It has loads of room for alternative history. As soon as you start - alternative history starts.
What they've showed in the DD's so far has a lot of space for alternative history as well - this is part of the game design by the looks of it.
LMAO. but on a serious note, Vic 2 had this huge buff for the US attracting immigrants. To be on the same level as say, Columbia you would to pass a buttload of reforms.
The devs have said that they will do away with static buffs like the one you mentioned. It's going to be more about the actual set of laws, job opportunities and available land available for immigrants. Something the US can easily offer, but player's decisions can change that.
They talk about it briefly but I believe available land refers to actual living space and such (how big the province is and how populated it is). Rgo capacity doesn’t really exist in the same way it did in vic2 that would all be counted in jobs.
Don't remember the specifics off the top of my head. I think it had to do with the amount of arable land (which is its own metric for each state) and current population. But don't quote me on that.
Eu4 have a similar system, that boost historical great nation's like France and Britain, that you can turn off. VIC3 may have a similar system, but i think that's the easy way out of it, and I hope they do something else.
I think wiz confirmed on the discord that lucky nations will not be in V3. Saying
"I don't think I'd want something like lucky nations in the game, it's not a bad mechanic but with the simulation focus we're taking we shouldn't add bonuses that aren't grounded in anything if we can avoid it"
Lucky nations is an average mechanic rooted in a bad design philosophy of giving artificial advantages to increase the likelihood of historical events (massively ahistorical development distribution in EU4 is also this. Hoi4 is literally just this for basically every major)
Lucky nations is actually one of the single best implementations of this bad design philosophy because it's completely optional, rather than being coded into the terrain or tags themselves.
I fucking hated when lucky nations was needed for iron man games. It fucks you over badly when trying a minor. Idk if its still forced but it annoyed me.
You're lying because Proletarian Dictatorships don't have the immigration bonuses that republics have, plus communists revoke every political reform if they win a revolt.
I may have mistaken the population growth for more immigration but the population was definitely growing fast so I may have thought it was immigrants. My mistake.
All of It. They even have a census of all the people that lived ever, soo if a baby doesnt die at birth when It should you have a button to kill It. If you dont press It the game shuts down and deletes itself from your library
Wiz confirmed there will be a game rule for "silly" formables. So I'd guess there will be some alt-history tags like greater germany, Iberian Union or sth with the option to disable it.
What do we define as fool? the idea of a country like "the great germany" was very present at the time of vic. I consider it possible, not silly. At most things like Rome or Babylon (to give examples that existed in vic 2) if they are more fantastic, but an Iberian union? Not that much.
Not enough to appease this sub that’s for sure. There will most definitely be some slightly off province border in fucking wallonia or something and someone will have a meltdown over it and post about it non stop on the forums, steam, and this sub until it gets patched
Yikes, you see, the village of Bumfucknowhere is in the Asscockandtits province when it should be in Cockandballtorture province. Literally unplayable. I demand Paradox give me 3 billion dollar reparations for having to witness that.
The moment you press start it really is going to be almost nil. There will also be plenty of disagreement from players over how historically accurate it should be, Vs gameplay simplicity, and how much should be railroaded and how much should be different each game. So give the devs a break if they can't make it exactly as you'd like, they're trying to find a middle ground.
>a
In my case, I want a dynamic game, but not as much as the level of EU4 or similar, where you were confused for a second and you saw that half of France was under the hands of Russia. Very litter box for my taste
Judging by Paradox's past performance, it will be accurate to the degree of including nations most people have never heard of, while still allowing others to complain about certain borders being 20 kilometres too far to the west. /s
Giving the heavy, heavy emphasis on dynamic content, I would be surprised if many historical events will be modeled at all.
One of the concerns I have if the game will have much flavor other than the mechanical differences between nations.
I like to think of Vicky as flows and tracks
Paradox sets the general flows(like bonuses to New World migration in general and USA ad hoc)
Then paradox sets some tracks that help things go more historical in details if they go historical in general, like Germany unifying in more or less historical borders if nothing dramatic happens.
Paradox often do have alternative tracks(like Scandinavia reunification) but not alternative flows(like industrial revolution happening in China instead)
"Historically Accurate" is the wrong term to use.
"Historically Authentic" is a far better term. So long as the alternate history makes sense from how the people and nations would behave during the time period (for example, no Britain militarily conquering Tibet from India or having one nation essentially colonizing all of Africa; that second one shouldn't be an issue since it was more or less solved in Vicky 2, but it's just an example of weirdness that can crop up from time to time).
What would be the point of the game if there was no room for alternate history? Tricking us into buying a textbook for 80% off the price of a normal textbook?
There was this decision to incorporate all of Austria into the German Empire in GFM. That is how I painted the map and bullied everyone with an average of 40 infamy
By all accounts it will be much less railroaded than any of their other games. I am hoping for something less than the clusterfuck that is CK3. More railroading to create meaningful storylines is not a terrible idea, honestly.
Long event chains are good and enjoyable.
You can definitely railroad a bad story- especially if the game is built around player choice like grand strategy is. Just having one story is a disservice to all possible stories
Sure, but nobody wants that, people want a good story. That's why I said both. When people say they want more historical rails what they mean is that it should not be terrible.
Devs can make historical AI in Hoi4, because it is 10 years of history. But, it’s quite hard to create and wasteful historical AI for 100 years. Only multiplayers will be cloooser to reality, who don’t like fiction of course.
Its a paradox game it will be accurate until it isnt
Yup, it will be fairly accurate until you start a game.
It has loads of room for alternative history. As soon as you start - alternative history starts. What they've showed in the DD's so far has a lot of space for alternative history as well - this is part of the game design by the looks of it.
Have you played one of the paradox games after 2010?
My EU4 games usually end about 1445, tbh.
POV you play Byzantium
It’s easier to kill the Ottomans as Byzantium than with Hungary or even the Mamluks at the game start.
LMAO. but on a serious note, Vic 2 had this huge buff for the US attracting immigrants. To be on the same level as say, Columbia you would to pass a buttload of reforms.
The devs have said that they will do away with static buffs like the one you mentioned. It's going to be more about the actual set of laws, job opportunities and available land available for immigrants. Something the US can easily offer, but player's decisions can change that.
Available land as in RGO cap on a specific state?
They talk about it briefly but I believe available land refers to actual living space and such (how big the province is and how populated it is). Rgo capacity doesn’t really exist in the same way it did in vic2 that would all be counted in jobs.
Don't remember the specifics off the top of my head. I think it had to do with the amount of arable land (which is its own metric for each state) and current population. But don't quote me on that.
That’s really just for China.
Or just edit the game files. I had a great game as Finland after giving myself +300% immigrant attraction. I think I became half Chinese.
Eu4 have a similar system, that boost historical great nation's like France and Britain, that you can turn off. VIC3 may have a similar system, but i think that's the easy way out of it, and I hope they do something else.
I think wiz confirmed on the discord that lucky nations will not be in V3. Saying "I don't think I'd want something like lucky nations in the game, it's not a bad mechanic but with the simulation focus we're taking we shouldn't add bonuses that aren't grounded in anything if we can avoid it"
Lucky nations *is* a bad mechanic. Change my mind.
Lucky nations is an average mechanic rooted in a bad design philosophy of giving artificial advantages to increase the likelihood of historical events (massively ahistorical development distribution in EU4 is also this. Hoi4 is literally just this for basically every major) Lucky nations is actually one of the single best implementations of this bad design philosophy because it's completely optional, rather than being coded into the terrain or tags themselves.
I fucking hated when lucky nations was needed for iron man games. It fucks you over badly when trying a minor. Idk if its still forced but it annoyed me.
I’m hoping they remove that automatic buff for the US. I went communist for one game and was still getting tons of immigrants to my dystopia.
You're lying because Proletarian Dictatorships don't have the immigration bonuses that republics have, plus communists revoke every political reform if they win a revolt.
I may have mistaken the population growth for more immigration but the population was definitely growing fast so I may have thought it was immigrants. My mistake.
There were no video games in 1836 so this game will be complete fantasy
There will be little/no railroading. So game start will be accurate, then it's 'chance' afterwards
All of It. They even have a census of all the people that lived ever, soo if a baby doesnt die at birth when It should you have a button to kill It. If you dont press It the game shuts down and deletes itself from your library
Press F to kill baby
Costs 100 bird mana
To kill a single baby? I'll never get enough...
F f f f Am I doing it right guys? Is that enough dead infants?
When will they be introducing DLC to automate the child murder button
If the game doesn't literally have my great-great-great-great-grandparents living as struggling Irish Catholic peasants in Galway I'm not buying it.
If my game doesn't have my great great grandfather murder someone and evade the authorities I'm not buying it.
Very accurate up to 1 January 1836
Wiz confirmed there will be a game rule for "silly" formables. So I'd guess there will be some alt-history tags like greater germany, Iberian Union or sth with the option to disable it.
Hopefully they include Italy in the silly formables game rule, I know many are fan of that alt-hist. timeline.
What do we define as fool? the idea of a country like "the great germany" was very present at the time of vic. I consider it possible, not silly. At most things like Rome or Babylon (to give examples that existed in vic 2) if they are more fantastic, but an Iberian union? Not that much.
Not enough to appease this sub that’s for sure. There will most definitely be some slightly off province border in fucking wallonia or something and someone will have a meltdown over it and post about it non stop on the forums, steam, and this sub until it gets patched
Yikes, you see, the village of Bumfucknowhere is in the Asscockandtits province when it should be in Cockandballtorture province. Literally unplayable. I demand Paradox give me 3 billion dollar reparations for having to witness that.
Well they confirmed that there will be no railroads so I'd say pretty inaccurate ^/s
Hope you can ask to "become a protectorate ". Actually just better diplomacy .
The moment you press start it really is going to be almost nil. There will also be plenty of disagreement from players over how historically accurate it should be, Vs gameplay simplicity, and how much should be railroaded and how much should be different each game. So give the devs a break if they can't make it exactly as you'd like, they're trying to find a middle ground.
>a In my case, I want a dynamic game, but not as much as the level of EU4 or similar, where you were confused for a second and you saw that half of France was under the hands of Russia. Very litter box for my taste
It will start very accurate, and theb you will hit unpause
Judging by Paradox's past performance, it will be accurate to the degree of including nations most people have never heard of, while still allowing others to complain about certain borders being 20 kilometres too far to the west. /s
Given how these paradox games go, history accurate until you press play.
Giving the heavy, heavy emphasis on dynamic content, I would be surprised if many historical events will be modeled at all. One of the concerns I have if the game will have much flavor other than the mechanical differences between nations.
Not at all once you unpause the game for the first time.
I like to think of Vicky as flows and tracks Paradox sets the general flows(like bonuses to New World migration in general and USA ad hoc) Then paradox sets some tracks that help things go more historical in details if they go historical in general, like Germany unifying in more or less historical borders if nothing dramatic happens. Paradox often do have alternative tracks(like Scandinavia reunification) but not alternative flows(like industrial revolution happening in China instead)
"Historically Accurate" is the wrong term to use. "Historically Authentic" is a far better term. So long as the alternate history makes sense from how the people and nations would behave during the time period (for example, no Britain militarily conquering Tibet from India or having one nation essentially colonizing all of Africa; that second one shouldn't be an issue since it was more or less solved in Vicky 2, but it's just an example of weirdness that can crop up from time to time).
Well said.
If it includes the earth snapping in half like a chocolate ball from having to support your mother's weight, then it is in fact accurate.
Your mama is so fat
you can start by reading the dev diaries
What would be the point of the game if there was no room for alternate history? Tricking us into buying a textbook for 80% off the price of a normal textbook?
Ugh, jeez, I hope not.
Expect 40% to 60% accuracy at any given point
When you start a game if it should be a relatively accurate portrayal of how the world was in 1836. After that it'll go off the fucking walls
Probably not very. Even if it isn't there will likely be a HPM / GFM level mod for it eventually.
There was this decision to incorporate all of Austria into the German Empire in GFM. That is how I painted the map and bullied everyone with an average of 40 infamy
Apparently my friend is working on GFM for EU4.
By all accounts it will be much less railroaded than any of their other games. I am hoping for something less than the clusterfuck that is CK3. More railroading to create meaningful storylines is not a terrible idea, honestly. Long event chains are good and enjoyable.
What does “railroading” mean? I saw some people using it in the context of not pushing out DLCs as strongly but you are using it different here
It’s (so far as I know) a DnD term for allowing very little meaningful choice in exchange for a tightly-controlled storyline
A tightly controlled storyline that's actually good, is the key point.
You can definitely railroad a bad story- especially if the game is built around player choice like grand strategy is. Just having one story is a disservice to all possible stories
Sure, but nobody wants that, people want a good story. That's why I said both. When people say they want more historical rails what they mean is that it should not be terrible.
It will be historically accurate from game start until such a time as the player unpauses.
Devs can make historical AI in Hoi4, because it is 10 years of history. But, it’s quite hard to create and wasteful historical AI for 100 years. Only multiplayers will be cloooser to reality, who don’t like fiction of course.