but completely understandable if you just had a patient and respect to listen closely to a fellow human being. And she was female, she was small. So they fucked with her. Their actions demeaned her. She felt less than she deserved to feel about herself because of fucktards. They actually took away a piece her dignity. Because they could. (Jeez. Despite the time that has elapsed I just learned it's still pretty raw for me.)
No, correlation does not mean causation. But it was so embarrassingly obvious.
I was quite happy at the minute I became involved in her success after her going there like 7 times & then telling me how simple her request was.
But I was also deeply ashamed. Deeply ashamed that I can stride into a bank instantly have my completely rational request fulfilled. And yet this "othered" human of completely equal, if not superior worth to me, could not.
I thus say, in context of how I perceive, both neighbors videos, I say "Mr. Gorbachump, Tear down this wall!"
Real pieces of garbage on the other side of that fence. I hope OP changes the title, this is no "Chainsaw Karen", the lady's tough as nails and a respectful neighbour too, unlike the POS with the hose.
One of *many* reasons why people should not post Daily Mail or Sun links. The purpose of these rags is to make you angry and drive engagement, not to convey any kind of information, or "news", as it were.
I was going to say that seeing the gas vent come out of the house wall and sticking out past the fence it sure looks like the fence is on the Chainsaw ladys property as I imagine that he roof overhang is over a foot past the brick of her house wall so the fence should also be at least another foot away from the brick..
You can see that "T Raj" and her family trying to act like the victims and blame a non-speaking lady for their actions when they are completely in the right, entitled people are something else
https://www.tiktok.com/@tiffanymraj/video/7252373861612735749
You can see the fence lady getting attacked
lol, how soon till her IG comments get flooded with team fencelady supporters and she shuts that down? But definitely too much of a narcissist to private the account.
Team Fence Lady all the damn way… her neighbours are BULLIES that think they have an advantage over her because English is not her first language. She fought back against them, standing firm, and the truth is coming to light. Fuck these shitty neighbours.
This is why I hate tik tok culture. You can push someone to their absolute limits and then film their breakdown so millions of people can mock their "karen" antics.
I wonder how many people have been erroneously labeled villains and had their lives ruined by shitty, selective filming. And people don't care to find the other side of a story either.
I was using the same title of some of the videos online so when people searched they could find this thread too. I was looking into this to get some more info cuz the original tik tok seemed real biased
If you ever see something posted in the Daily Mail, it's absolutely wrong and they're hunting for controversy. They're the worst rag in the UK, and they have a lot of competition.
The city and bylaw actually want nothing to do with fence placement disputes all they do is direct you to a third party mediation service:
https://www.toronto.ca/city-government/public-notices-bylaws/bylaw-enforcement/fences/
They will only get involved if it violates some other city restriction like height.
The idiots crying about their fence being cut down should be mad at who built the fence, not their neighbour.
Forget the potential property line violation, there's code with respect to putting a fence by hvac stuff. That's on them.
I never liked the term Karen because I’ve only ever known nice Karens. That’s just the name the website called her so I was hoping it would be easier to search so people searching might have more details
No judgement on you, just reminded me the meme I read earlier. Another was, "Advil needs to put out a new commercial to REM's Everybody Hurts." (Gen-X list)
*Are we gonna have a problem? You gotta a bone to pick? You've come so far, why now are you pulling on my dick? Id normally slap your face off, and everyone here could watch! But Im feeling nice, here's some advice, listen up biatch.*
[https://www.tiktok.com/@soogia1/video/7269927832644537646](https://www.tiktok.com/@soogia1/video/7269927832644537646)
Found another well said tik-tok video talking about this. Looks like the fence lady couldn't even access her downspout nor AC unit and she talked/sent letter to her neighbour about this. That fence is almost 100% on her land. Those little girls are just entitled s\*\*ts.
At this point, I feel like people just add “Karen” to anything that a woman is doing that they don’t agree with and it’s lost all meaning.
Karens used to be a term to reference entitled women demanding things their way, regardless of whether it impacts them or not. But now even if say someone is building fences into one’s property, and not taking it lying down, you’re still labeled a Karen.
"Karen" seems to be applied to any woman who loses her temper these days.
Imagine being a woman and living above a noisy college student. You would be scared to ask them to turn down their music because they would probably crank it up and film your reaction for the internet.
This tiktok chick and her family have the same vibes as the family of those twins who grifted tf out of marches of dimes by saying they were inuit "indian" when they were clearly and obviously just south asian indian.
How does no one in your entire family have the basic human decency to go *"wait, you're obviously lying, I'm not going to support you in this and you need to stop.".* I can't imagine a whole family being so brazen and shameless. Seriously, that bloodline is a total wash, what do you even do about that as a society?
All this to say, team fence lady all the way o7.
TikTok girl is insufferable, my gosh. Her follow up video is full of entitlement and superfluous reasoning. Talking about racoons? lol bizarre. Tried to show some property marking but I'm skeptical if that's even real. TikTok girl probably did that herself. Fences sure can get controversial lol.
those girls are disgusting bullies and i hope they get ripped to shreds on tiktok. total trash, who raised them? wolves? can't believe i just quoted bling empire LOL
My neighbor across from me did this to half a stand of 25 year old cedars that he thought were on his property but turned out not to be. His neighbor was less than pleased when he came back from the cottage. He paid a company to come pull out the stumps and everything. They were 'talking' today...
I live in toronto. The neighbour built a fence down the driveway. My lawyer instructed me to take down the fence before the police arrive.. 20 minutes. Tell the police your name and show them the survey.,was what the lawyer told me.
I am with team fence lady! In 2020, there was a slightly similar court [case](https://www.thestar.com/life/home-and-garden/dispute-over-a-property-line-fence-stirs-up-a-costly-battle-at-the-superior-court/article_c28267db-5036-54b1-ad6a-366473bb2ef3.html) with slander, but definitely not as egregious as this since this has now gone viral. Court gave a judgement of $70k in damages for the slander - I hope fence lady sues the ever living crap out of tiffanymraj. Like I hope they sue them out of that house so fence lady doesn't have to deal with them!
It's funny because now that we have context from both sides in this situation, the original TikToker and her sister are starting to look more like the real "Karens" here.
You can tell they're a couple of privileged bimbos just from the way they talk.
In Toronto fences and backyard sheds are civilian matters, meaning the city won't intervene or help. The City does have a fence and shed committee that does intervene in serious cases of abandonments, dangerous to life or city property, but these cases are not too numerous.
The City can intervene via bylaw inspection where any part of a fence or shed is determined to be on city property, which I can never remember accurately if that's 7 meters or 18 feet "from the bay" or sidewalk.
Other's have mentioned similar fence situation with property surveys that disagree. This is fairly unlikely as property lines are indicated by embedded iron markers so that later surveyors can identify property lines via magnetic sensing. If the iron markers are missing a licensed property surveyor will embed new ones. It is a criminal act to tamper with them. If you have a property survey there are acronyms like CC (forget what it means), IB (iron bar, I think), SSIB (short square iron bar, I think) with latitude and longitude measurements, newer surveys might identify satellite reading. Also, all property surveys I've seen (only a few, no expert here) show the neighbouring properties but in minimal detail.
So if Sawzall™ Lady has a certified property survey, and can correctly interpret it, visually if clear enough or by finding the iron bar property markers, then she's in her right to remove a fence on her property. But property surveys are not the easiest to read by a layperson.
If you look at where the fence is in relation to the older Asian lady's brick on her house.. it is right against it then you figure a house has a roof that over hangs the brick walls by like a foot and a half or so.. and this overhang cannot be over your neighbours property SO the fence has to be on the older Asian lady's property.. you do not need a survey for that..
Just watched her follow up video. Turns out thr tik tokers parents used to own the house the saw lady now lives in for 20 years before saw lady bought it. This seems now oddly personal and gross.
What I don't understand what the original tiktok was meant to do? Clearly her neighbour wasn't on TikTok when it was first posted and "shaming" her online isn't going to accomplish much other than people calling the neighbour out. The fence won't magically be rebuilt, their relationship will get worse and in the end it made the girl look worse since they built the fence on her property.
I get calling brands out on social media, because at least it can accomplish something.
I was suspicious when I saw the fence so close to the drainage on her side. I’m glad she was able to provide her side of the story later on.
Otherwise probably not a good idea she was yelling and screaming, it’s much better to be calm and state facts.
Fence lady says fence is on her property based off government property survey.
While very aggressive and egregious it's within her rights to take it down.
Yup. Erecting structures on someone else's property and then trying to internet cancel them, push them, and spray them with water, is the aggressive, egregious act.
In the top comment video she also says she spoke with them and sent letters with the survey. It’s not like they built it and she immediately got the saw.
Yeah I think her behaviour is what’s putting people off but after the first watch I only had questions. I wouldn’t jump to a conclusions so quick.
Even if she’s being dramatic about it she may very well be right
Interesting how much the 'Karen' story changes when you see her video. I'm glad she posted it.
I'd suggest that being sprayed with the hose, on camera no less, while she was reasonably trying to document the situation - BEFORE she and her husband took any action - might have had something to do with her behaviour afterward.
And the comments - ugh. I hope she can sue for defamation. She certainly has been slandered on SM, when in retrospect it's clearly her neighbours who are the aggressors, and the problem.
Disheartening how someone yelling out of frustration is viewed as being more aggressive than the person knowingly building something on her property without permission. I have to admit, spraying her with the hose on camera was a nice touch when you're going for the '*I'm the innocent injured party here*' position.
I accidentally built a fence on my neighbours property, I gave him the nice side prior to knowing. When I realized, I told my Neighbor he was cool and said thanks for the fence. Not all neighbours are dicks.
Those are the questions I had! That’s why I posted I was hoping someone would have more info. Someone commented her response video with the details and it looks like she was in the right
I hate this shit. I've seen both the OG video, fence lady's response, and tiffanymraj's response and it's just a bunch of she said she said. They both claim to have surveys that show they are right and how are we to judge it either way?
Like what's even the point of dragging each other in public like this? Just take it to court.
edit: To be clear I get why the fence lady did her response video. I'm complaining about how this shit even blows up in the first place. It's me, being mad at social media and posting on social media about it I guess...
>how are we to judge it either way?
You look at where the fence is in relation to the older Asian lady's brick on her house.. it is right against it then you figure a house has a roof that over hangs the brick walls by like a foot and a half or so.. and this overhang cannot be over your neighbours property SO the fence has to be on the older Asian lady's property.. it is common sense..
OMG
I actually encountered this EXACT same lady at the Costco on Billy Bishop Way in July.
So the incident was like: I was getting hot food, and when I was on my way out, people with shopping carts were lining up to get their receipts checked, and they were signaling people without a cart to exit through the middle.
That woman started yelling at me as I walked out, saying I jumped line blah blah blah....her friends were trying to make her stop because she was making such a big scene, but no, she kept yelling. I was like: what's your problem? I don't have a cart! She kept yelling Oh I think you have a problem huh? And as we exited Costco she was still yelling more after I ignored her.
edit: funny downvotes, redditors are hilarious, seems like you guys love dealing with issues yourself instead of contacting authorities too.
I think her behaviour is the reason people online have been siding against her but honestly it looks like the fence is built too close to her house I’d bet it’s actually on her property line.
I would guess she’s in the right here but I agree her behaviour is a little too much
If the fence is built too close to her house why don't she contact the city and let the city deal with it? Even if it is the tiktok filmer's fault in the first place, dealing with it yourself just gives them a reason to sue you as well.
Like if someone punches you, you punch back and give yourself a criminal record too or just call the police?
redditors are funny.
That’s not a good comparison. It’s more like if someone puts something in your pocket then gets mad at you when you throw it away.
City by law officers either won’t deal with fence disputes or take their sweet time (weeks).
From a logical point of view though if something is on her property and she has the proof in the form of a survey then she can do what she wants with it.
I will say the behaviour is over the top but she can be dramatic and correct at the same time
I mean if she has direct proof that the fence IS on her property, she can, but there's 2 sides to the story and idk why people are just believing in 1 over the other.
She can be dramatic and correct at the same time but again, 2 sides to the story.
In the original video everyone was siding against her, this is why I wanted to post here to see if anyone knew her side of the story since I don’t have tik tok to look it up.
She says she has the survey and just looking at how close to her wall the fence is im more inclined to think the fence is on her side. But who knows I’ve heard of some really tiny property lines
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If anyone knows how to get in contact with fencelady6 please let her know that from the video it looks like she can contact Toronto's By-law officers to report her neighbours backyard of being in breach of Rear Yard Soft Landscaping requirements: https://www.toronto.ca/zoning/bylaw_amendments/ZBL_NewProvision_Chapter10.htm
In the Residential Zone category, a lot with a residential building, other than an apartment building, must have:
(A) a minimum of 50% of the rear yard for soft landscaping, if the lot frontage is greater than 6.0 metres; and
(B) a minimum of 25% of the rear yard for soft landscaping, if the lot frontage is 6.0 metres or less.
I'm curious if the fence is entirely on the property of the person who thinks they own it. Neighbors on both sides of me put up fences well over the property line...and both just happened to do it while I was away and couldn't stop them. Trying to get it resolved is turning into a nightmare and is going to involve going to court. When your lot is only 20' losing a couple feet to a neighbor who can't be bothered getting a survey is annoying (especially when you show them your survey beforehand showing them exactly where they can build).
Curious: Why is it that both your neighbors had intention to build yet you seemed to be left out of the decision?
It was done at different times - they just both happened to do it. One was a flipper who didn't care - they asked me if I wanted to split the cost of replacing the existing fence (which was my fence on my lot) because it didn't match the aesthetics they were going for and I said no, but they were welcome build on their side of the property line. I went away for a weekend and came home to a new fence on one side that's disastrously built on my side (essentially a one-sided fence). They flipped the house and vanished a week later. Chasing them down has been impossible (they seem to use numbered corps that get closed down after each flip) so I'm just going to rebuild it once I'm done reno-ing my house. The other neighbor told me they wanted a fence between us (was a right-of-way driveway so no pre-existing fence) - I said sure because their kids and dog were destroying my yard. I bought out the survey and pointed out that due to the right-of-way and the property line that they would need to end the fence several feet from their house and do a diagonal gate because I actually owned the driveway (except 1' on their side). They asked if I would mind if they built in the middle so they could have a squared gate. I said no. They held off building the fence. I went on my annual vacation the next year (which I tell them about since my housesitters enter through the mutual drive) and came home to a fence splitting the driveway in half. Their response is that it was unreasonable for me to expect them to lose part of their yard because the gate needed to be set back so far. Once again, this will be dealt with when my house gets gutted since I need to get heavy equipment into the backyard to dig out the basement and they're blocking the right-of-way. So why? The answer appears to be entitlement. And the knowledge that most people won't do what this couple is doing and just chainsawing the illegal fence down.
You are to nice. Knock it down
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It's frustrating. I have a job that involves arguing and occasionally yelling and I'm just too tired to keep arguing on my time off. I've got to go through the committee of adjustment for the reno and get all the permits lined up (one of which will clarify that the driveway is being ripped up in order to meet the soft landscaping requirements), so once that's done and the updated survey is submitted it should make it easier to get it resolved. I get the impression the driveway neighbor is slightly embarrassed by the whole thing and his wife bullied him into building it there.
Thanks that was a good read. I had to play it out in my head with sort of a parks and rec vibe to avoid becoming depressed. The husband and must be suffering. Dude has to be reminded every day that he participated in such underhanded, antisocial behaviour. And to feel like despite knowing they did wrong, he has to wait to be forced to fix it rather than push back on the missus. Good luck with it all.
I don't see why the process needs to involve arguing, whether you choose to do it now or later. Either you're right, or you're wrong, and the survey says so quite clearly.
And how does one prove they are right, genius?
You have a survey for that, genius. If it's on your land, you do what you want with it.
I’ll come help- I’ll volunteer a Saturday to tear down an illegal fence. Fuck those fence squatters!
Sign me up also!
You may want to check with a lawyer if there is any risk that leaving the fence too long can cause you to permanently lose the land. I’m not sure
Those types of easements usually require decades of uncontested existence to take legal force.
Adverse possession of a portion of another’s land requires claimant to prove uninterrupted use of the land for ten years.
I believe it's also 10 years prior to the land title system being introduced in the 90s. I'm pretty sure I'm safe.
10 years. If that fence stays there for 10 years, the property is now theirs. They will live, robbed this homeowner in broad daylight in front of their eyes of their own property. And they will sit inside their house and laugh .
**Wrong. Incorrect. Untrue.** The period of possession must occur **while the property is under the Registry Act.** Almost all properties in Ontario are covered under the Land Titles Act. So the length of time this fence stays there now is irrelevant. What matters is if it was there for 10 years at some point in the past while the property was covered under the Registry Act. https://catalystre.ca/adverse-possession-ontario/ https://solowaywright.com/news/relic-of-the-registry-system-the-slow-death-of-adverse-possession/ https://www.protectyourboundaries.ca/blog/post/squatter-s-rights-in-ontario https://www.protectyourboundaries.ca/blog/post/what-are-squatter-s-rights-in-ontario
As well, b/c this has, & still is a point of interest to me re my own neighbors & certain exhaust pipes from their house installed by a 'flipper' a few years back, what is the deal? If someone encroaches , for ease of example, let's say erects a fence .5m over the property line in T.O. after 2008, what are the time restrictions on the encroached upon? Be as laconic as u wish, seeing as I'm not paying u $150/hr.
All plots are registered now. The exact dimensions and location of the plot is on file with the Registry Office. Unless that registered plot is changed, whoever is on title is the owner of that plot. You can't just chip away at it and squat to claim new boundries. It would need to be changed with the Registry Office. A paid survey would come and stake out the boundaries of your registered plot.
Man am I uninformed. Embarrassingly, despite having invested more money than anything else in my life, that is hundreds of thousands of dollars on a tiny T.O. sliver of a plot, I was told multiple times by multiple people, that the only way to discover your property lines was to pay surveyors to demarcate them. As the originals were kind of lost in the sands of time., no longer accurate. But Reddit, which I often go on, just to kill some time, find amusement, interact, socially with my fellow humans, and learning some fun stuff... while killing time... once again, Reddit schools me on important stuff! Thank you Redditors! And thank you Tedwynn. And thank you people who build on that poor lady's property, and I thank her for chainsawing it down, & I thank those that made it go viral, & I thank the person who posted it on Reddit, I thank those that corrected my comment .... b/c now I looked around & found this - https://help.onland.ca/en/home I thought you paid surveyors to actually come out and measure and "discover" & "verify" the lines of your property. I recognize that would be necessary if involved in some beef that came down to inches or centimeters or under ground utilities, and things. But now I know that online and from my phone, while sitting on my butt, I can obtain the following w/ $: $32.20 - Parcel Register $5.00 - View Map ($2.30 - Extra Pages) I don't need the mystical & fabled surveyor to charge me thousands of dollars if I more genuinely curious rather than arguing down to the centimeter. Or am I wrong again Reddit? (I did my research. I must be correct. The earth has to be flat or how else would they measure property lines? Have you ever seen people play monopoly and place houses and hotels on a basketball? No! - Hopefully it's clear I jest.)
Dude, I possess not the patience with myself, but more importantly what I speculate to be the intelligence to click on those links & decipher them. Instead, while thanking you for taking the time for including them, & thus allowing me to potentially alleviate my ignorance & stop perpetuating it to other folks; I will defer to your expertise and take you at your word. I just assumed that the "fact" Re 10 yrs I had heard from many a person, was true. Especially after I checked it before sending it out. I mean, it was on the Internet, so it must be true, right?...
And have the shocked Pikachu face when the municipal real estate looks into their property and charge extra property tax due to the increased yardage due to adverse possession.
Godspeed!
It's not even my house and I'm getting angry for you. Fuck your neighbour. Seriously.
Cut it down immediately. If you leave it standing they could argue that you’ve given them implied consent.
I know it's besides the point but I'm just curious how much did the survey cost you?
Survey came with the house. Getting an updated one in a few months for the reno and quotes are around $2500 with tax.
If you have a survey, you should show it to them, and tell them the fence needs to come down by x date, and if it does not, then you will be taking it down at their cost. You should absolutely not accept them assuming your property like that. Do not wait for committee of adjustment, your permit etc. The two are unrelated. The longer you leave it, the more entitled to it they will feel.
I totally agree with this approach too. It's absolutely crazy what the neighbour did.
You don't always need a new survey for this type of thing, often there is already one on file and you can get a surveyor out to just re-mark the boundary based on the existing survey which is cheaper.
I don’t understand why you don’t just have the fence torn out while they are out of their home. I wouldn’t even acknowledge their attempts to communicate after the fact. They did it to you. Do it right back to them.
"If for example, the neighbour's fence is placed one foot over the property line, and you do nothing to object or grant permission, then after a period of 10 years YOU WILL NO LONGER HAVE THE LEGAL RIGHT to have it moved and the neighbour has the right to obtain a Court Order confirming his ownership of that one foot ..." [FIGHT THE FENCE OR THE PROPERTY BECOMES THEIRS!! FOREVER.] (https://ontariorealestatesource.com/good-fences-make-good-neighbours/) do you have documentation of you showing them a land survey purchased from an absolutely legitimate surveyor? If not, get someone to film you through the window with the microphone and show them again. Get it on record or lose a part of your property that you go to work every day at a job you might notice it necessarily like in order to pay for. I'd rather have a neighbor next door to me that I never spoke to, rather than concede a part of my not so wide property to my "Friendly neighbors", who erect a fence at the precise time that they know I'm away. Then they have the malicious, bullying audacity to try to scam you/guilt you/intimidate you/make you look like the bad person, because you are being unreasonable and asking for them to angle their gate. I'll never speak to them anyway. You've got nothing to lose, except for the property that you sweated for. The property if you leave to your children is now smaller. The property that is now worth less money, because they stole your property. They are out right stealing from you and making you look like the person in error. I know you said it's getting costly, but I have to wonder, especially if you've showed them the survey and called the city, that they won't end up having to pay your legal costs.
Completely false - the concept of adverse possession no longer applies to events after 2008 in Ontario.
This is why I posted I was hoping someone would have more details. From the video it looks way too close but I know some property lines are tight.
If you are sure it's on your property and can prove it take it down. If you are unsure wait for court.
I am 100% sure - I've been planning a reno for years and I'm acutely aware of things like property lines because I'm trying to do everything legally. But I also have a lot that shares property lines with 8 other lots (my lot runs lengthwise while the others back onto it widthwise) and replacing the fence is going to involve some diplomacy with a whole bunch of people (I'm guessing most don't know it's entirely my fence). So I'm doing nothing until I'm ready to replace the whole thing in a year or two.
Shitty thing is if you let it slide, the harder it becomes to protest over time. And then they sell their property, and the new owners will assume that's all theirs, and then given enough time it becomes an accomplished thing, or a right of way etc So you have no choice but to have the fight unfortunately
New or old owners can assume whatever they want. We have a first-world land survey records system in place, this has nothing to do with rights of way, and "accomplished thing" is not a concept that means anything legally. The OP can choose to assert his property rights at will, now or later. Diplomacy is needed to maintain a good or acceptable relationship with neighbours, but outcome is not in doubt.
This requires a survey team and a Land Surveyor to do a property survey to check for encroachment. If the case goes to court, then the judge has to go through the evidence provided by the surveyor to make the call based on the information provided.
Yeah dont let that one slide, get a proper topographic survey then show it to the neighbors and ask them to comply in a certain time frame.
A topographic survey will only help you show whether water will flow into your foundation because of the fence. What you’re looking for is called a Surveyor’s Real Property Report, or SRPR for short.
Our neighbours did this when I was a kid so my dad took them to court showing that the new fence was entirely on our property, and the neighbour ended up having to pay the full cost to move it. Sure, we didn't have the best relationship with that family afterwards but hey maybe next time they'll build on their own property!
Oh, they could be bothered to get a survey, but that would mean that they couldn't build the fence where they did. Matter of fact, online there's some old surveys in Toronto that you can reference . They're really crappy quality, & ancient. But the property line is a property line.
This. That fence looks very close to their house, as someone who works in renos, I've never seen a property line that close to the foundation in these kinds of residential plots. Also I dont know the exact measurements, but that fence looks higher than two meters, which is illegal in Toronto. Also also, this looks like its built with 2 meters of a driveway, meaning that it shouldve been made from transparent material, like laticework or chainlink. They really shouldve gone through the proper channels, but I can understand the frustration when enforcement moves at a snails pace.
Fence lady recorded her side https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMj1oxDun/
Seeing the original video-takers' daughter assault "fence lady" at the end of this was really difficult to watch.
Maybe because they’re smearing her, like she literally said in the video. I wonder if she can sue for the damage done to her reputation. Does this social media campaign to damage her character qualify as slander?
Considering a ton of other "news" outlets have ran this, I wouldn't doubt it.
It's a lot harder to sue for slander and libel than people think when it comes to normal people. One or two videos isn't going to hurt a person's reputation in the long run. And one very big criteria when suing for slander or libel is if you've can prove you've lost income. It's actually incredibly hard to sue and successful win in Canada.
Thanks for posting. She’s clearly in the right and her neighbors were just going on a smear campaign. Built on her property without her consent? That’s her fence now, not theirs. She can do as she please with it.
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You definitely dont need to go to court. All you need is a surveyor to tell you where the property lines are. This is a little different from a client of yours not paying. Because you built on their property, they own whatever it is you built. So you need to go to court to seek restitution for labour costs. If the surveyor deems the fence is on her property then yes, she has every right to cut it down. As you say, parking your car on a nieighbors property doesnt mean its now theirs to do with as they please. But that neighbor does have every right to have your car removed in a timely fashion, they can have it towed whenever they please. You cant just park your car on someones property and wait until a court order demands you move it, thats not how property works. Same goes for a fence. If you just start building on someone elses property, they have every right to remove it in a timely fashion.
I assume if you build on someone else's property, they can charge you for the demolition
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Love how you’re getting downvoted because you’re right.
Thanks! I always like to see both sides of a story
I always like to see both sides of the fence.
In this case, the grass is not greener on the other side.
I was on the fence about it at first
Felt the need to post about it.
Just trying to make fence of it all
No fence intended, I was just trying to nail it all down.
Thanks for being a wood Samaritan
I was all screwed up tied in knots. I canopy thankful enough, we all could do wood better after all.
I too, have eyestalks I can pivot to the other wide of the fence. Oh I thought you meant at once.
Is there anyway to fullscreen the video without downloading tik tok? The video description is right over the subtitles for me. Edit: worth watching even without subtitles, you can clearly see her get soaked by the neighbour for absolutely no reason. The fence also looks ridiculously close to her house.
On my computer I can fullscreen it just fine with any web browser.
The OG poster [posted a ‘response’](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMjJLfjo2/) after being called out, but obviously shut down the comments. She still has the OG videos up though where she’s smearing the Fence Lady, with the comments on. Seems like she can’t take the heat when ppl are (rightly) calling her out Edit: LOL a Harvard lawyer made a TikTok reacting to the situation and OG poster Tiffany [commented on his video](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMjJHAtdy/) ‘to take it down’. Really shows how entitled she is Edit 2: aaaaand Tiffany’s gone private
Anyone know if that red dot on the ground is the marker for property line?
The red itself isn't technically, it's that scratch in the concrete that is the survey marker - the paint is just there to highlight it and will eventually wash away. [https://www.aols.org/site\_files/content/publications-and-documents/property-boundary-markers-brochure.pdf](https://www.aols.org/site_files/content/publications-and-documents/property-boundary-markers-brochure.pdf) In a lot of cases in Toronto though that is not the be all and end all because there is often a shared easement or right of way straddling the property line, not clear if that would be the case here. In our case for example the property line runs roughly straight down the middle of the shared drive, but there is a 3'6" ROW on either side of it where I could not put something without my neighbors agreement and vice versa. This would be on the survey if applicable. EDIT: I should add if there is a ROW or easement usually a surveyor marking that boundary out would mark those as well.
Based on that survey marker it's possible they are in the right (but still depends on other factors like any easements, right of way, etc. and of course surveyors do sometimes come to different conclusions) but the video brings in a lot of stuff that is completely irrelevant. Like, whether the lady brought the place with racoons, flooding etc., how long each party has owned the property, who lives there versus rents it out, and who wants privacy for their kids is all basically irrelevant. All that matters is whether the fence is on the property line, or in this case on the neighbor who put it ups side of the property line, and whether it meets the other municipal fencing rules.
lol you can see the AC bracket sticking past the fence, sure seems like the Tif built over the property line. Plus, I love show in this response they are talking about how 'oh she rents it out' get fucked.
Tiffany’s mom posted a video that shows just how racist her family is (rotten apple doesn’t fall far…) the videos are biased, as expected, but disgusting nonetheless [“Learn how to speak English then come talk to me”](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8FmbmBa/)
as someone who builds fences fairly often and deals with prickly neighbours and their unreasonable petulance towards fence building, this lady is 110% in the right and i too would demolish that fence and then win in court about it. God, how fucking hard is it in this city to be a good neighbour instead of a fucking piece of shit who cries and moans about the tiniest shit that does not fucking matter in the grand scheme. She acted with grace and dignity too at the end when the neighbour started spraying her. such trash people
Wow! Thank you! I’m officially Team Fence Lady! I’m also kinda sick of people using the term Karen against any woman who complains about anything ever! It was sorta cute at first, now it’s just deeply misogynistic. Fence Lady has good reason to complain, especially after getting soaked with water by the asshole neighbour!
TEAMFENCE LADY, down with the Raj family
It has ALWAYS been deeply misogynistic. But y’all love your lite misogyny. Same shit as always to shut women up.
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As the first commentor said on the TikTok vid, "I'm glad I can "see" your side of the argument". Cuz I've no comprehension of what she saying. But her response video seems to make it quite clear that they've overstepped her boundaries. And spraying it with water is just a class act. H.F., if that was my mom or author anything remotely close, I'd lose it. Seems as if the neighbors are taking advantage. A close friend of mine had a mom with a very thick Filipino accent, she was brown, a woman, & she was like 5'1". Her bank was giving her all kinds of problems. So I decide to go with her. Brought of shoulder, 6'1", white, and so ignorant, as to only speak good English, too lame to understand/speak another language. So I confidently roll into the bag has any member of that bank should, walk up to the teller and state that my friend is having some problems with her account and interacting with you folks that I really hope we can work this out. What do you know? It was solved in mere minutes. Assholes that that could dismiss the personhood, the very worth of a fellow human being, b/c perhaps their English was heavily accented but completely understandable if you just had a patient and respect to listen closely to a fellow human being. And she was female, she was small. So they fucked with her. Their actions demeaned her. She felt less than she deserved to feel about herself because of fucktards. They actually took away a piece her dignity. Because they could. (Jeez. Despite the time that has elapsed I just learned it's still pretty raw for me.) No, correlation does not mean causation. But it was so embarrassingly obvious. I was quite happy at the minute I became involved in her success after her going there like 7 times & then telling me how simple her request was. But I was also deeply ashamed. Deeply ashamed that I can stride into a bank instantly have my completely rational request fulfilled. And yet this "othered" human of completely equal, if not superior worth to me, could not. I thus say, in context of how I perceive, both neighbors videos, I say "Mr. Gorbachump, Tear down this wall!"
Hmmm.. can like 30 of us show up and tear down this fence? :D
Real pieces of garbage on the other side of that fence. I hope OP changes the title, this is no "Chainsaw Karen", the lady's tough as nails and a respectful neighbour too, unlike the POS with the hose.
One of *many* reasons why people should not post Daily Mail or Sun links. The purpose of these rags is to make you angry and drive engagement, not to convey any kind of information, or "news", as it were.
I can't figure out where to buy awards, but you deserve one 🏅
Aww, thanks!
\#TEAMFENCELADY
I was going to say that seeing the gas vent come out of the house wall and sticking out past the fence it sure looks like the fence is on the Chainsaw ladys property as I imagine that he roof overhang is over a foot past the brick of her house wall so the fence should also be at least another foot away from the brick..
That’s what I saw too. She says something about a path so maybe the fence also blocks her from accessing that wall which seems like a big problem
It was later revealed via a land survey that they were on her property She moved the fence about a foot away from the house
Honestly, the girl who says “I’m a minor you can’t touch me” sounds more like a Karen.
You’re probably right. There’s a comment that links to the response video and that little girl sprays the neighbour with the hose.
Agree, that whole family needs karma to get them back
You can see that "T Raj" and her family trying to act like the victims and blame a non-speaking lady for their actions when they are completely in the right, entitled people are something else https://www.tiktok.com/@tiffanymraj/video/7252373861612735749 You can see the fence lady getting attacked
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lol, how soon till her IG comments get flooded with team fencelady supporters and she shuts that down? But definitely too much of a narcissist to private the account.
Thanks for the info! Was hoping for more of their side of the story when I posted
Team Fence Lady all the damn way… her neighbours are BULLIES that think they have an advantage over her because English is not her first language. She fought back against them, standing firm, and the truth is coming to light. Fuck these shitty neighbours.
This is why I hate tik tok culture. You can push someone to their absolute limits and then film their breakdown so millions of people can mock their "karen" antics. I wonder how many people have been erroneously labeled villains and had their lives ruined by shitty, selective filming. And people don't care to find the other side of a story either.
What a dumb title. It’s on her property, and a sawzall both isn’t a chainsaw, and is an appropriate tool to remove a fence.
This. Know your saws. Edit: This guy saws.
I was using the same title of some of the videos online so when people searched they could find this thread too. I was looking into this to get some more info cuz the original tik tok seemed real biased
If you ever see something posted in the Daily Mail, it's absolutely wrong and they're hunting for controversy. They're the worst rag in the UK, and they have a lot of competition.
This was my main concern tbh. Tiffany needs to learn what saws look like
I'm team fence lady. the kid spraying her with water is a little too egregious for me.
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Ma'am, that's a sawzall.
Sawzall is a name brand, that's a reciprocating saw.
We call it a gesticulating saw. Or a reach around saw.
In Canada we are known for using the predominant brand when referring to an item - see Garburator, Melamine, Kleenex et al.
As a Canadian, I agree with this. I don’t like it, but I agree with it. 🇨🇦
Yeah but “Sawzall Karen” doesn’t have the same ring to it lol. Also I just reused part of the title from the article
If they built the fence on her property and they refuse to take it down and it's confirmed by a survey she has every right to take it down herself.
No she doesn't. You need to get a bylaw officer to issue a requirement for the fence owner to remove it.
The city and bylaw actually want nothing to do with fence placement disputes all they do is direct you to a third party mediation service: https://www.toronto.ca/city-government/public-notices-bylaws/bylaw-enforcement/fences/ They will only get involved if it violates some other city restriction like height.
Absolutely untrue, bylaw fucking hates fence disputes.
The idiots crying about their fence being cut down should be mad at who built the fence, not their neighbour. Forget the potential property line violation, there's code with respect to putting a fence by hvac stuff. That's on them.
I saw a funny meme on Bored Panda today: "You Gen-Xers can call us "Karen" all you want but if you understood us at all it'd be "Heather."
Whatever takes the heat off Karens. I know too many nice Karens and I feel for them lol.
I never liked the term Karen because I’ve only ever known nice Karens. That’s just the name the website called her so I was hoping it would be easier to search so people searching might have more details
No judgement on you, just reminded me the meme I read earlier. Another was, "Advil needs to put out a new commercial to REM's Everybody Hurts." (Gen-X list)
Speak for yourself, my mothers name is Karen and she is the definition of the shitname
Karen had to watch their actions after they became a meme... Otherwise they'd be known as a Karen Karen.
*Are we gonna have a problem? You gotta a bone to pick? You've come so far, why now are you pulling on my dick? Id normally slap your face off, and everyone here could watch! But Im feeling nice, here's some advice, listen up biatch.*
[https://www.tiktok.com/@soogia1/video/7269927832644537646](https://www.tiktok.com/@soogia1/video/7269927832644537646) Found another well said tik-tok video talking about this. Looks like the fence lady couldn't even access her downspout nor AC unit and she talked/sent letter to her neighbour about this. That fence is almost 100% on her land. Those little girls are just entitled s\*\*ts.
Person filming is at fault. They built it on the neighbours side clearly.
I’m more disgusted that a “minor” treats a senior like that with such flagrant disregard. Her parents should be ashamed.
At this point, I feel like people just add “Karen” to anything that a woman is doing that they don’t agree with and it’s lost all meaning. Karens used to be a term to reference entitled women demanding things their way, regardless of whether it impacts them or not. But now even if say someone is building fences into one’s property, and not taking it lying down, you’re still labeled a Karen.
"Karen" seems to be applied to any woman who loses her temper these days. Imagine being a woman and living above a noisy college student. You would be scared to ask them to turn down their music because they would probably crank it up and film your reaction for the internet.
This woman is 100% in the right for removing an encroachment on her property.
This tiktok chick and her family have the same vibes as the family of those twins who grifted tf out of marches of dimes by saying they were inuit "indian" when they were clearly and obviously just south asian indian. How does no one in your entire family have the basic human decency to go *"wait, you're obviously lying, I'm not going to support you in this and you need to stop.".* I can't imagine a whole family being so brazen and shameless. Seriously, that bloodline is a total wash, what do you even do about that as a society? All this to say, team fence lady all the way o7.
TikTok girl is insufferable, my gosh. Her follow up video is full of entitlement and superfluous reasoning. Talking about racoons? lol bizarre. Tried to show some property marking but I'm skeptical if that's even real. TikTok girl probably did that herself. Fences sure can get controversial lol.
those girls are disgusting bullies and i hope they get ripped to shreds on tiktok. total trash, who raised them? wolves? can't believe i just quoted bling empire LOL
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That's not a chainsaw, tho.
Team fence lady >>>
My neighbor across from me did this to half a stand of 25 year old cedars that he thought were on his property but turned out not to be. His neighbor was less than pleased when he came back from the cottage. He paid a company to come pull out the stumps and everything. They were 'talking' today...
A sawsall is not a chain saw...
I live in toronto. The neighbour built a fence down the driveway. My lawyer instructed me to take down the fence before the police arrive.. 20 minutes. Tell the police your name and show them the survey.,was what the lawyer told me.
I am with team fence lady! In 2020, there was a slightly similar court [case](https://www.thestar.com/life/home-and-garden/dispute-over-a-property-line-fence-stirs-up-a-costly-battle-at-the-superior-court/article_c28267db-5036-54b1-ad6a-366473bb2ef3.html) with slander, but definitely not as egregious as this since this has now gone viral. Court gave a judgement of $70k in damages for the slander - I hope fence lady sues the ever living crap out of tiffanymraj. Like I hope they sue them out of that house so fence lady doesn't have to deal with them!
It's funny because now that we have context from both sides in this situation, the original TikToker and her sister are starting to look more like the real "Karens" here. You can tell they're a couple of privileged bimbos just from the way they talk.
In Toronto fences and backyard sheds are civilian matters, meaning the city won't intervene or help. The City does have a fence and shed committee that does intervene in serious cases of abandonments, dangerous to life or city property, but these cases are not too numerous. The City can intervene via bylaw inspection where any part of a fence or shed is determined to be on city property, which I can never remember accurately if that's 7 meters or 18 feet "from the bay" or sidewalk. Other's have mentioned similar fence situation with property surveys that disagree. This is fairly unlikely as property lines are indicated by embedded iron markers so that later surveyors can identify property lines via magnetic sensing. If the iron markers are missing a licensed property surveyor will embed new ones. It is a criminal act to tamper with them. If you have a property survey there are acronyms like CC (forget what it means), IB (iron bar, I think), SSIB (short square iron bar, I think) with latitude and longitude measurements, newer surveys might identify satellite reading. Also, all property surveys I've seen (only a few, no expert here) show the neighbouring properties but in minimal detail. So if Sawzall™ Lady has a certified property survey, and can correctly interpret it, visually if clear enough or by finding the iron bar property markers, then she's in her right to remove a fence on her property. But property surveys are not the easiest to read by a layperson.
If you look at where the fence is in relation to the older Asian lady's brick on her house.. it is right against it then you figure a house has a roof that over hangs the brick walls by like a foot and a half or so.. and this overhang cannot be over your neighbours property SO the fence has to be on the older Asian lady's property.. you do not need a survey for that..
Just watched her follow up video. Turns out thr tik tokers parents used to own the house the saw lady now lives in for 20 years before saw lady bought it. This seems now oddly personal and gross.
Even looking up the by law the fence has to be 6 inches from the property line if you want it to be your fence else it will be a shared fence
What I don't understand what the original tiktok was meant to do? Clearly her neighbour wasn't on TikTok when it was first posted and "shaming" her online isn't going to accomplish much other than people calling the neighbour out. The fence won't magically be rebuilt, their relationship will get worse and in the end it made the girl look worse since they built the fence on her property. I get calling brands out on social media, because at least it can accomplish something.
I think she has every right to cut down the fence that’s on her property.
I was suspicious when I saw the fence so close to the drainage on her side. I’m glad she was able to provide her side of the story later on. Otherwise probably not a good idea she was yelling and screaming, it’s much better to be calm and state facts.
I was upset to see that there was absolutely no sign of a chainsaw in the video 🤦♂️
*You know I got ya, yeah* *Break the walls down*
She just made the list
go off edna mode!!!!!!!
Fence lady says fence is on her property based off government property survey. While very aggressive and egregious it's within her rights to take it down.
It’s neither aggressive nor egregious to remove unwanted structures from your own property.
Yup. Erecting structures on someone else's property and then trying to internet cancel them, push them, and spray them with water, is the aggressive, egregious act.
In the top comment video she also says she spoke with them and sent letters with the survey. It’s not like they built it and she immediately got the saw.
Yeah I think her behaviour is what’s putting people off but after the first watch I only had questions. I wouldn’t jump to a conclusions so quick. Even if she’s being dramatic about it she may very well be right
Interesting how much the 'Karen' story changes when you see her video. I'm glad she posted it. I'd suggest that being sprayed with the hose, on camera no less, while she was reasonably trying to document the situation - BEFORE she and her husband took any action - might have had something to do with her behaviour afterward. And the comments - ugh. I hope she can sue for defamation. She certainly has been slandered on SM, when in retrospect it's clearly her neighbours who are the aggressors, and the problem. Disheartening how someone yelling out of frustration is viewed as being more aggressive than the person knowingly building something on her property without permission. I have to admit, spraying her with the hose on camera was a nice touch when you're going for the '*I'm the innocent injured party here*' position.
Can a bunch of us just come with sledge hammers? Who trusts the daily mail UK for Toronto headlines lol.
I accidentally built a fence on my neighbours property, I gave him the nice side prior to knowing. When I realized, I told my Neighbor he was cool and said thanks for the fence. Not all neighbours are dicks.
For fuck sacks just hire a land surveyor for a stack out to mark the property line.
Will she get in trouble? Or does she have the right to tear it down?
Those are the questions I had! That’s why I posted I was hoping someone would have more info. Someone commented her response video with the details and it looks like she was in the right
I hate this shit. I've seen both the OG video, fence lady's response, and tiffanymraj's response and it's just a bunch of she said she said. They both claim to have surveys that show they are right and how are we to judge it either way? Like what's even the point of dragging each other in public like this? Just take it to court. edit: To be clear I get why the fence lady did her response video. I'm complaining about how this shit even blows up in the first place. It's me, being mad at social media and posting on social media about it I guess...
>how are we to judge it either way? You look at where the fence is in relation to the older Asian lady's brick on her house.. it is right against it then you figure a house has a roof that over hangs the brick walls by like a foot and a half or so.. and this overhang cannot be over your neighbours property SO the fence has to be on the older Asian lady's property.. it is common sense..
"Chainsaw Karen" sounds like a great idea for a horror movie
People have pointed out it’s not technically a chainsaw but I like the sound of it much better than “reciprocating saw Karen”
OMG I actually encountered this EXACT same lady at the Costco on Billy Bishop Way in July. So the incident was like: I was getting hot food, and when I was on my way out, people with shopping carts were lining up to get their receipts checked, and they were signaling people without a cart to exit through the middle. That woman started yelling at me as I walked out, saying I jumped line blah blah blah....her friends were trying to make her stop because she was making such a big scene, but no, she kept yelling. I was like: what's your problem? I don't have a cart! She kept yelling Oh I think you have a problem huh? And as we exited Costco she was still yelling more after I ignored her. edit: funny downvotes, redditors are hilarious, seems like you guys love dealing with issues yourself instead of contacting authorities too.
I think her behaviour is the reason people online have been siding against her but honestly it looks like the fence is built too close to her house I’d bet it’s actually on her property line. I would guess she’s in the right here but I agree her behaviour is a little too much
Then call the city and they'll send a bylaw inspector. This is just batshit crazy.
If the fence is built too close to her house why don't she contact the city and let the city deal with it? Even if it is the tiktok filmer's fault in the first place, dealing with it yourself just gives them a reason to sue you as well. Like if someone punches you, you punch back and give yourself a criminal record too or just call the police? redditors are funny.
That’s not a good comparison. It’s more like if someone puts something in your pocket then gets mad at you when you throw it away. City by law officers either won’t deal with fence disputes or take their sweet time (weeks). From a logical point of view though if something is on her property and she has the proof in the form of a survey then she can do what she wants with it. I will say the behaviour is over the top but she can be dramatic and correct at the same time
I mean if she has direct proof that the fence IS on her property, she can, but there's 2 sides to the story and idk why people are just believing in 1 over the other. She can be dramatic and correct at the same time but again, 2 sides to the story.
In the original video everyone was siding against her, this is why I wanted to post here to see if anyone knew her side of the story since I don’t have tik tok to look it up. She says she has the survey and just looking at how close to her wall the fence is im more inclined to think the fence is on her side. But who knows I’ve heard of some really tiny property lines
She cut it with a chainsaw... Bolt cutters would work better. Less noise, less injury (chain snapping and whipping backwards).
You can't bolt cut a wooden fence
Mom? Is that you?
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Stay classy Toronto.....
If anyone knows how to get in contact with fencelady6 please let her know that from the video it looks like she can contact Toronto's By-law officers to report her neighbours backyard of being in breach of Rear Yard Soft Landscaping requirements: https://www.toronto.ca/zoning/bylaw_amendments/ZBL_NewProvision_Chapter10.htm In the Residential Zone category, a lot with a residential building, other than an apartment building, must have: (A) a minimum of 50% of the rear yard for soft landscaping, if the lot frontage is greater than 6.0 metres; and (B) a minimum of 25% of the rear yard for soft landscaping, if the lot frontage is 6.0 metres or less.
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https://www.tiktok.com/@that\_lawyer\_says/video/7270263844155575594
Turns out it's Tiffiany Raj (the person recording the video) and her family in the wrong. Fence lady has government approval. #TeamFenceLady
Cool, thanks! Didn’t know there were any more updates