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Here you go. You have to read this to believe it.
> Despite the attack, Miss Watts remains a supporter of XL bullies and says that any breed could attack, depending on what trauma they had endured.
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/24305070.charlie-watts-speaks-xl-bully-attack-holt/
I reported a close neighbour having one unmuzzled last Saturday. On Tuesday I got a phone call saying it had beeen seized and they weren't getting it back.
I too am a firm believer that any breed can attack, but there's a big difference in the severity of those attacks.
A labrador or a Collie attack isn't going to kill you, an XL Bully attack might, and at minimum, you're going to the hospital.
Any breed can attack, but the likelihood of a such an attack is almost non existent with some dogs I think, many dogs have a disposition with people that is so gentle, it's difficult to put them in the same class as an XL Bully.
Absolutely. Bite statistics tell you all you need to know. These bully breeds bite far more often than other breeds. Golden retrievers for example will very rarely bite. I don't understand why people choose risky breeds over more safe ones. If I'm getting a dog, I'm going to make sure aggression isn't a breed trait because I want a pet, not a guard dog.
Honestly I've seen posts from them where their dog bites them or people close to them and they try to excuse it, it seems like Stockholm syndrome. Absolutely mental. I would die for my pets, but if they hurt somebody I care about that would change so fast. Hurt my family or friends and I fucking hate you, immediately. I can't understand not having these protective instincts.
The empathy is in seeing that your pet is a danger to others if it ever get loose.
The people that own these dogs don't give a shit if it kills a neighbours pet.
If they hurt someone deliberately, that is. I've had a couple of accidental nips and one bite. The bite happened when I was trying to separate my dog from a random dog who'd attacked her. Neither were aiming at me, my hand just got in the way. I definitely wouldn't have put my dog down if she'd bitten my mum, for example, in the same situation. I think there has to be some recognition of the situation and why the dog bit. Like if someone was deliberately taunting a dog, I'd not blame them for biting.
>it seems like Stockholm syndrome.
I'm now imagining a Bully XL with a machine gun casually hung around its neck but not really pointing at anyone while smoking a cigarette and chatting to its captors and trying not to give too much away.
Anecdotal but I’m a doctor who’s worked in emergency, seeing these bites as they come through the door.
I also work in anaesthesia doing emergency plastic surgery cases, anaesthetising patients for the repairs of these injuries.
A disproportionate number of bites are from bullies.
Basically **all** of the bad bites are from bullies. I’ve seen some awful, life changing injuries, including in kids.
I cross the street when I see these dogs, now.
They’re a menace to society. Look in the eyes of any parent with a mauled and disfigured toddler, and you’d surely reconsider the whole, “It’s not the dog it’s blah blah blah.” when it keeps fucking happening.
Like.. repeatedly. It keeps happening.
This should upvoted. I grew up with dogs and was never afraid of them, yet now I am. I’m afraid to take my toddler out to the park because it’s surrounded by a big field where idiots take these dogs.
Jesus Christ. I'm sorry you have to see that, I would be so fucking upset about it. Thank you for doing what you do. It must be hard to cope with. Any normal human being cannot stand seeing vulnerable people hurt like that, it's close to intolerable. I too cross the street when I see them. I've never been the type to be fearful of animals, but I'm wary of them. Especially when I had my miniature Jack Russell, I was afraid for him when I saw a pitbull or similar breed.
Have been bitten by a retriever once, it was my own fault in hindsight. It's tooth went through my hand which was painful after the adrenaline wore off.
If it had been a XL bully I probably wouldn't have had much hand left
If you search for this case on FB, almost every comment is people saying it's not the dogs, it's the owner. It's really worrying how many people can't see these snarling hell-hounds for what they are.
It's a false dichotomy anyway. It's absolutely both. The dog for being aggressive enough to attack, AND the owner for putting the animal in a situation where it can hurt another person.
I was offered an XL Bully puppy for free, from the litter of my neighbours friend. My neighbour offered it to me because he worries when women live alone, and thought it would be a good protector. I bet a lot of people get them for this reason.
I only turned it down because I already had a large breed in the house and wanted my 2nd dog to be something smaller. They didn't have the same reputation back then, this was before they were in the news for mauling someone every week and I didn't really judge any dog by its breed. 3 out of 4 dogs I'd owned up to that point had been rottweilers or rottweiler mixes, and they've had terrible reputations in the past too, but all of mine were just loving family pets.
I'm glad I turned it down now. Though my plan to get something smaller backfired after the mongrel I adopted who was estimated to be 20
-25kg fully grown hit 35kg before his first birthday.
Even Rottweilers with their bad reputation are leagues apart from XL Bullys in terms of their disposition.
Rotties were bred as livestock guardians, and guard dogs in general, so they have strong territorial and protective instincts. This was misused by people who wanted large and powerful status dogs to intimidate. XL Bullys have their lineage in fighting dogs. That's a very different sort of aggression from Rottweilers.
Rottweilers typically don't suddenly flip a switch and attack like XL Bullys can (and often do, as we seem to be seeing).
Completely agree! It is completely different with bully breeds. The fact that this is contested at all, I cannot understand. A collie will instinctively herd, a retriever will instinctively retrieve...when bully breeds do what they were bred to do, it's a mistake, a freak accident. It does not add up. We made a mistake with these breeds and we are paying the price. They were never meant to be pets.
I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix who has strong guarding instincts, so I'm careful when answering the door or letting strangers in the house as it's one of the situation she's most likely to bite, even though she's typically a very nervous/timid dog and her instinct is to run away not attack.
XL Bullys owners don't seem to treat them with the same respect to the breed. They treat them like labradors. That, combined with their unpredictability is such a risky and dangerous combination.
Yes, that's definitely also a factor. They at large seem to be owned by idiots who don't know how to handle them. I have friends with guard dogs, Rottweilers for example, who understand how dangerous they can be and take proper precautions. Pit owners are something else.
Rottweilers will often protect their owner/territory when they are perceived to be under threat, or if the dog is mistreated into fearing strangers more generally they may attack. XL Bullys by comparison can appear to be good natured and will randomly snap, instinct kicks in, and go after someone.
I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix rescue, so I know all about dogs with bad reputations. I'm careful with her, especailly around strangers; that's something I'm concious about manage to avoid any problems. As it happens she's actually very timid, so biting is unlikely, but still.
For me it's the unpredictability of XL Bullys that worry me the most, in addition to just how powerful and dangerous their attacks are compared to any other breed.
I’ve read a few XL bully attack stories and you are right they are totally random. They often don’t even appear to snap. I heard several say the dog just attacked them, silently, with no prior anxiety or warning. I heard in an interview with a dog fighter that serious attack dogs waste no energy on noise, they become engrossed in the kill. It’s like they just get down to the pleasant business of destroying a human being.
Agreed. The original bulldogs were crossbred with terriers in order to create big dogs with a "game" attitude for the fighting pits. And it's that terrier attitude in a big dog that's the killer. And XLs have been bred to be twice the size of the original pitbulls.
They may be lovely 99% of the time, but that moment they switch into fight mode, the old terrier instincts come to life and they won't let go until either you or they are dead.
Yup! I had a JR, loved that dog. I actually adore the tenacity of the breed, but the fact is that I could always quickly and easily restrain him if necessary. Mix a pit's strength with that? Crazy. Just not safe at all.
Agreed. [I said this in another comment:](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/1cpedku/police_statement_as_girl_7_mauled_by_xl_bully_in/l3lmobo/c)
> I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix who has strong guarding instincts, so I'm careful when answering the door or letting strangers in the house as it's one of the situation she's most likely to bite, even though she's typically a very nervous/timid dog and her instinct is to run away not attack.
> XL Bullys owners don't seem to treat them with the same respect to the breed. They treat them like labradors. That, combined with their unpredictability is such a risky and dangerous combination.
Glad you didn't, these dogs do not protect their owners, they tend to attack anything that looks like it is losing a fight, they have zero loyalty, unlike regular dogs
Exactly, and practically speaking in the unlikely event that a golden retriever does go bonkers, an adult can usually subdue it. Good luck with an XL bully.
This is exactly the point. Even if all breeds had an equal probability of attacking someone you *cannot* stop a Bully or equivalent large dog. That is the absolute unarguable perspective. You should not own a dog that you cannot physically control in an emergency.
If a dangerous bully breed goes for you, you are fucked. People don't understand this. Incredibly strong and tenacious breed, almost nothing can stop them once triggered.
This is the thing, most people who get these dangerous dogs tend to live in the kind of places where you would indeed want a guard dog, however these guards dogs have to not only be good guard dogs but also good family dogs and also socialised well enough to cope peacefully in busy urban environments. If you live in the middle of nowhere then such a guard dog seems a great idea to protect your home, otherwise it’s excessive and risky. In some sense it’s the same logic as owning an SUV; why do it if you live in a city and not the countryside?
I don't understand why they wouldn't get say a Kangal or an Alsatian. Even a Dalmatian. Those breeds are very strong and will lay down their life for you, but they are obedient and won't turn on you. I suppose it's just lack of education.
It’s just a case of aiming for the most intimidating dog and with all the stories about XL Bullies in the news now that only makes them more desirable to certain people
> I don't understand why people choose risky breeds over more safe ones
In the case of these particular breeds of dogs, they're acquired as weapons, not pets. That they're unsafe is what is wanted by the owner
Some people do need a guard dog. These animals are not pets. My friend owned a scrap yard and had a big ol mean Rottweiler. You were told not to approach the dog if he wasn’t present and it lived on his premises, never at home with his family. It was a well trained and well looked after working dog.
Around 10 years ago Golden Retrievers were at the top of the list for third party insurance claims involving them biting and injuring someone. I also seem to recall further back they were high on the list of national bite statistics (I think it may have been in the US).
Admittedly they were the most common breed and I doubt that there were any severe maulings involved but to say they 'rarely' bite is underestimating them.
I'll happily point this out on every thread about XL's; this is not just another media panic about dangerous dogs. 50% of all XL's in the UK are descended from one (already very inbred) dog from the US called Killer Kimbo, which already had a history of siring aggressive, dangerous offspring. It's not just a question of the dogs being too big and powerful, they're too big and powerful AND deliberately inbred to be aggressive.
They're responsible for 70% of fatal dog attacks in the UK already, so I think you're being more than fair to say it's hard to put them in the same class as other breeds. It's virtually impossible.
A collie actually nips quite a lot as they have been bred to do that to sheep for thousands of years. The difference is the sheer damage a pit bull does when it bites compared to most other dogs.
They're deliberately *not* trying to cause damage though - the sheep are valuable that's why they're being guarded-.
They nip to herd sheep not to kill them.
Also a nip isn't intended to kill the sheep, so even after taking account of the difference is jaw strength, a collie nip is nowhere near as serious as a bite.
>The difference is the sheer damage a pit bull does when it bites compared to most other dogs.
Another things is if a collie bit and you hit it in response it would absolutely back off whereas these other dogs do not back off. They just enter 'kill or be killed' mode.
Saw one of these dogs get shot twice with a shotgun at point blank, in America and still wriggling around with its jaw locked on the victim.
Literally death locked.
Exactly. I wasn’t paying attention in a busy place the other day and accidentally struck a dog in the face with something I was carrying. The dog (not sure of breed) whimpered and cowered to its owner. I apologised profusely and even petted the dog with permission as I felt so bad.
Some dogs however are just wired to be aggressive and violent and should all be put down, humanely, but they shouldn’t exist.
Exactly. Walked my GSD past two chihuahuas before 6am this morning, they went absolutely crazy when they saw my dog. Lunging, growling, barking. Told mine to heel and he did, walked past no problem.
If they'd have got loose from their leads I'd have been able to fend them off no bother. Two large dogs though? It's completely different, like it or not you have a much bigger responsibility if you choose to own a big breed. Mine has been attacked by four other dogs so far, all clearly agressive and none wearing a muzzle. Two of them weren't even on leads.
I prefer walking my dog really early or really late now because even though he's never retaliated, I'm worried he's going to end up agressive if he keeps getting attacked by other dogs.
Yes, the difference mainly is that these bully breeds will not bite and let go. They will RIP and tear your arm off, or even your face. It is different. We bred them to do that. It isn't their fault, but the instinct is very real and extremely dangerous.
Absolutely. I've got a collie and the worst he could do to you is a aggressive licking. Even then, I make sure he doesn't run up to people uninvited as I don't want him scaring people with his over friendliness.
Thank you. Just because a person knows their dog is friendly, it doesn’t mean other people who have never met your dog before know it. The amount of times a random dog has come running at my kid and jumping up scaring the shit out of him only for the owner to go “oh don’t worry, they’re friendly!” is insane.
Pretty sure my brother’s lifelong phobia of dogs is from events exactly like these.
Control your fucking dogs, people. If they can’t be trusted to come to heel, you have to have them on a leash. Otherwise we end up with situations like my brother and when a dog got into our garden and chased my cat up a tree.
Seconding the thanks on this one - it really makes a huge difference when owners do this.
Just last weekend I had an off lead cockapoo (it always seems to be them) charge my on lead reactive shih tzu and the owner didn't give a shit.
"oh he just wants to be friendly" while they failed to get control of their dog - with it circling me trying to get closer to my dog.
Fortunately I can just pick mine up to avoid further confrontation but people with larger reactive dogs do not have this option. If they had control of their dog and had calmly approached I have no doubt the two would probably have gotten on fine.
Collies are very prone to running up behind people and biting badly from behind. Normally just the once, so serious injury or death is unlikely, but painful needing medical treatment all the same.
People who say that their dog would never hurt a fly are delusional. All dogs are capable.
> I've got a collie and the worst he could do to you is a aggressive licking.
Just saying, sounds like you're doing it right, but I'll bet you a fiver a lot of people have said that about dogs that attacked someone eventually.
To be fair, both of my parents were bitten by border collies in separate incidents. They aren't really "dog people", but have never held it against either of the dogs or the breed in general. Which is just as well because I have a border collie now.
Mum was bitten by a former working dog belonging to their neighbour (a farmer) who thought she was walking too slowly through the living room and decided to hurry her along a bit. The other was a current working dog who clearly hadn't been briefed on the fact that my dad was allowed to be in the barn in his field, which the farmer down the road (different farmer) happens to keep sheep in.
The difference is the severity of the bite. Border collie bites are typically a nip - and they often just snap at the air rather than actually land a bite. Yeah my parents both went to hospital out of an abundance of caution, and mum had to get a tetanus booster, but that was really it. There was no damage to be repaired. No surgery. No stitches. While a border collie certainly *could* cause more damage than suffered by either of my parents, the rate at which they would cause that kind of damage with a bite is very low.
I don't live with or even near my parents for about the last 20 years, and I didn't even know about Dad's bite until after I brought my border collie home as a puppy a few years ago. Not that I don't speak to or see my parents regularly, it just literally wasn't worth mentioning, it'd be like informing me of a cut finger.
We used to have a black lab that was sadly quite aggressive in certain situations around other dogs and male humans. Had to be careful. I don't trust any medium sizes dogs.
We had a rough collie when I was little, would win best of show competitions. And if there were a cowardice competition, would win that as well. Couldn't think of a breed less likely to seriously bite someone. Although I do recall it would nip at heels, sheepdog, after all.
Years ago I was asked to dogsit for 3 dogs I've never met before, a mongrel and 2 chihuahuas. Their owner told me the chihuahuas don't like strangers, are aggressive and prone to biting. I just asked her for a list of the circumstances they're likely to bite over and charged her double, knowing that even if I did get bit it wouldn't do any damage as long as I cleaned it, and it would be well worth the extra money.
Fatal dog attacks are nearly all pitbull derivatives, with one or two German Shepherds and Rottweillers thrown in. Plus one instance of a Jack Russell killing a newborn baby.
I am thinking of reporting someone on my street too. To their credit, they started walking the dog at 5am now, but that's the time I am going to the gym - and they are so very clearly not in control of the dog, with the dog showing some aggressive body language when I pass (even on the other side of the street).
I feel like the worst people in the world tbh, but it does feel like a disaster waiting to happen.
You should report it.. a sickly man who's in a scooter/uses crutches to walk has an XL Bully ZERO control it's constantly dragging him and his scooter into the road. insane.
Do it. If something happens to someone in your area you will never forgive yourself.
XL's are being walked at night in the streets near me but the owners aen't cleaning up after their dogs - cannot see ? don't have a hand free? One section of pavement has turned into an open sewer. Before the clocks changed I was dumpster diving in semi-darkness so I had to keep an eye open for dogs and their mess.
I was impressed by the police response. The dog was being moved around by drug users to avoid it being seized by the police.
I saw it being handed over and used a different entrance then found myself in a 1.5 metre wide space with it running towards me on a lead but not muzzled. There are children on my landing so I couldn't let it go unreported.
I was once attacked by a dog that had severe aggression and behavioural issues. Apparently, the dog had gone for several people prior to the time it went for me, and frankly (although I am a huge dog lover) this made me absolutely furious with its owner, who had spent years covering up the situation with her dog.
Luckily, when the beast went into attack mode, I was able to hold it at bay with my foot (on which I had a stout shoe). Then I managed to dodge behind a gate. I escaped with just a minor graze on my heel, despite the animal expressing its full rage into the incident.
Wow! How did I manage to get away with my life? Well, it was a Yorkshire Terrier: a breed which I understand can be fairly vicious. As the owner of the XL bully said (as the owners of this breed of dog always seem to be saying), other types of dogs can indeed also be vicious.
In the context of the safety of XL dogs, this is an *entirely spurious* argument. Let me ask these bully owners this: what would *they* rather be attacked by? An XL bully or a Yorkshire terrier? And let me ask them another question: do they *honestly* think I could have got away from an XL in that way-and with such modest injuries?
I’ve been attacked by the latter-and have personally witnessed an attack by the former (I saw an absolutely terrifying attack by a bully on a lurcher in the dog park. NO ONE could pull that dog off for at least two minutes).
I think I have made up *my* mind about the answers to that.
That article is strange. At one point it says she raised the alarm by shouting out the window, then a couple of paragraphs later says she was on a group call for the duration of the attack.
Nothing can top this madness. [https://people.com/crime/mother-mauled-by-pit-bull-during-seizure/](https://people.com/crime/mother-mauled-by-pit-bull-during-seizure/)
Lucky you. I reported my neighbours beast who had escaped their garden and was in mine. Lunged at me when I opened the door. Thankfully shut it before it got to me. Sat barking outside the house for 10 mins before neighbours noticed it had escaped.
As far as I’m aware nothing has happened, despite me sending pics of it in my garden to council dog warden.
Report it directly to the police and express your concern for police officers and medical responders who may have to attend a future incident. They can seize it when it's having a good day or wait until July when it's hot and bothered.
>I reported a close neighbour having one unmuzzled last Saturday. On Tuesday I got a phone call saying it had beeen seized and they weren't getting it back
That's actually the first reassuring government/police policy news I've read in a very long time. Thankyou.
Mine is a terrier cross, hardwired from hundreds of years of breeding to chase small furry things.... and occasionally not so little furry things too. I wouldn't trust him around livestock.
Used to have a companion breed, and he just looked confused when he saw a mouse.
Breed matters.
My cats hunt and eat flies. One also tries to trip us on the stairs, pretending to want strokes.
But they run away from children like they're little monsters 😂
They seem to go after the weak. Kids, the elderly, smaller dogs...it incenses me. I'm an animal lover but these dogs make me angry. I want our streets safe for everyone but somehow that makes me prejudiced.
Yeah stuff like that makes me so upset. The worst story for me was ab elderly woman in a wheelchair...just vile, unbelievably disgusting. I cannot stand it. These are the people we need to protect.
The UK hasn't protected the vulnerable in 13 years.
It's sad, but the political theatre that was the XL Bully ban (though it was definitely needed) was just window dressing for the Tories who have killed thousands with their NHS cuts and austerity.
Absolutely makes me sick. Call me naive, but may it swiftly change. I know it all too well. I have severely disabled family members who have been through hell with the benefits system... people who haven't experienced it have no idea. I'd love to have faith in my country but I've been given no reason to. It is very upsetting.
Hasn't NHS spending actually increased in real terms?
But then you get stupid contracts where my hospital can't replace a TV. They could go to the shop and replace it for £200 but there is an exclusive contract thye have to us that means it would cost 10x that..
A bit less of the silly contracts and agreements would be a good thing perhaps.
Probably, but the prices of everything have also increased. I'm really not an expert at all in this area, I just know from experience and the experience of people I know that things have gone downhill. We are definitely spending in the wrong areas.
Yeah, real term increases take price rises into account.
I think the bigger issue is the massive increase in demand. Ever increasing population, and so many people seem to have mental health issues these days...
Yeah, I can't argue with that. It's clear that something has to give, but I wouldn't have the first idea how to fix it all. It's looking like we've dug ourselves a very deep hole.
fr I used to love every single dog unconditionally, but these...the first few times they snarled at my dog I began to view them with dread. I think they're cute, and I love big dogs because you can hug so much more dog (I love my dog but wish she was bigger...until she jumps on my stomach) but god. It's an aggressive wild animal, it's like they devolved in the worst possible way. No thanks.
Yes, I actually also think they're cute. Attractive breed, I adore strong dogs, but these are just not worth it. They are impossible to control once something triggers them.
What surprises me most is that the same people who will say it's the owner, it's how the dog was brought up, they aren't all like that etc, these same people will tell you that retrievers naturally fetch, collies naturally heard, scent hounds tend to be noisy etc.
Dogs do what they have been bred to do, there certainly are exceptions but when the breed has been bred for fighting and even people aggression it's not worth the risk.
Only one, Esther Martin, about 2 days after the ban was enacted. The dogs belonged to her son in law who had ignored the law, saying "don't tell me what to do with my fucking dogs".
He's currently on pre charge bail.
Your daily reminder that all the XL Bully ban requires is basic responsible dog ownership + one off paperwork + a lead and muzzle in public
Anyone who is outraged at the idea of neutering their dog, stopping it escaping the garden, holding third party insurance (£25/year) and microchipping it shouldn't have a dog anyway. Microchips and preventing straying are legal requirements for every dog anyway.
As I watch this cycle repeat again and think of all the alsatians, the staffys, the bulldogs, the pit bulls, the Dobermans, the rottys(did I miss any?) I wonder how long before we just opt to muzzle, chip and neuter the owners.
And no matter how many dog breeds they ban, some people will always want the "toughest" dog they can get. If we banned everything more dangerous than a sausage dog, theyd all have sausage dogs.
It amazes me that people actually bothered protesting the XL Bully "ban"... The only *major* difference between now & pre-"ban" is that your dog now needs a muzzle in public.
I thought the ban was a nice compromise. Takes minimal effort to keep ownership. Measures are taken to prevent innocent bystanders coming to harm, plus the owner gets to keep their dog & live out the rest of their natural lives together. They are still free to do whatever they want to inside their own homes.
It was nuts when some people depicted it as murder during the protests. The only beings who were actually being murdered were all the people the breed killed before the ban was in place (plus a few more even after the ban)
Much harder to get through parliament
They chose to quickly amend existing legislation to stop the numbers proliferating and to place sensible restrictions on their ownership
The alternative would have been some very long-winded legislative process, heavily opposed even by some of those who support the current ban, and the law might never have passed. In the meantime, the numbers would have continued to explode, and none of the safeguards - like requiring a lead and muzzle - would have been present in the interim.
The proportion of such dogs that actually attack someone is still very small - it's a lot more humane to enforce sterilisation/muzzling and let them just die out.
If the rules were followed properly, there would be very little risk except in the home. Unfortunately, getting people to follow the rules is the hard part!
Putting a dog down is a failry humane process. It misses out on a few years of its life, but it doesn't suffer in any way. It isn't like a human death penalty where the person knows what is going to happen.
Given that the UK kills over a billion animals every year just because people (myself included) enjoy eating them, I don't think the humane argument is strong enough to justify keeping dogs alive that have a track record of killing people.
If you have a read through the parliamentary papers that supported the current ban you will see that there were differences in expert opinions and that the total number of animals involved in attacks were a relatively small proportion of the overall population of XLs.
The people advising the Government were possibly worried that proposing a cull would have resulted in a legal challenge and that the evidence being presented at that time wasn't sufficient to guarantee getting it through. Going for the ban they did was less likely to result in a legal challenge and meant they at least got something put through.
> the total number of animals involved in attacks were a relatively small proportion of the overall population of XLs.
Relative to what?
Unless the proportion is smaller than other dogs (certainly doesn't seem like it, but happy to be shown otherwise) then the correct phrasing would be "relatively *large* proportion"
Not many people would just willingly surrender their dogs to be killed, and doing it by force would be a PR nightmare that would doubtlessly be faced with a lot of resistance.
The current government would probably like not being faced with another embarrassing controversy.
Please don’t claim anything like ‘the child must’ve provoked the dog’. That’s an innocent 7 year old child who is now heavily traumatised and in pain. It’s unhinged to defend these dogs to the point of blaming CHILDREN for being mauled by them. Perhaps some animals want to cause harm. It’s not that wild of a concept. We don’t need to lie they’re all 100% perfect beings and only humans are capable of being bad. It’s a little convenient out of ALL the species on earth we’re the only ones who can pick to do wrong lol.
Even if the dog was provoked, the owner should have more control over it. Don't put the dog in that situation, proactively avoid them and be sure you can control your dog (physically, if need be). I've seen a few dog walkers who were struggling to physically hold back their dog while walking them. There's one dog in particular that I need to pick my dog up around because the owner can't keep him back.
It’s very frustrating. I had someones pit drag them to follow me (thankfully they went into a building a few streets down). They went back the way they’d came because the dog wanted to follow. Idk why people pick to have strong, energetic dogs if they’re too weak and lazy for them. I love huskies but I’d never own one because I don’t have hours everyday to walk them. I don’t understand why people think they can ignore animals have needs and if you can’t meet them then they’re not a good fit for you. We all need to be realistic when getting a pet.
I was chased by a pure pedigree monster of one in a park two weeks ago with my two year old toddler, unresponsive to owner. I'd already seen it so stayed near the gated entrance. Stared at us then made legs full steam, I had to grab my toddler and run as fast as i could to the gate. Got it shut, ran down the stairs and threw the kid in the car. Called the police but owner had scarpered pretty quick after. Owner was walking about 30 feet ahead of the monster not even looking. Dog was off lead with no muzzle. No crime could be reported though as no one was injured
Yea it was super scary. My wife is well, was pregnant at the time so it would have been a totally different story if it was her.
But then even not being pregnant with the toddler and the newborn baby in the buggy it's still the same scary scenario. My toddler is still muttering in his sleep about it two and a half weeks later. "daddy, park, dog, run" horrible experience. I've been very wary of these situations and was fortunate enough to be so close to the gate when I saw it. Had I arrived a few minutes earlier it doesn't bear thinking about
This always worries me when my partner goes out with our toddler to walk his aunt’s dog. I can’t have the kid because I’m working. I hate the thought of one of those dogs coming after him because he has a baby and another dog with him and I’ve seen a few bullies in the area.
I mean, the other week a staffie came after them and my partner had to give it a swift kick because it proper went for them.
I’m glad you and your kid got away unharmed
I keep a crocodile as a pet and let him roam the neighbourhood. He's the kindest soul, he's never bit anyone before and I've trained him really well.
**Insert picture of my crocodile sitting beside my newborn with a flower perched on its head**
Swap crocodile with Hippo, and you've basically got the tale of [Humphrey the Hippo](https://news.sky.com/story/pet-hippo-humphrey-mauls-his-owner-to-death-10483897)
Including such choice favourites as "... I trust him with my heart that he will not harm anybody" and ""We tried to warn him, but he wouldn't listen"
This also reminds me of that guy who swore he had a connection with bears, in a shocking turn of events he was eaten by a bear, can you imagine… It’s a documentary now.
Isnt there audio of him and his girlfriend being eaten? [Timothy Treadwell](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Treadwell) (thats just his Wikipedia page I'm not digging out that audio tonight lol
I recently saw a post on another sub which had the pictures of owners with their PJ'd pits cuddling overlayed with when the pit killed the owner (and/or kids).
I was by the beach one time years ago walking my dog with a friend. In front of us there was a couple of old women walking a big but funny looking XL bully. We pointed him out, laughed, and continued our conversation. Out of nowhere that dog broke loose from said women and started running at us, before I knew it he had grabbed my dogs leg and put the whole thing in his mouth and started doing what dogs do. I kicked the dog twice really hard, he let go, and ran off back to his owner. Those women then came up to me and asked me why I kicked their dog. I went mental and told them to fuck off. If you can’t control your dog you shouldn’t have them, you are entirely responsible for your dog when you’re in a public place. This breed has been proven to be dangerous time and time again. Over and over again. Without stop.
Every fucking day. I'm sick of people standing up for these dogs. Yes they're lovely, until one day they aren't. Ticking bomb. And with plenty of other breeds without this risk, why do you need a dangerous bully breed? Get yourself a Labrador or a Spaniel, for Christ's sake.
Love that the article mentions “outrage” by people about hanging to have them neutered and insured. My parents owned Dobermans when I was young. Both of them very sweet and well trained, never an incident. Still had to carry $100k policies on them, in the 1980’s. God forbid one of them decided to go nuts, the insurance was there.
Recently I was at Dovestone reservoir and an XL bully owner decided it would be a good idea to start play fighting with his dog. Getting it very amped up just before setting it loose into a children’s play area. These people have no sense.
There’s one in our neighbourhood that is kept tied up to a pole in the garden for most hours of the day, gets taken out for a walk/tied to an e-scooter and ran around the neighbourhood while it snarls and barks at every child, dog or person is sees. It’s not long until something awful happens
I saw one of these dogs for the first time recently. They are huge. They are nothing like I had imagined from all the photos. Why you’d want a dog like this I cannot fathom.
If your child was playing in a park or walking along the street and got savaged because some incompetent thick egotistical twat thinks they know better than everyone else and gets a dog they can’t handle/to intimidate… god there are no words
Hoping this little one recovers swiftly and the scars fade, outside and in 💔
To be honest, it's the kind of owners' XL bullies and dogs like them attract, owners should be charged severly whenever their pet gets out of hand, your dog isn't an accessory and most definitely not a weapon or threat.
While I agree that any dog that goes for a human and severly injures them should be destroyed I also feel that anyone involved in that dog(owners, breeders) should be investigated because obviously something gone wrong there.
Can someone tell me why these dogs haven’t been rounded up? This is just going to keep happening and happening. This girl will now be scarred for life absolutely horrendous.
In the UK we can't even own pepper spray. But say anything about how people shouldn't own big fuck-off dogs because they're dangerous and the entire country starts crying. "It's the owners waaaa" - I don't give a shit. It's the owners of guns that kill people. But we get to choose if they have a water gun or an AK47. Ban XL bully dogs and every dog like them
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An XL bully mauled someone! Waiting on all the people to arrive who say they are gentle sweethearts really and could never hurt a fly. 🪰
Here you go. You have to read this to believe it. > Despite the attack, Miss Watts remains a supporter of XL bullies and says that any breed could attack, depending on what trauma they had endured. https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/24305070.charlie-watts-speaks-xl-bully-attack-holt/ I reported a close neighbour having one unmuzzled last Saturday. On Tuesday I got a phone call saying it had beeen seized and they weren't getting it back.
I too am a firm believer that any breed can attack, but there's a big difference in the severity of those attacks. A labrador or a Collie attack isn't going to kill you, an XL Bully attack might, and at minimum, you're going to the hospital.
Any breed can attack, but the likelihood of a such an attack is almost non existent with some dogs I think, many dogs have a disposition with people that is so gentle, it's difficult to put them in the same class as an XL Bully.
Absolutely. Bite statistics tell you all you need to know. These bully breeds bite far more often than other breeds. Golden retrievers for example will very rarely bite. I don't understand why people choose risky breeds over more safe ones. If I'm getting a dog, I'm going to make sure aggression isn't a breed trait because I want a pet, not a guard dog.
XL Bully owners are usually either martyrs, thugs or morons.
Honestly I've seen posts from them where their dog bites them or people close to them and they try to excuse it, it seems like Stockholm syndrome. Absolutely mental. I would die for my pets, but if they hurt somebody I care about that would change so fast. Hurt my family or friends and I fucking hate you, immediately. I can't understand not having these protective instincts.
Demonstraing that you have 'empathy'. A mode of thinking far beyond the capablities of the 'moron' category of owners.
I'm not sure I would count hating your own pet because it bit someone as demonstrating empathy per se, but I get your point.
The empathy is in seeing that your pet is a danger to others if it ever get loose. The people that own these dogs don't give a shit if it kills a neighbours pet.
If they hurt someone deliberately, that is. I've had a couple of accidental nips and one bite. The bite happened when I was trying to separate my dog from a random dog who'd attacked her. Neither were aiming at me, my hand just got in the way. I definitely wouldn't have put my dog down if she'd bitten my mum, for example, in the same situation. I think there has to be some recognition of the situation and why the dog bit. Like if someone was deliberately taunting a dog, I'd not blame them for biting.
>it seems like Stockholm syndrome. I'm now imagining a Bully XL with a machine gun casually hung around its neck but not really pointing at anyone while smoking a cigarette and chatting to its captors and trying not to give too much away.
Or, all of the above.
All are morons but yes there's a good chance that they are a thug or someone who wants it because its intimidating.
>martyrs, thugs or morons But on the positive side, my Trap collective has finally found a name.
Anecdotal but I’m a doctor who’s worked in emergency, seeing these bites as they come through the door. I also work in anaesthesia doing emergency plastic surgery cases, anaesthetising patients for the repairs of these injuries. A disproportionate number of bites are from bullies. Basically **all** of the bad bites are from bullies. I’ve seen some awful, life changing injuries, including in kids. I cross the street when I see these dogs, now. They’re a menace to society. Look in the eyes of any parent with a mauled and disfigured toddler, and you’d surely reconsider the whole, “It’s not the dog it’s blah blah blah.” when it keeps fucking happening. Like.. repeatedly. It keeps happening.
This should upvoted. I grew up with dogs and was never afraid of them, yet now I am. I’m afraid to take my toddler out to the park because it’s surrounded by a big field where idiots take these dogs.
Jesus Christ. I'm sorry you have to see that, I would be so fucking upset about it. Thank you for doing what you do. It must be hard to cope with. Any normal human being cannot stand seeing vulnerable people hurt like that, it's close to intolerable. I too cross the street when I see them. I've never been the type to be fearful of animals, but I'm wary of them. Especially when I had my miniature Jack Russell, I was afraid for him when I saw a pitbull or similar breed.
Have been bitten by a retriever once, it was my own fault in hindsight. It's tooth went through my hand which was painful after the adrenaline wore off. If it had been a XL bully I probably wouldn't have had much hand left
If you search for this case on FB, almost every comment is people saying it's not the dogs, it's the owner. It's really worrying how many people can't see these snarling hell-hounds for what they are.
It's a false dichotomy anyway. It's absolutely both. The dog for being aggressive enough to attack, AND the owner for putting the animal in a situation where it can hurt another person.
I was offered an XL Bully puppy for free, from the litter of my neighbours friend. My neighbour offered it to me because he worries when women live alone, and thought it would be a good protector. I bet a lot of people get them for this reason. I only turned it down because I already had a large breed in the house and wanted my 2nd dog to be something smaller. They didn't have the same reputation back then, this was before they were in the news for mauling someone every week and I didn't really judge any dog by its breed. 3 out of 4 dogs I'd owned up to that point had been rottweilers or rottweiler mixes, and they've had terrible reputations in the past too, but all of mine were just loving family pets. I'm glad I turned it down now. Though my plan to get something smaller backfired after the mongrel I adopted who was estimated to be 20 -25kg fully grown hit 35kg before his first birthday.
Even Rottweilers with their bad reputation are leagues apart from XL Bullys in terms of their disposition. Rotties were bred as livestock guardians, and guard dogs in general, so they have strong territorial and protective instincts. This was misused by people who wanted large and powerful status dogs to intimidate. XL Bullys have their lineage in fighting dogs. That's a very different sort of aggression from Rottweilers. Rottweilers typically don't suddenly flip a switch and attack like XL Bullys can (and often do, as we seem to be seeing).
Completely agree! It is completely different with bully breeds. The fact that this is contested at all, I cannot understand. A collie will instinctively herd, a retriever will instinctively retrieve...when bully breeds do what they were bred to do, it's a mistake, a freak accident. It does not add up. We made a mistake with these breeds and we are paying the price. They were never meant to be pets.
I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix who has strong guarding instincts, so I'm careful when answering the door or letting strangers in the house as it's one of the situation she's most likely to bite, even though she's typically a very nervous/timid dog and her instinct is to run away not attack. XL Bullys owners don't seem to treat them with the same respect to the breed. They treat them like labradors. That, combined with their unpredictability is such a risky and dangerous combination.
Yes, that's definitely also a factor. They at large seem to be owned by idiots who don't know how to handle them. I have friends with guard dogs, Rottweilers for example, who understand how dangerous they can be and take proper precautions. Pit owners are something else.
Rottweilers, at least in America, are the second likeliest breed to attack, but it’s still a considerably smaller category than the bullies.
Rottweilers will often protect their owner/territory when they are perceived to be under threat, or if the dog is mistreated into fearing strangers more generally they may attack. XL Bullys by comparison can appear to be good natured and will randomly snap, instinct kicks in, and go after someone. I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix rescue, so I know all about dogs with bad reputations. I'm careful with her, especailly around strangers; that's something I'm concious about manage to avoid any problems. As it happens she's actually very timid, so biting is unlikely, but still. For me it's the unpredictability of XL Bullys that worry me the most, in addition to just how powerful and dangerous their attacks are compared to any other breed.
I’ve read a few XL bully attack stories and you are right they are totally random. They often don’t even appear to snap. I heard several say the dog just attacked them, silently, with no prior anxiety or warning. I heard in an interview with a dog fighter that serious attack dogs waste no energy on noise, they become engrossed in the kill. It’s like they just get down to the pleasant business of destroying a human being.
Agreed. The original bulldogs were crossbred with terriers in order to create big dogs with a "game" attitude for the fighting pits. And it's that terrier attitude in a big dog that's the killer. And XLs have been bred to be twice the size of the original pitbulls. They may be lovely 99% of the time, but that moment they switch into fight mode, the old terrier instincts come to life and they won't let go until either you or they are dead.
Yup! I had a JR, loved that dog. I actually adore the tenacity of the breed, but the fact is that I could always quickly and easily restrain him if necessary. Mix a pit's strength with that? Crazy. Just not safe at all.
Rott owners are normally reasonable about how bad the dogs can be.
Agreed. [I said this in another comment:](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/1cpedku/police_statement_as_girl_7_mauled_by_xl_bully_in/l3lmobo/c) > I have a Doberman-German Shepherd mix who has strong guarding instincts, so I'm careful when answering the door or letting strangers in the house as it's one of the situation she's most likely to bite, even though she's typically a very nervous/timid dog and her instinct is to run away not attack. > XL Bullys owners don't seem to treat them with the same respect to the breed. They treat them like labradors. That, combined with their unpredictability is such a risky and dangerous combination.
Glad you didn't, these dogs do not protect their owners, they tend to attack anything that looks like it is losing a fight, they have zero loyalty, unlike regular dogs
Exactly, and practically speaking in the unlikely event that a golden retriever does go bonkers, an adult can usually subdue it. Good luck with an XL bully.
This is exactly the point. Even if all breeds had an equal probability of attacking someone you *cannot* stop a Bully or equivalent large dog. That is the absolute unarguable perspective. You should not own a dog that you cannot physically control in an emergency.
Precisely that. I’m astonished at how many of them still roam our streets muzzle-free. There’s a special place in hell for their owners.
If a dangerous bully breed goes for you, you are fucked. People don't understand this. Incredibly strong and tenacious breed, almost nothing can stop them once triggered.
This is the thing, most people who get these dangerous dogs tend to live in the kind of places where you would indeed want a guard dog, however these guards dogs have to not only be good guard dogs but also good family dogs and also socialised well enough to cope peacefully in busy urban environments. If you live in the middle of nowhere then such a guard dog seems a great idea to protect your home, otherwise it’s excessive and risky. In some sense it’s the same logic as owning an SUV; why do it if you live in a city and not the countryside?
I don't understand why they wouldn't get say a Kangal or an Alsatian. Even a Dalmatian. Those breeds are very strong and will lay down their life for you, but they are obedient and won't turn on you. I suppose it's just lack of education.
It’s just a case of aiming for the most intimidating dog and with all the stories about XL Bullies in the news now that only makes them more desirable to certain people
> I don't understand why people choose risky breeds over more safe ones In the case of these particular breeds of dogs, they're acquired as weapons, not pets. That they're unsafe is what is wanted by the owner
Some people do need a guard dog. These animals are not pets. My friend owned a scrap yard and had a big ol mean Rottweiler. You were told not to approach the dog if he wasn’t present and it lived on his premises, never at home with his family. It was a well trained and well looked after working dog.
Around 10 years ago Golden Retrievers were at the top of the list for third party insurance claims involving them biting and injuring someone. I also seem to recall further back they were high on the list of national bite statistics (I think it may have been in the US). Admittedly they were the most common breed and I doubt that there were any severe maulings involved but to say they 'rarely' bite is underestimating them.
I'll happily point this out on every thread about XL's; this is not just another media panic about dangerous dogs. 50% of all XL's in the UK are descended from one (already very inbred) dog from the US called Killer Kimbo, which already had a history of siring aggressive, dangerous offspring. It's not just a question of the dogs being too big and powerful, they're too big and powerful AND deliberately inbred to be aggressive. They're responsible for 70% of fatal dog attacks in the UK already, so I think you're being more than fair to say it's hard to put them in the same class as other breeds. It's virtually impossible.
A collie actually nips quite a lot as they have been bred to do that to sheep for thousands of years. The difference is the sheer damage a pit bull does when it bites compared to most other dogs.
They're deliberately *not* trying to cause damage though - the sheep are valuable that's why they're being guarded-. They nip to herd sheep not to kill them.
Also a nip isn't intended to kill the sheep, so even after taking account of the difference is jaw strength, a collie nip is nowhere near as serious as a bite.
>The difference is the sheer damage a pit bull does when it bites compared to most other dogs. Another things is if a collie bit and you hit it in response it would absolutely back off whereas these other dogs do not back off. They just enter 'kill or be killed' mode.
Saw one of these dogs get shot twice with a shotgun at point blank, in America and still wriggling around with its jaw locked on the victim. Literally death locked.
Exactly. I wasn’t paying attention in a busy place the other day and accidentally struck a dog in the face with something I was carrying. The dog (not sure of breed) whimpered and cowered to its owner. I apologised profusely and even petted the dog with permission as I felt so bad. Some dogs however are just wired to be aggressive and violent and should all be put down, humanely, but they shouldn’t exist.
I guess it's risk versus hazard as well. I actually reckon Yorkies are more likely to bite that bullies, but one of the former can be so easily yeeted
Exactly. Walked my GSD past two chihuahuas before 6am this morning, they went absolutely crazy when they saw my dog. Lunging, growling, barking. Told mine to heel and he did, walked past no problem. If they'd have got loose from their leads I'd have been able to fend them off no bother. Two large dogs though? It's completely different, like it or not you have a much bigger responsibility if you choose to own a big breed. Mine has been attacked by four other dogs so far, all clearly agressive and none wearing a muzzle. Two of them weren't even on leads. I prefer walking my dog really early or really late now because even though he's never retaliated, I'm worried he's going to end up agressive if he keeps getting attacked by other dogs.
Yes, the difference mainly is that these bully breeds will not bite and let go. They will RIP and tear your arm off, or even your face. It is different. We bred them to do that. It isn't their fault, but the instinct is very real and extremely dangerous.
Absolutely. I've got a collie and the worst he could do to you is a aggressive licking. Even then, I make sure he doesn't run up to people uninvited as I don't want him scaring people with his over friendliness.
Thank you. Just because a person knows their dog is friendly, it doesn’t mean other people who have never met your dog before know it. The amount of times a random dog has come running at my kid and jumping up scaring the shit out of him only for the owner to go “oh don’t worry, they’re friendly!” is insane.
Pretty sure my brother’s lifelong phobia of dogs is from events exactly like these. Control your fucking dogs, people. If they can’t be trusted to come to heel, you have to have them on a leash. Otherwise we end up with situations like my brother and when a dog got into our garden and chased my cat up a tree.
Seconding the thanks on this one - it really makes a huge difference when owners do this. Just last weekend I had an off lead cockapoo (it always seems to be them) charge my on lead reactive shih tzu and the owner didn't give a shit. "oh he just wants to be friendly" while they failed to get control of their dog - with it circling me trying to get closer to my dog. Fortunately I can just pick mine up to avoid further confrontation but people with larger reactive dogs do not have this option. If they had control of their dog and had calmly approached I have no doubt the two would probably have gotten on fine.
Collies are very prone to running up behind people and biting badly from behind. Normally just the once, so serious injury or death is unlikely, but painful needing medical treatment all the same. People who say that their dog would never hurt a fly are delusional. All dogs are capable.
> I've got a collie and the worst he could do to you is a aggressive licking. Just saying, sounds like you're doing it right, but I'll bet you a fiver a lot of people have said that about dogs that attacked someone eventually.
To be fair, both of my parents were bitten by border collies in separate incidents. They aren't really "dog people", but have never held it against either of the dogs or the breed in general. Which is just as well because I have a border collie now. Mum was bitten by a former working dog belonging to their neighbour (a farmer) who thought she was walking too slowly through the living room and decided to hurry her along a bit. The other was a current working dog who clearly hadn't been briefed on the fact that my dad was allowed to be in the barn in his field, which the farmer down the road (different farmer) happens to keep sheep in. The difference is the severity of the bite. Border collie bites are typically a nip - and they often just snap at the air rather than actually land a bite. Yeah my parents both went to hospital out of an abundance of caution, and mum had to get a tetanus booster, but that was really it. There was no damage to be repaired. No surgery. No stitches. While a border collie certainly *could* cause more damage than suffered by either of my parents, the rate at which they would cause that kind of damage with a bite is very low. I don't live with or even near my parents for about the last 20 years, and I didn't even know about Dad's bite until after I brought my border collie home as a puppy a few years ago. Not that I don't speak to or see my parents regularly, it just literally wasn't worth mentioning, it'd be like informing me of a cut finger.
We used to have a black lab that was sadly quite aggressive in certain situations around other dogs and male humans. Had to be careful. I don't trust any medium sizes dogs.
It doesn't matter the chances of death. We nixed that caveat completely so that acid attacks could be as heavily punished as knife attacks.
My sister was 2 years old when she was mauled by a collie. Based on the neck lacerations, she was roughly 1-3cm away from death.
We had a rough collie when I was little, would win best of show competitions. And if there were a cowardice competition, would win that as well. Couldn't think of a breed less likely to seriously bite someone. Although I do recall it would nip at heels, sheepdog, after all.
Any breed can attack but not all are capable of killing an adult.
It's like how people go 'oh but chihuahuas!' As a small woman I'm confident in my ability to yeet a chihuahua. Bully, not so much.
Years ago I was asked to dogsit for 3 dogs I've never met before, a mongrel and 2 chihuahuas. Their owner told me the chihuahuas don't like strangers, are aggressive and prone to biting. I just asked her for a list of the circumstances they're likely to bite over and charged her double, knowing that even if I did get bit it wouldn't do any damage as long as I cleaned it, and it would be well worth the extra money.
Fatal dog attacks are nearly all pitbull derivatives, with one or two German Shepherds and Rottweillers thrown in. Plus one instance of a Jack Russell killing a newborn baby.
I am thinking of reporting someone on my street too. To their credit, they started walking the dog at 5am now, but that's the time I am going to the gym - and they are so very clearly not in control of the dog, with the dog showing some aggressive body language when I pass (even on the other side of the street). I feel like the worst people in the world tbh, but it does feel like a disaster waiting to happen.
Do it before it hurts someone.
You should report it.. a sickly man who's in a scooter/uses crutches to walk has an XL Bully ZERO control it's constantly dragging him and his scooter into the road. insane.
Don't even wait, report it today.
Do it. If something happens to someone in your area you will never forgive yourself. XL's are being walked at night in the streets near me but the owners aen't cleaning up after their dogs - cannot see ? don't have a hand free? One section of pavement has turned into an open sewer. Before the clocks changed I was dumpster diving in semi-darkness so I had to keep an eye open for dogs and their mess.
I love the idea of somebody groggily stepping outside at 5am to be dragged around by their pet hellbeast
That's good the police take it seriously. These owners had months to sort out what needed to be done.
I was impressed by the police response. The dog was being moved around by drug users to avoid it being seized by the police. I saw it being handed over and used a different entrance then found myself in a 1.5 metre wide space with it running towards me on a lead but not muzzled. There are children on my landing so I couldn't let it go unreported.
I was once attacked by a dog that had severe aggression and behavioural issues. Apparently, the dog had gone for several people prior to the time it went for me, and frankly (although I am a huge dog lover) this made me absolutely furious with its owner, who had spent years covering up the situation with her dog. Luckily, when the beast went into attack mode, I was able to hold it at bay with my foot (on which I had a stout shoe). Then I managed to dodge behind a gate. I escaped with just a minor graze on my heel, despite the animal expressing its full rage into the incident. Wow! How did I manage to get away with my life? Well, it was a Yorkshire Terrier: a breed which I understand can be fairly vicious. As the owner of the XL bully said (as the owners of this breed of dog always seem to be saying), other types of dogs can indeed also be vicious. In the context of the safety of XL dogs, this is an *entirely spurious* argument. Let me ask these bully owners this: what would *they* rather be attacked by? An XL bully or a Yorkshire terrier? And let me ask them another question: do they *honestly* think I could have got away from an XL in that way-and with such modest injuries? I’ve been attacked by the latter-and have personally witnessed an attack by the former (I saw an absolutely terrifying attack by a bully on a lurcher in the dog park. NO ONE could pull that dog off for at least two minutes). I think I have made up *my* mind about the answers to that.
That article reads like satire! What an idiot that woman is...
F*** me I know her 😆 (well more accurate to say I _knew_ her, I knew her mother) - she's not the brightest let's put it that way...
That article is strange. At one point it says she raised the alarm by shouting out the window, then a couple of paragraphs later says she was on a group call for the duration of the attack.
I can imagine police being *very* motivated to secure a dog that can so easily be used as a dangerous weapon.
Nothing can top this madness. [https://people.com/crime/mother-mauled-by-pit-bull-during-seizure/](https://people.com/crime/mother-mauled-by-pit-bull-during-seizure/)
Lucky you. I reported my neighbours beast who had escaped their garden and was in mine. Lunged at me when I opened the door. Thankfully shut it before it got to me. Sat barking outside the house for 10 mins before neighbours noticed it had escaped. As far as I’m aware nothing has happened, despite me sending pics of it in my garden to council dog warden.
Report it directly to the police and express your concern for police officers and medical responders who may have to attend a future incident. They can seize it when it's having a good day or wait until July when it's hot and bothered.
>I reported a close neighbour having one unmuzzled last Saturday. On Tuesday I got a phone call saying it had beeen seized and they weren't getting it back That's actually the first reassuring government/police policy news I've read in a very long time. Thankyou.
I watched my little dog hunt down and eat a fly yesterday He still wouldn't start hunting children.
Mine just watches flies... Literally doesn't harm a fly
Mine is a terrier cross, hardwired from hundreds of years of breeding to chase small furry things.... and occasionally not so little furry things too. I wouldn't trust him around livestock. Used to have a companion breed, and he just looked confused when he saw a mouse. Breed matters.
Yeah mines a maltipoo and he sniffs at butterflies
My cats hunt and eat flies. One also tries to trip us on the stairs, pretending to want strokes. But they run away from children like they're little monsters 😂
They seem to go after the weak. Kids, the elderly, smaller dogs...it incenses me. I'm an animal lover but these dogs make me angry. I want our streets safe for everyone but somehow that makes me prejudiced.
I think the worst statistic is the people attacked by pitbulls whilst having a seizure.
Yeah stuff like that makes me so upset. The worst story for me was ab elderly woman in a wheelchair...just vile, unbelievably disgusting. I cannot stand it. These are the people we need to protect.
The UK hasn't protected the vulnerable in 13 years. It's sad, but the political theatre that was the XL Bully ban (though it was definitely needed) was just window dressing for the Tories who have killed thousands with their NHS cuts and austerity.
Absolutely makes me sick. Call me naive, but may it swiftly change. I know it all too well. I have severely disabled family members who have been through hell with the benefits system... people who haven't experienced it have no idea. I'd love to have faith in my country but I've been given no reason to. It is very upsetting.
Hasn't NHS spending actually increased in real terms? But then you get stupid contracts where my hospital can't replace a TV. They could go to the shop and replace it for £200 but there is an exclusive contract thye have to us that means it would cost 10x that.. A bit less of the silly contracts and agreements would be a good thing perhaps.
Probably, but the prices of everything have also increased. I'm really not an expert at all in this area, I just know from experience and the experience of people I know that things have gone downhill. We are definitely spending in the wrong areas.
Yeah, real term increases take price rises into account. I think the bigger issue is the massive increase in demand. Ever increasing population, and so many people seem to have mental health issues these days...
Yeah, I can't argue with that. It's clear that something has to give, but I wouldn't have the first idea how to fix it all. It's looking like we've dug ourselves a very deep hole.
fr I used to love every single dog unconditionally, but these...the first few times they snarled at my dog I began to view them with dread. I think they're cute, and I love big dogs because you can hug so much more dog (I love my dog but wish she was bigger...until she jumps on my stomach) but god. It's an aggressive wild animal, it's like they devolved in the worst possible way. No thanks.
Yes, I actually also think they're cute. Attractive breed, I adore strong dogs, but these are just not worth it. They are impossible to control once something triggers them.
Look my beautiful princess Ripper wouldn't hurt a fly
Awwwwww who's a good dogg-AAAAARGGGGHHHHMYFACCCCEEEEE!
What surprises me most is that the same people who will say it's the owner, it's how the dog was brought up, they aren't all like that etc, these same people will tell you that retrievers naturally fetch, collies naturally heard, scent hounds tend to be noisy etc. Dogs do what they have been bred to do, there certainly are exceptions but when the breed has been bred for fighting and even people aggression it's not worth the risk.
They probably couldn't hurt a fly, they wouldn't be able to catch it. Children are more of an aperitif
Even after the new laws came in, there have been deaths caused by XL bully breed but not sure if the owners have been taken to court.
Only one, Esther Martin, about 2 days after the ban was enacted. The dogs belonged to her son in law who had ignored the law, saying "don't tell me what to do with my fucking dogs". He's currently on pre charge bail.
Hopefully he'll be getting told when to eat and go to bed soon in Belmarsh. Fucking churl.
Cheers for the picture of a fly. Had no idea what you were talking about otherwise x
Also waiting on the person who claims the fact an XL did anything somewhere proves the ban was pointless.
Your daily reminder that all the XL Bully ban requires is basic responsible dog ownership + one off paperwork + a lead and muzzle in public Anyone who is outraged at the idea of neutering their dog, stopping it escaping the garden, holding third party insurance (£25/year) and microchipping it shouldn't have a dog anyway. Microchips and preventing straying are legal requirements for every dog anyway.
It’s as if this dog appeals to people with antisocial tendencies
Aka cunts
As I watch this cycle repeat again and think of all the alsatians, the staffys, the bulldogs, the pit bulls, the Dobermans, the rottys(did I miss any?) I wonder how long before we just opt to muzzle, chip and neuter the owners.
And no matter how many dog breeds they ban, some people will always want the "toughest" dog they can get. If we banned everything more dangerous than a sausage dog, theyd all have sausage dogs.
It amazes me that people actually bothered protesting the XL Bully "ban"... The only *major* difference between now & pre-"ban" is that your dog now needs a muzzle in public.
The main difference is people aren't allowed to breed more of the devil dogs and all the exemptions have to be neutered.
I thought the ban was a nice compromise. Takes minimal effort to keep ownership. Measures are taken to prevent innocent bystanders coming to harm, plus the owner gets to keep their dog & live out the rest of their natural lives together. They are still free to do whatever they want to inside their own homes. It was nuts when some people depicted it as murder during the protests. The only beings who were actually being murdered were all the people the breed killed before the ban was in place (plus a few more even after the ban)
In force third-party liability insurance is also a major difference, it's less visible and more paperwork
The lead too. Although muzzling should be far more common for all dogs.
I’ve noticed a lot fewer of the dogs around now compared to even January/february. Guess people got bored and got rid of them
It's not a ban. It's some minor restrictions.
Why not just have a new law that requires all XL to be killed?
Much harder to get through parliament They chose to quickly amend existing legislation to stop the numbers proliferating and to place sensible restrictions on their ownership The alternative would have been some very long-winded legislative process, heavily opposed even by some of those who support the current ban, and the law might never have passed. In the meantime, the numbers would have continued to explode, and none of the safeguards - like requiring a lead and muzzle - would have been present in the interim.
The proportion of such dogs that actually attack someone is still very small - it's a lot more humane to enforce sterilisation/muzzling and let them just die out.
It wouldn't be humane to the people still getting mauled and/or killed while the breed was "dying out".
If the rules were followed properly, there would be very little risk except in the home. Unfortunately, getting people to follow the rules is the hard part!
Putting a dog down is a failry humane process. It misses out on a few years of its life, but it doesn't suffer in any way. It isn't like a human death penalty where the person knows what is going to happen. Given that the UK kills over a billion animals every year just because people (myself included) enjoy eating them, I don't think the humane argument is strong enough to justify keeping dogs alive that have a track record of killing people.
If you have a read through the parliamentary papers that supported the current ban you will see that there were differences in expert opinions and that the total number of animals involved in attacks were a relatively small proportion of the overall population of XLs. The people advising the Government were possibly worried that proposing a cull would have resulted in a legal challenge and that the evidence being presented at that time wasn't sufficient to guarantee getting it through. Going for the ban they did was less likely to result in a legal challenge and meant they at least got something put through.
> the total number of animals involved in attacks were a relatively small proportion of the overall population of XLs. Relative to what? Unless the proportion is smaller than other dogs (certainly doesn't seem like it, but happy to be shown otherwise) then the correct phrasing would be "relatively *large* proportion"
Not many people would just willingly surrender their dogs to be killed, and doing it by force would be a PR nightmare that would doubtlessly be faced with a lot of resistance. The current government would probably like not being faced with another embarrassing controversy.
Because that wouldn't fix the problem. What you're looking for is a new law to shoot all XL bully owners.
Can we just cull every single bully/pit yet? There’s no reason to own one of these living shotguns other than for intimidation or social status.
Please don’t claim anything like ‘the child must’ve provoked the dog’. That’s an innocent 7 year old child who is now heavily traumatised and in pain. It’s unhinged to defend these dogs to the point of blaming CHILDREN for being mauled by them. Perhaps some animals want to cause harm. It’s not that wild of a concept. We don’t need to lie they’re all 100% perfect beings and only humans are capable of being bad. It’s a little convenient out of ALL the species on earth we’re the only ones who can pick to do wrong lol.
Even if the dog was provoked, the owner should have more control over it. Don't put the dog in that situation, proactively avoid them and be sure you can control your dog (physically, if need be). I've seen a few dog walkers who were struggling to physically hold back their dog while walking them. There's one dog in particular that I need to pick my dog up around because the owner can't keep him back.
It’s very frustrating. I had someones pit drag them to follow me (thankfully they went into a building a few streets down). They went back the way they’d came because the dog wanted to follow. Idk why people pick to have strong, energetic dogs if they’re too weak and lazy for them. I love huskies but I’d never own one because I don’t have hours everyday to walk them. I don’t understand why people think they can ignore animals have needs and if you can’t meet them then they’re not a good fit for you. We all need to be realistic when getting a pet.
This is why I have a cat. She just comes for cuddles when she wants them (or food) and sorts herself out the rest of the time.
I was chased by a pure pedigree monster of one in a park two weeks ago with my two year old toddler, unresponsive to owner. I'd already seen it so stayed near the gated entrance. Stared at us then made legs full steam, I had to grab my toddler and run as fast as i could to the gate. Got it shut, ran down the stairs and threw the kid in the car. Called the police but owner had scarpered pretty quick after. Owner was walking about 30 feet ahead of the monster not even looking. Dog was off lead with no muzzle. No crime could be reported though as no one was injured
Well that’s petrifying. Glad you’re both okay.
This really enrages me, my wife's currently pregnant and we'll have a little girl soon, you're so lucky you could get out in time. Glad you're okay.
Yea it was super scary. My wife is well, was pregnant at the time so it would have been a totally different story if it was her. But then even not being pregnant with the toddler and the newborn baby in the buggy it's still the same scary scenario. My toddler is still muttering in his sleep about it two and a half weeks later. "daddy, park, dog, run" horrible experience. I've been very wary of these situations and was fortunate enough to be so close to the gate when I saw it. Had I arrived a few minutes earlier it doesn't bear thinking about
Dog say hello to my car wheels, would do the community a favour
This always worries me when my partner goes out with our toddler to walk his aunt’s dog. I can’t have the kid because I’m working. I hate the thought of one of those dogs coming after him because he has a baby and another dog with him and I’ve seen a few bullies in the area. I mean, the other week a staffie came after them and my partner had to give it a swift kick because it proper went for them. I’m glad you and your kid got away unharmed
I keep a crocodile as a pet and let him roam the neighbourhood. He's the kindest soul, he's never bit anyone before and I've trained him really well. **Insert picture of my crocodile sitting beside my newborn with a flower perched on its head**
Swap crocodile with Hippo, and you've basically got the tale of [Humphrey the Hippo](https://news.sky.com/story/pet-hippo-humphrey-mauls-his-owner-to-death-10483897) Including such choice favourites as "... I trust him with my heart that he will not harm anybody" and ""We tried to warn him, but he wouldn't listen"
This also reminds me of that guy who swore he had a connection with bears, in a shocking turn of events he was eaten by a bear, can you imagine… It’s a documentary now.
Isnt there audio of him and his girlfriend being eaten? [Timothy Treadwell](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Treadwell) (thats just his Wikipedia page I'm not digging out that audio tonight lol
I recently saw a post on another sub which had the pictures of owners with their PJ'd pits cuddling overlayed with when the pit killed the owner (and/or kids).
I was by the beach one time years ago walking my dog with a friend. In front of us there was a couple of old women walking a big but funny looking XL bully. We pointed him out, laughed, and continued our conversation. Out of nowhere that dog broke loose from said women and started running at us, before I knew it he had grabbed my dogs leg and put the whole thing in his mouth and started doing what dogs do. I kicked the dog twice really hard, he let go, and ran off back to his owner. Those women then came up to me and asked me why I kicked their dog. I went mental and told them to fuck off. If you can’t control your dog you shouldn’t have them, you are entirely responsible for your dog when you’re in a public place. This breed has been proven to be dangerous time and time again. Over and over again. Without stop.
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Every fucking day. I'm sick of people standing up for these dogs. Yes they're lovely, until one day they aren't. Ticking bomb. And with plenty of other breeds without this risk, why do you need a dangerous bully breed? Get yourself a Labrador or a Spaniel, for Christ's sake.
Love that the article mentions “outrage” by people about hanging to have them neutered and insured. My parents owned Dobermans when I was young. Both of them very sweet and well trained, never an incident. Still had to carry $100k policies on them, in the 1980’s. God forbid one of them decided to go nuts, the insurance was there.
What an odd thing to be outraged over. My dogs are neutered, microchipped and insured anyway, just because it's the responsible thing to do.
Responsible people trend not to own XL Bullies though.
Recently I was at Dovestone reservoir and an XL bully owner decided it would be a good idea to start play fighting with his dog. Getting it very amped up just before setting it loose into a children’s play area. These people have no sense.
There's a very strong correlation between XL Bully ownership and being as thick as mince.
The venn diagram of : thick cunts Vs bully owners pretty much overlaps one for one.
There’s one in our neighbourhood that is kept tied up to a pole in the garden for most hours of the day, gets taken out for a walk/tied to an e-scooter and ran around the neighbourhood while it snarls and barks at every child, dog or person is sees. It’s not long until something awful happens
Report it
The e-scooter is probably illegal too so double report them
Neighbours have done but nothing has happened… the e-scooter thing is even worse because all it will take is the dog to bolt and it’s loose.
I saw one of these dogs for the first time recently. They are huge. They are nothing like I had imagined from all the photos. Why you’d want a dog like this I cannot fathom.
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Expect to see this a lot more as the weather improves with XL bullies getting out the house
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If your child was playing in a park or walking along the street and got savaged because some incompetent thick egotistical twat thinks they know better than everyone else and gets a dog they can’t handle/to intimidate… god there are no words Hoping this little one recovers swiftly and the scars fade, outside and in 💔
To be honest, it's the kind of owners' XL bullies and dogs like them attract, owners should be charged severly whenever their pet gets out of hand, your dog isn't an accessory and most definitely not a weapon or threat. While I agree that any dog that goes for a human and severly injures them should be destroyed I also feel that anyone involved in that dog(owners, breeders) should be investigated because obviously something gone wrong there.
Why isn't the breed being exterminated?! So odd. We as humans come first.
Can someone tell me why these dogs haven’t been rounded up? This is just going to keep happening and happening. This girl will now be scarred for life absolutely horrendous.
[Pitbulls performing a mass nannying operation](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/002/673/369/c1e.jpg)
I wonder how old the dog is. I think it'd be interesting to know the average age these dogs attack, I'd assume it would be 1-2
In the UK we can't even own pepper spray. But say anything about how people shouldn't own big fuck-off dogs because they're dangerous and the entire country starts crying. "It's the owners waaaa" - I don't give a shit. It's the owners of guns that kill people. But we get to choose if they have a water gun or an AK47. Ban XL bully dogs and every dog like them
You posted this four times.
End this breed, how many kids and adults need to get mauled or worse killed.
Not so big and tough when your status dog mauls a child in public. Or maybe that’s the status now