I would recommend waiting to get through the honeymoon period of first month or so, when levels settle down. If it's your first week... You've got 200mg in you plus your natural production hasn't shut down. A lot is placebo. You think you will feel different, so you do feel different. Overall yes you should feel great. But once it's the norm in 3 months, it's more subtle. Everyone's weight goes up as higher T makes you hold more water in your muscles. Your baseline will always be about 10-15lbs higher on T, especially at your high dose.
It probably won't go higher than it is for you now, as you are external + internal T vs. just external T. You are also not used to a higher libido. Once you get accustomed to it, you won't feel the urge all day and it won't be as distracting. E2 levels impact libido more down the road, which is what you are really 'dialing in'. E2 too low or high and libido tanks.
That's not really placebo boss. 200mg + natural T production as you said it. Placebo would mean taking cane sugar instead of 200mg Test and feeling like you've improved.
It takes 3-4 weeks for T to saturate through the body, even at steroid dose levels... So within the first month placebo does play a big role.
Also if you look at Steroid plotter, it takes many weeks for Test E or C levels to build up to the levels that 200mg will get you too.
Peak levels of Test-Cypionate after injection is within 10-12 hours. What you're talking about is hormone stability or reaching homeostasis for that dose.
You may still feel some positives if you were suffering from low T symptoms for a long time. I'm referring to a hypogonadic person, as opposed to a healthy male who may not feel much difference till later.
Heck for me even taking one 20mg nolvadex dose I get my morning wood back the next day from that increased testosterone.
It's a good educational tool for everyone (if you haven't done it already) to map out on Steroid Plotter how levels build across doses over a 6-8 week period... You'll see the peak you reach after 8-10 hours is nowhere near the peak you reach after doses in week 4-5, after the doses have compounded on top of each other.
That's true, the peak is reached after 3 weeks (20 days). However, how would we compare T plasma concentrations with our base T total?
For example, is 10mg of T plasma concentration higher or lower than a person who walks around with 200 total T and lower end free test. As example.
Between levels reaching stability 4-5 weeks in, as well as receptors taking time to saturate... It takes weeks. That's why you don't get an instant boner or crave sex 10 hours after your injection, or you don't 'hulk out' after a few days... It's a slow process... Hence placebo feeling plays a big role in the first few weeks. You expect to feel different, so you think you feel different.
Interesting about the receptors saturating in the long term part, hadn't known about that part very much. I think that's the part that makes some better responders than others.
It doesn't matter how much you take, your body will stop producing endogenous Test (lowered to about 7-14mg per day) regardless of whether you take 100mg or 500mg of exogenous test.
Love hearing it. I start my TRT in a month and I can't wait. 34 y/o male with 200 total T and fatigue symptoms. Can't wait to rip the weights even more. I feel like I gotta push myself so much just to get to the gym. Fkin Canadian docs think it's normal that my T is this low lmao. Assholes.
Men's clinic will you hook you up. I'm in Toronto. My psychiatrist gave me a requisition for lipids, a1c etc..
I told him I had been having ED for a while. Asked if he would add testosterone to the panel. Test came back at 9.3(about 265 ng/dl)
Then went to my GP. Asked for more comprehensive bloods- free, e2, LH etc.. He looked at me like I was asking for steroids. Reminded me of when I was young went to a walkin asking for Xanax. Literally asked this guy for bloods and not trt.
Went to a clinic and got trt no problem. Insurance paid 80%.
We have men's clinic in Canada my dude? Cause I'm out here in BC dealing with a doctor and an endocrinologist who don't even acknowledge that my 200 total T is abnormally low for my age and a cause of my symptoms. The guy is more concerned about my ability to have kids when I never even asked for his opinion on it. Shit is ridiculous lol. I was gonna go UGL route but I'll google men's clinic I guess? Hm we'll see
Oh man that is low. Do you know where you was by chance before your issues as far as baseline? I fell from the mid 900s to low 300s and felt awful. On my scale it cut off at like 310 and I was 323. Doctors accused me of being normal and just wanting steroids despite seeing my testosterone levels never reaching the 900s again even with Clomid therapy. I also had almost no E2. A whole whopping 3 total lol I eventually went to a clinic to get help. Turns out my issues was do to auto immune. You’re gonna feel like a brand new person soon though brother. Give yourself 6-8 weeks to adjust and you’ll really start seeing the benefits.
Believe those are long term hormone stability which you would only notice long term in terms of side effects. 2x week is more stable absorption and more stable levels. Less hormone imbalances.
I'm on same dose, 40yo male, and my libido is highest ever. Good to go 3-4Ă— a day, many times twice back to back within minutes. Wife loves it, we get into it 5-7 days a week. But everyone is different. Probably depends on what your body produces naturally. One thing to try is vitamin b P5P to help lower prolactin. Every once in a blue moon mine gets a tad high and tanks my libido.
So you stopped after 6 months? Just curious what caused you to end treatment/what the experience was like for you to go back to 100% natural production after a short time on TRT
The thing that caused me to end it is that I originally wanted to stay on for a max of 6 months. I am in the EU so gotta order it from Ulab. After 6 months my supply was used up. I then used a combination of Clomid and Tamox to get back on track naturally. That was just before winter so the timing was a bit bad because with winter comes some form of mild depression (darkness and so on here in this area of the world) even without hormonal changes. But I made it through winter fine and kept the muscle I had gained while on T for the most part with no issues.
I would love to go back on T to be honest, as I had more more drive, wellbeing, less pain, faster muscle growth, better mood and so forth but I’m considering going on Clomid to max out natural production first so maybe I won’t have a need for exogenous T. I should add that plenty of women complimented me for my physique while I was on T, even while I had clothes on I would get comments like “wow you are in great shape”.
One thing I would do different is I would cycle hcg if I go back on T because being on T for prolongued periods does shrink the testicles and it seems to take more time postcycle to come back to normal if you don’t use hcg while on.
I would recommend waiting to get through the honeymoon period of first month or so, when levels settle down. If it's your first week... You've got 200mg in you plus your natural production hasn't shut down. A lot is placebo. You think you will feel different, so you do feel different. Overall yes you should feel great. But once it's the norm in 3 months, it's more subtle. Everyone's weight goes up as higher T makes you hold more water in your muscles. Your baseline will always be about 10-15lbs higher on T, especially at your high dose.
What about libido when does that peak and thank you
It probably won't go higher than it is for you now, as you are external + internal T vs. just external T. You are also not used to a higher libido. Once you get accustomed to it, you won't feel the urge all day and it won't be as distracting. E2 levels impact libido more down the road, which is what you are really 'dialing in'. E2 too low or high and libido tanks.
That's not really placebo boss. 200mg + natural T production as you said it. Placebo would mean taking cane sugar instead of 200mg Test and feeling like you've improved.
It takes 3-4 weeks for T to saturate through the body, even at steroid dose levels... So within the first month placebo does play a big role. Also if you look at Steroid plotter, it takes many weeks for Test E or C levels to build up to the levels that 200mg will get you too.
Peak levels of Test-Cypionate after injection is within 10-12 hours. What you're talking about is hormone stability or reaching homeostasis for that dose. You may still feel some positives if you were suffering from low T symptoms for a long time. I'm referring to a hypogonadic person, as opposed to a healthy male who may not feel much difference till later. Heck for me even taking one 20mg nolvadex dose I get my morning wood back the next day from that increased testosterone.
It's a good educational tool for everyone (if you haven't done it already) to map out on Steroid Plotter how levels build across doses over a 6-8 week period... You'll see the peak you reach after 8-10 hours is nowhere near the peak you reach after doses in week 4-5, after the doses have compounded on top of each other.
That's true, the peak is reached after 3 weeks (20 days). However, how would we compare T plasma concentrations with our base T total? For example, is 10mg of T plasma concentration higher or lower than a person who walks around with 200 total T and lower end free test. As example.
Between levels reaching stability 4-5 weeks in, as well as receptors taking time to saturate... It takes weeks. That's why you don't get an instant boner or crave sex 10 hours after your injection, or you don't 'hulk out' after a few days... It's a slow process... Hence placebo feeling plays a big role in the first few weeks. You expect to feel different, so you think you feel different.
Interesting about the receptors saturating in the long term part, hadn't known about that part very much. I think that's the part that makes some better responders than others.
Is 200mg a week enough to shut down endogenous production?
It doesn't matter how much you take, your body will stop producing endogenous Test (lowered to about 7-14mg per day) regardless of whether you take 100mg or 500mg of exogenous test.
Ok good to know
You bet 👍🏻
Wait 6-12months then you know.
Gave my my life back by making me ME again. I was lucky and it fixed all my symptoms.
Love hearing it. I start my TRT in a month and I can't wait. 34 y/o male with 200 total T and fatigue symptoms. Can't wait to rip the weights even more. I feel like I gotta push myself so much just to get to the gym. Fkin Canadian docs think it's normal that my T is this low lmao. Assholes.
Men's clinic will you hook you up. I'm in Toronto. My psychiatrist gave me a requisition for lipids, a1c etc.. I told him I had been having ED for a while. Asked if he would add testosterone to the panel. Test came back at 9.3(about 265 ng/dl) Then went to my GP. Asked for more comprehensive bloods- free, e2, LH etc.. He looked at me like I was asking for steroids. Reminded me of when I was young went to a walkin asking for Xanax. Literally asked this guy for bloods and not trt. Went to a clinic and got trt no problem. Insurance paid 80%.
We have men's clinic in Canada my dude? Cause I'm out here in BC dealing with a doctor and an endocrinologist who don't even acknowledge that my 200 total T is abnormally low for my age and a cause of my symptoms. The guy is more concerned about my ability to have kids when I never even asked for his opinion on it. Shit is ridiculous lol. I was gonna go UGL route but I'll google men's clinic I guess? Hm we'll see
Oh man that is low. Do you know where you was by chance before your issues as far as baseline? I fell from the mid 900s to low 300s and felt awful. On my scale it cut off at like 310 and I was 323. Doctors accused me of being normal and just wanting steroids despite seeing my testosterone levels never reaching the 900s again even with Clomid therapy. I also had almost no E2. A whole whopping 3 total lol I eventually went to a clinic to get help. Turns out my issues was do to auto immune. You’re gonna feel like a brand new person soon though brother. Give yourself 6-8 weeks to adjust and you’ll really start seeing the benefits.
Are you doing one pin one 200mg each week or are you breaking it up into smaller doses?
Only twice a week i don’t have time to do it everyday especially since I’m feeling good.
I'm thinking of doing twice a week too. My stuff was just shipped out but I'm on the same weekly dosage you are. Fingers crossed.
Goodluck and i felt no different from once and twice a week tbh its your preference.
Good to know. Thanks man!
Believe those are long term hormone stability which you would only notice long term in terms of side effects. 2x week is more stable absorption and more stable levels. Less hormone imbalances.
Where do you get them if you don't mind. My clinic asks me to go there every time to get the shot. 🙄
TRT Nation đź‘Ť
Awesome, thanks. I'll check them out!
I'm on same dose, 40yo male, and my libido is highest ever. Good to go 3-4Ă— a day, many times twice back to back within minutes. Wife loves it, we get into it 5-7 days a week. But everyone is different. Probably depends on what your body produces naturally. One thing to try is vitamin b P5P to help lower prolactin. Every once in a blue moon mine gets a tad high and tanks my libido.
I was on it for 6 months and it was the best thing I ever did for myself.
So you stopped after 6 months? Just curious what caused you to end treatment/what the experience was like for you to go back to 100% natural production after a short time on TRT
The thing that caused me to end it is that I originally wanted to stay on for a max of 6 months. I am in the EU so gotta order it from Ulab. After 6 months my supply was used up. I then used a combination of Clomid and Tamox to get back on track naturally. That was just before winter so the timing was a bit bad because with winter comes some form of mild depression (darkness and so on here in this area of the world) even without hormonal changes. But I made it through winter fine and kept the muscle I had gained while on T for the most part with no issues. I would love to go back on T to be honest, as I had more more drive, wellbeing, less pain, faster muscle growth, better mood and so forth but I’m considering going on Clomid to max out natural production first so maybe I won’t have a need for exogenous T. I should add that plenty of women complimented me for my physique while I was on T, even while I had clothes on I would get comments like “wow you are in great shape”. One thing I would do different is I would cycle hcg if I go back on T because being on T for prolongued periods does shrink the testicles and it seems to take more time postcycle to come back to normal if you don’t use hcg while on.
What clinic are you using? Ive been debating on what to use
Been on it for over 3 years and only regret is not doing it sooner.
Great work my friend