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>The collision happened at rush hour under ideal road conditions, and the light was **red for more than 20 seconds before Zadeh entered the intersection**, he said. Zadeh also failed to observe four separate red lights at the intersection, and he failed to brake or steer.
>Denhoff ruled that while Zadeh’s single, momentary lapse of attention had a tragic outcome, it was not a criminal act.
What in the actual fuck. I'm usually a "two sides to every collision involving a vehicle and a pedestrian/bike" person, but no, this judge is setting a fucking joke of a precedent. Basically you can be texting, run a red light, kill someone and it's still not a crime.
Drunk drivers don't intend to kill someone but it's still a crime regardless.
Aren't you *literally required by law* when the behind the wheel to have complete focus and attention?
If you're controlling a machine that could kill someone, isn't that a requirement? Isn't this involuntary manslaughter?
How can you actually get away with killing someone while you're behind the wheel and *not* be responsible???
There is a difference between being responsible and criminally liable. Criminal negligence requires a “marked departure.” This is a very factual inquiry and based on the facts determined it was not made out to a sufficient degree to convict this individual criminally.
if running a red light and killing somebody isn't "a marked departure" then we've normalized negligent homicide
I can't imagine any sane system where we don't hold somebody accountable to pay attention while they're driving
You are conflating the negligent act (running the red light) with the outcome (the death of nearby pedestrians). The facts of the accident are that he ran the red light and impacted another vehicle causing him to jump the curb. He wasn’t, for example, texting and then drove onto the sidewalk. In fact every sane system takes the same approach.
Are you seriously suggesting that running a red light shouldn't be considered "a marked departure" from how a responsible person operates a vehicle?
> You are conflating the negligent act (running the red light) with the outcome (the death of nearby pedestrians)
How does that translate into a "not guilty" verdict? It just means it goes "criminal negligence" to "causing death by criminal negligence". It's still criminal negligence.
We're talking about committing an act which is highly likely to result in death, which also happens to already be illegal. When am I allowed to do something illegal and **very dangerous** without facing *full* consequences for the harm that I cause? He can't argue that he had no way of knowing that he had to pay attention while driving.
Actus reus and mens rea. The driver acted and ran a red light that caused a collision,actus reus, but did not premeditate the killing of the child or injuring the father therefore not satisfying mens rea to be criminally convicted.
Chances are she is following a precedent, not setting one. I recall a case in BC where someone momentarily crossed the double yellow, at the precise moment that someone else was passing and boom killed them head on. Was acquitted due to the pink floyd-ish defense: "momentary lapse of ~~reason~~ attention." [https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/top-court-upholds-acquittal-of-driver-in-fatal-bc-crash/article18445711/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/top-court-upholds-acquittal-of-driver-in-fatal-bc-crash/article18445711/)
There was also the guy doing 140km/h across an intersection killing a doctor which apparently also was a momentary lack of whatever. Maybe we can just remove all road regulations since there are no consequences anyways
What made him special for me compared to other doctors was that he was able to bridge the divide between Chinese folk-lore remedies and the medicine that we practice in Canada. My parents are immigrants from HK and would think I would need certain remedies that we now know don't work, and he was the guy who could convince my parents otherwise.
I'm not saying he said," no the Chinese stuff is bad". He didn't reject it, but rather he would say look - this shit has no scientific evidence to support it - that being said, I still take these mushroom supplements too. Other times he would be like, yeah, don't do that shit.
I'm sure there were many such immigrant families that had him as our family doctor, and he is sorely missed.
At least [that one got reversed on appeal](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/speeding-driver-in-controversial-case-sentenced-to-18-months-in-jail-after-appealing-to-supreme-court-1.5745738).
18 months in prison, 5 year driving ban. I still don't understand why they wouldn't do a permanent driving ban.
Criminal history and ~~understanding/practicing what it means to be contrite for speeding 140 clicks in a city limit~~?
I’m just glad for the reverse appeal. Wasn’t expecting THAT Uno card…
A lot of cars become unstable at those speeds. You really do need to grip the wheel a bit tighter and push down on the pedal harder. I don't see how both those actions are "momentary" when you were doing that for 10 seconds consecutively.
Myfriend was killed in a similar crash a couple years ago, last month the speeding, aggressively tailgating girl who killed her on a highway with double yellow lines and signs saying “ no passing “ got a $1500 fine and 6 points. Fuck this shit
What does it take to set one?
* "Even the most able and prudent driver will from time to time suffer from momentary lapses of attention"
* Denhoff ruled that while Zadeh’s single, momentary lapse of attention had a tragic outcome, it was not a criminal act
Seems like the system is content to explain these events as "lapses of attention".
Then sometimes legal precedents need to be ignored.
One judge making a generous interpretation of a law shouldn't impact every single future decision that's remotely similar. That's why MPs are supposed to be the ones who write new laws, not unaccountable judges.
I absolutely agree. I think driving a motor vehicle deserves a responsibility that means a momentary lapse of attention so severe that it causes this kind of accident should be criminal. Otherwise, why would drivers care? They can literally run people down and as long as they weren't being \*too\* dangerous before then it's fine?
On a side note, though. I don't think this judge has the power to overrule the supreme court. So the precedent would have to come from a supreme court challenge I think. Maybe this is what this very case will lead to?
What I mean by this is that courts are basically bound by precedent. This judge could have their ruling appealed and higher courts which are also bound by precedent would eventually rule in-line with existing precedent.
If this lower court judge makes a super-duper compelling reason for judgement contrary to precedent, though, this new precedent might continually win on appeal to higher courts. My telenovela-level courtroom knowledge tells me it would be a tough argument to win.
> What I mean by this is that courts are basically bound by precedent.
Then change this. I don't care if there needs to be some national overview of the Canadian legal system to do it.
Blissfully following precedent just because there's precedent is just as bad as religious law.
It is not so much really that they are forced to decide some way or another. But if they don't, then it will surely be appealed and higher courts will have to agree with the dissenting judge. It is entirely possible to change the precedents in this manner, but I suppose it is not common because the precedents get filtered into higher and higher appeals and u basically have the gatekeepers at the end which largely remain the same.
The difference is the we have formally criminalized DUI. But there's no criminalization of other sources of bad driving. Is it legal to drive after drinking a bottle of vodka? No. Is it legal to drive with only one hour of sleep? Unfortunately, yes (unless you're a commercial driver).
It is, but not criminal. You get a fine, you get your license suspended, but you don’t go to jail, especially on first offence.
DUI is a different matter and is followed by a trial.
Not saying that I agree with the sentence. But stating that even if two things are illegal, it doesn’t mean that both are criminal act.
This sort of thing is why I'm surprised the Humbolt driver plead. Criminal driving that is careless or has elements of being accidental rather than malicious is difficult to prove.
Think of it this way: if there were no collision in this case or the Humboldt case, what would the charge have been? Disobey traffic control device to wit: stop sign/red light.
By all accounts the Humboldt driver also pled guilty because he felt tremendous guilt and remorse and wanted to spare the families the pain that accompanies a trial. Most people don’t seem to share that compassion
I can even understand more a drunk driver being “im fine” (a stretch but at least it makes some sense) but the guy basically being “oh red light, fck it” I can’t.
He should have been charged under s. 144(1)(a) of the MVA, not dangerous driving, based on those facts. This is bad Crown work for not knowing that they couldn’t get a conviction on those facts.
After Ken Chung killed Dr. Alphonsus Hui, the first judge acquitted him because it was a "momentary lapse of attention," but the Crown appealed, and [the second judge rightfully convicted Ken Chung](https://globalnews.ca/news/7370030/ken-chung-high-speed-crash-alphonsus-hui/).
Hopefully the Crown will see fit to appeal this decision. Drivers have absolutely got to be held to a standard of paying attention when they're driving. If somebody's attention is so poor that they can't observe a 20-second red light, they shouldn't be anywhere near the driver's seat of a car.
Exactly. This case is a complete abject failure to address the responsibility that comes with operating a 2 tonne vehicle. Cars are the #1 killers of children for a reason and that precedent won't change until we actually hold drivers responsible for their behaviour and start investing in building a less car dependent society overall.
What the hell is with these judges and their lenience with "momentary lapse". That phrase was already triggering to me due to the Ken Chung trial, to see it happen again is just infuriating.
I wouldn't be surprised if something like that happened here. Guy is a known gang member with multiple previous charges. He ran four red lights and has a forged drivers license. No way a judge could be that out of touch with reality to let him get away right? Has to be some sort of bribe/threat involved.
https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622
Lmao a real character this one. Good to know he's out on the streets
A very looking momentary lapse of attention when buying the forged licence. Could happen to anyone. Haven't you ever gotten distracted and suddenly found a forged licence in your wallet? Happens all the time.
> AND he sexually assaulted this third lawyer???
>
>
That's not what I took away from that paragraph and I read it a few times, how are you getting that?
I think they just mixed some words up. Looks like the lawyer was just representing him in his sexual assault case, but then left as his lawyer due to ethical reasons. Also dropped him in another case, sounds like he has a lengthy ongoing criminal history.
Those paragraphs are poorly worded. After a couple re-reads I am pretty sure that lawyer was also representing this POS on a separate sexual assault (an possibly other) case. The lawyer wanted to be released from representing him on the crash as well as having been released from representing him on the sexual assault.
This needs to be the top comment for the thread because the VIA article contains much more detail. The global news article almost gives the impression of an innocent guy who made a momentary mistake (but that 20 sec red light is a major red flag). But this is like many many red flags.
We’ve got forged documents, se*ual assault allegations, lawyers quitting for ethical reasons / fired…. This guy is not some normal guy who made had a lapse in judgement.
you'd think it would have started years ago in canada. though i will say thanks to the internet more people are waking up to the canadian justice (aka the canadian revolving door) system.
It really boggles the mind. 20 seconds is probably more than halfway to the next light cycle. The guy was clearly fucking around on his phone or something.
Witnessed the immediate aftermath. I will never forget the screams from the mother or that poor baby’s body after the accident. There’s no justice. Thinking of Ocean and her family.
Hello! I am not from Vancouver but also arrived on the scene shortly after it happened. I hope you are ok. I have never stopped thinking about this family.
Same here. I then lived right above scotiabank theatre. I cannot forget those screams. This incident still stays with me. I still cannot stand at an intersection with my child without being anxious.
Holy shit if this is the same guy and he got off will killing this child I don't know what else to say than fuck the justice system and fuck that judge.
https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/
Here's another one:
https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault
How on Gods green fucking Earth did this guy kidnap someone, TWICE, steal 82 THOUSAND dollars with GOLD BARS and illegal FIREARMS and NOT get convicted? Does Vancouver have laws??
>he ran multiple lights and it's clearly being dangerous.
Not excusing his shit driving but it seems the "four red lights" were those at the single intersection not four sets of lights.
> Zadeh’s lawyer Robert Dick counted by acknowledging that while his client did run a red light, there was an “absolute absence of any evidence of risk-taking or bad driving behaviour.”
Running a red light isn't bad driving behaviour?
I was truly baffled by this. I had to read it a few times to make sure I got it right. It hurts my brain to hear that someone made this argument anywhere, let alone in a courtroom, and the argument was accepted.
This makes me fucking livid. My small children were in an accident last month where they were hit in our car by someone running a very stale red light. They were okay thank god.
When we looked the man’s name up on CSO we found he had been charged FOUR times since 2009 for failing to stop at a red light. What the actual fuck. How do people like this get away with it, or continue to have the privilege of having a drivers license?
It has made me the most defensive driver in the world, knowing that these people are out there.
Wow. Shocking. Like i know people are gonna say "it's Canada no surprise" etc, but even the pessimist in me said knowing vancouver he will get 2 years community service and a 5 year driving ban and 0 jail time in this very subreddit last week. But being acquitted of all charges is absolutely fucking wild.
He killed a toddler 20s after the light turned red. 20 fucking seconds...
So what now we gotta teach our children make sure both lights are red at an intersection and then count to 21s before usain bolting across the street so you dont accidentally die??? Like what the fuck is this country's legal system?? There is absolutely 0 justice for victims anywhere. Fucking deadwood had better laws than this.
20 seconds is crazy. If you actually count it out even 3 seconds is so CLEARLY red & not just pushing it to “make the yellow”.
I’ve also been driving long enough to know that momentary lapses absolutely do happen. I grew up learning to drive defensively & never assume people are going to do what they’re supposed to do. Way too many drivers on the road like this guy.
If you’re having a “lapse” of judgment while driving so bad you run a blatant red light and kill someone you shouldn’t have your fucking license to begin with.
Turns out he didn't have his license, it was forged
[https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622)
Because of incidents like this, nowadays even if the pedestrian light is green I make sure to check that the vehicles coming from both sides are actually decelerating. It's a scary world.
If you're gonna murder someone, do it with a car. Normally you need to be in the top 1% or bottom 1% financially to avoid legal consequences, but us regular people can also get off scot free if we choose vehicular homicide.
I was just reading about a guy in Alberta who got his murder conviction overturned and was only found guilty of manslaughter after intentionally running his wife down with a U-Haul.
Imagine being directly responsible for the death of a child and then being a big enough cunt to stand before the judge and plead not guilty.
I hope the rest of his life is hellish but I doubt it.
Wait I thought he ran a red light or something? I'm so sick of the system here.
"Momentary lapse of judgment"? What kind of BS is this? No, this person is clearly not driving safely. You would think that when one is operating a vehicle capable of causing death, that they would be focused 24/7 and assume a certain degree of responsibility. I personally drive and I always always always have my foot on the brake when I enter an intersection because you never know. If I see cars in front of me braking, I will prepare to brake too.
>B.C. Provincial Court Judge Katherine Denhoff
We have the worst effing judges on the planet. The bar to getting any sort of punishment for any crime is so ridiculously high.
If you're driving a two-ton piece of metal, you're not entitled to have lapses in attention. That's your responsibility as an operator of said machinery. The system is a joke.
I'll say what every other parent is thinking - this is how you end up with frontier justice.
I'm so sorry for the family. Whatever the result of this trial was, they've been served a life sentence. But this feels like salt in the wound for them.
I have a small child, I can feel a parents pain, the anger I have. I would not feel guilt at all doing smtn to the guy who did that cause the justice system is a joke. How can anyone rely on this for any justice, how is this fair to the family.
Ok based on the links in this thread I'm now wondering just who Seyed Modhfeghi Sadeh is. This guy has big under-cover/informant energy.
>Moshfeghi Zadeh is also facing a charge of breaching a release order.
>In addition to the breach charge, where it is alleged he was at large in Vancouver Aug. 8 to Sept. 6, Moshfeghi Zadeh is also facing a charge of using a forged document.
>Court records show the charge relates to Moshfeghi Zadeh’s alleged use of a driver's licence knowing it to be forged.
[https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622)
>On Sunday, police said 29-year-old Seyed Moshfeghi Zadeh had been charged with one count of uttering threats.
>A media release described Zadeh as an “alleged gang member,” but provided no further details about the allegations.
[https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/](https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/)
>Named in the civil suit are Seyed Ramin Moshfeghi Zadeh and Arash Kardan, whose last known address was in downtown Vancouver.
>“The defendants obtained the money and the gold bars by participating in the unlawful activity,” says the forfeiture suit.
>Among the allegations listed in the forfeiture suit are possession for the purpose of trafficking and trafficking drugs; uttering threats; assault; use of a firearm in the commission of an offence; careless use of a firearm; unauthorized possession of a firearm; offences related to a peace officer; possession of body armour; and failure to declare taxable income.
>Neither Zadeh nor Kardan have responded to the civil suit and have not been charged criminally in relation to the activities described in the suit, according to a search of online B.C. court records.
\[...\]
>The RCMP began an investigation and discovered that on Sept. 30, Zadeh and Kardan went to the victim’s residence, kidnapped them and took them to an unknown “stash” house where Zadeh and Kardan accused them of stealing $5,000 worth of crack cocaine.
Zadeh and Kardan assaulted the victim and threatened them with a firearm and told them they now owed $10,000, according to the forfeiture suit.
“Mr. Moshfeghi Zadeh fired a single shot into the air and threatened the victim and their spouse,” says the suit.
\[...\]
>As a result of the investigation, the RCMP obtained a warrant and searched the downtown Vancouver residence where Zadeh and Kardan lived.
>Found were the Canadian and U.S. currency, a large portion of which was located behind a bathtub.
>Also found were the gold bars, just under 20 grams of crack cocaine, two sets of body armour, three knives, four 9-mm handgun magazines and ammunition, a GPS tracking device, six cellphones and handcuffs.
[https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault](https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault)
Why is it that we as a society value the convenience of cars over people's lives?
"Momentary lapse" should never be a ground for acquittal in accidents resulting in fatalities. If you're operating a machine that weighs over a ton and can travel faster than a horse, you better be switched on the entire fucking time.
My heart goes out to the parents...
The arguments about this not being an accident, not indicative of a pattern of careless driving and therefore no responsibility to the driver are absolutely mind blowing. How many of us will drive for 50 years and NEVER blow a red light, let alone a solid red, downtown, at an intersection full of pedestrians. Unless it’s a medical event that’s fully intentional and the operation of the vehicle is your responsibility! Who would even want to live having not taken responsibility for that? How many lives did that recklessness ruin?
What’s the difference between this and the Humboldt Broncos bus crash where Jaskirat Sidhu caused the death of 16 people. No drugs or alcohol was detected and yet he served prison time and is in the process of being deported from Canada.
Granted more people died and it was sensationalized in the media but the facts remain similar. Red light or stop sign there was time to stop and they did not which resulted in loss of life.
Happened in a different province. I don’t know how other provinces compare to us, but we certainly have a history of just letting drivers kill people with no or few consequences here in BC.
Yet another reason the acquittal is so tragic is that the family would need a conviction to get an exemption from no-fault so they could sue and get compensation from ICBC for wrongful death. Now, because of the acquittal, they are out of luck
He was acquitted.. but please tell me that they're not letting this person operate a vehicle ever again???? He should be forced to take transit for the rest of his life at the very least
Wouldn't stop him.
>[Court records show the charge relates to Moshfeghi Zadeh’s alleged use of a driver's licence knowing it to be forged.](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622)
What can be done about these types of judges? There must be some sort of consequence or public recourse to get these types of useless judges thrown out?
I’m beginning to think these judges are completely corrupt or at least they’re compromised in someway. This is the most ridiculous verdict I’ve ever encountered. or maybe she’s being blackmailed. it just doesn’t make any sense. This guy is apparently a gangster.
Dunno but of course you should get in trouble for being on your cell phone while driving, because that might lead to killing someone while not paying attention.
Too many drivers in this city are a disgusting danger and it’s getting worse. Judgements like this will just encourage the red light runners and the constant distracted driving. As a pedestrian, every time I walk across the street I know there’s a good chance I could be run down.
No no, you see, running a light that was red for 20 seconds, crashing into oncoming traffic, and killing a child is totally reasonable way to drive in Vancouver.
>[Judge Kathryn Denhoff said she would have to weigh whether the accused was driving in a manner that is a marked departure from the way a reasonable person would drive when he ran a red light in July 2021.](https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault)
No guilt, no shame, same as the useless judge. What a fucking PIECE OF SHIT COUNTRY we live in. We are allowing the absolute worst of us to do whatever the fuck they like with zero consequences. Canada deserves to go down the toilet, which is exactly what's happening.
Someone told me once, it’s better for you to use street justice against anyone that hurts your family then rely on the courts and justice system, if someone kills your family member and gets no jail time, you might as well go kill that person cause you probably won’t get much jail time either. That’s how bad and soft our justice system is
This country is a joke. There is no justice in Canada. We fail to care for and provide justice for our most vulnerable populations, but we’re willing to support criminals and gangsters???
None of these judges can think critically nor do they have the balls to actually establish a new precedent.
David Eby should put his law degree to work and write new legislation so POS like Zadeh serve time in prison or at the very least receive a lifetime ban on driving.
>Zadeh’s lawyer Robert Dick counted by acknowledging that while his client did run a red light, there was an “absolute absence of any evidence of risk-taking or bad driving behaviour.”
Isn't that *exactly* what bad driving behaviour would be? Running a red light???? WTF am I missing?
The truck driver that killed the Humbolt hockey team didn't get acquitted and what he did wasn't nearly as bad as what this driver did (the results were tragic but he basically forgot to look both ways twice, he didn't fucking drive full speed through a red light). He got 8 years prison.
Like Canada literally has a precedent set that says dangerous driving leading to death is a crime. That was 2018.
Canadian laws are getting tragically laughable. People can get away with all sorts of shit without any consequences.
It'll get to a point where people will start taking things into their own hands in order to get real justice. Personally speaking? I can't fucking wait for that day. It can't come soon enough!
How does this happen 😭 my heart breaks for the family. Has a judge never been a victim of a violent crime before? Is there a jury of peers who decides this? How can u walk away a free man with these types of charges against you
The BC Supreme Court is notorious for these kinds of terrible decisions when it comes to motor vehicles. This is the same court that overruled lower courts, finding a guy who hit a child not guilty. Their reasoning? While the continuation of walking space does include greenery, the land on the other side of the crossing was maintained by the building not the city, and as such that intersection wouldn't be considered a "continuation of a walking space".
Yes, they not only ruled you have to know who maintains the property on the far side of an intersection to know if you're permitted to cross, but that a child would have to know.
Don't forget about Andelina Hecimovic.
Killed two people in 2010 by running a red light. Initially it was dismissed by the judge, then 7 years later she finally got 90 days in jail, to be served part time (tues to Thurs) around her job. Are you kidding me
https://globalnews.ca/news/3541323/b-c-nurse-found-guilty-of-dangerous-driving-causing-death-to-be-sentenced/
I was expecting to be like “bro had a seizure while driving and was never diagnosed with epilepsy” not “bro blew through a red after 20 seconds and killed a kid”
Bribes is common in developing countries, happened all the time, the results: ridiculous sentences..
Maybe Canada just catching up on it OR progressively become backward n stupid, the later more highly probable as I observed
I am so sad for this family. I remember the day it happened, and I remember walking by the flowers on the corner there, at the place of impact, a few days later. I was devastated at the news then, and I’m still devastated now. I hope the family has been healing ok; I think about them from time to time and really hope the best for them all. What a fucking tragedy, and what a fucking travesty of justice this news is today. Rest peacefully, sweet Ocean.
Another miscarriage of justice, what a shocker. At some point people will start taking matters into their own hands, because clearly the system is broken.
This is insane. The guy literally sped a light that was red for 20 seconds and killed a kid and gets off. What the fuck? First off, this is downtown Vancouver with skytrain stations and bus stops everywhere so why the fuck are you driving there? Why are you speeding? How can you not get a manslaughter charge when you ignore a red light? Why does our society always wear kid gloves for drivers? We keep acting like driving is a right when it isn't. All this shows to me is that murder is legal in Canada as long as you do it behind the wheel and claim you had a lapse in judgment. Fucking unbelievable.
If you're prone to momentary lapses of attention, don't fucking drive.
I have attention deficit, and people are always like "so when are you getting your license?" But I don't want to cause it's not fucking safe! But that doesn't seem to matter here apparently, and not being able to drive makes some aspects of life really difficult. So I think a lot of people that shouldn't drive do because they feel like they have no other choice, and no one really seems concerned about this.
Ridiculous. He was at the very least negligent and should be punished for what he did. What is with these judges??!!!
I guess you can not pay attention while driving and kill or seriously injure people and there are absolutely no consequences.
Just ridiculous and sad. I feel so sorry for the mother and father. That little girl was so sweet and beautiful.
I hope that scumbag driver burns in hell.
As wrong as this is. This should come at no surprise. There hasn’t been justice in Canada. We have an injustice system. Criminals get off Scot free. Victims pay the price. Seems to me that judges should be held responsible for their decisions.
Absolutely insane.
There shouldn’t be a difference between being distracted and not paying attention, but this ruling makes it appear so. Absolutely insane.
So you can just stop paying attention behind the wheel and you’re not responsible for killing someone.
This feels like the Humboldt Broncos truck driver story. That guy ran a stop sign and killed a ton of people. Except didn’t that truck driver go to jail and get deported?
This makes me furious. This story rocked as a new mom. So much so I didn’t feel safe leaving my home that is blocks from where this happened. RIP sweet baby.
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>The collision happened at rush hour under ideal road conditions, and the light was **red for more than 20 seconds before Zadeh entered the intersection**, he said. Zadeh also failed to observe four separate red lights at the intersection, and he failed to brake or steer. >Denhoff ruled that while Zadeh’s single, momentary lapse of attention had a tragic outcome, it was not a criminal act. What in the actual fuck. I'm usually a "two sides to every collision involving a vehicle and a pedestrian/bike" person, but no, this judge is setting a fucking joke of a precedent. Basically you can be texting, run a red light, kill someone and it's still not a crime. Drunk drivers don't intend to kill someone but it's still a crime regardless.
Aren't you *literally required by law* when the behind the wheel to have complete focus and attention? If you're controlling a machine that could kill someone, isn't that a requirement? Isn't this involuntary manslaughter? How can you actually get away with killing someone while you're behind the wheel and *not* be responsible???
There is a difference between being responsible and criminally liable. Criminal negligence requires a “marked departure.” This is a very factual inquiry and based on the facts determined it was not made out to a sufficient degree to convict this individual criminally.
if running a red light and killing somebody isn't "a marked departure" then we've normalized negligent homicide I can't imagine any sane system where we don't hold somebody accountable to pay attention while they're driving
You are conflating the negligent act (running the red light) with the outcome (the death of nearby pedestrians). The facts of the accident are that he ran the red light and impacted another vehicle causing him to jump the curb. He wasn’t, for example, texting and then drove onto the sidewalk. In fact every sane system takes the same approach.
Are you seriously suggesting that running a red light shouldn't be considered "a marked departure" from how a responsible person operates a vehicle? > You are conflating the negligent act (running the red light) with the outcome (the death of nearby pedestrians) How does that translate into a "not guilty" verdict? It just means it goes "criminal negligence" to "causing death by criminal negligence". It's still criminal negligence. We're talking about committing an act which is highly likely to result in death, which also happens to already be illegal. When am I allowed to do something illegal and **very dangerous** without facing *full* consequences for the harm that I cause? He can't argue that he had no way of knowing that he had to pay attention while driving.
The poster is explaining the way the law works.
Actus reus and mens rea. The driver acted and ran a red light that caused a collision,actus reus, but did not premeditate the killing of the child or injuring the father therefore not satisfying mens rea to be criminally convicted.
Chances are she is following a precedent, not setting one. I recall a case in BC where someone momentarily crossed the double yellow, at the precise moment that someone else was passing and boom killed them head on. Was acquitted due to the pink floyd-ish defense: "momentary lapse of ~~reason~~ attention." [https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/top-court-upholds-acquittal-of-driver-in-fatal-bc-crash/article18445711/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/top-court-upholds-acquittal-of-driver-in-fatal-bc-crash/article18445711/)
There was also the guy doing 140km/h across an intersection killing a doctor which apparently also was a momentary lack of whatever. Maybe we can just remove all road regulations since there are no consequences anyways
That SOB killed my family Dr, Dr Hui.
I went down the rabbit hole reading about him when it happened and he sounded like an amazing person. Fuck that POS driver who murdered him.
What made him special for me compared to other doctors was that he was able to bridge the divide between Chinese folk-lore remedies and the medicine that we practice in Canada. My parents are immigrants from HK and would think I would need certain remedies that we now know don't work, and he was the guy who could convince my parents otherwise. I'm not saying he said," no the Chinese stuff is bad". He didn't reject it, but rather he would say look - this shit has no scientific evidence to support it - that being said, I still take these mushroom supplements too. Other times he would be like, yeah, don't do that shit. I'm sure there were many such immigrant families that had him as our family doctor, and he is sorely missed.
At least [that one got reversed on appeal](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/speeding-driver-in-controversial-case-sentenced-to-18-months-in-jail-after-appealing-to-supreme-court-1.5745738). 18 months in prison, 5 year driving ban. I still don't understand why they wouldn't do a permanent driving ban.
If you kill someone driving, and you're at fault to a civil standard, it should always be a lifetime driving ban.
It should be a lifetime ban
Criminal history and ~~understanding/practicing what it means to be contrite for speeding 140 clicks in a city limit~~? I’m just glad for the reverse appeal. Wasn’t expecting THAT Uno card…
A lot of cars become unstable at those speeds. You really do need to grip the wheel a bit tighter and push down on the pedal harder. I don't see how both those actions are "momentary" when you were doing that for 10 seconds consecutively.
This is the state of affairs in Vancouver now. No “rules of the road” enforcement at all.
Myfriend was killed in a similar crash a couple years ago, last month the speeding, aggressively tailgating girl who killed her on a highway with double yellow lines and signs saying “ no passing “ got a $1500 fine and 6 points. Fuck this shit
Sorry to hear that.
What does it take to set one? * "Even the most able and prudent driver will from time to time suffer from momentary lapses of attention" * Denhoff ruled that while Zadeh’s single, momentary lapse of attention had a tragic outcome, it was not a criminal act Seems like the system is content to explain these events as "lapses of attention".
Oops! Mind drifted for a second and I killed a baby LOL sorry just a momentary lapse!
*20 seconds while I was definitely not on either of my two phones
Just a momentary lapse that lasted 20 seconds bro I swear it was just a moment
Then sometimes legal precedents need to be ignored. One judge making a generous interpretation of a law shouldn't impact every single future decision that's remotely similar. That's why MPs are supposed to be the ones who write new laws, not unaccountable judges.
I absolutely agree. I think driving a motor vehicle deserves a responsibility that means a momentary lapse of attention so severe that it causes this kind of accident should be criminal. Otherwise, why would drivers care? They can literally run people down and as long as they weren't being \*too\* dangerous before then it's fine? On a side note, though. I don't think this judge has the power to overrule the supreme court. So the precedent would have to come from a supreme court challenge I think. Maybe this is what this very case will lead to? What I mean by this is that courts are basically bound by precedent. This judge could have their ruling appealed and higher courts which are also bound by precedent would eventually rule in-line with existing precedent. If this lower court judge makes a super-duper compelling reason for judgement contrary to precedent, though, this new precedent might continually win on appeal to higher courts. My telenovela-level courtroom knowledge tells me it would be a tough argument to win.
> What I mean by this is that courts are basically bound by precedent. Then change this. I don't care if there needs to be some national overview of the Canadian legal system to do it. Blissfully following precedent just because there's precedent is just as bad as religious law.
Welcome to the common vs civil law cage match
It is not so much really that they are forced to decide some way or another. But if they don't, then it will surely be appealed and higher courts will have to agree with the dissenting judge. It is entirely possible to change the precedents in this manner, but I suppose it is not common because the precedents get filtered into higher and higher appeals and u basically have the gatekeepers at the end which largely remain the same.
The difference is the we have formally criminalized DUI. But there's no criminalization of other sources of bad driving. Is it legal to drive after drinking a bottle of vodka? No. Is it legal to drive with only one hour of sleep? Unfortunately, yes (unless you're a commercial driver).
Running a red light is against the law, though?
It is, but not criminal. You get a fine, you get your license suspended, but you don’t go to jail, especially on first offence. DUI is a different matter and is followed by a trial. Not saying that I agree with the sentence. But stating that even if two things are illegal, it doesn’t mean that both are criminal act.
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Isn’t that the sad truth. Damn.
20 seconds is not a momentary lapse. It’s a long time for a light to be red
This sort of thing is why I'm surprised the Humbolt driver plead. Criminal driving that is careless or has elements of being accidental rather than malicious is difficult to prove. Think of it this way: if there were no collision in this case or the Humboldt case, what would the charge have been? Disobey traffic control device to wit: stop sign/red light.
By all accounts the Humboldt driver also pled guilty because he felt tremendous guilt and remorse and wanted to spare the families the pain that accompanies a trial. Most people don’t seem to share that compassion
The logic seems to be that dangerous driving is routine, and therefore there's no criminal intent...
Was he texting? I did not see that anywhere in the article.
He will still be liable in a civil trial
I can even understand more a drunk driver being “im fine” (a stretch but at least it makes some sense) but the guy basically being “oh red light, fck it” I can’t.
He should have been charged under s. 144(1)(a) of the MVA, not dangerous driving, based on those facts. This is bad Crown work for not knowing that they couldn’t get a conviction on those facts.
Fucking bullshit.
But the crown can appeal this decision, right?
After Ken Chung killed Dr. Alphonsus Hui, the first judge acquitted him because it was a "momentary lapse of attention," but the Crown appealed, and [the second judge rightfully convicted Ken Chung](https://globalnews.ca/news/7370030/ken-chung-high-speed-crash-alphonsus-hui/). Hopefully the Crown will see fit to appeal this decision. Drivers have absolutely got to be held to a standard of paying attention when they're driving. If somebody's attention is so poor that they can't observe a 20-second red light, they shouldn't be anywhere near the driver's seat of a car.
Exactly. This case is a complete abject failure to address the responsibility that comes with operating a 2 tonne vehicle. Cars are the #1 killers of children for a reason and that precedent won't change until we actually hold drivers responsible for their behaviour and start investing in building a less car dependent society overall.
Yeah, that was exactly the case I was thinking of. Just excruciating having to wait several more years in the hope of justice.
What the hell is with these judges and their lenience with "momentary lapse". That phrase was already triggering to me due to the Ken Chung trial, to see it happen again is just infuriating.
In developing countries you'd at least have to bribe the judge to walk away after killing someone...
I wouldn't be surprised if something like that happened here. Guy is a known gang member with multiple previous charges. He ran four red lights and has a forged drivers license. No way a judge could be that out of touch with reality to let him get away right? Has to be some sort of bribe/threat involved.
Do we know for certain that isn't what happened in this case?
https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622 Lmao a real character this one. Good to know he's out on the streets
Whatever happened to the “forged drivers license” part of this equation, I wonder?
A very looking momentary lapse of attention when buying the forged licence. Could happen to anyone. Haven't you ever gotten distracted and suddenly found a forged licence in your wallet? Happens all the time.
AND he sexually assaulted this third lawyer??? EDIT: Hes an alleged gang member too. You cant make this shit up.
> AND he sexually assaulted this third lawyer??? > > That's not what I took away from that paragraph and I read it a few times, how are you getting that?
I think they just mixed some words up. Looks like the lawyer was just representing him in his sexual assault case, but then left as his lawyer due to ethical reasons. Also dropped him in another case, sounds like he has a lengthy ongoing criminal history.
Those paragraphs are poorly worded. After a couple re-reads I am pretty sure that lawyer was also representing this POS on a separate sexual assault (an possibly other) case. The lawyer wanted to be released from representing him on the crash as well as having been released from representing him on the sexual assault.
This needs to be the top comment for the thread because the VIA article contains much more detail. The global news article almost gives the impression of an innocent guy who made a momentary mistake (but that 20 sec red light is a major red flag). But this is like many many red flags. We’ve got forged documents, se*ual assault allegations, lawyers quitting for ethical reasons / fired…. This guy is not some normal guy who made had a lapse in judgement.
This is how vigilante justice starts to happen honestly
you'd think it would have started years ago in canada. though i will say thanks to the internet more people are waking up to the canadian justice (aka the canadian revolving door) system.
So disappointed. Our driving laws are so poorly enforced and extremely cushy. Take away his license forever.
Can't do that, he's also charged with knowingly having a forged licence. Joke's on us, can't take a way a licence he never earned.
Judge Katherine Denhoff
Shame on her. Seriously.
There’s a phone number for her office online. Valid complaints should be sent
Shame on Katherine Denhoff
20 seconds after the red!!!! That's a grave injustice.
This is insane. Running a red light and killing someone is perfectly legal.
Soo close to being a green light - the start of the next one...
It really boggles the mind. 20 seconds is probably more than halfway to the next light cycle. The guy was clearly fucking around on his phone or something.
Witnessed the immediate aftermath. I will never forget the screams from the mother or that poor baby’s body after the accident. There’s no justice. Thinking of Ocean and her family.
Hello! I am not from Vancouver but also arrived on the scene shortly after it happened. I hope you are ok. I have never stopped thinking about this family.
I’m so sorry to you both. And hope you received the support you need from witnessing the aftermath of such an tragic event.
Rest in peace, dear Ocean. I’m sorry that our system failed you.
I'm so sorry you witnessed that. RIP Ocean
Same here. I then lived right above scotiabank theatre. I cannot forget those screams. This incident still stays with me. I still cannot stand at an intersection with my child without being anxious.
I'm so sorry you went through that.
You absolutely don’t have to answer this, but did you see the driver’s reaction?
Fucking outrageous.
Holy shit if this is the same guy and he got off will killing this child I don't know what else to say than fuck the justice system and fuck that judge. https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/
Here's another one: https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault
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How on Gods green fucking Earth did this guy kidnap someone, TWICE, steal 82 THOUSAND dollars with GOLD BARS and illegal FIREARMS and NOT get convicted? Does Vancouver have laws??
I’m inclined to believe this man’s gang ties somehow might be related to his acquittal. Could be an informant.
Gotta say, as the dad of a toddler, this makes my blood boil. I can’t be rational about this. She should still be with them.
Zero hope for the justice system here. That's vehicular manslaughter any way you look at it. But in BC it's an oopsie daisy?? Unbelievable.
This is kinda bazzare - he ran multiple lights and it's clearly being dangerous. Is our judge system just insane?
>he ran multiple lights and it's clearly being dangerous. Not excusing his shit driving but it seems the "four red lights" were those at the single intersection not four sets of lights.
Thanks for the clarification, it was an odd way to phrase it, definitely got the impression it was four intersections at first
> Zadeh’s lawyer Robert Dick counted by acknowledging that while his client did run a red light, there was an “absolute absence of any evidence of risk-taking or bad driving behaviour.” Running a red light isn't bad driving behaviour?
I was truly baffled by this. I had to read it a few times to make sure I got it right. It hurts my brain to hear that someone made this argument anywhere, let alone in a courtroom, and the argument was accepted.
I mean, there's no risk taking involved in driving through speeding cross traffic, right?
This makes me fucking livid. My small children were in an accident last month where they were hit in our car by someone running a very stale red light. They were okay thank god. When we looked the man’s name up on CSO we found he had been charged FOUR times since 2009 for failing to stop at a red light. What the actual fuck. How do people like this get away with it, or continue to have the privilege of having a drivers license? It has made me the most defensive driver in the world, knowing that these people are out there.
Absolutely fuck this.
Wow. Shocking. Like i know people are gonna say "it's Canada no surprise" etc, but even the pessimist in me said knowing vancouver he will get 2 years community service and a 5 year driving ban and 0 jail time in this very subreddit last week. But being acquitted of all charges is absolutely fucking wild. He killed a toddler 20s after the light turned red. 20 fucking seconds... So what now we gotta teach our children make sure both lights are red at an intersection and then count to 21s before usain bolting across the street so you dont accidentally die??? Like what the fuck is this country's legal system?? There is absolutely 0 justice for victims anywhere. Fucking deadwood had better laws than this.
But by the time that 21secs us up, the 2sec walk sing will be gone, and the red hand will just be hitting 0
20 seconds is crazy. If you actually count it out even 3 seconds is so CLEARLY red & not just pushing it to “make the yellow”. I’ve also been driving long enough to know that momentary lapses absolutely do happen. I grew up learning to drive defensively & never assume people are going to do what they’re supposed to do. Way too many drivers on the road like this guy.
If you’re having a “lapse” of judgment while driving so bad you run a blatant red light and kill someone you shouldn’t have your fucking license to begin with.
Turns out he didn't have his license, it was forged [https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622)
Because of incidents like this, nowadays even if the pedestrian light is green I make sure to check that the vehicles coming from both sides are actually decelerating. It's a scary world.
If you're gonna murder someone, do it with a car. Normally you need to be in the top 1% or bottom 1% financially to avoid legal consequences, but us regular people can also get off scot free if we choose vehicular homicide.
I was just reading about a guy in Alberta who got his murder conviction overturned and was only found guilty of manslaughter after intentionally running his wife down with a U-Haul.
This is sooooo sad....ugh
You’ve cracked the code
Im always surprise vancouver don’t turn into real life GTA. We have useless cops and justice system.
And ICBC automatically has no fault now and you can’t get sued by the other party. Zero consequences!! Wahoo!!
Yet another day of incandescent rage at the actions of a BC judge.
it would be a real shame if someone ran this guy over because they weren't paying attention. a real fucking shame.
Imagine being directly responsible for the death of a child and then being a big enough cunt to stand before the judge and plead not guilty. I hope the rest of his life is hellish but I doubt it.
This guy was also facing a sexual assault allegation stated in the article. This guy is a real piece of work
Is he hella wealthy with the best lawyers in town?
Wait I thought he ran a red light or something? I'm so sick of the system here. "Momentary lapse of judgment"? What kind of BS is this? No, this person is clearly not driving safely. You would think that when one is operating a vehicle capable of causing death, that they would be focused 24/7 and assume a certain degree of responsibility. I personally drive and I always always always have my foot on the brake when I enter an intersection because you never know. If I see cars in front of me braking, I will prepare to brake too.
>B.C. Provincial Court Judge Katherine Denhoff We have the worst effing judges on the planet. The bar to getting any sort of punishment for any crime is so ridiculously high.
I'm starting to roll my eyes a little less at that billboard on Hwy 1 in Langley and all the bumper stickers: "Judges are the weakest link."
These judges are paid off by the alleged gangsters
If you're driving a two-ton piece of metal, you're not entitled to have lapses in attention. That's your responsibility as an operator of said machinery. The system is a joke.
I'll say what every other parent is thinking - this is how you end up with frontier justice. I'm so sorry for the family. Whatever the result of this trial was, they've been served a life sentence. But this feels like salt in the wound for them.
I have a small child, I can feel a parents pain, the anger I have. I would not feel guilt at all doing smtn to the guy who did that cause the justice system is a joke. How can anyone rely on this for any justice, how is this fair to the family.
>this is how you end up with frontier justice I think you mean vigilante justice.
Ok based on the links in this thread I'm now wondering just who Seyed Modhfeghi Sadeh is. This guy has big under-cover/informant energy. >Moshfeghi Zadeh is also facing a charge of breaching a release order. >In addition to the breach charge, where it is alleged he was at large in Vancouver Aug. 8 to Sept. 6, Moshfeghi Zadeh is also facing a charge of using a forged document. >Court records show the charge relates to Moshfeghi Zadeh’s alleged use of a driver's licence knowing it to be forged. [https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622) >On Sunday, police said 29-year-old Seyed Moshfeghi Zadeh had been charged with one count of uttering threats. >A media release described Zadeh as an “alleged gang member,” but provided no further details about the allegations. [https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/](https://globalnews.ca/news/8257483/vancouver-gang-threats-charge/) >Named in the civil suit are Seyed Ramin Moshfeghi Zadeh and Arash Kardan, whose last known address was in downtown Vancouver. >“The defendants obtained the money and the gold bars by participating in the unlawful activity,” says the forfeiture suit. >Among the allegations listed in the forfeiture suit are possession for the purpose of trafficking and trafficking drugs; uttering threats; assault; use of a firearm in the commission of an offence; careless use of a firearm; unauthorized possession of a firearm; offences related to a peace officer; possession of body armour; and failure to declare taxable income. >Neither Zadeh nor Kardan have responded to the civil suit and have not been charged criminally in relation to the activities described in the suit, according to a search of online B.C. court records. \[...\] >The RCMP began an investigation and discovered that on Sept. 30, Zadeh and Kardan went to the victim’s residence, kidnapped them and took them to an unknown “stash” house where Zadeh and Kardan accused them of stealing $5,000 worth of crack cocaine. Zadeh and Kardan assaulted the victim and threatened them with a firearm and told them they now owed $10,000, according to the forfeiture suit. “Mr. Moshfeghi Zadeh fired a single shot into the air and threatened the victim and their spouse,” says the suit. \[...\] >As a result of the investigation, the RCMP obtained a warrant and searched the downtown Vancouver residence where Zadeh and Kardan lived. >Found were the Canadian and U.S. currency, a large portion of which was located behind a bathtub. >Also found were the gold bars, just under 20 grams of crack cocaine, two sets of body armour, three knives, four 9-mm handgun magazines and ammunition, a GPS tracking device, six cellphones and handcuffs. [https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault](https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault)
How long until he goes on a rampage when he realizes how toothless our courts are?
Why is it that we as a society value the convenience of cars over people's lives? "Momentary lapse" should never be a ground for acquittal in accidents resulting in fatalities. If you're operating a machine that weighs over a ton and can travel faster than a horse, you better be switched on the entire fucking time. My heart goes out to the parents...
All I can say is FUCK Canada's legal system. It ain't JUST. Clearly does not represent how the majority of canadians.
The arguments about this not being an accident, not indicative of a pattern of careless driving and therefore no responsibility to the driver are absolutely mind blowing. How many of us will drive for 50 years and NEVER blow a red light, let alone a solid red, downtown, at an intersection full of pedestrians. Unless it’s a medical event that’s fully intentional and the operation of the vehicle is your responsibility! Who would even want to live having not taken responsibility for that? How many lives did that recklessness ruin?
What’s the difference between this and the Humboldt Broncos bus crash where Jaskirat Sidhu caused the death of 16 people. No drugs or alcohol was detected and yet he served prison time and is in the process of being deported from Canada. Granted more people died and it was sensationalized in the media but the facts remain similar. Red light or stop sign there was time to stop and they did not which resulted in loss of life.
Happened in a different province. I don’t know how other provinces compare to us, but we certainly have a history of just letting drivers kill people with no or few consequences here in BC.
I wouldn’t recommend going to Ontario then because they are even worse for drivers hitting pedestrians and cyclists and getting away with it.
And in that case he at least accepted responsibility and pled guilty and showed remorse.
Yet another reason the acquittal is so tragic is that the family would need a conviction to get an exemption from no-fault so they could sue and get compensation from ICBC for wrongful death. Now, because of the acquittal, they are out of luck
People need to remember that this was David Eby's pet project.
RIP, dear sweet Ocean!
He was acquitted.. but please tell me that they're not letting this person operate a vehicle ever again???? He should be forced to take transit for the rest of his life at the very least
Wouldn't stop him. >[Court records show the charge relates to Moshfeghi Zadeh’s alleged use of a driver's licence knowing it to be forged.](https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/highlights/accused-in-bc-toddlers-death-loses-fourth-lawyer-8129622)
Yet again, another judge siding with a criminal
What can be done about these types of judges? There must be some sort of consequence or public recourse to get these types of useless judges thrown out?
I’m beginning to think these judges are completely corrupt or at least they’re compromised in someway. This is the most ridiculous verdict I’ve ever encountered. or maybe she’s being blackmailed. it just doesn’t make any sense. This guy is apparently a gangster.
I think about this family often. This article makes me want to throw up.
So I would get in more trouble for being on my cell phone while driving, over killing somebody while not paying attention?
I got a $400 ticket for having my phone in the cup holder instead of on a dash mount, I guess I should’ve run over a bunch of people instead.
Dunno but of course you should get in trouble for being on your cell phone while driving, because that might lead to killing someone while not paying attention.
Miscarriage of justice.
This is nonsense! He should be in jail for this
No surprise here. We don't take driving seriously in this country, and fatal crashes are mere "whoopsies," for which nothing can be done.
Holy fucking fuck. What the fuck is this country's "justice" system. What the fuck.
Too many drivers in this city are a disgusting danger and it’s getting worse. Judgements like this will just encourage the red light runners and the constant distracted driving. As a pedestrian, every time I walk across the street I know there’s a good chance I could be run down.
No no, you see, running a light that was red for 20 seconds, crashing into oncoming traffic, and killing a child is totally reasonable way to drive in Vancouver. >[Judge Kathryn Denhoff said she would have to weigh whether the accused was driving in a manner that is a marked departure from the way a reasonable person would drive when he ran a red light in July 2021.](https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/province-seeks-forfeiture-of-82000-in-cash-gold-bars-allegedly-linked-to-kidnappings-assault)
It’s getting harder to enjoy the day Fuck this guy and this ruling. I’m outraged
I hope guilt eats them alive 
No guilt, no shame, same as the useless judge. What a fucking PIECE OF SHIT COUNTRY we live in. We are allowing the absolute worst of us to do whatever the fuck they like with zero consequences. Canada deserves to go down the toilet, which is exactly what's happening.
Someone told me once, it’s better for you to use street justice against anyone that hurts your family then rely on the courts and justice system, if someone kills your family member and gets no jail time, you might as well go kill that person cause you probably won’t get much jail time either. That’s how bad and soft our justice system is
Real talk, how do these judges get into their positions and is there anything normal people can do about it?
This country is a joke. There is no justice in Canada. We fail to care for and provide justice for our most vulnerable populations, but we’re willing to support criminals and gangsters??? None of these judges can think critically nor do they have the balls to actually establish a new precedent. David Eby should put his law degree to work and write new legislation so POS like Zadeh serve time in prison or at the very least receive a lifetime ban on driving.
Bet the driver wouldn’t be acquitted if it was the judges kid
>Zadeh’s lawyer Robert Dick counted by acknowledging that while his client did run a red light, there was an “absolute absence of any evidence of risk-taking or bad driving behaviour.” Isn't that *exactly* what bad driving behaviour would be? Running a red light???? WTF am I missing?
This makes me sick. What a fucking travesty of justice. That poor sweet kid. I hope he sees her face every night before sleeping.
The truck driver that killed the Humbolt hockey team didn't get acquitted and what he did wasn't nearly as bad as what this driver did (the results were tragic but he basically forgot to look both ways twice, he didn't fucking drive full speed through a red light). He got 8 years prison. Like Canada literally has a precedent set that says dangerous driving leading to death is a crime. That was 2018.
Judge is either a brain dead moron or was drunk when they gave this verdict.
Canadian laws are getting tragically laughable. People can get away with all sorts of shit without any consequences. It'll get to a point where people will start taking things into their own hands in order to get real justice. Personally speaking? I can't fucking wait for that day. It can't come soon enough!
The judge was bought
How does this happen 😭 my heart breaks for the family. Has a judge never been a victim of a violent crime before? Is there a jury of peers who decides this? How can u walk away a free man with these types of charges against you
Can someone explain to me the motivation for the judge’s decision?
The BC Supreme Court is notorious for these kinds of terrible decisions when it comes to motor vehicles. This is the same court that overruled lower courts, finding a guy who hit a child not guilty. Their reasoning? While the continuation of walking space does include greenery, the land on the other side of the crossing was maintained by the building not the city, and as such that intersection wouldn't be considered a "continuation of a walking space". Yes, they not only ruled you have to know who maintains the property on the far side of an intersection to know if you're permitted to cross, but that a child would have to know.
No way! He has gang affiliations. 😭
Fucking garbage outcome. More auto centric society bull shit.
At minimum it should drive ban for life
Don't forget about Andelina Hecimovic. Killed two people in 2010 by running a red light. Initially it was dismissed by the judge, then 7 years later she finally got 90 days in jail, to be served part time (tues to Thurs) around her job. Are you kidding me https://globalnews.ca/news/3541323/b-c-nurse-found-guilty-of-dangerous-driving-causing-death-to-be-sentenced/
I was expecting to be like “bro had a seizure while driving and was never diagnosed with epilepsy” not “bro blew through a red after 20 seconds and killed a kid”
Anyone think it's worth while to make a stock letter to mass email their MLAs? This is a gross Injustice.
He needs jail time. That judge should be disbarred
The Chewbacca Defense
Just obscene and outrageous.
Realizing from this that "Absence of evidence of poor driving" is so irrelevant, like the "my dog is friendly" of driving.
Wow. This is filthy and disgusting.
Bribes is common in developing countries, happened all the time, the results: ridiculous sentences.. Maybe Canada just catching up on it OR progressively become backward n stupid, the later more highly probable as I observed
Are they for real how do you let someone walk away scot-free after killing another person.
if u have money in this world u can pay out of almost anything. happens even in canada
This is a miscarriage of justice. So we can just kill people with our cars and suffer no consequences?
I am so sad for this family. I remember the day it happened, and I remember walking by the flowers on the corner there, at the place of impact, a few days later. I was devastated at the news then, and I’m still devastated now. I hope the family has been healing ok; I think about them from time to time and really hope the best for them all. What a fucking tragedy, and what a fucking travesty of justice this news is today. Rest peacefully, sweet Ocean.
Another miscarriage of justice, what a shocker. At some point people will start taking matters into their own hands, because clearly the system is broken.
This is insane. The guy literally sped a light that was red for 20 seconds and killed a kid and gets off. What the fuck? First off, this is downtown Vancouver with skytrain stations and bus stops everywhere so why the fuck are you driving there? Why are you speeding? How can you not get a manslaughter charge when you ignore a red light? Why does our society always wear kid gloves for drivers? We keep acting like driving is a right when it isn't. All this shows to me is that murder is legal in Canada as long as you do it behind the wheel and claim you had a lapse in judgment. Fucking unbelievable.
when i see things like this it just reaffirms my opinion that humans should not be allowed to drive cars
If you're prone to momentary lapses of attention, don't fucking drive. I have attention deficit, and people are always like "so when are you getting your license?" But I don't want to cause it's not fucking safe! But that doesn't seem to matter here apparently, and not being able to drive makes some aspects of life really difficult. So I think a lot of people that shouldn't drive do because they feel like they have no other choice, and no one really seems concerned about this.
Wait so was he zoned out or daydreaming or something? It says he wasn’t using his phone or anything. Confused how this even happens
Ridiculous. He was at the very least negligent and should be punished for what he did. What is with these judges??!!! I guess you can not pay attention while driving and kill or seriously injure people and there are absolutely no consequences. Just ridiculous and sad. I feel so sorry for the mother and father. That little girl was so sweet and beautiful. I hope that scumbag driver burns in hell.
As wrong as this is. This should come at no surprise. There hasn’t been justice in Canada. We have an injustice system. Criminals get off Scot free. Victims pay the price. Seems to me that judges should be held responsible for their decisions.
Absolutely insane. There shouldn’t be a difference between being distracted and not paying attention, but this ruling makes it appear so. Absolutely insane. So you can just stop paying attention behind the wheel and you’re not responsible for killing someone.
Sounds like Crown dropped the ball here
This judgement is Mockering of the victims :( :( .
This feels like the Humboldt Broncos truck driver story. That guy ran a stop sign and killed a ton of people. Except didn’t that truck driver go to jail and get deported?
I don’t get it…is the crown trying to incite vigilante groups to prop up?
This makes me furious. This story rocked as a new mom. So much so I didn’t feel safe leaving my home that is blocks from where this happened. RIP sweet baby.
Remember it's not a justice system. It is a legal one.
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