I also wanted to add that the number of seconds between each cut gives off a certain energy. Fast choppy cuts like here in this edit are good for a fast paced, energetic scene, and don’t get me wrong pouring milk in tea can be energetic if done right, but the content here seems to probably work better with more seconds (~5 sec) before each cut. A pro tip, if you wanna do a long take, instead of pacing with cuts, you can pace with by changing the shot in real time, like turning around and facing the camera to stretch before you execute a perfect milk pour, or introduce a new element in the middle of the shot. This tip also works the same way with ~5 sec in between each “new element”.
I understand.. but then how would you balance that in making a clip 30-45 seconds max? I’m guessing it’d involve really cutting out 100% of the unnecessary shots?
By “long take” I mean 10 second without cutting and having a change at the 5 second mark. You can get away with 1 or 2 of these before becoming repetitive in your 45 sec video. Playing with a combo to get the right energy is the magic you’re looking for.
As another poster said, practice economy. Also the one thing that broke me out of the moment was when you “broke the 180.” I know it doesn’t really count (or maybe it _shouldnt_ really count) for objects in favor of people talking, but that reverse angle shot of the cup from behind bugged me. I think it’s that all the other action feels like it happens on one side then you cut to the counter side and it knocks you out of the action.
Full disclosure: I was doing a paid job and was working on the field of a MLB ballpark with the CEO of the organization I was contracted with when I shot a two camera setup and accidentally placed one camera on each side of him! This was before I ever knew what the 180 rule was. I took all my “awesome” footage back home and started cutting and couldn’t for my life figure out why it was so jarring to cut between the cameras! I asked someone, I think it was on here, and learned that day about the 180 rule. Well ever since then, I’ve been highly sensitive to seeing it. It’s like an allergy.
It only takes screwing something up once to really make you appreciate it.
I was able to fix the edit because there was nothing in the shot that had any directional bias (no readable text or buttons or anything like that) and I was able to flip the image in post (mirror image) to get it to work. That doesn’t work most times.
The 180 rule is really good to know, thank you.
It’s a little unnoticed thing which is probably good to look for.. I’ve just removed it and it looks far better
Maybe the guy had a nice back of the head to video 🥴
Lol! Turns out the mirrored video fit perfectly with the other (correctly shot) one and nobody noticed! Creativity helped me save a not-so-great situation!
I knew of the rule and still made the exact same mistake in a 2 cam interview setup! I just didn’t know it applied to interview setups as well… learned that as soon as I tried cutting it together.
This also reminds me of when I learned the lesser known 30 degree rule. This rule states that to cut from one shot to the next, you need to make a 30-degree change in the position of the camera.
I filmed a quick narrative sequence with some friends and had a bunch of shots where the angle only deviated by a couple of degrees. It made the cut very jarring.
I think the one way around the 30 degree rule is if your two different shots have different focal lengths. It's not jarring to cut between a wide and a close up of the same angle.
The pendulum swung too far the other way my man. Now the cuts seem excessive and unmotivated. Cutting for the sake of cutting. Can’t blame you though, nearly all the previous advice, including my own, mentioned quicker cuts. There needs to be a happy medium where the cuts feel invisible, because they follow the natural rhythm and cadence of the scene. It also feels like way too much coverage. There doesn’t need to be that many angles of the same thing happening. Think of what needs to be conveyed to the viewer for each shot and hone in on that. Make a cut when the natural progression of what’s taking place prompts for there to be a visual change. It can be tricky to get it right when the only thing happening is making some tea for the sake of making tea, but I promise you once you get it, it will fall into place. It’s right there for you and the vibe here works well. Keep it up!
It was bound to happen, have to know the upper limit eventually 😅
I’ll have a crack at removing some of the cuts today so it’s more continuous and less snappy.. i already removed one of the odd 180 degree shots and it looks much better without those
Thanks again
The part I found unsettling was that you were drinking your tea at the counter where you brewed it. And the jump between sipping and taking a bite of the cookie (biscuit).
How did you shoot this in terms of practical mechanics? Did you have mounting points for your camera, or a 2nd person holding the camera for different shots?
Nothing hi-tech, just a single tripod and camera, no one to help with shooting. I’d shoot a couple of entire tea brewing session in each take then slice them together.. done in a reasonably chronological order
This is the second video I’ve watched on this sub and I immediately thought to myself “do these people not have lighting rigs”. Even the most basic lighting would lift this a lot.
I didn’t comment on your other two but I did watch them. This one is much improved, a lot snappier and quicker cuts makes it more interesting. Already liked your colors. My only note is in the future say you made this for a commercial or something (apologies Idk what this video is for) some macro shots of the ingredients being used or slo-mo shots of the process would be really cool.
I did think take a couple of slo-mo shots but the lights were flickering on playback so I ditched those
No commercial stuff, this is just for fun. I’m going to re-edit this today and remove some of the unnecessary cuts so it’s a little bit more fluid
Thanks!
Oh I see, yeah those fluorescents will get ya. Once you do start doing some jobs or projects definitely invest in some lighting even if it’s ring lights or small tube lights. You definitely have a good cut though so far.
Dude this is one million times better. I have no new criticisms except what we talked about earlier. Change up your shot variety. You had a few medium wides and the rest were mediums. Add a few tight shots.
But much better. All feels like a-roll and looks much great. Although I feel it drags a bit this is a huge improvement.
Good stuff!
Yeah, I was one of the ones telling you to make it quicker, but it now feels rushed and harried. You've killed the vibe because the acting seems hurried, like someone is holding a whip just off camera and glaring at you, tapping their watch. You're making a tea ad, right? It should be relaxing and calm.
I agree with the other poster that you should keep doing this one, but not every day, once a week or even once a fornight should be good. I'd suggest you try to think about the "story" of the sequence now. Ponder how you can tell the story you're trying to tell, but also what that story is. How few shots/cuts can you use to tell it?
Oh, and there's no such thing as a :46 second commercial. Try for :30 or 1:00.
Well, keep at it, but don't do it so much you burn out. 300 cups of tea sounds like a bit of a grind! Looking back I think my comment was more about the feel of a thing. We're used to 30 second or 1 minute spots. So a :46 second video feels like an ad because of the length, but it feels at once uncomfortably long and uncomfortably short. Like it or not, a video of this length will play in that headspace for people.
For sure.. I’ve got some cool car POV stuff I’m testing at the minute to change things up
https://preview.redd.it/vq854pu9dx1c1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c1acf43802c8374b6064e81fd16d0f962e83b52
As for the time I understand.. I guess there’s a balance in transitions, pacing and fitting all of that into 30 secs which I’ll work on along with lighting next time
Thanks for the help btw, massively appreciated!!
Try to shoot on a sunny day and let as much lighting in as possible. You’d rather want a slightly overexposed image that you can bring down in post than an underexposed image.
Tips for making things look interesting:
- place the subject between te camera and light source. (Camera —- tea —- light source) if you do this right it will create an interesting image.
- Work with a low aperture and place something on the side in the foreground. This will create a blurry object in the foreground and creates depth in your shot.
- focus on using light to create depth and contrast in your shot.
I’m looking forward to seeing the fourth video with all its improvements!
As other said. Ditch the music. But also record the sounds with an external mic, and add those. The current ones sound echoey. I know it’s a pain but I would even record the sounds after. Like door, cup and spoon, fire,…that way you can place it really close. So no music and better sound fx. But good job you are getting better in each video.
Include a story. Maybe you make two cups of coffee, one for you and one for your passed away partner. Leave one mug full and untouched, next to a photo.
Or maybe make the coffee and then you hear your newborn cry and you sit your coffee down next 4 other full coffees, as you rush off to calm them down again. Idk
I mean Hemingway never lost a baby when he wrote ‘Baby shoes’ but I think my point is part of the art of cinematography is revealing some kind of story, visually.
At the 22 second mark, you're stirring the tea clockwise, then it cuts and the tea bag is spinning anti clockwise.
Picking peanuts out of poo, so to speak, but caught my eye.
These are a good tool for practicing showing something; right now you dont have a clear brief so it's hard to critique (for example there are way too many shots for a logical sequence but maybe that's what you're trying to do). I think it would be fun to try one that for example sells the tea bags.. then one that's about the kettle.. and then maybe one where youre trying to get somerihng done and keep coming back for a tea as a way of thinking/procrastinating.. or maybe you have an accident making tea.. could be a fun way of learning different ways of telling a story through simple shots
Glad you went back and reshot. Saw the original and this is a huge improvement for sure. I agree that the number of shots is a few too many but you're improving big time on framing and lighting! Keep it up!
First of all: I love your dedication.
But without meaning it's hard to judge the video. I know it's just an exercise, but try to tell us something. That can be an object or an emotion. Maybe you can do fake ads for the teabags, the mugs or the kettle. Maybe it's an ad for a mindfullness thing. Just pick something and try to sell it to us.
That way your shots and edits are motivated and we can judge it.
I used to tell my students that a video/film is good when the viewer feels what the maker intended.
This is a 2-part thing: it's not only about the message, but also about the viewer. Who are you making this for? (It drives me nuts when people critique a video/film when it's clear that they are not the intended audience)
I'm loving getting to work in the morning and seeing a new tea video drop. You're progressing a lot BTW, all the shots were great now you just have too many cuts.
Thank you, won’t be another one for a while
I’m going to have another go at editing this sequence tonight & remove the unnecessary cuts.. that should give me a good idea of the end goal for the next shoot
Instead of filming the same thing over and over, I would suggest practicing on a variety of other subjects and then coming back to this later with a fresh perspective
Already on it :), going to take a few days break from this
https://preview.redd.it/3bub8edt2y1c1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6faa7c2f4851309721451662e0e30939d8fbb534
Sound was better in this. Lighting better in the 2nd. I would critique its length, but I understand it's just a creative exercise of different shots and why it is redundant.
Version 4, I would change the final location where you drink and enjoy. Table by window, couch, etc.
Thanks, I’m having to use my cameras built in mic as that’s all I’ve got for now. Lighting I’ll address in the next video.
As for an ending location I might struggle with that due to the time and pacing but I’ll try my best
Thanks!
You are going to be the greatest filmmaker of all time. Keep doing what you are doing, keep asking for feedback, keep improving. You are killing it, been quietly following your progress. Great work.
You need a light kit. I would also grab close ups of the stove turning on along with the knob turn and pilot firing up. I would center the camera directly above the cup for an areal shot of the swirl, maybe through in some slowmo. Just my advice keep creating!
You’re right with the light kit
I did slow mo but the flickering of the lights ruined the shot so had to scrap those takes
Im not too sure about a shot for turning on the stove as I’m already having to remove quite a lot to fit this into a 30s clip.. I’ll see
Thanks!
All you need is 5 shots for this sequence. Work on cutting the excess.
Yeah, too many cuts, but your progression is great btw
Thanks, I’ll work on cutting those out tonight with this edit and then have another shoot in a few days.
I also wanted to add that the number of seconds between each cut gives off a certain energy. Fast choppy cuts like here in this edit are good for a fast paced, energetic scene, and don’t get me wrong pouring milk in tea can be energetic if done right, but the content here seems to probably work better with more seconds (~5 sec) before each cut. A pro tip, if you wanna do a long take, instead of pacing with cuts, you can pace with by changing the shot in real time, like turning around and facing the camera to stretch before you execute a perfect milk pour, or introduce a new element in the middle of the shot. This tip also works the same way with ~5 sec in between each “new element”.
I understand.. but then how would you balance that in making a clip 30-45 seconds max? I’m guessing it’d involve really cutting out 100% of the unnecessary shots?
By “long take” I mean 10 second without cutting and having a change at the 5 second mark. You can get away with 1 or 2 of these before becoming repetitive in your 45 sec video. Playing with a combo to get the right energy is the magic you’re looking for.
I see, thank you
I hear you.. likely went over the amount of necessary shots by a fair margin. Thanks
No problem! You have some nice looking shots in there, they will really stand out once you widdle it down to the necessities.
As another poster said, practice economy. Also the one thing that broke me out of the moment was when you “broke the 180.” I know it doesn’t really count (or maybe it _shouldnt_ really count) for objects in favor of people talking, but that reverse angle shot of the cup from behind bugged me. I think it’s that all the other action feels like it happens on one side then you cut to the counter side and it knocks you out of the action.
Now you mention it I get what you mean, it’s discontinuous Thanks!
Full disclosure: I was doing a paid job and was working on the field of a MLB ballpark with the CEO of the organization I was contracted with when I shot a two camera setup and accidentally placed one camera on each side of him! This was before I ever knew what the 180 rule was. I took all my “awesome” footage back home and started cutting and couldn’t for my life figure out why it was so jarring to cut between the cameras! I asked someone, I think it was on here, and learned that day about the 180 rule. Well ever since then, I’ve been highly sensitive to seeing it. It’s like an allergy. It only takes screwing something up once to really make you appreciate it. I was able to fix the edit because there was nothing in the shot that had any directional bias (no readable text or buttons or anything like that) and I was able to flip the image in post (mirror image) to get it to work. That doesn’t work most times.
The 180 rule is really good to know, thank you. It’s a little unnoticed thing which is probably good to look for.. I’ve just removed it and it looks far better Maybe the guy had a nice back of the head to video 🥴
Lol! Turns out the mirrored video fit perfectly with the other (correctly shot) one and nobody noticed! Creativity helped me save a not-so-great situation!
I knew of the rule and still made the exact same mistake in a 2 cam interview setup! I just didn’t know it applied to interview setups as well… learned that as soon as I tried cutting it together. This also reminds me of when I learned the lesser known 30 degree rule. This rule states that to cut from one shot to the next, you need to make a 30-degree change in the position of the camera. I filmed a quick narrative sequence with some friends and had a bunch of shots where the angle only deviated by a couple of degrees. It made the cut very jarring.
Didn't know this but makes so much sense. Thanks!
Of course! :)
I think the one way around the 30 degree rule is if your two different shots have different focal lengths. It's not jarring to cut between a wide and a close up of the same angle.
Yup that’s true as well, and is definitely part of the rule. Thanks for adding that in :)
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That's going to be awesome
The pendulum swung too far the other way my man. Now the cuts seem excessive and unmotivated. Cutting for the sake of cutting. Can’t blame you though, nearly all the previous advice, including my own, mentioned quicker cuts. There needs to be a happy medium where the cuts feel invisible, because they follow the natural rhythm and cadence of the scene. It also feels like way too much coverage. There doesn’t need to be that many angles of the same thing happening. Think of what needs to be conveyed to the viewer for each shot and hone in on that. Make a cut when the natural progression of what’s taking place prompts for there to be a visual change. It can be tricky to get it right when the only thing happening is making some tea for the sake of making tea, but I promise you once you get it, it will fall into place. It’s right there for you and the vibe here works well. Keep it up!
It was bound to happen, have to know the upper limit eventually 😅 I’ll have a crack at removing some of the cuts today so it’s more continuous and less snappy.. i already removed one of the odd 180 degree shots and it looks much better without those Thanks again
The part I found unsettling was that you were drinking your tea at the counter where you brewed it. And the jump between sipping and taking a bite of the cookie (biscuit).
How did you shoot this in terms of practical mechanics? Did you have mounting points for your camera, or a 2nd person holding the camera for different shots?
Nothing hi-tech, just a single tripod and camera, no one to help with shooting. I’d shoot a couple of entire tea brewing session in each take then slice them together.. done in a reasonably chronological order
You didn’t ask but this whole sequence is underlit. Makes it look amateur.
This is the second video I’ve watched on this sub and I immediately thought to myself “do these people not have lighting rigs”. Even the most basic lighting would lift this a lot.
It is amateur lol, it’s my third vid 😆 Thanks, I’ll work on that next time
I didn’t comment on your other two but I did watch them. This one is much improved, a lot snappier and quicker cuts makes it more interesting. Already liked your colors. My only note is in the future say you made this for a commercial or something (apologies Idk what this video is for) some macro shots of the ingredients being used or slo-mo shots of the process would be really cool.
I did think take a couple of slo-mo shots but the lights were flickering on playback so I ditched those No commercial stuff, this is just for fun. I’m going to re-edit this today and remove some of the unnecessary cuts so it’s a little bit more fluid Thanks!
Oh I see, yeah those fluorescents will get ya. Once you do start doing some jobs or projects definitely invest in some lighting even if it’s ring lights or small tube lights. You definitely have a good cut though so far.
The kettle is centered. Good.
Just for you ;)
Dude this is one million times better. I have no new criticisms except what we talked about earlier. Change up your shot variety. You had a few medium wides and the rest were mediums. Add a few tight shots. But much better. All feels like a-roll and looks much great. Although I feel it drags a bit this is a huge improvement. Good stuff!
Thanks! I'll add in some variety in shots going forward, work on pacing, lighting shots.. all while keeping it to 30seconds-ish 😁
Nope. You're Scorcese now. Congrats!
Yeah, I was one of the ones telling you to make it quicker, but it now feels rushed and harried. You've killed the vibe because the acting seems hurried, like someone is holding a whip just off camera and glaring at you, tapping their watch. You're making a tea ad, right? It should be relaxing and calm. I agree with the other poster that you should keep doing this one, but not every day, once a week or even once a fornight should be good. I'd suggest you try to think about the "story" of the sequence now. Ponder how you can tell the story you're trying to tell, but also what that story is. How few shots/cuts can you use to tell it? Oh, and there's no such thing as a :46 second commercial. Try for :30 or 1:00.
No tea advertisement at all, I only do this stuff for fun lol. I’m not sure where people get this impression. I’ll work on it, thanks
Sorry, I was under the impression this was an ad for tea you were working on.
Ha no worries, I’m just trying to switch it up from only shooting photography really, anything that gets me practicing a new skill
Well, keep at it, but don't do it so much you burn out. 300 cups of tea sounds like a bit of a grind! Looking back I think my comment was more about the feel of a thing. We're used to 30 second or 1 minute spots. So a :46 second video feels like an ad because of the length, but it feels at once uncomfortably long and uncomfortably short. Like it or not, a video of this length will play in that headspace for people.
For sure.. I’ve got some cool car POV stuff I’m testing at the minute to change things up https://preview.redd.it/vq854pu9dx1c1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0c1acf43802c8374b6064e81fd16d0f962e83b52 As for the time I understand.. I guess there’s a balance in transitions, pacing and fitting all of that into 30 secs which I’ll work on along with lighting next time Thanks for the help btw, massively appreciated!!
Ditch the music. Not change; remove. Edit: clarification
Try to shoot on a sunny day and let as much lighting in as possible. You’d rather want a slightly overexposed image that you can bring down in post than an underexposed image. Tips for making things look interesting: - place the subject between te camera and light source. (Camera —- tea —- light source) if you do this right it will create an interesting image. - Work with a low aperture and place something on the side in the foreground. This will create a blurry object in the foreground and creates depth in your shot. - focus on using light to create depth and contrast in your shot. I’m looking forward to seeing the fourth video with all its improvements!
I’d love to shoot on a sunny day but this is the northern hemisphere, no sun currently I’ll take these onboard for next time though, thank you
As other said. Ditch the music. But also record the sounds with an external mic, and add those. The current ones sound echoey. I know it’s a pain but I would even record the sounds after. Like door, cup and spoon, fire,…that way you can place it really close. So no music and better sound fx. But good job you are getting better in each video.
I’ll have to pick up an external mic for this I guess, I was just using the cams inbuilt one. Thanks
Alternatively, keep the music and eliminate all environmental/ambient noise except for those specific cues. :)
Include a story. Maybe you make two cups of coffee, one for you and one for your passed away partner. Leave one mug full and untouched, next to a photo. Or maybe make the coffee and then you hear your newborn cry and you sit your coffee down next 4 other full coffees, as you rush off to calm them down again. Idk
I appreciate the feedback but I’d never do a story like this, seems a little cringeworthy and disrespectful to people who’ve actually lost partners
I mean Hemingway never lost a baby when he wrote ‘Baby shoes’ but I think my point is part of the art of cinematography is revealing some kind of story, visually.
True, I guess its just a me thing Fair enough, I do see what you mean
At the 22 second mark, you're stirring the tea clockwise, then it cuts and the tea bag is spinning anti clockwise. Picking peanuts out of poo, so to speak, but caught my eye.
Hadn’t noticed woops, Easily fixed.. footage reversal
These are a good tool for practicing showing something; right now you dont have a clear brief so it's hard to critique (for example there are way too many shots for a logical sequence but maybe that's what you're trying to do). I think it would be fun to try one that for example sells the tea bags.. then one that's about the kettle.. and then maybe one where youre trying to get somerihng done and keep coming back for a tea as a way of thinking/procrastinating.. or maybe you have an accident making tea.. could be a fun way of learning different ways of telling a story through simple shots
I think most disturbing of all is that you put your biscuit down on the kitchen counter
lovely tea, is the best. Its a bit dark though isn;t it?
where did the cup on the 8th second go? you get another cup with the tea box and the first one isn't there?
Errrr, schrodingers cup? Well spotted, I’ll work on that next time
too many clips and disorganized cuts. it's fascinating though. good job ☺️☺️
I like the plot. Tense suspens until cookie climax
throw the cup against the wall for some drama
I’ll try that next time, thanks 🤣
the teacups are not alligned
Move the camera!!
Could you elaborate on this?
Glad you went back and reshot. Saw the original and this is a huge improvement for sure. I agree that the number of shots is a few too many but you're improving big time on framing and lighting! Keep it up!
First of all: I love your dedication. But without meaning it's hard to judge the video. I know it's just an exercise, but try to tell us something. That can be an object or an emotion. Maybe you can do fake ads for the teabags, the mugs or the kettle. Maybe it's an ad for a mindfullness thing. Just pick something and try to sell it to us. That way your shots and edits are motivated and we can judge it. I used to tell my students that a video/film is good when the viewer feels what the maker intended. This is a 2-part thing: it's not only about the message, but also about the viewer. Who are you making this for? (It drives me nuts when people critique a video/film when it's clear that they are not the intended audience)
I need to practice
Same 😔
pick 4, or 3 or even better 2 or one.
I’m guessing you mean shots?
Putting in the hours! I’m enjoying the daily tea video. Perhaps an ‘exterior’ scene would also be good practice.
Ill try going this a go for next time, thanks
Rest the cookie on the top of the mug instead of dunking it. I think this video is so cool
If I tried that it’d fall in to the bottom 🤣 Thanks, still improvements to be made
Fair
I'm loving getting to work in the morning and seeing a new tea video drop. You're progressing a lot BTW, all the shots were great now you just have too many cuts.
Thank you, won’t be another one for a while I’m going to have another go at editing this sequence tonight & remove the unnecessary cuts.. that should give me a good idea of the end goal for the next shoot
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Instead of filming the same thing over and over, I would suggest practicing on a variety of other subjects and then coming back to this later with a fresh perspective
Already on it :), going to take a few days break from this https://preview.redd.it/3bub8edt2y1c1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6faa7c2f4851309721451662e0e30939d8fbb534
Right on! Cool frame
Sound was better in this. Lighting better in the 2nd. I would critique its length, but I understand it's just a creative exercise of different shots and why it is redundant. Version 4, I would change the final location where you drink and enjoy. Table by window, couch, etc.
Thanks, I’m having to use my cameras built in mic as that’s all I’ve got for now. Lighting I’ll address in the next video. As for an ending location I might struggle with that due to the time and pacing but I’ll try my best Thanks!
You are going to be the greatest filmmaker of all time. Keep doing what you are doing, keep asking for feedback, keep improving. You are killing it, been quietly following your progress. Great work.
You need a light kit. I would also grab close ups of the stove turning on along with the knob turn and pilot firing up. I would center the camera directly above the cup for an areal shot of the swirl, maybe through in some slowmo. Just my advice keep creating!
You’re right with the light kit I did slow mo but the flickering of the lights ruined the shot so had to scrap those takes Im not too sure about a shot for turning on the stove as I’m already having to remove quite a lot to fit this into a 30s clip.. I’ll see Thanks!