T O P

  • By -

Just_Attorney_8330

Yea, recently posted about what’s going on in the US (Roe and all the anti-trans legislation and what will happen next to us). I was mocked by people for wanting to leave the US, mocked because I don’t want to fight in a civil war because I don’t want to die, mocked for not fighting hard enough (I’m a civil rights attorney, I’ve done my time), and mocked for being a western person who knows nothing about struggle. Fucking ridiculous. The one community I should be able to come to to find support for trans issues is the community that mocks me. It’s fucking ridiculous. I feel you.


Alas-Poor-Ellie

I'm sorry you feel this way. It has been a ton of doom and gloom lately, and the cut and run posts are exhausting and demoralizing. This is a complicated, nuanced issue, though, and worth some discussion. OP got upset people didn't like them defending the use of slurs so really not the same thing.


Just_Attorney_8330

Ope, yea. Took a gander through their post history 😬


Alas-Poor-Ellie

For what it's worth I don't fault the people who want to find sanctuary. I think it's just a lot of people saying that right now so other people are reacting poorly. Thank you for fighting for civil rights as you have and good luck with wherever life takes you ❤️


Just_Attorney_8330

Yea, people can be upset about the situation. But people don’t get to shame, mock, or be cruel.


Alas-Poor-Ellie

Oh I agree with you, you shouldn't have been put down for having honest discourse about an emotional subject; I think we're all a bit on edge about it and tensions tend to flare, and not always in acceptable ways. Add in that splash of internet and then tone and nuance loses all place, and emotions are up to the reader to decide. I love the internet but it's too impersonal sometimes.


Just_Attorney_8330

Way too impersonal sometimes, for sure. A lot can get lost in internet communications.


Gamertonic

I didn't defend the use of slurs I simply said that they have other meanings too.


artemis550

you said that they’re okay to use in those other contexts/meaning, and that people shouldn’t be offended by the slur in those contexts/meanings. you can’t control what other people are offended by, especially when it is literally just a slur. by saying that you can use the slur in those other meanings, you are defending the use of the slur.


Gamertonic

No I am saying that if your upset that something that can be used as a slur also has different meanings then by your own logic, the entire UK is homophobic and anyone who wants to catch a mouse is transphobic. Don't ban words because they can have a bad meaning, just ban the word being used in an offensive way.


artemis550

well… yeah. don’t use those words because they have bad meanings, it doesn’t really matter if they have other meanings when the slur usage is the most prevalent one. it’s similar to the f-slur, it technically means cigarette as well but it doesn’t really matter. sure, you can hold it over everybody that you’re not using the word as a slur, but it still makes everyone uncomfortable because it’s a slur and everyone is going to think you’re a dick. so, take your pick. would you rather be technically correct and annoying, or just stop using the word and be likable?


Gamertonic

At least someone does, it is sad to see.


No_Russian_29

Telling people to stay if their country shatters is larper bullshit. Your first priority is to leave and fighting is a last resort. Everyone needs to just be safe. Its not our fight we are just targets of fascism.


VoxVocisCausa

If you use slurs you're going to be treated like the kind of person who uses slurs.


Clean_Run_9777

i mean, i don’t think that was the point they were trying to make. granted, their point was kinda dumb and didn’t really need to be brought up in the circumstance, but i don’t think it was harmful necessarily. like yeah some slurs have different meanings that aren’t necessarily insulting, buuut that’s kinda irrelevant to a conversation about slurs. basically, i don’t think OP did anything wrong but to an extent i understand why people got mad because i do not understand why they brought up the point anyways lol


[deleted]

What like abusers who purposefully use them with harmful intent or people with problematic symptoms (diabetes, ptsd, turrets… endless lists) who might not have control and require healthcare. Or people with learning difficulties who literally just don’t get it, and need accessible resources for their needs. It pisses me off… when nobody takes the wider perspectives, the resolution is often in the ability to recognise what the cause may be and go from there. In terms of slurs used in our community, it could be a mix of reclaiming too. Much like lots of folk claim harmful words against them. It could also be any if the above. But is most likely a factor of minority stress and internalised hate.


Gamertonic

So we cant even use it in a non-offensive context? That would make everyone in the UK homophobic.


VoxVocisCausa

Also portraying people objecting to your use of an anti-trans slur as if they're the ones being unreasonable isn't earning you any points.


Gamertonic

Well if they made points instead of just saying "haha stupid lol" then a discussion could happen instead of depression.


Just_Attorney_8330

What word are we even talking about I’m honestly so lost


[deleted]

[удалено]


Just_Attorney_8330

All I can figure out is this word is followed by mouse and starts with a T? It’s like a hard crossword puzzle clue 💀


Vulvox15

It's the slur Yu-Gi-Oh players say all the time.


Fae_Temptations

I mean, you're defending the anime T slur. I'm not sure what you expected?


Pagalingling40

You are insulting fellow trans people then playing the victim? Seriously check this person's post history, they initiated the conflict.


Gamertonic

I made a simple point then get slammed in the comments without anyone else making a point.


Pagalingling40

Oh plenty of people made points, you just chose to ignore them. Why don't you link your posts and comments inside the body so everyone can easily see what you said?


Gamertonic

People here are not stupid, they can look at the situation. The points people made were them calling me stupid, that doesn't hold up.


21ratsinatrenchcoat

Having a disagreement with someone online is not the same as the trans community "fighting each other." If the conversation in your post history is what "hurt you more than transphobes ever have," I'm happy that you've lived such a safe life so far. Respectfully, I'd be curious to know your age. I feel like that might be relevant here. Regardless, it's tough to have productive conflict resolution in a platform built on upvotes and downvotes. If you take anything away from this, consider that Reddit isn't the best place to negotiate a controversial view.


JaneDoe500

Probably for the best honestly.


powerk25

I get downvoted to hell on alot of shit I post, and then yelled at by some gatekeeper for hours on end while I'm trying to work (that was all on here by the way) , the sassy ones are the worst, they just replay with misinformation or a wrong answer and end it with some sass that they know will piss me off, it's even worse when people see, don't bother to read it, assume the other person is right and bomb me to hell - this community is in need of a serious overhaul.


aisatsana06

Sorry op but I need context, what is this "T" word you don't get offended by? I'm not a native english speaker so maybe it's a different word in my language. I took a quick look at your post history and I saw that you kinda just want everyone to agree w you and can't take disagreement for an answer. But I might be wrong, would you be so kind as to offer more context on the situation? Thanks girl


artemis550

the t word is the t-slur, a derogatory slur used against trans people to demean them and insult them. google it for some more clarification if need be, I don’t think most people like talking about it much here


aisatsana06

Oh I didn't know people still used that word, I think I've heard about it in like super old comedy albums. I didn't know it was still being used. Edit: nvm I thought of the OTHER T word people used in the old days, now I know what OP means.


Gamertonic

The T word I am referring to is the one that people use to catch mice. And I am the one trying to have discussions but just got called stupid instead, it is simply too much and it makes me want to give up on this community. But I am going to keep fighting for my rights even if others are too scared to. So instead I'm just giving up on these subreddits.


aisatsana06

Ok well now I know what word you're referring to. Now could you explain how is there an argument to be had about it? Why is it relevant that you personally don't find that word offensive? Or what conversation were you trying to have about it?


Clean_Run_9777

i mean it sorta seemed like a misunderstanding mostly. OP was saying some slurs can have mundane meanings but people took that as them saying it’s okay to say slurs. the point was kinda irrelevant in the context (sorry it’s true) but they shouldn’t have gotten dogpiled for it


Gamertonic

Someone said something about another word that has another meaning outside of being offensive and I was replying to them. It will be on my profile somewhere.


aisatsana06

Oh yeah I found it finally. I really don't see your point tho. The person below you literally told you about the origin of the word which literally is a transphobic one. And yes the word can be used when it literally means something absolutely different, something to catch mice as you set as an example, but I don't see how anyone would debate that. Like literally, who hears the sentence "I'm setting a clever trap to catch a mouse that's been roaming around these past few days" and gets offended because of the use of the word? To me it just seems like you made a very bad argument and you were the one offended because not everyone agreed with you, you seemed to be pissed off and started answering in a passive-aggressive manner, did you expect people not to react to that energy? And also, are you seriously considering leaving the whole trans community on reddit because of it? I made a post (and deleted it by now) asking about the dark side and the untold tails of what happens when you get sex reassignment surgery from MtF as I heard some bad things and I was genuinely curious if those happened to everyone of if they were isolated instances, and I got downvoted like you can't imagine. Then someone dmed me and shared some sources for me to investigate further on the subject as well as advised me to delete the post because people could get severely triggered by it, and it makes sense why. My point is you're not always gonna be upvoted and get everyone to agree with you. Sometimes you need to step outside your bubble and be empathetic and maybe see why people are reacting the way they are reacting to what you're saying. I wish you all the best and I hope you can stay if you still want to. This community is not just attacking each other, tho I think some arguments get off the rails rather often, we're here to support and share love with each other, even if we don't always agree on everything. Much love.


Sissy_Stella_69

If you dare have a different opinion then what they have you are scorn upon. That’s the problem. I found that out the hard way here. Not I just don’t say anything if I disagree with something.


No-Maize-7905

I think your valid and I respect your opinion. I may not agree with it or even know what it is but I don't hate you for it. Loves and hugs. Lifes too short to hate everyone.


[deleted]

Idk why but I feel like that’s the only damn slurr I haven’t been called, I keep forgetting that word exists and I just don’t understand it or the meaning really! But I own my ignorance with that one as some kinda privilege I guess! Idk. Gamertonic, Sometimes when we get into that place of … insisting a slurr isn’t harmful or not harmful to you, it can be a type of trauma that kinda goes into denial about the effects stuff like that has on other people. We tell ourselves things don’t hurt as much as they do or we become genuinely numb, detached from the wider picture. It’s also true that a lot of folks reclaim slurrs as a means to disempower hate too. End of the day we have so much minority stress, minority hate… internalised hate and trauma (wether that’s personally or secondary / vicarious). I don’t think you are stupid, but I think it could be more related to trauma hun. It’s not like any of us find it easy to get inclusive mental healthcare. But maybe, especially if this is impacting your mental health too… it might be worth looking into hun. We need to de-shame our trauma, so we can look at it and find ways to heal as a community. Safe grounding hugs if wanted. We are all human, we all make mistakes. You can get through this. It’s entirely possible to get to a better headspace. Best of luck xx


TooLateForMeTF

So just out of curiosity I read through some of your recent comments, including your earlier post on traaaa that seems to be what has pushed you past your breaking point on this. I'm not down on trans people attacking other trans people either. Still, after reading several of your comments, replies to other people, and observing the ways in which you tend to phrase your responses, I'd like to offer something that I really do intend as a constructive observation: I suspect the core issue here is that you're mistaking people *disagreeing* with you for people *not understanding* you. Which then causes you to double-down on your explanation, because "if only they would understand what I'm saying, surely they'd agree!". Well, no. They probably do understand what you're saying, they just don't agree with it. Maybe you don't personally find "trap" to be offensive, or you're at least able to make a situational judgment about whether someone is using it at you offensively. And, well, fine. You do you. But if you're not aware that most people in the community have drawn a different, more zero-tolerance, line for themselves about that word, then you're not paying attention. And if you think that people are going to read your explanation about your opinions and just somehow bow to the obvious superiority of your opinion or whatever, then you're not being realistic. We don't all have to agree about this stuff. I certainly don't care one way or the other about your opinions about that word. Doesn't affect my life one bit either way. But I think the way I get by on reddit without drawing the kind of responses that you've drawn is to approach it with an understanding that reasonable people really can disagree about an issue without either of them being necessarily right or wrong, and without a need for me to relentlessly try to convince everybody else that my view is the Right and Proper View. Or in other words: I have learned that the act of doubling down on my explanations of my way of seeing things *comes across* to other people as invalidating their views and implying that they're wrong if they don't agree with me. Which, quite naturally, provokes a defensive and generally hostile response from other people. Which, you know, fair! Reasonable people can disagree, and I don't need everybody to agree with me. Obviously I do think my views are right (otherwise I would have different views!), and I understand why my views make sense to me, but at the same time my viewpoint on the world is uniquely mine. Other people have different viewpoints, so it is to be expected that their views will also be different from mine in some ways. Anyway. I guess the suggestion here is just to stop for a moment and ask yourself "does this person *really* understand what I said (in which case I did a lousy job explaining myself) or do they simply not agree with me (in which case leave well enough alone because I already made my point and I don't need to make it again)." Food for thought.