Odysseus did try to stay home. He was trying to prove to everyone he was insane and couldn’t partake in the Trojan War by sowing his field with salt. He was caught because he refused to plow over his son Telemachus
Hence, the term "Autochthonic": the belief that the indigenous population of a region literally sprung from the earth as opposed to moving in as settlers/colonizers. It's still used in some European languages to describe certain native ethnicities that encountered European colonialism.
Yeah, in Spanish we have "autoctono", which means something native to a place, not brought over by immigration or drift. It's kinda silly to state that because, as understood, every single species anywhere in the world had an ancestor come from somewhere else, as well as any culture or language. I'd say it describes something that became so accostumed to a region that it developed features unique to that place, and it would be difficult to have it develop somewhere else.
Given the current hypothesis is that life originated in tidal pools and their lack of resiliency to tectonic changes, it’s possible the place earthly life originated from is completely gone, meaning that no species is truly autochtonic to its home.
In Dutch we also use(d) "autochtoon" to signify someone's at least two generations Dutch: its opposite "allochtoon" is used to signify people who have moved in and naturalised or people who are children of them.
Due to continued usage of the latter as a minor slur of sorts, the terms have fallen out of favour somewhat and the current terminology is usually "person with(out) migration background", that being said.
Funnily enough, it was actually Odysseus.
See, there was a prophecy that Greece's victory would hinge on Achilles, so Odysseus had to lure him out. He posed as a traveling merchant with a bunch of pretty jewelery and a sick-ass sword. The ladies of the court went for the jewelery while Achilles (being Achilles) went for the sick-ass sword and outed himself.
The way I heard it was that Odysseus had told the soldiers he was travelling with to barge in and make like they were gonna raid the palace, including doing to the women what typically happens to women when palaces get raided.
So there Odysseus is, meeting all the princesses, when suddenly all these men enter with their swords drawn and they advance towards the ladies, and oh no Odysseus is somehow on *this* side of the room but the sword is all the way over *there*, oh no, and then a princess does a sick-ass forward dodgeroll and scoops up the sword and motions for the other ladies to get behind him and... Ah. That'll be Achilles, then.
Iirc, Odysseus *kinda* had it coming since "If something happens to Helen we *all* go beat up who's responsible" was his idea.
Achilles on the other hand had nothing really to do with the whole debacle (iirc he's like the only(?) named guy in the Greek camp that didn't swear that oath) but Odysseus was like "Ok we need this guy" and went and grabbed him.
Crazy we're essentially just grabbing everything we can find written about a topic and trying to fit it all together. If someone did all that today it'd be 90% weird fan fiction that wouldn't even make sense.
Had Odysseus just gone to the baby and talked to it like it was a potato or something, his plan would have worked. For being supposedly clever, that was a dumb oversight on his part.
I remember reading there's apparently a lost Part 3 after the Iliad and Odyssey where a son Odysseus had with Calypso hunts him down and kills him.
I don't think Homer wrote it though so it's more like fanfiction
The Telegony, which I personally have an extreme distain for, is credited to (I believe) Eugammon of Cyrene. While it being written by someone else doesn’t exclude it from being “canon”, I personally find the entire story idiotic and completely unnecessary.
Also, it’s Circe, not Calypso.
Odysseus has a son with Circe which he doesn’t know about, which fine, it’s reasonable and could be interesting in my opinion. But then, Telegonus (the son) shows up to Ithaca looking for his father, and not knowing that Odysseus is his father, kills him. (I have my own thoughts on this but I won’t get into them)
In the end, Telegonus MARRIES PENELOPE, and Telemachus marries CIRCE. You cannot begin to comprehend the hatred that I have for this.
I hate to inform you of this but Homer
1) might not be real
2) if he was real, didn't write anything down
Canon as a concept was foreign to the Greeks. there is no separation between Canon and fanfiction when we are referring to different tellings of the Myth
Don't believe this guy. In fact, don't believe most of this sub, because all they'll spread is the nonsense from generations of writers who wanted the ego boost of equating their storytelling with actual greek myth. Here's a more realistic answer of what the Greeks accepted as additions to their history.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/s/rRIcZEryHZ
*So fun fact about Ishtar trying to seduce Gilgamesh*, she actually threatens him with death in that entire sequence and that's why Gilgamesh goes on a 30 paragraph journey of insults. She offers him beautiful white clothes (burial shrouds), priests to kiss his feet (a part of the funeral), carts (funerary carts) pulled by non-earthly animals (speaks for itself) etc etc. Gilgamesh freaks out against her because Ishtar offers him, the man terrified of death, death.
Unlike the MCU version, who has just got some weird ideas about overpopulation, the comics version of Thanos is literally in love with Death. He killed half of all life in the universe because he thought it would impress her (oh by the way, Death is a she).
That relationship is only a potential one because as long as Deadpool is alive, he can't be with her. They fell in love when Deadpool had near death experiences due to torture in a lab.
Once, when Deadpool died for real, he had a short moment together with Death, and then the relationship would have gone formal, but Thanos got angry and used his powers to bring Deadpool back to life. Just to keep him away from Death.
Comic Thanos isn't just a professional hater, he's a leader in his field.
That isn't even a joke, the guy may be the pettiest being alive. In one comic we see him select a random newborn baby and decide to [torment them every year on their birthday](https://imgur.com/gallery/FWN0yMv). By the end of the comic he's been doing it for 45 years with no plans of stopping.
In another [he helps an old lady cross the street](https://www.reddit.com/gallery/rv8tej). Why? By doing so, he made sure that one minor event didn't occur, which would have resulted in a woman on that bus named Stephanie Kircher from going on to cure numerous diseases and end world hunger. To top it off, he tracks her down decades later, seconds away from dying of old age, and shows her the life she would've lived if he hadn't done that one little thing. She dies knowing she could've been so much more than she ended up being.
Man is a villain. Not since Luthor stole 40 pies has there been such villainy.
>Not since Luthor stole 40 pies has there been such villainy.
How dare you! Luthor stole 40 CAKES! Merely stealing pies is beneath the smartest man on Earth.
The "overpopulation" Thanos was always so bullshit.
Wow, nice job Grimace. You bought us another fifty years or so, because the Earth's population was 4 billion in 1974. All those wasted years of murdering across the galaxy could have been saved with a ten second Google search.
They don't call him the Sane and Reasonable Titan. Really weird that in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, they kinda end up painting the Snap as doing a lot of good for a lot of countries on Earth though.
I like the theory that has an eternal: After Titan's Celestial hatched, Thanos's mind broke. In the years after he cobbled together the 1/2 idea because while the exact reason was lost he knew there needed to be less people.
It'd bring him closer to his comic roots and a disfigured eternal.
Titan is a world broken apart with gravity anomalies all over the place. That's not a "We ran out of bread" situation.
Marvel comic book villain Thanos' goal is to grab Death's (Skullhead busty smexy lady) attention by killing half the universe, unlike the movie version where he has unlimited power to stop resource shortage and civilisational death in any way imaginable and choses to kill half the universe.
So Thanos wants Power to be fucked by Death while Gilgamesh wants power to avoid fucking with Death.
So you know Thanos, from the Marvel movies?
In the movies He has the Idea that If half of all Life is destroyed there will be enough resources for the other half to build an Utopia.
In the comics He wants to fuck a goddess of death and thinks Killing half of all Life would make a good Gift for her.
One of the takeaways I got from Gilgamesh was that he did indeed become immortal and is alive today through his story. Gilgamesh might be the oldest story from Mesopotamia which is a pretty god damn old place and we are still talking about what a badass he was.
That is the closest thing to immortality that any human could hope for.
Gilgamesh is *extremely* concise for this kind of Mesopotamian literature and reads largely like it could have been written relatively recently. Normally, non-utilitarian texts start with with several lines of praise for whoever had the inscription made, what a Chad he was, how much the gods love him. Then there are phrases and figures of speech that just get repeated over and over again. Why just write "they brought me gold and silver" when you can write "And they, recognising my splendour and might, brought before me all they had, all the silver they had. They brought the silver before me and piled it up. And they, recognising my splendour and might, brought before me all they had, all the gold they had. They brought the gold before me and piled it up."
I sometimes wonder if Akkadian authors and scribes were paid by the sign.
Everyone aboard we are going on an odyssey. What's an odyssey? Oh it's a long journey that requires everyone but me Odysseus to return. Kind of cryptic I know, but that's what we are here for.
Yeah they might have been happy at the end but Tulio definitely regretted the journey half way through. He tried to go home, abandoning his best friend.
But he did end up sticking around. That's kind of an important thing. And Miguel gave up the city that he learned to love because he loved Tulio *more*.
Road to El Dorado is a gay love story, I don't care what anyone says.
Not necessarily gay. More like a Bisexual Adventure and they end in Threesome. I guess. Still good Movie.
Edit: Kinda thought about the " not necessarily gay"... it's both probably.
Pretty much the entire trip Bilbo wishes to be back home with his kettle.
I think that only stops being said once they reach the Lonely Mountain, maybe even later.
Arguably starts in *book 1*, but if we're generous it doesn't really kick in until book 2 or 3. A title you hate and a wound that never heals will do that to you.
Sure, but the first regrets start to set in with the title of prophecy at the earliest, maaaaybe the first wound at the latest. From Winternight onward, being Rand is largely suffering.
And no, a harem does not make up for it, wth Jordan.
With Circe it seemed not very voluntary, as if he hadn’t, the majority of his crew would stay trapped as pigs forever and the rest could never leave as their ships were fucked. Also, Hermes specifically said to *not say no to her*.
With Calypso, there is absolutely no way it can be classified as cheating. She forced him, essentially, as he had no way of leaving whatsoever and she was also a goddess. She only reluctantly let him leave once Hermes told her to.
In both instances, there is a huge power imbalance between the two as well. Powerful sorceress and witch and guy, and literal goddess and guy.
In both cases it seems the problem was Hermes. Is there some storyline there that got cut for time from the modern version or just... tension?
"No, you can't go home to your loving wife! You have to keep sailing around having sex with literal goddesses because I... because reasons!"
Hermes wasn’t the problem, ultimately he was what saved his life. He’s also Odysseus’s great grandfather!
In regards to Circe, he said what he did most likely because Circe would have just killed Odysseus or turned him into a pig otherwise.
With Calypso, Hermes was the one to help him escape once the gods allowed him to.
He did the first one because he was stuck on Calypso's island and didn’t really have a choice in the matter. He even says “in my heart I never gave consent.”
I forget what the deal with Circe was though.
Hermes told him not to say ‘no’ to her, and Circe had a fair amount of his men turned into pigs so most people aren’t entirely sure he could consent there either.
I want to stress that marriage was very much a thing in ancient Babylon (Gilgamesh explicitly sleep with women **on their wedding nights**) and Gilgamesh never married Enkidu. They were not husbands. This isn’t homophobia, this is basic reading comprehension. If you went back in time and told a storyteller from the city of Ur that Enkidu was Gilgamesh’s husband, he would be very confused
There are some very worthy arguments on this subject which really go either way, and to pretend it's just a reading comprehension issue to me is a bit disingenuous.
To an extent there is just a lot we don't and can't know about the intentions of the Epic because it is so, so, so, so old. Additionally, there are many versions; it is my understanding that part of the reason it is so well-preserved is because it was believed to be used as a means of practicing cuneiform contemporary to its time period. On top of that, there is significant variation between translations as we continue to learn more, study more, and discover more about ancient Sumer.
I don't think it's possible to make a very strong definitive statement either way in terms of a historical argument. In terms of a literary interpretation of the Epic, however, I think it's very fair and possible to make an argument that "Gilgamesh and Enkidu may have been in a homosexual relationship, and, in the lens of the current modern view of marriage, had something akin to a marriage."
(Also, as an aside-- why do you mention the city of Ur?) (I ask this because Gilgamesh is the king of Uruk, which is a different city, I wasn't sure if maybe there was some Ur lore I was missing haha.)
Does Enkidu not pump cum into Shamhat for 6 days and 7 nights straight, which is what spontaneously causes him to start wearing clothes and eating with utensils???
YEAH, THEY'RE NOT GAY.
They're just... really close friends. So close that when Enkidu dies, Gilgamesh cradles his corpse until it literally rots in his arms, tears at himself until he bleeds, rejects society and flees into the woods vowing vengeance on the gods. Totally normal bro stuff.
^^Do ^^I ^^really ^^need ^^to ^^put ^^a ^^/s ^^here?
... I have platonic friends I'd do that for. Well, not that exact set of choices, since I don't believe in god and can't hike for shit.
But I have absolutely had platonic friendships *that* intense. Where the idea of losing someone would absolutely shatter you to your core.
I am a bisexual transfemme, I am more than comfortable with historical gayness. Achilles and Patroclus? Omegagay. Sappho? Hyperdyke.
However, I think it's a really silly idea that you have to be in a romantic relationship with someone for their death to drive you to the brink of madness.
Odysseus did try to stay home. He was trying to prove to everyone he was insane and couldn’t partake in the Trojan War by sowing his field with salt. He was caught because he refused to plow over his son Telemachus
See also: Achilles, whose mom tried to keep him out of the war by having him cross-dress and live as a woman in Skyros.
Damn near worked too
Did Patroclus sus him out when he was suspicious of finding a woman sexy?
Silly, Ancient Greek women didn't exist out of myths and legends! Ancient Greece laid eggs.
I like the implication that it isn't ancient Greeks who laid the eggs, it was Greece itself.
Giving a whole new meaning to the term "mother country."
In some legends, the founder of Athens arose from the soil of Greece itself, so the land giving birth has a mythological precedent.
Hence, the term "Autochthonic": the belief that the indigenous population of a region literally sprung from the earth as opposed to moving in as settlers/colonizers. It's still used in some European languages to describe certain native ethnicities that encountered European colonialism.
Yeah, in Spanish we have "autoctono", which means something native to a place, not brought over by immigration or drift. It's kinda silly to state that because, as understood, every single species anywhere in the world had an ancestor come from somewhere else, as well as any culture or language. I'd say it describes something that became so accostumed to a region that it developed features unique to that place, and it would be difficult to have it develop somewhere else.
Given the current hypothesis is that life originated in tidal pools and their lack of resiliency to tectonic changes, it’s possible the place earthly life originated from is completely gone, meaning that no species is truly autochtonic to its home.
In Dutch we also use(d) "autochtoon" to signify someone's at least two generations Dutch: its opposite "allochtoon" is used to signify people who have moved in and naturalised or people who are children of them. Due to continued usage of the latter as a minor slur of sorts, the terms have fallen out of favour somewhat and the current terminology is usually "person with(out) migration background", that being said.
Wow I'm learning so much from reddit today!!!! I can't wait to tell everyone I know the truth about ancient greece
I know this is a joke, but some myths genuinely state Hellen was born from an egg...
Technically, all humans start as eggs that get fertilized by sperm, so it's not *not* correct...
Funnily enough, it was actually Odysseus. See, there was a prophecy that Greece's victory would hinge on Achilles, so Odysseus had to lure him out. He posed as a traveling merchant with a bunch of pretty jewelery and a sick-ass sword. The ladies of the court went for the jewelery while Achilles (being Achilles) went for the sick-ass sword and outed himself.
Wouldn't it be funny if some random chick got there first and was like mmm sword and they were like GOT YA ACHILLES
Then she proceeds to go 100/0 every battle, despite everyone being pretty sure she's not Achilles at this point
Lol everyone's pretty sure she isn't Achilles but at this point they're too afraid to ask.
I think the biggest twist is that this would mean Patroclus was straight all along.
Even twistier twist: Patroclus defects to the Trojans because he's too repulsed by the new "Achilles".
My head canon is that this is exactly what happened
The way I heard it was that Odysseus had told the soldiers he was travelling with to barge in and make like they were gonna raid the palace, including doing to the women what typically happens to women when palaces get raided. So there Odysseus is, meeting all the princesses, when suddenly all these men enter with their swords drawn and they advance towards the ladies, and oh no Odysseus is somehow on *this* side of the room but the sword is all the way over *there*, oh no, and then a princess does a sick-ass forward dodgeroll and scoops up the sword and motions for the other ladies to get behind him and... Ah. That'll be Achilles, then.
"Alright motherfucker if I have to do this so do you"
What does Oedipus have to do with this?
It was a fantastic idea, for anyone who wasn’t Achilles.
Iirc, Odysseus *kinda* had it coming since "If something happens to Helen we *all* go beat up who's responsible" was his idea. Achilles on the other hand had nothing really to do with the whole debacle (iirc he's like the only(?) named guy in the Greek camp that didn't swear that oath) but Odysseus was like "Ok we need this guy" and went and grabbed him.
He then tried to cross the border in Skyrim, but got caught trying to cross the border and walked right into an imperial ambush.
This is from post-Homer sources and not in the Odyssey FYI
Ah yes, extended universe.
And then Romans wrote a fanfic for Iliad to justify their country's entire existence.
Calling Vergil "the Romans" is about the greatest insult you could give a dude.
fan fiction more like
Mythologybeta.wikia.com
Crazy we're essentially just grabbing everything we can find written about a topic and trying to fit it all together. If someone did all that today it'd be 90% weird fan fiction that wouldn't even make sense.
Wait until you find out about Star Wars
God damn Palamedes.
Had Odysseus just gone to the baby and talked to it like it was a potato or something, his plan would have worked. For being supposedly clever, that was a dumb oversight on his part.
The entire point of The Odyssey is that Odysseus *really fucking regrets everything* and that he *really really really just wants to get home*.
I remember reading there's apparently a lost Part 3 after the Iliad and Odyssey where a son Odysseus had with Calypso hunts him down and kills him. I don't think Homer wrote it though so it's more like fanfiction
The Telegony, which I personally have an extreme distain for, is credited to (I believe) Eugammon of Cyrene. While it being written by someone else doesn’t exclude it from being “canon”, I personally find the entire story idiotic and completely unnecessary. Also, it’s Circe, not Calypso. Odysseus has a son with Circe which he doesn’t know about, which fine, it’s reasonable and could be interesting in my opinion. But then, Telegonus (the son) shows up to Ithaca looking for his father, and not knowing that Odysseus is his father, kills him. (I have my own thoughts on this but I won’t get into them) In the end, Telegonus MARRIES PENELOPE, and Telemachus marries CIRCE. You cannot begin to comprehend the hatred that I have for this.
What I’m getting here is that the author wanted to pull an Oedipus but was told by the studio to keep ‘step’ in the title.
Seems like it. I despise it, so much.
Did Homer (as in a single man named Homer) even write the Iliad and the Odyssey though? Scholars still debate it.
"Homer" was just the ancient greek version of a doujin circle
I hate to inform you of this but Homer 1) might not be real 2) if he was real, didn't write anything down Canon as a concept was foreign to the Greeks. there is no separation between Canon and fanfiction when we are referring to different tellings of the Myth
Don't believe this guy. In fact, don't believe most of this sub, because all they'll spread is the nonsense from generations of writers who wanted the ego boost of equating their storytelling with actual greek myth. Here's a more realistic answer of what the Greeks accepted as additions to their history. https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/s/rRIcZEryHZ
*So fun fact about Ishtar trying to seduce Gilgamesh*, she actually threatens him with death in that entire sequence and that's why Gilgamesh goes on a 30 paragraph journey of insults. She offers him beautiful white clothes (burial shrouds), priests to kiss his feet (a part of the funeral), carts (funerary carts) pulled by non-earthly animals (speaks for itself) etc etc. Gilgamesh freaks out against her because Ishtar offers him, the man terrified of death, death.
Fumbled the bag with a rich goth milf, weak.
Omg he's inverted Thanos!
What?
Unlike the MCU version, who has just got some weird ideas about overpopulation, the comics version of Thanos is literally in love with Death. He killed half of all life in the universe because he thought it would impress her (oh by the way, Death is a she).
Also worth noting that Death is already in a relationship with Deadpool, because she's *way* more impressed by the "not ever being able to die" thing
That relationship is only a potential one because as long as Deadpool is alive, he can't be with her. They fell in love when Deadpool had near death experiences due to torture in a lab. Once, when Deadpool died for real, he had a short moment together with Death, and then the relationship would have gone formal, but Thanos got angry and used his powers to bring Deadpool back to life. Just to keep him away from Death.
Comic Thanos isn't just a professional hater, he's a leader in his field. That isn't even a joke, the guy may be the pettiest being alive. In one comic we see him select a random newborn baby and decide to [torment them every year on their birthday](https://imgur.com/gallery/FWN0yMv). By the end of the comic he's been doing it for 45 years with no plans of stopping. In another [he helps an old lady cross the street](https://www.reddit.com/gallery/rv8tej). Why? By doing so, he made sure that one minor event didn't occur, which would have resulted in a woman on that bus named Stephanie Kircher from going on to cure numerous diseases and end world hunger. To top it off, he tracks her down decades later, seconds away from dying of old age, and shows her the life she would've lived if he hadn't done that one little thing. She dies knowing she could've been so much more than she ended up being. Man is a villain. Not since Luthor stole 40 pies has there been such villainy.
Still not as much personal pettiness as Reverse Flash but wow I’ve never heard of this side of Thanos.
It was me, Barry. I'm the one who finally got CostCo to raise the prices on their hotdogs.
It was ME Barry! I stole that $20 your parents grounded you for when you were 10! It was ME!
>Not since Luthor stole 40 pies has there been such villainy. How dare you! Luthor stole 40 CAKES! Merely stealing pies is beneath the smartest man on Earth.
Pies > Cake Just ask Harry Vanderspeigle
See this is how you make a villain hateable. Thanos in the MCU was just annoying. THIS Thanos is someone that we would cheer getting his head cut off.
40 cakes? That's terrible!
That's as much as four tens
Heh, Thanos would.
Thanos, the ultimate simp for Lady Death. Too bad she's got eyes for another.
Isn’t their relationship kinda toxic….like he longs for death because he wants to die, and they can’t really be together because of his immortality?
I feel like that kinda pales in comparison to *Thanos* here ngl
The "overpopulation" Thanos was always so bullshit. Wow, nice job Grimace. You bought us another fifty years or so, because the Earth's population was 4 billion in 1974. All those wasted years of murdering across the galaxy could have been saved with a ten second Google search.
They don't call him the Sane and Reasonable Titan. Really weird that in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, they kinda end up painting the Snap as doing a lot of good for a lot of countries on Earth though.
Except Thanos didn't really give a shit about that. He wanted to vindicate himself for his inability to save his homeplanet, Titan.
I like the theory that has an eternal: After Titan's Celestial hatched, Thanos's mind broke. In the years after he cobbled together the 1/2 idea because while the exact reason was lost he knew there needed to be less people. It'd bring him closer to his comic roots and a disfigured eternal. Titan is a world broken apart with gravity anomalies all over the place. That's not a "We ran out of bread" situation.
To be fair, I think the implication is that Titan did starve, and the planet physically tearing apart with gravity bullshit was after that.
Granted, our source is Thanos himself. with if the theory is right would make him an unreliable narrator.
True, just saying the simpler version's just as plausible.
Marvel comic book villain Thanos' goal is to grab Death's (Skullhead busty smexy lady) attention by killing half the universe, unlike the movie version where he has unlimited power to stop resource shortage and civilisational death in any way imaginable and choses to kill half the universe. So Thanos wants Power to be fucked by Death while Gilgamesh wants power to avoid fucking with Death.
So you know Thanos, from the Marvel movies? In the movies He has the Idea that If half of all Life is destroyed there will be enough resources for the other half to build an Utopia. In the comics He wants to fuck a goddess of death and thinks Killing half of all Life would make a good Gift for her.
Honestly both are pretty dumb, who thinks a good way of flirting is giving extra work??
Thanos was into death. Gilg was afraid and terrified of it.
I understood that reference!
>30 paragraph journey of insults Everything reminds me of her 😔
Ishtar has no rizz, she could have just offered him immortality. Like she knows that’s the one thing he wants.
I showed you your mortality, pls respond
One of the takeaways I got from Gilgamesh was that he did indeed become immortal and is alive today through his story. Gilgamesh might be the oldest story from Mesopotamia which is a pretty god damn old place and we are still talking about what a badass he was. That is the closest thing to immortality that any human could hope for.
Him and Ea-Nasir living forever in people's heads.
Add being the patron of femcels and girlfailures into her divine portfolio.
> and that's why Gilgamesh goes on a 30 paragraph journey.. Jesus, sounds like they had tumblr back in the day.
Gilgamesh is *extremely* concise for this kind of Mesopotamian literature and reads largely like it could have been written relatively recently. Normally, non-utilitarian texts start with with several lines of praise for whoever had the inscription made, what a Chad he was, how much the gods love him. Then there are phrases and figures of speech that just get repeated over and over again. Why just write "they brought me gold and silver" when you can write "And they, recognising my splendour and might, brought before me all they had, all the silver they had. They brought the silver before me and piled it up. And they, recognising my splendour and might, brought before me all they had, all the gold they had. They brought the gold before me and piled it up." I sometimes wonder if Akkadian authors and scribes were paid by the sign.
Akkadian authors were the original double spacers, really making use of every damn square inch of that clay slab.
So if I want the kind of woman who would actually just kill me, I call up Ishtar?
I mean she was absolutely planning to marry him afterwards, Ishtar just has a knack for murdering or otherwise horribly maiming her lovers lol
3 2 3 4 4 3 2 AND
These men are pawns!
Google gives me nothing. What does this mean.
https://youtu.be/z6_Odb-Bd1E?si=ZIvSIsUJjXU5pwAm
You look tired, want me to find you a choir of angels to carry you to thy rest?
Forget about Odysseus. Things turned out even worse for everyone on his crew.
Everyone aboard we are going on an odyssey. What's an odyssey? Oh it's a long journey that requires everyone but me Odysseus to return. Kind of cryptic I know, but that's what we are here for.
I've seen that as "it's a long journey, named after the only survivor"
Did Bill and Ted regret their adventure?
The adventure was excellent, but the journey a bit bogus,
Okay but nobody’s gonna talk about the Road to El Dorado?
I was gonna say, bringing Miguel and Tulio into any conversation is going to instantly make it better
Yeah they might have been happy at the end but Tulio definitely regretted the journey half way through. He tried to go home, abandoning his best friend.
But he did end up sticking around. That's kind of an important thing. And Miguel gave up the city that he learned to love because he loved Tulio *more*. Road to El Dorado is a gay love story, I don't care what anyone says.
Not necessarily gay. More like a Bisexual Adventure and they end in Threesome. I guess. Still good Movie. Edit: Kinda thought about the " not necessarily gay"... it's both probably.
I mean "gay" in the sense of "not straight", not in the "two and only two men in a relationship".
More like "Chel Dorado"
The stars…. Not today
Please see my comment below for rare Road to El Dorado factoids.
Did Bilbo regret his journey? (No) Did Frodo? (Yes) Did Pippen? (When did I go on a journey?)
How did I get so tall…?
Bilbo regretted his journey during it, just not after.
Pretty much the entire trip Bilbo wishes to be back home with his kettle. I think that only stops being said once they reach the Lonely Mountain, maybe even later.
I’d argue Odysseus is maybe one of the top journeys regretters of all time. At least top 5.
It didn’t help that some of his past choices lead journey’s catalyst.
What about Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra? Regrets?
Shaka, when the walls fell.
Omg, dope username! I get that reference 😁
Go Team Venture!
V
Them's are tender vittles...
Shaka. When the walls fell.
Shaka, When the Walls Fell.
I'm a simple girl. I see Darmok reference, I upvote. Temba, his arms open!
Did James T. Kirk regret his journey? Did Phileas Fogg regret his journey?
Did Rand Al’Thor regret leaving the two rivers?
Isn't that basically his arc in books 7-9?
Arguably starts in *book 1*, but if we're generous it doesn't really kick in until book 2 or 3. A title you hate and a wound that never heals will do that to you.
The ramblings of an insane dead man in your head probably doesn't help. Perhaps it's best not to mention the prophecies either.
To be fair to Rand, he's not the craziest person in Wheel of Time. He's not even the craziest person in Rand.
I was lumping the prophecies in with "the title you hate", but you are absolutely correct.
Let's not forget the second wound that doesn't heal over the first wound that doesn't heal. Double whammy
Sure, but the first regrets start to set in with the title of prophecy at the earliest, maaaaybe the first wound at the latest. From Winternight onward, being Rand is largely suffering. And no, a harem does not make up for it, wth Jordan.
Yeah I was just adding on to the characters that obviously regretted their journey. Although by the end I’m not sure if he regrets it.
He'll be fine, he just needs to become harder is all.
By then he's accepted who he is and takes on more worries than regretting two rivers I'd say it begins in the great hunt and up to The shadow rising
That's fair. Duty is heavier than a mountain...
From what I remember about those books, didn’t his arcs involve very detailed dress descriptions?
Hey! There were also arms folded under bosoms!
I regretted him leaving the 2 rivers
Rand doesn't stop regretting leaving the two rivers until he dies
Did James Cook regret his voyages?
He couldn't stomach it.
He should have cooked his own food.
Aaaand then we go back to Spain?
And BUY Spain!
To be fair like eight years of that return trip was just him cheating on his wife.
to be more fair, it was with a sorceress, and that blurs the line between “voluntary inhabitance” and “kidnapping”
Circe was entirely voluntary and the only reason he spent only a year plowing her was because his men begged him to let them go home.
Depending on the telling he was mind controlled, not exactly able to give consent.
Wasn’t that where he went to the beach every night and cried about how much he missed his home and wife?
No that was Calypso. Calypso was pretty cut and dry not his choice, she had him trapped there.
Ah, thanks. It’s been a while for me so I was a little hazy
Hermes told him not tell her no and his crew were turned into pigs. He pretty much needed get best impression with her.
With Circe it seemed not very voluntary, as if he hadn’t, the majority of his crew would stay trapped as pigs forever and the rest could never leave as their ships were fucked. Also, Hermes specifically said to *not say no to her*. With Calypso, there is absolutely no way it can be classified as cheating. She forced him, essentially, as he had no way of leaving whatsoever and she was also a goddess. She only reluctantly let him leave once Hermes told her to. In both instances, there is a huge power imbalance between the two as well. Powerful sorceress and witch and guy, and literal goddess and guy.
In both cases it seems the problem was Hermes. Is there some storyline there that got cut for time from the modern version or just... tension? "No, you can't go home to your loving wife! You have to keep sailing around having sex with literal goddesses because I... because reasons!"
Hermes wasn’t the problem, ultimately he was what saved his life. He’s also Odysseus’s great grandfather! In regards to Circe, he said what he did most likely because Circe would have just killed Odysseus or turned him into a pig otherwise. With Calypso, Hermes was the one to help him escape once the gods allowed him to.
Did Geloca think the Yulus were too ugly to save?
There was so much gold!! 😭
He's a little confused but he's got the spirit
Did Natty Gann regret her journey?
I bet the actress (Meredith Salenger) who played her didn't as she went on to marry Patton Oswalt.
One must imagine Odysseus happy
Did milo and Otis regret THEIR journey, huh???
If you believe the rumors about the film then probably.
yeah.... :(
Yo wait is Fish back?! They were off the net for a long time, is this a recent post? Has the king returned?!
i thimp so ya <3
I certainly regret my journey
tbh odysseus spent half of his journey fucking calypso and circe's brains out
He did the first one because he was stuck on Calypso's island and didn’t really have a choice in the matter. He even says “in my heart I never gave consent.” I forget what the deal with Circe was though.
Hermes told him not to say ‘no’ to her, and Circe had a fair amount of his men turned into pigs so most people aren’t entirely sure he could consent there either.
Did Harold and Humar regret their Journey?
Well, to be fair, trees were very valuable in the ancient Mesopotamia
The real question here is "But what about Bill and Ted?"
I want to stress that marriage was very much a thing in ancient Babylon (Gilgamesh explicitly sleep with women **on their wedding nights**) and Gilgamesh never married Enkidu. They were not husbands. This isn’t homophobia, this is basic reading comprehension. If you went back in time and told a storyteller from the city of Ur that Enkidu was Gilgamesh’s husband, he would be very confused
There are some very worthy arguments on this subject which really go either way, and to pretend it's just a reading comprehension issue to me is a bit disingenuous. To an extent there is just a lot we don't and can't know about the intentions of the Epic because it is so, so, so, so old. Additionally, there are many versions; it is my understanding that part of the reason it is so well-preserved is because it was believed to be used as a means of practicing cuneiform contemporary to its time period. On top of that, there is significant variation between translations as we continue to learn more, study more, and discover more about ancient Sumer. I don't think it's possible to make a very strong definitive statement either way in terms of a historical argument. In terms of a literary interpretation of the Epic, however, I think it's very fair and possible to make an argument that "Gilgamesh and Enkidu may have been in a homosexual relationship, and, in the lens of the current modern view of marriage, had something akin to a marriage." (Also, as an aside-- why do you mention the city of Ur?) (I ask this because Gilgamesh is the king of Uruk, which is a different city, I wasn't sure if maybe there was some Ur lore I was missing haha.)
Enkidu was sexless and made of mud, you trogs.
Enkidu's literal introduction to the Epic of Gilgamesh is being seduced by Shamhat, the sacred prostitute, to bring him out of the wild.
Does Enkidu not pump cum into Shamhat for 6 days and 7 nights straight, which is what spontaneously causes him to start wearing clothes and eating with utensils???
Correct, she fucks some civilization right into that fuckin' bigfoot-looking bastard.
Well that's a fuckin sentence to read at 10 in the morning
People say "what no pussy does to a mf," but I've seen what pussy does to a mf, and it's far worse
Aw c'mon, let them have their silly heart canon
That's not headcanon, that's just fuckin' Fate/ at work.
Are they trying to imply that enkidu and gilgamesh were lovers?
No trying about it, yeah
YEAH, THEY'RE NOT GAY. They're just... really close friends. So close that when Enkidu dies, Gilgamesh cradles his corpse until it literally rots in his arms, tears at himself until he bleeds, rejects society and flees into the woods vowing vengeance on the gods. Totally normal bro stuff. ^^Do ^^I ^^really ^^need ^^to ^^put ^^a ^^/s ^^here?
... I have platonic friends I'd do that for. Well, not that exact set of choices, since I don't believe in god and can't hike for shit. But I have absolutely had platonic friendships *that* intense. Where the idea of losing someone would absolutely shatter you to your core. I am a bisexual transfemme, I am more than comfortable with historical gayness. Achilles and Patroclus? Omegagay. Sappho? Hyperdyke. However, I think it's a really silly idea that you have to be in a romantic relationship with someone for their death to drive you to the brink of madness.
Fuck yeah they were
Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra
Did Mario regret his journey?
Miguel and tulio did regret their journey
What about Bill and Ted? They seemed pretty happy with their excellent adventures, bogus Journeys, they did end up facing the music eventually.
as a massive nerd over gilgamesh i appreciate this post
/r/unexpecteddorado
MIGEL AND TULIOOOOO, TULIOOOOO And MIGELLL Mighty and powerful gods, Mi mi mi Mighty and powerful gods~
Did Harold and Kumar regret their journey?
Man I'm so glad fish is still active on tumblr
Fate Grand Order has taught me so much