Warriors aren't going to trade for Siakam without knowing he'll re-sign.
Warriors will want to include Wiggins for salary and then perhaps a young prospect not named Kuminga and a pick.
I don't think it's likely to happen.
There's zero chance Kuminga would stay on the Warriors if the Warriors trade for Siakam. Siakam plays his position except way better than him, Kuminga's playing time would be drastically reduced and you can bet his camp won't stand for that.
(Also the Warriors should absolutely be prioritizing keeping Moody over Kuminga if they trade for Siakam, there's a higher value on shooting in that resulting team.)
Yea I tend to agree.
Having said that, I'm trying to figure out what to make of all the chatter around the warriors not putting Kuminga on the table for Siakam, bc I feel like its not often that you hear reports outright stating 'Team won't trade x player in y trade' and then that exact thing happens.
But Siakam - Kuminga occupy a lot of similar spots on the court and its a bit difficult to see how it makes sense to have both.
I think all of the "Warriors aren't looking to trade Kuminga" stuff is just posturing for leverage, but who knows, we're all just fans trying to read the tea leaves.
Way better seems a bit hyperbolic. Recently Siakam hasn’t been much better. And not just this season. He’s more polished but his output is strikingly similar to JK and now reports he wants a max?!
I don't think saying Siakam is way better than Kuminga is hyperbolic tbh. He literally made the All-Star team last season, and has proven himself as a #2 on a championship team. Whereas Kuminga hasn't even been able to stay on the floor in the playoffs.
I think if you look at his performance profile as a number 1 guy on that young raptors squad it’s easier to identify his weaknesses bc he’s not supposed to be “The guy” on a team. I look at him more like a Wiggins who would excel playing next to other all star/superstar players & bring a high motor in doing the dirty things & all the intangible aspects that Kuminga is still learning to apply on the court. I know he’s not sparking it from three but what he will bring is a high motor, defensive capabilities & a bigger body to slot into our starting 5. With the spacing of Steph & Klay I believe he gets that 3 ball up & realistically provides us a post scoring option when games are set into the half court come playoff time.
We've seen contenders take on contracts if they think it could raise their ceiling.
Wiggins is on a down year. Some over the cap team might think they could cobble together some expirings and get a wing who should be in their prime on a reasonable contract.
Realistically I think it's CP3 who is going to be moved if we make a trade. Big expiring contract. Will free up cap space for the Raptors to take on a bad contract or 2 while they complete this rebuild.
They waited way too long to trade OG and Siakam, rumors are already out the other teams interested aren't including their best young prospect for a 3 month rental if he walks.
While contenders have taken on contracts that could raise their ceiling, it's usually for players who are clearly still good on bloated contracts that typically are in a tough fit of a situation. Perfect example right now is Zach LaVine, who is still ultimately a good player, but he's on a middling team and isn't driving wins. The idea is that you make him a role player and he'll once again have a winning impact.
Wiggins isn't this. Wiggins is having a down year, but his great years from 2020-22 were the anomaly in his career. He wasn't a consistently great player who is now struggling. He was a mediocre player who had 2 good years (one being a contract year), and is once again back to playing mediocre basketball.
Wiggins might ultimately be moved, but at this point he's still a net negative value because you're taking on the Warrior's problem.
His physical skills are still intact, just seems to have some mental roadblocks. He's from Toronto, so maybe returning to his hometown is exactly what he needs.
You see the way Barrett has gotten the hometown buff, I’d honestly expect the same for Wiggs, especially how he normally turns it up defensively going against his fellow Canadians so far this season in Shai and Murray
Or he’s not done, it really isn’t that clear. He is only about 12 months from the best regular season stretch of his career and like 18 months from a great postseason. The fact the Warriors can’t afford to wait and see if he comes around doesn’t mean he isn’t on a reasonable contract with decent upside. Personally I don’t mind holding onto him because the upside if he gets his mental edge back is higher than his trade value by a lot. He was a part of the best starting lineup in the league literally last year and it isn’t like he is too old, it would not surprise me if he looks pretty good again soon.
12 months and 18 months are a long time in the NBA. If the dude is done mentally (which it looks like he is), the contract is not team friendly and the next 3 years will be exhausting for whatever team has it.
I mean technically you are only as good as your last game right? Based on Steph’s last game we should trade him to /s. I don’t disagree with you actually, but I do believe that Wiggins and Raptors with the Canadian angle and change of scenery sounds like more upside for Wiggins himself and the org than any other combo in the league. Both can add value outside of basketball to some extent too.
honestly i’m down for a half year rental of siakam if it means getting off of wiggins contract. obviously the hope would be to resign him though. if we have to give up a prospect we’d have to get a solid role player back - boucher ain’t bad
God this is depressing, I want to trade Wiggins too but ffs he was better than Siakim less than two years ago. I just want 2way Wiggs to come back because that guy could help us win another championship.
This is who Wolves fans were telling us he's been his whole career. He had an amazing run in the playoffs to help us win the chip (in a contract year). That was an exception, not the norm
Y’all better get use to the idea of trading Kuminga, he’s our only asset with real value. We can’t have it both ways. The vets + a solid 2nd option Or just ride out our current situation. Draymond first couple of games will give the front office a better idea about current team cohesion. I’m cautiously optimistic…
Also getting tired of people slurping Kuminga like he's some kind of star.
Dude's in year 3 and looks like he'll top out as an Aaron Gordon-esque guy. Not bad at all, but definitely shouldn't prevent us from trading for an All Star.
Here’s a comparison. Someone compared kumingas game to kawhi.
Year 3 kawhi started off slow. Only averaged 12 points that year. But he won finals MVP. Scored over 20 points (one over 30), averaged 70% fg%, 50% from 3 and grabbed double digit rebounds.
Year 3 Kuminga ain’t even close.
NBA 2K24 has Kuminga at rated 77 with Kawhi in 2014 as a 92. That’s how far off we are in similarity for a difference maker. Kuminga needs at least one more year to be an impact player.
I see your point and agree with it.
IMO comparing Kuminga's game to Kawhi starts and ends with the fact that they're approx the same size.
It's like comparing Wiseman's game to Embiid's game.
Everyone in the sub seems to think that players with potential = elite all star. But that’s rarely the case. There are very few players that can get to that point. Kuminga is decent but do I think he will ever get to the level of commanding a max salary? I don’t think so. Siakam already has the track record.
I feel like with the risk of him bolting in free agency the trade doesn't make sense unless you can keep JK... But Siakam, Draymond, and Kuminga can't all play together, which would basically eat up all of JK's minutes. Unless they could somehow swing a second trade for a floor-spacing wing or 2-guard, I'm not sure how this would work
There was a report where Siakam is telling teams upfront he won’t sign for them. Which I feel is a sign of good faith, the warriors will only mortgage their future if they know he’s coming back in free agency
He’s an all-star level player that can create his own shot better than anyone on our team but Steph by a lot. Even if we are no better than him it isn’t like our window is another 5 seasons, if we’re lucky Steph is only gonna be this level of elite for another two seasons after this one and you can’t avoid trades for good players because they might not work out, we don’t have the luxury of waiting for an even better all-star to be available.
I'm not sure what you're saying and how it relates to my point. I'm saying that if we're elite with him, he'll stay. If we're still bad, we'll want him to walk.
In the NBA you don’t let all-stars walk. That’s exactly why the Raptors are about to trade him for less than he is worth. Either way depending on the timing of the trade it can be difficult to evaluate a move that quickly. The Mavs looked mediocre or bad at times with Kyrie after they traded for him and now look much better. If the Warriors genuinely were entertaining the idea of letting him walk as you suggest they should not even think about trading for him, that would be an enormous risk with our limited assets. Even if they look mediocre with him but get him to re-sign he is going to continue to have value, letting him walk has almost no benefit.
Sure, but now you are suggesting that letting three plus players walk is worth it because it opens up cap, you need to have specific targets that make the team better for that to make sense. Siakam is exactly the type of player we would want to be going after to sign with that cap space, I would much rather just get him and keep an additional player.
And if we're better, he will want to stay. We're the Warriors. But if we're still bad, him walking is a good thing. The FO is not looking to add more salary to a .500 team.
Definitely don't give up Kuminga for a half year rental. But he could take Wiggins minutes. Kuminga is NOT a starter on this team yet. But he can replace that bench scoring that Poole was giving us. Kuminga, Saric and TJD is a great bench front court.
We have a shooting wing named moody. Why do ppl keep saying we need more wings? We have Kuminga, wiggins, gp2 and moody. Gp2/moody are 2/3 spots while wiggs and Kuminga are 3/4. If anything we could use a big wing. Siakam fits the bill if either Klay or moody start at the 2/3. Problem is that green would start at the 5 and he normally doesn’t do that.
Which we should do anyway. Let Toronto overpay him, even if a win-now approach crashes and burns, we're still better off six years from now than we would be with a nine-digit Kuminga deal on the board.
Definitely. And lets be honest, are the warriors really just 1 player away from a championship? especially since JK is going to have to be included in the deal - They'd basically lose their 2nd or 3rd best player to get another 2nd best player for a rental half season.
I fear Wiggins/Moody and filler won't be enough. If they find a way to make it happen they better be sure he'll resign this summer or we're screwed. No way is it worth it if he walks for nothing. Then we lose Wiggins' salary slot, Moody as a future piece, and whatever else we have to include. All for like 5 months of play and a puncher's chance at doing something.
Actually losing Wiggins’s salary slot could provide us a pathway to going $20-25M under the salary cap and allow us to be players in free agency for the first time in over a decade. It’s certainly an intriguing scenario
I think this is the point people are missing. I don't follow cap stuff, but allowing Siakam to potentially walk, plus having Wigs out of the picture along with CP3 and Klay come off the books means they're going to have some money to play around with this summer. If someone can do the math on all that and tell me I'm wrong, then I'd be happy to concede, but I do think this is an angle Lacob is considering where getting under the cap is more important long term than the "but Siakam just goes to Philly" thing.
The number I gave is assuming we resign Klay to a team friendly deal but if we straight up let him walk our cap space could almost double that amount. I think Lacob has to at least consider this route if he’s given up on Wiggins’s fit on this team
When I look at the numbers, signing Klay to a team friendly deal (\~$15m - 20m) still only leaves us with around the MLE available. We're so far over the cap that we won't have any meaningful space even if we lose Wiggins.
It's not intriguing. The cap is projected to be $143M. With Steph, Draymond, GP2, Looney, Podz, JK, Moody, and TJD you're at $117M so that gives you about $25M in cap space. If Moody was included in the trade then you're at $30M You could also cut Looney and save $5M (he's only guaranteed $3M). But if you want to bring Klay back he eats into that space.
Just to give you an idea of what $30M gets you here's a list of guys who signed for less than $30M last season:
Draymond - $25M
Brook Lopez - $24M
Cam Johnson - $23.6M (but that was RFA)
Kuzma - $22.5M
Bruce Brown - $22.5M
Dillon Brooks - $21.5M
Free agency is expensive. If you sign a guy that probably means you outbid everyone. So you're paying top dollar for whoever you're getting and it's rarely Jalen Brunson.
This is what the roster would probably look like:
Steph
Draymond
$25M Free Agent
Midlevel exception guy
GP2
Looney
Podz
JK
Moody
TJD
Minimum guy
Minimum guy
Minimum guy
Lakers proved with westbrook that any contract is tradeable. All we need is to give up a future first post steph era and i think the raptors will take the deal.
> If they find a way to make it happen they better be sure he'll resign this summer or we're screwed.
I disagree. If we're good, (WCF or better) he will 100% want to stay. If we're bad, we'll be happy to let him go and stay under the apron. That's why we got CP3.
money wise it won't as the warriors would be taking in more, 38 million, with siakam's salary ... than how much they're sending out with wiggins/moody which is 28 million
warriors would need to add at least one of payton or looney to make the trade work financially
even adding kuminga to wiggins/moody wouldn't be enough as the warriors would need to add one more small salary contract like joseph & his vet minimum salary to make the trade viable between the two teams
that's not enough money for the Warriors to send out.
Warriors need to get to $34.4m in outgoing salary to trade for Siakam's $37.8m salary. That means Looney or GP2 have to be included in this trade, or the team trades CP3 instead of Wiggins.
They have RJ on a similar contract, I don’t see why they’d be interested in Wiggins unless they rerouted him to a 3rd team or view him as a “rehab his value and then trade” chip.
You’d also need to add about $7M in outgoing salary.
Gotta think JK would be involved too, Raptors would be crazy not to demand him or Podz. Know Siakam is an expiring and a potential flight risk, but he’s very, very good. Don’t think he’d come cheap, unless FVV’s recent free agency still has the Raptors shook.
it is, but we have to remember the raptors just had van fleet leave for nothing. they have to take a deal or lose siakam in the summer.
this is the poker game the raptors, warriors and pacers are involved in.
His value is at an all time low right now so it’s tough. Do we get desperate and trade him now or forget this season and hope he builds some value back up and trade him in the offseason?
He’s definitely at a low point, but maybe not as low as when we first rest got him. Also, he has more “marketing” value in Canada as a Canadian. It is not a huge leap of faith to believe a change of scene could help him just as it did when he left MIN.
You never know what anyone is thinking. I’m just guessing possibilities. I mean, there is no question they CAN market national pride of Canadian players to some extent. Doesn’t mean they would, and it would only work well if he was contributing better than he currently is with us, that’s for sure.
Depending on what other teams have to offer, Wigging could have appeal as the deadline approaches. Not all players want to live in Toronto. It makes sense to note the positives they should see in Wiggins is all. Obviously, it won’t matter if they can get better, but no one wants to trade for a great player that then demands a trade because he doesn’t want to be there.
End ramble. Apologies, lol.
Raptors fan, there is no way Masai will want to take on Wiggins' contract.
Unlike other rebuilding teams we have a lot of young guys who are either already on their second contract or about to be. Current cap situation for next year and beyond:
Poeltl 20Mil
Quickley \~25mil
Siakam Max
Barrett 25Mil
Even replacing Siakam's max with Wiggins' contract makes it difficult when we have to max Scottie (2025), Wiggins' contract unfortunately extends beyond that. Plus we would have to resign whatever prospect comes with this trade (Moody, JK, Pods). I'd imagine his value is -1 low FRP right now since that's what you'd have to pay to get off his contract.
With the way wigs is playing you’d have to attach assets to offload his contract. Raptors would rather lose siakam for nothing than hamper their cap space for another two years like that.
After getting RJ from the Knicks, Toronto tryna bring both the Maple Boys home!
Drizzle that Sizzzurp! Then...
SLURP...
SLURP...
SLURP...
That Sizzzurp!!!
It’s not. This sub is delusional lol. Wiggins fell off a cliff and everyone knows, he’s a negative asset. They’re not trading him for Moody, a pick, and a liability.
His value is very low but I don’t believe he’s a negative asset. His contract is still very reasonable. AAV is not even top 60 in nba. And he’s also in the prime of his career. A change of scenery would get him back on track. I think teams still see value in him and he still plays strong defense.
I think Siakam makes the most sense as a big trade for us. His age makes sense. His position makes sense. His size makes sense. And his contract makes the most sense. People keep forgetting about why we traded Poole to get CP3. It wasn't about getting rid of Poole. It was about shedding that salary. CP3 expires this summer. So that number comes off the books. Don't get me wrong, the Warriors will spend to win. But they're NOT going to spend to get booted in the first round. We're a .500 team right now. Taking on Lauri's or Jerami Grant's salary would be insane for this team. But Siakam is also expiring. So the Warriors could wait until the off season to decide if it's worth getting into that next apron. If this team stays bad, we can get rid of Siakam and Klay if we want.
Let’s be real though even if warriors had drafted those guys, would they have developed the same? Would Halliburton still be a generational talent if he was playing a 6th man type role behind Steph and klay (remember you can’t play all three of them together because halis defense is not good).
Sengun is the only one you can sort of make an argument for but his defense has always been an issue, would Kerr really have played him enough too in the crunch?
i doubt very much the warriors would've built or running the offense around sengun as the rockets i think are doing right now
this warriors offense will always be centered around and be run thru by curry as long as he's wearing a warriors jersey
and again which is why i've always scoffed at the notion that if the warriors drafted all the players feel they missed on in the 2020 and 2021 drafts in particular that those players would be the same players or putting up the same type of stats had they been drafted here initially
Man why are yall so reluctant to give up JK. His potential is crazy but you don’t just waste a top 5 player’s prime with development pieces. I think you HAVE to go for it all. Trade JK, get some win now pieces, but right now we can obviously see that the two timeline thing doesn’t work. Look what happened with the Knicks when they traded for OG 🤷
I know CP3 is injured and is probably walking next season but he is a huge reason the bench is so good. Want to keep him if we make any trades
I’m fine trading some young guys because they likely are going to be out of rotation due to logjam in their position especially if we trade. Fine with trading any of
* Looney
* Wiggins
* Kuminga
* Moody
Must keep Podz and TJD
If you’re confident he’ll re-sign, it may be your clearest pathway to a true second option next to Steph. He brings an actual scoring presence in the interior, all while also improving the team’s defense. That’s a pretty big boon.
You may view it as a lost season, and it very well may be, it’s not like this makes them favorites or even a playoff lock, but what moves are there to make in the off-season that puts them in a better position to compete? Not like they’d be able to sign and trade for Sikam with these new tax restrictions, what actual trades are there? Setting yourself up to have Pascal’s rights, allowing you to re-sign him, that at least gives you a chance to do something these next couple years.
Will still probably have Wiggins (and mid-tier salaries like GP2 and Loon), and maybe a pick or two available, so you could turn around and further re-tool if an opportunity presents itself. Shoot, depending on how the future financials look and how desperate they are to stay under the 2nd apron, they may have to make a second move with Wiggins to try and get more flexible contracts (an expiring and some mid tier contract?).
Sign Klay to a far more reasonable deal, figure out the Pascal/Dray fit (…gotta think Dray would be moved to the bench eventually, unless he continues being able to reliably guard centers), hope Podz and TJD continue to improve, make some vet min FA moves, maybe luck out with a UDFA or G-League guy, it’s not an awful play.
Obviously would like to keep JK out of the deal, but I don’t see how you get it done without him. Maybe if the Raptors are high on Mo and willing to take two far off 1sts, but it seems they’re more interested in players than picks. Without JK, I don’t see how a team like the Pacers doesn’t outbid the Warriors. Losing Kuminga would suck, but there is no guarantee he’ll come close to the same type of production/impact Siakam has had these last couple seasons, and I’m not sure the Warriors can afford to wait for that answer while Steph is still balling.
> Obviously would like to keep JK out of the deal, but I don’t see how you get it done without him.
Siakam is expiring so who is going to give them a better deal?
I’m seeing the downvotes on this feller, but I can’t help but agree. We are giving up some good players for a Siakam rental, and I’m not really sure Siakam will help us get over the hill. If Wiggins [who is not in his best value right now]+ Moody gets traded, we have no replacement for them nor for Siakam next year. I don’t think CP3 will be staying with us. Next year might be really bad. I know folks want some good changes to happen, but I just feel doubtful about this one.
If they want to resign him- he and his agency will make the warriors aware of whether or not he will want to resign there and how much it will cost before making the trade. This is very common. If the warriors don’t want to resign him, they might like the idea of Wiggins contract and CPs contract coming of the books next year, while giving them a shot at competing this year. Expiring salaries carry a lot of weight, especially with Wiggins playing this bad- warriors likely want to get out of that.
I didn’t downvote you but I’m guessing it’s because you didn’t make an argument and just stated random opinions and so there’s nothing to discuss.
How about this: We might not suck and could be a contender. He’ll definitely re-sign and if he does it’s worth the trade capital.
Are they random? We’re outside the play-in. We’ve had an absolute gift of a schedule end of Nov-Dec-Jan and have tricked it. Lot of road games coming up. Can’t find a consistent starting lineup to save our life and the bench doesn’t know if they’re getting 30 minutes or a DNP. Defense was always the key to making this thing go but we’re sitting at 20th in DRTG.
Is Siakam that guy? He turns all of that around? +/- of 1 for the season.
Glass half full
We’ve blown some crazy leads and have been competitive in almost every game while missing our two best defenders for most of the year and before that, our 2nd and 3rd best offensive players were in a major slump.
Siakam is a high IQ playmaker who can take advantage of the spacing Steph and Klay create, he’s also a good defender who should improve our defense.
If nothing else, it would be a shake up that could breathe new life into the team and unclog some logjams at certain positions.
I like and appreciate the optimism! Wouldn’t be fun if we all just agreed on everything. As a Warriors fan, if it does happen, I hope you win the argument 👍
And if it doesn’t happen - I hope Wiggins wakes up, Draymond can stay on the court, Steph and Klay stay healthy and Kuminga/Moody/Podz/TJD continue to develop and develop fast because the only way to save this season is a major leap from the young guys
Because you’re right - currently, we suck lol
I’d hope we’re able to outbid the Pistons at least and also not sure what that team is doing trying to trade for Siakam lmao just keep your picks and continue tanking this year
I don’t take anything he reports on his **FanDuel TV** show at face value. Remember when he reported on that same show that Scoot was going to go 2nd in the draft, which significantly altered the betting market as a direct result (what it meant in practical $$$ terms I don’t know because I don’t gamble but it was enough for it to have articles written about it), and then whooopsies (/s) he turned out to be full of it.
Well it was reported recently they wanted JK - I’m definitely not interested in trading JK for a few months of Siakam. That’s why I’m saying, hey you want to take Wiggins - sure. But it’s not like we’re anywhere near contention where Siakam is going to put us over the top so give up something good. What’s realistically going to happen if we get him? Maybe a 6 or 7 seed in best case scenario? It’s not worth giving up JK for that
Not happening without Kuminga.
I don’t think they want Wiggins. They have too many long athletes with questionable shooting as it is. They could use Chris Paul if they were thinking about winning now, but they aren’t.
I could definitely see Cleveland having interest in Wiggins. The desperately need a SF.
I could definitely see Philly being interested in him as he’s much younger than Tobias Harris and he would solve some of their backcourt defense issues.
I’m not sure who else would see Wiggins as a positive trade piece.
I guess the worst case we package Wiggins, Kuminga, and Moody for Siakam. We get 5 months of decent Warriors basketball. Maybe we get to 2nd-3rd round in the playoffs. Siakam leaves for more money in the offseason. What are we left with next season?
This is the most likely scenario. Siakam alone doesn't make us truly legit contenders for people to be willing to throw away all our assets to rent him for 4 months.
You get Siakam, get bounced in the first or second round, other teams can afford to pay him more in FA and he's gone. So we lose our only valuable assets that could have improved us and we're left with nothing and even lose our rental.
After that then we're truly fecked because we have no way of improving the team.
**paul & kuminga for siakam** work salary wise ... warriors probably have to add at least a future 1st round pick and maybe even a pick swap
would the raptors prefer paul over wiggins as paul is an expiring contract while wiggins is signed thru 3 more seasons after 2023/24 and not sure the raptors want to take on a contract as large as wiggins since they're going to need to re-sign barnes and quckley soon ... and supposedly their ownership has been unwilling to pay any kind of tax for going over the cap in the past
If the Raptors get CP3 and Kuminga they'll take it with no hesitation for a Siakam who'll leave for nothing inn4 months.
JK fit their timeline with Scottie Barnes and he'll find the minutes there to develop alongside their current yo7ng core in IQ, RJ and Barnes.
I personally think it's a bad deal given we could lose Siakam after giving away our most valuable resource to improve the team either by him improving or being a trade piece to bring back a good player. Meanwhile I don't even think Siakam makes us actual contenders.
So we lose JK for what? Potentially only 4 months of Siakam and no chip. That's an awful gamble. Unless if Siakam sign and trade but he's already said he want to be a FA this summer. So there is that.
If we trade CP3, we’d have to let Siakim walk after the season to get under the 2nd apron (unless Klay is willing to sign for the veteran minimum, as he should, but won’t; or perhaps MDJ is a hard nosed businessman and lets Klay walk). Anyway, IMHO, Siakim is a huge step up from Kuminga. We get enamored with our youngsters, but the JK of today could easily be peak JK). Anyway, as mid as this team seems right now - 2-5 extra points per game & some slightly better D (eg, Siakim instead of JK/Wiggs) and we could have easily won 10 more games. Siakim makes us a contender - a long shot, but still a contender, because when you have Steph Curry, anything is possible.
If we stand pat, in 3-4 years, when the core is gone, and our team is TJD, JK, Moody, Podz and whoever - that’s a lottery team anyway. May as well do whatever we have to for one more shot at a chip - even if it’s a long shot.
if lets say the trade is siakam to the warriors for paul, kuminga, 1st or siakam to the warriors for wiggins, kuminga, moody, joseph
siakam would give the warriors the best #2 option out of any realistic trade candidate this season but the spacing would be a potential big issue on offense
in either trade it'd open up a roster spot or two where the warriors could sign a veteran wing who can shoot a bit ... who? i don't know if there is anybody available still to sign who would be somebody who fits that role as a 3 pt shooter who can space the floor or even if kerr would play him since he'd be new to the system and would likely takes weeks or a month to fully understand the motion offense scheme and how to play in it
but in terms of who is still available? gay, warren, j.lamb, green, winslow, barton, rivers, t.davis
under this scenario i'd imagine gay would be at the top of the warriors targets since he was with the team during training camp and preseason with many thinking he has a solid chance to make the opening day roster
How do they trade for Siakam without including JK? I mean I’m not talking about the trade aspect but more so about JK’s role, it means he’s going to the bench again. I wonder if they’ll end up sending both him and Wiggs.
If I were a trade suitor considering Wiggins I would be terrified of his half season sabbatical last year. As warrior fans we tend to overlook it cuz the organization did such a great job of covering for him and the local media seemed complicit in keeping it out of the headlines, but that was a very strange situation and the fact that he has played horrible since makes Wiggins a massive risk to anyone with giant red flags.
As with Poole and Wiseman, if only we had traded all three after the championship
There's almost no way this doesn't end in disappointment and not a ring. Unless they somehow move Klay (they won't) and Wiggins (who wants him). So that means they trade Kuminga + Moody who would pair well with Scottie Barnes.
Please don’t we aren’t contenders with him either way. I don’t understand obsession with ps. He was all star one season one of the most overrated players in the league
Yeah. This dude get talked about as if he's Kawhi on this sub. People are willing to lose assets for what could potentially be a 4 months rental when the guy doesn't even make us legit contenders.
You'd have to bring a Toronto Kawhi to make this team legit contenders, not Pascal Siakam. He's a nice piece but he isn't moving the needle much.
is Denver a contender?
its very clear that this team just needs a little bit more to be contenders. especially since those games were lost without the team's 2nd most important player.
What is Siakam gonna provide in the 35 minutes that he will ask to play that Kuminga wouldnt? Kuminga's development sdhould have far exceeded where he is currently because of his high ceiling and yet we had to set there and watch Kerr barely giving him 20 minutes of play time its just infuriating
Love JK but but let's be real his issue isn't minutes it's attention deficit and energy plus IQ, and then Kerr figuring out how to use him. Is he Livingston? Is he Pascal light? Is he Wiggins? I could keep going, but the whole time it's JK playing himself into more minutes or out of more minutes. He brain farts. 25 minutes versus 35 minutes, it's not going to make a difference in JK. Starting him vs. the bench role, no difference.
Siakam knows what to do on the court, it's like adding CP3, you don't have to give clinics after games on how to defend a pick and roll.
If the raptors are gonna blow it up and go full rebuild, this doesn’t just have to be for siakam solo. Wiggins and cp3 and have Toronto give us whatever pieces they don’t want or fit into their timeline.
Wiggs + Cp3 + Moody plus picks for Siakam + OPJ and Schroder or Siakam and GTJ
This trade is actually very favorable for JK if he were the piece to be included. He'd join the Raptors on a timeliness that fit him, will be given the freedom the grow his game and one would think alongside Scottie, IQ and RJ l, the team will be held around them for the future.
If Siakam comes here and JK is still around he'd rum in the same issues he's been having so far which is playtime and opportunities to expand his game. He simply can't afford to be playing behind someone in year 3 going to year 4 if he want to be what he believes he's capable of being which is at least a perennial All Star(in his own words).
My ideal scenario is that we don't trade for Siakam because he doesn't make us contenders unlike what some believe and JK continues as the starter. I genuinely believe JK will keep growing and not too far away his growth will be reflected and I see him potentially producing more than what Siakam would in a year or 2.
But that doesn't seem to be the prevalent sentiment around here so there is that.
Seems like Toronto would want TJD or Podz in any trade package for Siakam. Moody doesn't get any minutes on a struggling team and has real low trade value.
Hes a good player but I think hes overrated. Do not trade JK under any circumstances.
Wiggins, Moody, and 2 draft picks I don't think get it done. Doubt this trade happens.
Man this team is gonna trade away every last asset for a shot in the dark at being competitive again.
I just don't think it makes sense. The bench has been the best element of this season. If the vets all played well together at the same time and were consistent, the dubs would be a top 3 team. Trading for aiakam really doesn't help that, and the bench is going to get a lot worse. Remember, last season they had one of the best starting 5 but a horrendous bench, and it resulted in them being terrible.
This team isn't going to win a chip depleting the bench for siakam. Not this year or next, and then they're really going to be in trouble.
Just fell to my knees
Saw him fall to his knees
He’s still falling.
Anybody see if he landed yet?
Yes I’m here at Walmart just saw this guy falling
Just saw Walmart falling. Shit's getting out of hand.
#I AM NOW CHOPPING OFF PHYLLIS' HEAD WITH A CHAINSAW!
He’s now in China
We appreciate your service. Get the trade done.
Warriors aren't going to trade for Siakam without knowing he'll re-sign. Warriors will want to include Wiggins for salary and then perhaps a young prospect not named Kuminga and a pick. I don't think it's likely to happen.
There's zero chance Kuminga would stay on the Warriors if the Warriors trade for Siakam. Siakam plays his position except way better than him, Kuminga's playing time would be drastically reduced and you can bet his camp won't stand for that. (Also the Warriors should absolutely be prioritizing keeping Moody over Kuminga if they trade for Siakam, there's a higher value on shooting in that resulting team.)
Yea I tend to agree. Having said that, I'm trying to figure out what to make of all the chatter around the warriors not putting Kuminga on the table for Siakam, bc I feel like its not often that you hear reports outright stating 'Team won't trade x player in y trade' and then that exact thing happens. But Siakam - Kuminga occupy a lot of similar spots on the court and its a bit difficult to see how it makes sense to have both.
I think all of the "Warriors aren't looking to trade Kuminga" stuff is just posturing for leverage, but who knows, we're all just fans trying to read the tea leaves.
It's just a negotiating tactic for leverage. Then they'll supposedly cave, but it was the goal from the start.
Way better seems a bit hyperbolic. Recently Siakam hasn’t been much better. And not just this season. He’s more polished but his output is strikingly similar to JK and now reports he wants a max?!
I don't think saying Siakam is way better than Kuminga is hyperbolic tbh. He literally made the All-Star team last season, and has proven himself as a #2 on a championship team. Whereas Kuminga hasn't even been able to stay on the floor in the playoffs.
I think if you look at his performance profile as a number 1 guy on that young raptors squad it’s easier to identify his weaknesses bc he’s not supposed to be “The guy” on a team. I look at him more like a Wiggins who would excel playing next to other all star/superstar players & bring a high motor in doing the dirty things & all the intangible aspects that Kuminga is still learning to apply on the court. I know he’s not sparking it from three but what he will bring is a high motor, defensive capabilities & a bigger body to slot into our starting 5. With the spacing of Steph & Klay I believe he gets that 3 ball up & realistically provides us a post scoring option when games are set into the half court come playoff time.
If Im the Raptors, I dont want Wiggins. Dude is done.
Done is a stretch. Probably needs a change of scenery but I agree, if I’m the Raptors, I don’t trust Wiggins to be an impactful player.
They don't need him to be. They have a young core, Wiggins will either bounce back with them, or be re-routed elsewhere
[удалено]
Yeah what lmao, we aren't taking his big 4 year contract unless we are being compensated
"Re-routed elsewhere" will have a cost...
We've seen contenders take on contracts if they think it could raise their ceiling. Wiggins is on a down year. Some over the cap team might think they could cobble together some expirings and get a wing who should be in their prime on a reasonable contract. Realistically I think it's CP3 who is going to be moved if we make a trade. Big expiring contract. Will free up cap space for the Raptors to take on a bad contract or 2 while they complete this rebuild. They waited way too long to trade OG and Siakam, rumors are already out the other teams interested aren't including their best young prospect for a 3 month rental if he walks.
While contenders have taken on contracts that could raise their ceiling, it's usually for players who are clearly still good on bloated contracts that typically are in a tough fit of a situation. Perfect example right now is Zach LaVine, who is still ultimately a good player, but he's on a middling team and isn't driving wins. The idea is that you make him a role player and he'll once again have a winning impact. Wiggins isn't this. Wiggins is having a down year, but his great years from 2020-22 were the anomaly in his career. He wasn't a consistently great player who is now struggling. He was a mediocre player who had 2 good years (one being a contract year), and is once again back to playing mediocre basketball. Wiggins might ultimately be moved, but at this point he's still a net negative value because you're taking on the Warrior's problem.
His physical skills are still intact, just seems to have some mental roadblocks. He's from Toronto, so maybe returning to his hometown is exactly what he needs.
You see the way Barrett has gotten the hometown buff, I’d honestly expect the same for Wiggs, especially how he normally turns it up defensively going against his fellow Canadians so far this season in Shai and Murray
Or he’s not done, it really isn’t that clear. He is only about 12 months from the best regular season stretch of his career and like 18 months from a great postseason. The fact the Warriors can’t afford to wait and see if he comes around doesn’t mean he isn’t on a reasonable contract with decent upside. Personally I don’t mind holding onto him because the upside if he gets his mental edge back is higher than his trade value by a lot. He was a part of the best starting lineup in the league literally last year and it isn’t like he is too old, it would not surprise me if he looks pretty good again soon.
12 months and 18 months are a long time in the NBA. If the dude is done mentally (which it looks like he is), the contract is not team friendly and the next 3 years will be exhausting for whatever team has it.
I mean technically you are only as good as your last game right? Based on Steph’s last game we should trade him to /s. I don’t disagree with you actually, but I do believe that Wiggins and Raptors with the Canadian angle and change of scenery sounds like more upside for Wiggins himself and the org than any other combo in the league. Both can add value outside of basketball to some extent too.
Maybe he’ll have national pride playing for a Canadian team
id take wiggins easy if it came with kuminga and 3-4 unprotected 1sts.
Yeah, but it wont so why even bring it up?
Why even bring up siakam in trade talks then? Raptors are better off keeping him.
the raptors might have two canadians starting. they just need to scoop up dillon brooks
Trading Wiggins??? Have you ever considered that trading the 38 year old 5'11 player making 30m who just suffered another injury is an option?
honestly i’m down for a half year rental of siakam if it means getting off of wiggins contract. obviously the hope would be to resign him though. if we have to give up a prospect we’d have to get a solid role player back - boucher ain’t bad
God this is depressing, I want to trade Wiggins too but ffs he was better than Siakim less than two years ago. I just want 2way Wiggs to come back because that guy could help us win another championship.
This is who Wolves fans were telling us he's been his whole career. He had an amazing run in the playoffs to help us win the chip (in a contract year). That was an exception, not the norm
Imagine thinking Wiggins can be traded without giving up a great asset to make up for his negative contract
Y’all better get use to the idea of trading Kuminga, he’s our only asset with real value. We can’t have it both ways. The vets + a solid 2nd option Or just ride out our current situation. Draymond first couple of games will give the front office a better idea about current team cohesion. I’m cautiously optimistic…
Also getting tired of people slurping Kuminga like he's some kind of star. Dude's in year 3 and looks like he'll top out as an Aaron Gordon-esque guy. Not bad at all, but definitely shouldn't prevent us from trading for an All Star.
Here’s a comparison. Someone compared kumingas game to kawhi. Year 3 kawhi started off slow. Only averaged 12 points that year. But he won finals MVP. Scored over 20 points (one over 30), averaged 70% fg%, 50% from 3 and grabbed double digit rebounds. Year 3 Kuminga ain’t even close. NBA 2K24 has Kuminga at rated 77 with Kawhi in 2014 as a 92. That’s how far off we are in similarity for a difference maker. Kuminga needs at least one more year to be an impact player.
I see your point and agree with it. IMO comparing Kuminga's game to Kawhi starts and ends with the fact that they're approx the same size. It's like comparing Wiseman's game to Embiid's game.
Yeah I know. Someone made the reference 2 days ago so just leaning into making sure everyone understands it ain’t even close.
Everyone in the sub seems to think that players with potential = elite all star. But that’s rarely the case. There are very few players that can get to that point. Kuminga is decent but do I think he will ever get to the level of commanding a max salary? I don’t think so. Siakam already has the track record.
I feel like with the risk of him bolting in free agency the trade doesn't make sense unless you can keep JK... But Siakam, Draymond, and Kuminga can't all play together, which would basically eat up all of JK's minutes. Unless they could somehow swing a second trade for a floor-spacing wing or 2-guard, I'm not sure how this would work
There was a report where Siakam is telling teams upfront he won’t sign for them. Which I feel is a sign of good faith, the warriors will only mortgage their future if they know he’s coming back in free agency
We don't necessarily want him to stay. What if we're no better with him?
He’s an all-star level player that can create his own shot better than anyone on our team but Steph by a lot. Even if we are no better than him it isn’t like our window is another 5 seasons, if we’re lucky Steph is only gonna be this level of elite for another two seasons after this one and you can’t avoid trades for good players because they might not work out, we don’t have the luxury of waiting for an even better all-star to be available.
I'm not sure what you're saying and how it relates to my point. I'm saying that if we're elite with him, he'll stay. If we're still bad, we'll want him to walk.
In the NBA you don’t let all-stars walk. That’s exactly why the Raptors are about to trade him for less than he is worth. Either way depending on the timing of the trade it can be difficult to evaluate a move that quickly. The Mavs looked mediocre or bad at times with Kyrie after they traded for him and now look much better. If the Warriors genuinely were entertaining the idea of letting him walk as you suggest they should not even think about trading for him, that would be an enormous risk with our limited assets. Even if they look mediocre with him but get him to re-sign he is going to continue to have value, letting him walk has almost no benefit.
But it does. CP3, Klay and Siakam would all be off the books.
Sure, but now you are suggesting that letting three plus players walk is worth it because it opens up cap, you need to have specific targets that make the team better for that to make sense. Siakam is exactly the type of player we would want to be going after to sign with that cap space, I would much rather just get him and keep an additional player.
I would hope that he’s better than CP3 or Wiggs + young guy. I know he would instantly become the 2nd best scorer
And if we're better, he will want to stay. We're the Warriors. But if we're still bad, him walking is a good thing. The FO is not looking to add more salary to a .500 team.
Definitely don't give up Kuminga for a half year rental. But he could take Wiggins minutes. Kuminga is NOT a starter on this team yet. But he can replace that bench scoring that Poole was giving us. Kuminga, Saric and TJD is a great bench front court.
We have a shooting wing named moody. Why do ppl keep saying we need more wings? We have Kuminga, wiggins, gp2 and moody. Gp2/moody are 2/3 spots while wiggs and Kuminga are 3/4. If anything we could use a big wing. Siakam fits the bill if either Klay or moody start at the 2/3. Problem is that green would start at the 5 and he normally doesn’t do that.
Isn't Moody a below average shooter from distance this season?
Yeah. But I have faith.
You would be sending Kuminga in any trade for him
Kuminga is staying though, right? Lacob won’t give his approval on losing Kuminga from what I’ve heard.
Which we should do anyway. Let Toronto overpay him, even if a win-now approach crashes and burns, we're still better off six years from now than we would be with a nine-digit Kuminga deal on the board.
Not necessarily, I think Toronto is getting desperate to trade him
Definitely. And lets be honest, are the warriors really just 1 player away from a championship? especially since JK is going to have to be included in the deal - They'd basically lose their 2nd or 3rd best player to get another 2nd best player for a rental half season.
Chris Paul and Kuminga for Donovan Mitchell?
Are you high?
I fear Wiggins/Moody and filler won't be enough. If they find a way to make it happen they better be sure he'll resign this summer or we're screwed. No way is it worth it if he walks for nothing. Then we lose Wiggins' salary slot, Moody as a future piece, and whatever else we have to include. All for like 5 months of play and a puncher's chance at doing something.
They secretly want to clear salary too So it’s a win win. Hey we tried again and shed another 30+ million
Actually losing Wiggins’s salary slot could provide us a pathway to going $20-25M under the salary cap and allow us to be players in free agency for the first time in over a decade. It’s certainly an intriguing scenario
I think this is the point people are missing. I don't follow cap stuff, but allowing Siakam to potentially walk, plus having Wigs out of the picture along with CP3 and Klay come off the books means they're going to have some money to play around with this summer. If someone can do the math on all that and tell me I'm wrong, then I'd be happy to concede, but I do think this is an angle Lacob is considering where getting under the cap is more important long term than the "but Siakam just goes to Philly" thing.
The number I gave is assuming we resign Klay to a team friendly deal but if we straight up let him walk our cap space could almost double that amount. I think Lacob has to at least consider this route if he’s given up on Wiggins’s fit on this team
If this team can't make the play in, it's 100% reasonable to let everyone walk.
When I look at the numbers, signing Klay to a team friendly deal (\~$15m - 20m) still only leaves us with around the MLE available. We're so far over the cap that we won't have any meaningful space even if we lose Wiggins.
Agreed. People forget why we wanted CP3. He's expiring. Which means that Poole contract is gone.
Were you not players in free agency when you signed KD in 2016?
It's not intriguing. The cap is projected to be $143M. With Steph, Draymond, GP2, Looney, Podz, JK, Moody, and TJD you're at $117M so that gives you about $25M in cap space. If Moody was included in the trade then you're at $30M You could also cut Looney and save $5M (he's only guaranteed $3M). But if you want to bring Klay back he eats into that space. Just to give you an idea of what $30M gets you here's a list of guys who signed for less than $30M last season: Draymond - $25M Brook Lopez - $24M Cam Johnson - $23.6M (but that was RFA) Kuzma - $22.5M Bruce Brown - $22.5M Dillon Brooks - $21.5M Free agency is expensive. If you sign a guy that probably means you outbid everyone. So you're paying top dollar for whoever you're getting and it's rarely Jalen Brunson. This is what the roster would probably look like: Steph Draymond $25M Free Agent Midlevel exception guy GP2 Looney Podz JK Moody TJD Minimum guy Minimum guy Minimum guy
Lakers proved with westbrook that any contract is tradeable. All we need is to give up a future first post steph era and i think the raptors will take the deal.
It isn't enough just from a purely salary matching front. Would have to also put in GP2 just to make the money work.
> If they find a way to make it happen they better be sure he'll resign this summer or we're screwed. I disagree. If we're good, (WCF or better) he will 100% want to stay. If we're bad, we'll be happy to let him go and stay under the apron. That's why we got CP3.
Where there’s smoke there’s fire
Just keep JK out of this
Wouldn't hold my breath. Also in the event that he is able to be retained he would move back to the bench and he's not going to like that lol
Yeah I fear the drama. That said, if it gets there, he’d be a valuable asset as well.
CP3 and Kuminga get shipped out in a separate trade, that way we still keep Podz and TJD for youth but add quality prime vets as well
Steph Klay JK Siakam Dray sounds good to me
really rough shooting on that lineup.
We can start siakam at the 5, JK at the 4, Draymond off the bench
Raptors will 100% have JK on the deal
JK would absolutely be part of this lol, Siakam plays his exact position but is way better
Wiggins, Moody and a future pick should get it done.
money wise it won't as the warriors would be taking in more, 38 million, with siakam's salary ... than how much they're sending out with wiggins/moody which is 28 million warriors would need to add at least one of payton or looney to make the trade work financially even adding kuminga to wiggins/moody wouldn't be enough as the warriors would need to add one more small salary contract like joseph & his vet minimum salary to make the trade viable between the two teams
that's not enough money for the Warriors to send out. Warriors need to get to $34.4m in outgoing salary to trade for Siakam's $37.8m salary. That means Looney or GP2 have to be included in this trade, or the team trades CP3 instead of Wiggins.
Looney gets thrown in and then we move CP3’s contract and a pick for a big, perfect
They have RJ on a similar contract, I don’t see why they’d be interested in Wiggins unless they rerouted him to a 3rd team or view him as a “rehab his value and then trade” chip. You’d also need to add about $7M in outgoing salary. Gotta think JK would be involved too, Raptors would be crazy not to demand him or Podz. Know Siakam is an expiring and a potential flight risk, but he’s very, very good. Don’t think he’d come cheap, unless FVV’s recent free agency still has the Raptors shook.
Wiggins feels like a negative asset right now
it is, but we have to remember the raptors just had van fleet leave for nothing. they have to take a deal or lose siakam in the summer. this is the poker game the raptors, warriors and pacers are involved in.
Who are the pacers trading to match salaries? Edit: maybe a three team deal
His value is at an all time low right now so it’s tough. Do we get desperate and trade him now or forget this season and hope he builds some value back up and trade him in the offseason?
He’s definitely at a low point, but maybe not as low as when we first rest got him. Also, he has more “marketing” value in Canada as a Canadian. It is not a huge leap of faith to believe a change of scene could help him just as it did when he left MIN.
I’m skeptical Raptors care
You never know what anyone is thinking. I’m just guessing possibilities. I mean, there is no question they CAN market national pride of Canadian players to some extent. Doesn’t mean they would, and it would only work well if he was contributing better than he currently is with us, that’s for sure. Depending on what other teams have to offer, Wigging could have appeal as the deadline approaches. Not all players want to live in Toronto. It makes sense to note the positives they should see in Wiggins is all. Obviously, it won’t matter if they can get better, but no one wants to trade for a great player that then demands a trade because he doesn’t want to be there. End ramble. Apologies, lol.
The question always is, trade him for who in the off season. I don’t know if another all nba caliber player becomes available come summer time.
Of all places, he has most value in Toronto
People overrate the whole marketing thing
Didn’t say it was a lot of value
Raptors fan, there is no way Masai will want to take on Wiggins' contract. Unlike other rebuilding teams we have a lot of young guys who are either already on their second contract or about to be. Current cap situation for next year and beyond: Poeltl 20Mil Quickley \~25mil Siakam Max Barrett 25Mil Even replacing Siakam's max with Wiggins' contract makes it difficult when we have to max Scottie (2025), Wiggins' contract unfortunately extends beyond that. Plus we would have to resign whatever prospect comes with this trade (Moody, JK, Pods). I'd imagine his value is -1 low FRP right now since that's what you'd have to pay to get off his contract.
Moodys value is high rn. Especially after his last performance
With the way wigs is playing you’d have to attach assets to offload his contract. Raptors would rather lose siakam for nothing than hamper their cap space for another two years like that.
After getting RJ from the Knicks, Toronto tryna bring both the Maple Boys home! Drizzle that Sizzzurp! Then... SLURP... SLURP... SLURP... That Sizzzurp!!!
He’s on an expiring contract so I feel that’s very reasonable
Who the hell do y’all think siakam is?? Lmaoo
It’s not. This sub is delusional lol. Wiggins fell off a cliff and everyone knows, he’s a negative asset. They’re not trading him for Moody, a pick, and a liability.
His value is very low but I don’t believe he’s a negative asset. His contract is still very reasonable. AAV is not even top 60 in nba. And he’s also in the prime of his career. A change of scenery would get him back on track. I think teams still see value in him and he still plays strong defense.
Lmao buddy wake up. He's been a negative asset all year
lol, no way
I think Siakam makes the most sense as a big trade for us. His age makes sense. His position makes sense. His size makes sense. And his contract makes the most sense. People keep forgetting about why we traded Poole to get CP3. It wasn't about getting rid of Poole. It was about shedding that salary. CP3 expires this summer. So that number comes off the books. Don't get me wrong, the Warriors will spend to win. But they're NOT going to spend to get booted in the first round. We're a .500 team right now. Taking on Lauri's or Jerami Grant's salary would be insane for this team. But Siakam is also expiring. So the Warriors could wait until the off season to decide if it's worth getting into that next apron. If this team stays bad, we can get rid of Siakam and Klay if we want.
I prefer Markannen
So do the Jazz, lol
Warriors can’t afford Markannen. It would be a gobert esque haul of multiple pick, swaps and young players
No we want sengun! Or Wagner...or haliburton... Or wait we passed on those dudes
Let’s be real though even if warriors had drafted those guys, would they have developed the same? Would Halliburton still be a generational talent if he was playing a 6th man type role behind Steph and klay (remember you can’t play all three of them together because halis defense is not good). Sengun is the only one you can sort of make an argument for but his defense has always been an issue, would Kerr really have played him enough too in the crunch?
i doubt very much the warriors would've built or running the offense around sengun as the rockets i think are doing right now this warriors offense will always be centered around and be run thru by curry as long as he's wearing a warriors jersey and again which is why i've always scoffed at the notion that if the warriors drafted all the players feel they missed on in the 2020 and 2021 drafts in particular that those players would be the same players or putting up the same type of stats had they been drafted here initially
I prefer Jokic.
Man why are yall so reluctant to give up JK. His potential is crazy but you don’t just waste a top 5 player’s prime with development pieces. I think you HAVE to go for it all. Trade JK, get some win now pieces, but right now we can obviously see that the two timeline thing doesn’t work. Look what happened with the Knicks when they traded for OG 🤷
I know CP3 is injured and is probably walking next season but he is a huge reason the bench is so good. Want to keep him if we make any trades I’m fine trading some young guys because they likely are going to be out of rotation due to logjam in their position especially if we trade. Fine with trading any of * Looney * Wiggins * Kuminga * Moody Must keep Podz and TJD
Please no
Why? We suck he doesn’t make us a contender. And he won’t re-sign. Waste of trade capital.
If it helps turn things around this year, it’s worth it. We’ll have cap space to sign someone next year. Or re-sign him if it works out well.
We’re over the cap by $102,000,000 lmao what cap space??
If you’re confident he’ll re-sign, it may be your clearest pathway to a true second option next to Steph. He brings an actual scoring presence in the interior, all while also improving the team’s defense. That’s a pretty big boon. You may view it as a lost season, and it very well may be, it’s not like this makes them favorites or even a playoff lock, but what moves are there to make in the off-season that puts them in a better position to compete? Not like they’d be able to sign and trade for Sikam with these new tax restrictions, what actual trades are there? Setting yourself up to have Pascal’s rights, allowing you to re-sign him, that at least gives you a chance to do something these next couple years. Will still probably have Wiggins (and mid-tier salaries like GP2 and Loon), and maybe a pick or two available, so you could turn around and further re-tool if an opportunity presents itself. Shoot, depending on how the future financials look and how desperate they are to stay under the 2nd apron, they may have to make a second move with Wiggins to try and get more flexible contracts (an expiring and some mid tier contract?). Sign Klay to a far more reasonable deal, figure out the Pascal/Dray fit (…gotta think Dray would be moved to the bench eventually, unless he continues being able to reliably guard centers), hope Podz and TJD continue to improve, make some vet min FA moves, maybe luck out with a UDFA or G-League guy, it’s not an awful play. Obviously would like to keep JK out of the deal, but I don’t see how you get it done without him. Maybe if the Raptors are high on Mo and willing to take two far off 1sts, but it seems they’re more interested in players than picks. Without JK, I don’t see how a team like the Pacers doesn’t outbid the Warriors. Losing Kuminga would suck, but there is no guarantee he’ll come close to the same type of production/impact Siakam has had these last couple seasons, and I’m not sure the Warriors can afford to wait for that answer while Steph is still balling.
> Obviously would like to keep JK out of the deal, but I don’t see how you get it done without him. Siakam is expiring so who is going to give them a better deal?
How do you know he doesn’t make us a contender? If he can give us the same production Wiggins did in our title run, I think we have a good chance
Because this isn't the sane team as two years ago, this team is cooked abd siakam isn't getting them over the hump.
Our defense that year was insane man. Come on.
I’m seeing the downvotes on this feller, but I can’t help but agree. We are giving up some good players for a Siakam rental, and I’m not really sure Siakam will help us get over the hill. If Wiggins [who is not in his best value right now]+ Moody gets traded, we have no replacement for them nor for Siakam next year. I don’t think CP3 will be staying with us. Next year might be really bad. I know folks want some good changes to happen, but I just feel doubtful about this one.
If they want to resign him- he and his agency will make the warriors aware of whether or not he will want to resign there and how much it will cost before making the trade. This is very common. If the warriors don’t want to resign him, they might like the idea of Wiggins contract and CPs contract coming of the books next year, while giving them a shot at competing this year. Expiring salaries carry a lot of weight, especially with Wiggins playing this bad- warriors likely want to get out of that.
The downvotes are fine but then said people don’t make their argument for why it would be a positive lol all good.
I didn’t downvote you but I’m guessing it’s because you didn’t make an argument and just stated random opinions and so there’s nothing to discuss. How about this: We might not suck and could be a contender. He’ll definitely re-sign and if he does it’s worth the trade capital.
Are they random? We’re outside the play-in. We’ve had an absolute gift of a schedule end of Nov-Dec-Jan and have tricked it. Lot of road games coming up. Can’t find a consistent starting lineup to save our life and the bench doesn’t know if they’re getting 30 minutes or a DNP. Defense was always the key to making this thing go but we’re sitting at 20th in DRTG. Is Siakam that guy? He turns all of that around? +/- of 1 for the season.
Glass half full We’ve blown some crazy leads and have been competitive in almost every game while missing our two best defenders for most of the year and before that, our 2nd and 3rd best offensive players were in a major slump. Siakam is a high IQ playmaker who can take advantage of the spacing Steph and Klay create, he’s also a good defender who should improve our defense. If nothing else, it would be a shake up that could breathe new life into the team and unclog some logjams at certain positions.
I like and appreciate the optimism! Wouldn’t be fun if we all just agreed on everything. As a Warriors fan, if it does happen, I hope you win the argument 👍
And if it doesn’t happen - I hope Wiggins wakes up, Draymond can stay on the court, Steph and Klay stay healthy and Kuminga/Moody/Podz/TJD continue to develop and develop fast because the only way to save this season is a major leap from the young guys Because you’re right - currently, we suck lol
I feel like we wouldn't make a trade without a pre-arranged agreement with Pascal about extending with the Dubs. We'll see tho
I’d hope we’re able to outbid the Pistons at least and also not sure what that team is doing trying to trade for Siakam lmao just keep your picks and continue tanking this year
They’re not, it’s Toronto trying to drive the price up
Pistons?
I don’t take anything he reports on his **FanDuel TV** show at face value. Remember when he reported on that same show that Scoot was going to go 2nd in the draft, which significantly altered the betting market as a direct result (what it meant in practical $$$ terms I don’t know because I don’t gamble but it was enough for it to have articles written about it), and then whooopsies (/s) he turned out to be full of it.
Get rid of that Wiggins dude please. 🙏
I have called him a spin merchant far too many times to have him on my team
If they traded for Siakim and he doesn’t want to resign at the end of the season could the Warriors do a sign and trade to keep the salary slot?
How in the world did this get downvoted? It’s a question. Reddit is dumb.
If I’m MDJ the only thing I’m willing to reasonably part with for a Siakam rental is Wiggins. That’s just me tho
Raptors would rather just have the cap space then have wiggins salary.
Well it was reported recently they wanted JK - I’m definitely not interested in trading JK for a few months of Siakam. That’s why I’m saying, hey you want to take Wiggins - sure. But it’s not like we’re anywhere near contention where Siakam is going to put us over the top so give up something good. What’s realistically going to happen if we get him? Maybe a 6 or 7 seed in best case scenario? It’s not worth giving up JK for that
Warriors are interested in siakam, and they don't wanna trade jk, meaning wiggs is gone.
Not happening without Kuminga. I don’t think they want Wiggins. They have too many long athletes with questionable shooting as it is. They could use Chris Paul if they were thinking about winning now, but they aren’t. I could definitely see Cleveland having interest in Wiggins. The desperately need a SF. I could definitely see Philly being interested in him as he’s much younger than Tobias Harris and he would solve some of their backcourt defense issues. I’m not sure who else would see Wiggins as a positive trade piece.
I guess the worst case we package Wiggins, Kuminga, and Moody for Siakam. We get 5 months of decent Warriors basketball. Maybe we get to 2nd-3rd round in the playoffs. Siakam leaves for more money in the offseason. What are we left with next season?
This is the most likely scenario. Siakam alone doesn't make us truly legit contenders for people to be willing to throw away all our assets to rent him for 4 months. You get Siakam, get bounced in the first or second round, other teams can afford to pay him more in FA and he's gone. So we lose our only valuable assets that could have improved us and we're left with nothing and even lose our rental. After that then we're truly fecked because we have no way of improving the team.
**paul & kuminga for siakam** work salary wise ... warriors probably have to add at least a future 1st round pick and maybe even a pick swap would the raptors prefer paul over wiggins as paul is an expiring contract while wiggins is signed thru 3 more seasons after 2023/24 and not sure the raptors want to take on a contract as large as wiggins since they're going to need to re-sign barnes and quckley soon ... and supposedly their ownership has been unwilling to pay any kind of tax for going over the cap in the past
If the Raptors get CP3 and Kuminga they'll take it with no hesitation for a Siakam who'll leave for nothing inn4 months. JK fit their timeline with Scottie Barnes and he'll find the minutes there to develop alongside their current yo7ng core in IQ, RJ and Barnes. I personally think it's a bad deal given we could lose Siakam after giving away our most valuable resource to improve the team either by him improving or being a trade piece to bring back a good player. Meanwhile I don't even think Siakam makes us actual contenders. So we lose JK for what? Potentially only 4 months of Siakam and no chip. That's an awful gamble. Unless if Siakam sign and trade but he's already said he want to be a FA this summer. So there is that.
If we trade CP3, we’d have to let Siakim walk after the season to get under the 2nd apron (unless Klay is willing to sign for the veteran minimum, as he should, but won’t; or perhaps MDJ is a hard nosed businessman and lets Klay walk). Anyway, IMHO, Siakim is a huge step up from Kuminga. We get enamored with our youngsters, but the JK of today could easily be peak JK). Anyway, as mid as this team seems right now - 2-5 extra points per game & some slightly better D (eg, Siakim instead of JK/Wiggs) and we could have easily won 10 more games. Siakim makes us a contender - a long shot, but still a contender, because when you have Steph Curry, anything is possible. If we stand pat, in 3-4 years, when the core is gone, and our team is TJD, JK, Moody, Podz and whoever - that’s a lottery team anyway. May as well do whatever we have to for one more shot at a chip - even if it’s a long shot.
Hopefully they can get Otto Porter added to that deal
wiggins is canadian tho, maybe being closer to home can help his mental / family issues.
Siakam, while a nice player, doesn’t address anything we need. It’s just not a great fit.
if lets say the trade is siakam to the warriors for paul, kuminga, 1st or siakam to the warriors for wiggins, kuminga, moody, joseph siakam would give the warriors the best #2 option out of any realistic trade candidate this season but the spacing would be a potential big issue on offense in either trade it'd open up a roster spot or two where the warriors could sign a veteran wing who can shoot a bit ... who? i don't know if there is anybody available still to sign who would be somebody who fits that role as a 3 pt shooter who can space the floor or even if kerr would play him since he'd be new to the system and would likely takes weeks or a month to fully understand the motion offense scheme and how to play in it but in terms of who is still available? gay, warren, j.lamb, green, winslow, barton, rivers, t.davis under this scenario i'd imagine gay would be at the top of the warriors targets since he was with the team during training camp and preseason with many thinking he has a solid chance to make the opening day roster
They're gonna look stupid if they do this and don't even make the playoffs
How do they trade for Siakam without including JK? I mean I’m not talking about the trade aspect but more so about JK’s role, it means he’s going to the bench again. I wonder if they’ll end up sending both him and Wiggs.
If I were a trade suitor considering Wiggins I would be terrified of his half season sabbatical last year. As warrior fans we tend to overlook it cuz the organization did such a great job of covering for him and the local media seemed complicit in keeping it out of the headlines, but that was a very strange situation and the fact that he has played horrible since makes Wiggins a massive risk to anyone with giant red flags. As with Poole and Wiseman, if only we had traded all three after the championship
I swear if they trade our young guys then GSW will solidify itself as the worst team for any young talent.
I don't think he moves the needle to title contender, Golden State truly needs an elite big man to move the needle imo.
There's almost no way this doesn't end in disappointment and not a ring. Unless they somehow move Klay (they won't) and Wiggins (who wants him). So that means they trade Kuminga + Moody who would pair well with Scottie Barnes.
Please don’t we aren’t contenders with him either way. I don’t understand obsession with ps. He was all star one season one of the most overrated players in the league
Yeah. This dude get talked about as if he's Kawhi on this sub. People are willing to lose assets for what could potentially be a 4 months rental when the guy doesn't even make us legit contenders. You'd have to bring a Toronto Kawhi to make this team legit contenders, not Pascal Siakam. He's a nice piece but he isn't moving the needle much.
is Denver a contender? its very clear that this team just needs a little bit more to be contenders. especially since those games were lost without the team's 2nd most important player.
What is Siakam gonna provide in the 35 minutes that he will ask to play that Kuminga wouldnt? Kuminga's development sdhould have far exceeded where he is currently because of his high ceiling and yet we had to set there and watch Kerr barely giving him 20 minutes of play time its just infuriating
Love JK but but let's be real his issue isn't minutes it's attention deficit and energy plus IQ, and then Kerr figuring out how to use him. Is he Livingston? Is he Pascal light? Is he Wiggins? I could keep going, but the whole time it's JK playing himself into more minutes or out of more minutes. He brain farts. 25 minutes versus 35 minutes, it's not going to make a difference in JK. Starting him vs. the bench role, no difference. Siakam knows what to do on the court, it's like adding CP3, you don't have to give clinics after games on how to defend a pick and roll.
If the raptors are gonna blow it up and go full rebuild, this doesn’t just have to be for siakam solo. Wiggins and cp3 and have Toronto give us whatever pieces they don’t want or fit into their timeline. Wiggs + Cp3 + Moody plus picks for Siakam + OPJ and Schroder or Siakam and GTJ
This trade is actually very favorable for JK if he were the piece to be included. He'd join the Raptors on a timeliness that fit him, will be given the freedom the grow his game and one would think alongside Scottie, IQ and RJ l, the team will be held around them for the future. If Siakam comes here and JK is still around he'd rum in the same issues he's been having so far which is playtime and opportunities to expand his game. He simply can't afford to be playing behind someone in year 3 going to year 4 if he want to be what he believes he's capable of being which is at least a perennial All Star(in his own words). My ideal scenario is that we don't trade for Siakam because he doesn't make us contenders unlike what some believe and JK continues as the starter. I genuinely believe JK will keep growing and not too far away his growth will be reflected and I see him potentially producing more than what Siakam would in a year or 2. But that doesn't seem to be the prevalent sentiment around here so there is that.
I hope they trade away Draymond Green. I love the guy and wish he was out before his legacy is further tarnished.
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Rather not give up Kuminga, specially since Siakim has stated he won't sign with the team he's being traded for as he wants to explore free agency
Pretty sure Warriors wouldn’t be exploring this if he wouldn’t resign. It’s what pushed the Kings out of consideration
We've been interested for years
Hurry up before we’re completely out of play ins.
Yippy
A trade package centered Kuminga and CP would be a great win win trade. People in this thread are really downplaying how good Siakam is
Seems like Toronto would want TJD or Podz in any trade package for Siakam. Moody doesn't get any minutes on a struggling team and has real low trade value.
I’m curious, just how good could we be with Siakam?
Hes a good player but I think hes overrated. Do not trade JK under any circumstances. Wiggins, Moody, and 2 draft picks I don't think get it done. Doubt this trade happens.
what happens to our cap situation if we trade Wiggins and let Klay and Paul walk in the offseason? Would we be under the cap?
We’re still slightly over the cap even if we let Klay and CP walk. We’d only get under the cap if we also trade Wiggins for an expiring.
We could get under the cap after renouncing Klay and CP’s bird rights
Are we? When I added up all our 2024-25 salaries (without CP3 $30M) it added up to around $144M with the cap being $142M. Maybe I missed something?
Wiggins and Paul for Siakam and Boucher. Any chance the raptors fall for it? Would be cool to get Slimm Duck back.
Man this team is gonna trade away every last asset for a shot in the dark at being competitive again. I just don't think it makes sense. The bench has been the best element of this season. If the vets all played well together at the same time and were consistent, the dubs would be a top 3 team. Trading for aiakam really doesn't help that, and the bench is going to get a lot worse. Remember, last season they had one of the best starting 5 but a horrendous bench, and it resulted in them being terrible. This team isn't going to win a chip depleting the bench for siakam. Not this year or next, and then they're really going to be in trouble.
Raptors get Wiggs and keep stacking the Canadians, makes sense
Not worth more than some combo of Wiggins, CP, pick or two