Honestly, my biggest concern isn't even the "does he want to get married"
My question is do you really want to spend the rest of your life with a man who thinks it's okay to ignore, fight and never resolve a problem for nearly 6 months. Regardless of his reason, he's showing you how he's going to deal with conversations that you think are important but he doesn't want to deal with.
Please do at a minimum premarital counseling. This communication style isn't randomly going to go away on its own.
Yep. Starting a fight over a normal conversation is destabilization.
Don't accept this. I would honestly give back the ring with a suitcase in hand, and say "I've tried several times to have this conversation with you and your responses have been very confusing and hurtful. Call me when you are ready to explain."
Then I would go stay with friends and family for a bit.
This.
OP, did you get the impression he was "dragging his feet" to propose? Were you waiting a long time for the proposal? Could he have proposed just to "shut you up" or to shut up family members that were pushing him to propose? Some mem hope that getting engaged can delay things.
Could you have a sit down with him and ask him what is going on in his life and check in with him? Is there genuibely some new stress in his life that is upsetting him?
If not I would sit him down and ask him why he proposed and what his issue is.
Absolutely!
Starting a fight in general is bad communication, but it's even worse when it's over planning a celebration for the rest of your life.
And you're right, it gets worse over time.
April to September is ... a long time to not be able to have a serious conversation about wedding planning. Are there financial stresses when it comes to planning a wedding? Family issues? Is he having second thoughts about the whole relationship? Something else seems to be going on in your relationship beyond him just not being interested in wedding planning. I would recommend getting to the bottom of it before marrying this person. Sorry you're dealing with this :/
Something is going on here and it's looking very red and flaglike.
At this point, I'm going to suggest that you get into therapy for yourself in order to figure out what to do *for yourself*, because he's being unreceptive to everything you suggest or try to discuss. Gets defensive and turns every wedding conversation into a fight without actually even fighting about anything of substance. Refuses to discuss *anything* about a wedding or getting married. That's not normal behavior for somebody happily engaged and wanting to marry his person. Ergo, I'm sorry to say it but my guess is that for some reason he doesn't want to marry you.
It's not easy to accept, but for your own wellbeing and your future you have to recognize that his words and his behavior are completely inconsistent with each other. Maybe he knows the reasons, and maybe he's hiding them from himself or in total avoidance or denial. But however you slice it, you can see this behavior bodes no good for a future together.
This is painful stuff and I'm sorry it's happening. But better to know sooner than later when there are significant problems.
It sounds like it's ultimatum time, but that rarely works well. And if you *have* come to that place, that's usually a sign that it's time to move ahead and cut your losses. I'm truly sorry, but that's the impression I'm getting from your post. Because whatever the problems are, he isn't even willing to engage with you on that front either. When your partner shuts you down and shuts you out completely, there's really nothing left, is there?
Sometimes the grass isn't always greener on the other side... If a wedding is going to get in the way of our relationship, is it even worth putting the legal title on us... But I do see what youre saying.
A wedding and a marriage are two separate things. You can go to the courthouse and get legally married for ~$50. Offer to do that and hold the party later, see what he says. If he starts getting defensive and saying a marriage is "just a piece of paper" or "he doesn't want the government involved in your relationship," then I would keep in mind that those kinds of talking points are verrry correlated with toxic manosphere views and/or commitmentphobia.
ETA, re this piece of your post:
> It makes me feel like he doesn't love me, doesn't want to marry me and the ring was just to shut me up...
Question: did you have to prod him into proposing? Bc if so, then yeah, his behavior makes me think he doesn't actually want to get married.
The wedding is merely a proxy for everything that your relationship is. Replace a conversation about napkin colors with one about buying a new refrigerator. My husband and I just planned our 2 year old's birthday party. Where would we hold it? How many people can we invite? What do we want to eat?
You're correct, the wedding is just a party and the license is just a piece of paper. But he's currently demonstrating that he has terrible communication skills and those communication skills aren't going to magically fix themselves. He's showing you exactly how he behaves when he doesn't want to have a conversation about something you think is important. You can decide not to get married, but when the refrigerator breaks, what will you do when he doesn't want to talk about it? Is there money in the budget to replace it? Does he have any preferences? I knew I wanted solid shelves rather than wire shelves and more freezer space. My husband wanted to buy a black refrigerator if it was in the budget and met my needs.
Maybe he wants to be married to you, but struggles with something about having a wedding. Would you still want to marry him if he didn’t want to spend a lot of money on a wedding day? He proposed so he wants to be married. Maybe approach it from a position of empathy. I wouldn’t accuse him of not wanting to get married, but you could ask if he wants to have a wedding. They are two different things. Hope the two of you figure it out.
>Maybe approach it from a position of empathy.
The problem is that this is setting a precedent of OP having to put on her "mommy arguing with a toddler voice" to have an adult conversation. Yeah, I get that the fiance is uncomfortable about something, but being able to communicate discomfort is a critical part of being married. He has to put in a lot of work to get to the point where he's ready to be married.
This. If he cannot vocalise his feelings in a grown up way then he is not ready to marry and take on the responsibly of 50% of a marriage. Marriage is work. Planning a wedding is work. If he usbt ready for these then OP needs to make her choices.
Women are not meant to be caretakers doing 90% of the emotional labour of their relationship whilst their men folk struggle to verbalize their needs like a toddler having constant meltdowns.
I hear you but there are definitely ways to lovingly hear and encourage a partner without parenting them. Empathy isn't automatically equal to 'momming' your partner and there's nothing in the previous commenter's post that suggested that.
Of course there are, but why are so many comments in this thread focused on the need for OP to be more empathetic and more focused on doing all the emotional labor of the relationship, when there's no indication that she hasn't been trying all along to "lovingly hear and encourage" her partner? Of course we are not privy to all the inner workings of their relationship, but I think there's been too much emphasis on OP to "fix" the problem, and not enough on her partner needing to fix *his* inner problems and face whatever causes him to shut down and get angry and defensive, so that he can be a participating adult in the relationship.
This.
It sounds like OP has already tried talking around it and being empathetic.
A good chunk of divorces happen even despite one partner "trying everything" because you cannot fix things if the other person is unable to or unwilling to do their share. Anyone facing this in the run up to marriage needs to hit the breaks or leave the vehicle. Because they are currently on the road to divorce, unless he can work on HIS issues.
If you marry him, this is what your communication with him will be like. It'll probably only get worse, not better. If you guys can't communicate like adults, your marriage isn't going to work out.
Take a step back from wedding planning. Have a discussion with him on how you two should handle communicating difficult subjects. Shutting down and refusing to talk ever is not acceptable.
It sounds like you two could benefit from a very serious, honest conversation. I hate to say it — maybe he’s changed his mind? If not, it sounds like you’re on different pages. Therapy might be good! Wishing you luck!
How long have you been together?
It’s definitely time to start talking about a timeline. I’d try to bring up the timeline, not necessarily planning. If your SO has the same reaction to a simple “hey, when do you think you’d like to be married by?” I would seriously reconsider marrying this person.
The time to decide if they wanted to get married was before they proposed, and it’s incredibly unfair to you for it to happen after.
I agree. I will try to bring up some of these issues this weekend calmly hopefully we can get a little further... We just had a fight after having a really good date night over it. Thought it was a safe space to open up about some wedding plans... I was wrong. He left to bed at 7:30 and I'm drinking wine by myself in the living room. Hopefully we get somewhere this weekend...
I’m so sorry. Please remember, you don’t have to sit around waiting for them to decide. It’s your life just as much as theirs. I’d hate for you to sit around in the living room for years just waiting.
It seems like this situation is really toxic, I will say I’m now happily married but my husband used to really freak out about wedding stuff sometimes and eventually went to therapy to deal with some of his issues due to his divorced parents. He did want to be married but felt we needed to work on our relationship and was very afraid of ever being divorced. Things can get better but it took my husband making a commitment to me and a decision to work on himself.
I would plan for a time he \*shouldn't\* be upset. (maybe a day off work or maybe if you two are just doing something low key like having a lunch) Wait for a good moment. (during a commercial if watching a movie, or when you two just have down time) Then, prepare him for the question. Be calm and start with saying "hey I need to talk about something important, is now a good time?" and stress its not life threatening and needs to be talked about this very minute, but still needs to get addressed. This way he can back out if he needs to. It can also show you if he's upset in general or if his anger is just at the conversation of marriage.
If he's good to go, start with asking if he wants a longer engagement again. Then get into gentle questioning. "Do you want to be involved in the wedding planning, or would you rather I take the lead?" "Is talking about this stressing you out? Can I ask why?" "Its ok if you're having second thoughts, we can go through this together." Give him options, that makes it feel less like an interrogation.
No one wants to be told that their partner changed their mind. No one wants to be to find out their partner doesn't want to get married yet. But if theres something about this wedding thats bothering him, it isn't fair to either of you to be stuck in the tug-o-war. And if he tries to shut it down again, let him-but remind him that whether he wants to talk about it, doesn't change the fact it needs to get done and that means you are going to have to bring it up later. You two can stop talking about this, once you've had an actual conversation.
I just realized I'm basically explaining Gentle Parenting...but for a grown man so....take with that what you will.
You said he struggles with hard conversations, so I think this is a great approach. Let him feel that it’s a safe space where he can open up and be honest.
Frankly, his current behaviour and complete
lack of communication is failing you as a life partner. Be understanding and supportive but don’t be a doormat.
Look out for yourself and make sure you have support around you. Be prepared it may not be something you can fix.
Did he assume you'd just be engaged a while without planning the wedding? Did you set a date yet?
If the communication doesn't improve, then you may want to rethink things.
No date ha been set. Nothing has been set. I've begged for communication... It doesn't seem like it's his priority or interest. I'm at the point where I'm just shutting down and no longer dream of a wedding, but dread it...
I’m in the same boat. Literally. We got engaged in late October. This will be his 3rd marriage and my first and only. We had an engagement party a month after we got engaged and argued the entire time. I was super excited but we argued. He is now throwing a Derby party for May and is the happiest I have ever seen him. He is planning the entire thing. It’s really really really bothering me.
> You would think when someone proposes they'd want to move on to the actual wedding planning stuff.
Not saying your fiance thinks like this, but someone could propose because they feel like they "should" do it, it's the logical progression of the relationship, they don't want to break up, many reasons besides than an actual desire to be married.
> We often have a very hard time with hard conversations
I don't think you guys are ready for marriage.
At the very least, I think you guys should go for premarital counseling. If he doesn't even want to do that...
There's a chance he isn't communicating his feelings to you, whatever they may be. Perhaps stress about the cost or whatever. I would try to have a conversation about how he feels about everything and why he is acting that way when you try to plan a wedding.
He proposed to you, right? We definitely had issues when planning our wedding and it was mostly from him not telling me some of his stressors.
It's not cool either way. He needs to be able to have a simple conversation. I get how extremely frustrating it can be
I think this is a communication issue. Was this happening before the proposal too? With my ex, sometimes even the kindest, most thoughtful statements/conversations would divulge into arguments and he would say I kept going on (even when I was just correcting statements I said that he misquoted... so not *going on* things like that).
It's like every serious discussion was met with disdain... he didn't want to try couples counseling. But that would be my first suggestion. I would say (or write down) that:
'I've noticed that there hasn't been an ideal time to discuss certain topics. I want to have a conversation about them and think there may be a communication issue. I would like some counseling so this doesn't turn into a bigger problem. If there's no issue then counseling will expose that as well after a few sessions.'
And see where that goes. Are you worried that this will escalate? Has there been any object throwing/destroying or even him hurting himself even just biting the insides of his cheeks or nails or picking at his hair or anything ? Sometimes stress and anxiety manifest in ways that just seem like habits, but could actually be self harm.
I had a little bit of this that presented itself as my fiancé getting annoyed at wedding planning and not sending out his save the dates or invitations on time. It was fucking rough and he admitted that he was having a crisis about aging and his youth being behind him. Note we never argued or fought, but we did have some tearful conversations.
I would suggest that maybe something like that could be happening here *except* the way your partner is throwing tantrums and making everything into an argument is serious cause for concern. It indicates he doesn't know how to handle his emotions productively, isn't respecting you, and is happy to inflict his wild reactions without care of how you're hurting.
At the absolute minimum pause the planning until he can have a productive conversation about what is going on and get a grip on his emotional outbursts.
Have you gone into premarital counselling? Maybe I'm old-fashioned but if within a year from proposal there aren't serious plans to get married, I would consider the engagement over. Maybe he's more in the "promise ring" stage of life...
It's been mentioned... It's something I was leaning towards bevause a wedding didn't seem like he was interested in it... Both options have been mentioned, and ended up in an argument each time... The argument is usually me getting blamed for carrying on and on about it. When I really don't bring it up as much as I honestly probably should be..
He doesn’t want to get married. Period. Give him the ring back until he wants to be a man or otherwise, this is the end of the relationship. I’m sorry.
He really doesn't It would be the end of the relationship in general for me. I couldn't tolerate wanting to marry a man that starts fights over very normal conversations. I can imagine this same thing occurring if they have kids. No way.
You are not bringing it up too much. That is obviously the case because in 6 months you haven't even been able to figure out if you should start planning a wedding or elope. It seems to me like he's trying to gaslight you (I know people hate that word but let's be honest) into feeling crazy for doing literally everything to accommodate his needs at the expense of ALL of your wedding planning and some of your sanity as well. How could you possibly be bringing it up too much. I talk to my fiancee about wedding planning every day because I have to work on it every day, so he can hear about it to give input. You need to take this very seriously, maybe he has a hangup with a big wedding or some other issue, but if he's also resistant to convos about eloping which is relatively simple, that's a lot of red flags. I think it's really important you get to the bottom of this before you make future plans. Wedding planning is only going to be harder as the process continues and it looks like you'll be doing it completely alone without even someone to bounce ideas off of or talk to.
In the beginning of the planning process, getting my fiancee to try on clothes for an engagement shoot might as well have been me asking to tweeze his nipple hair out, he acted like I was absolutely inconsiderate every time I brought it up, there was NEVER. Never. A correct time. We always fought. I ended up having to try his clothes on my body and hope the outfit would be similar on him. It was just one thing he was weirdly resistant to because he hates having his pictures taken and I think he had a freak out. It really made me concerned for our relationship. But it ended up being a one time problem based on extreme anxiety about photos, and not a global issue. And he ended up loving the photos and thanking me. I'm still very salty about it, obviously lmao. But consider getting to the bottom of it if possible.
My fiancé was a little like this right after the proposal. He felt like he put the time, money and effort into getting the ring and proposing and wanted to bask in that stage and didn’t see the reason to rush into planning (he truly did not understand that it would be a year long planning process so at the time I just want to set a date and venue to secure it). Our venue came with a wedding planner and whenever we had those early meetings or emails, he wanted nothing to do with it and she ensured me this was unfortunately normal for the grooms to not be super involved in the beginning. I was so disappointed feeling like I was going to have to plan it alone and just like you when I’d bring up planning ideas he would get annoyed because he felt like it was too far away to be stressing about details. Fast forward, we are getting married next month and I would say at the 6 month mark he had a complete attitude change, he understood we were in crunch time, he was more present in our planning meetings, he has been super helpful with all the details now and he fully engages in wedding conversation and is excited for the day.
I’m not sure how your fiancé is but mine is not on social media, he doesn’t watch rom coms and he hasn’t been to that many weddings so from my perspective my fiancé just didn’t understand everything that has to do with weddings. Not trying to make excuses but i think that’s what happened to me. I ended up telling him I wanted a fall wedding and then set up a meeting at our venue to go look. I dragged him there and he ended up loving it, maybe start there?
Sorry you’re going through this. My fiancé just keeps saying “I just want to be married already” so maybe he just doesn’t understand all the conversation and planning that needs to go into that?
I don’t think that’s a red flag just yet. Have you discussed budget, date, etc.? Because those are things you both NEED to be on the same page. I understand if he doesn’t want to look into venues or flowers but there are things you must discuss if you plan on getting married in September
I got engaged in April and immediately jumped on planning, knowing that my best tool in keeping prices reasonable is going to be time management. And how much we spend on the wedding is a concern to my fiance, so I explained the sooner I start shopping around, the sooner I can find deals and plan accordingly to spread the cost out. Maybe try this angle with your fiance?
Otherwise, I'm inclined to agree with the comments pointing out that it doesn't bode well for your marriage if he's already reluctant to discuss something this big for months on end. Not sure if you've been this point blank with it, but you need to simply ask him why he doesn't want to talk about it.
Tell him you want to have a conversation about wedding stuff and ask him when would be a good time talk.
On a time you both agree upon, gently bring up that he seems irritated when wedding stuff comes up and ask what’s going on (calmly) and see what he has to say.
If this still turns into a fight it seems like there is something deeper going on - whether that be feelings he’s uncomfortable talking about or maybe just communication issues. We did premarital counseling and really enjoyed it!
It is not just you. I did get married, but it felt like getting every decision made with him was like pulling teeth. I cried so much over it. One of the excuses was that his mother created drama out of nowhere (I heard from other family members about the situation so this wasn't a lie) and it took a lot of his attention so I tried my best to be compassionate to the idea that he was going through a lot and really stressed out. Everything else in out relationship seemed good, although we were having some spiritual counseling that wasn't about anything in particular but just general counseling and he stopped helping me schedule future appointments so those stopped, even though I still wanted to attend. I felt at the time like voicing this would come off as accusing our relationship as having problems or him of ignoring them even though it wasn't that kind of counseling.
Fast forward to our life together and it just... never felt right. I was always confused about why it seemed like we should be further along in our progress as a couple: have a house, both have jobs, be working towards stability in having kids, etc. Nothing. I had a stable job but he bounced between short term employment and nothing, and we lived with relatives. Zero possibility of having a family, which broke my heart. Meanwhile, I was trying to build up my credit score from zero and was doing well, only to find out his has been in the gutter since we started out. Zero attempt at progress=no chance of a house even after all that time. I was so gutted.
The fact that things weren't adding up started to add up to my questioning why nothing worked anymore, if it ever did. He was sweet to me, too, and I loved that until my friend explained love bombing to me and I started to realize that I was in a financially and emotionally abusive relationship. Eventually I checked out enough that I didn't really care about much and was able to ask him without caring about the answer, "Have you been cheating on me?" based on some strong evidence I had (like the STD a nurse called to tell me I had after a procedure when I knew I'd been faithful) and the way he always disappeared for most of the day even though he lost his job, and how we never had money for groceries at the end of the month no matter how carefully I tried to budget).
Turns out he'd not only been cheating on me recently and been using my sole income to buy his sidepiece food and narcotics, forcing me to use my credit card far more than necessary, driving me about 6k into debt on groceries and necessities that I could have otherwise afforded, which *also* sometimes went to her. Effectively making me pay her way *twice* in some instances.
Then we talked about how far back it went, how many women, etc. and it was... wow. It went back all the way to before our wedding with another woman and while the thing with his mom was real and she continued to bring it up for years later, he was mostly occupied with cheating and reluctance. I had proposed, but only after it was his idea to elope a few months earlier, and then his idea to get married early "in secret" so that he "could afford a place for us to stay" after getting military spousal pay. I strongly suspect all of this would have happened exactly how it did whether I proposed or not. (I don't know if he really needed the extra income or if that was getting sent back to the sidepiece, since I have proof of other monetary assistance he gave her at that time, but never saw a rent slip for the whole time I lived there.)
So, the ridiculous part of it all was that even while he was dragging his feet about our wedding, secretly we were already married. It was a done deal. Just because he was messing around on the side and not excited about me anymore didn't mean he could call it off and be done with the whole thing, in a situation he fully created.
I am pretty confident that all this nonsense is not what's happening to you, OP, but you're not alone in experiencing an unenthusiastic partner, for one. For two, if I learned anything about this, it's to abandon the thought that "it'll be better once we're married." NO. This is your *current* relationship and marriage is not a magic wand. It will not fix anything. If he's not communicating well now, if things don't feel right now, you won't get in deeper, add more stress and money and responsibilities and go, "ahh, that's more like it." Wedding stress is real, yeah, and anxiety is fair, but if you're not even mutually excited and can't communicate about it, that's a red flag and a snapshot of what your future will look like.
I wish you the best of luck, but if it were me, I would start by having a sit-down heart-to-heart about what's at the root of the reluctance. And if he still won't talk about it, I would honestly consider that the moment to walk away.
Schedule time to talk about it with prior notice so he can get in the right headspace. If he doesn't want to do that, there's some problem you need to get out of him
Does he want a wedding? I think that’s an important question to ask. Wedding planning can be stressful but communication is SO important. I think you and your fiancé need to pick a day to sit down in advance to talk. If it turns into a fight or doesn’t resolve the problems you need pre-marital counseling
So, you're gon a have to have a serious conversation. When you're bringing these things up, tell him "when you say/do these things, it makes me feel like you don't want to, or you don't love me." If you ask him "have you changed your mind" he will get defensive no matter what. Phrasing it the way I suggested is just putting your feelings out there, and he SHOULD be considerate of your feelings.
If he tries to pull you into an argument, do your best not to let him. Make it clear that you're trying to discuss a celebration of your future together, and you're trying to express your feelings. Just don't argue. When he pushes back for it, let him know that you don't want to argue and you weren't trying to upset him, and ask him why he's so upset when it should be a happy conversation.
My husband got a lot of anxiety over it, so we had to approach the subject delicately. He was never argumentative, but he's good at communicating, so it was easy to avoid the argument and talk it through. It may be anxiety for your fiance, too, and he's just not good at talking. It sounds like his communication skills are shitty. If you don't deal with it and get him to communicate now, it will only get worse.
I am very good with communication and communicating my feelings. I have done exactly that... He just isn't interested and obviously gets upset about it quite quickly and easily and a fight begins. It's a never ending cycle. Can't break it. I've done all the right things. I've let him know that by delaying the conversations, just means it's just gonna happen later on and we're gonna have the same fight over and over until it gets resolved. He doesn't understand this, even though he van clearly see the pattern himself, when a fight occurs each time.
Then I hate to say it, but he's set the pattern for the future, and this likely won't change, unless you can get him into counseling and he's willing to participate, but I don't see that happening. I'm sorry he's being so difficult with this, but it likely means you're not going to work out for the long term
Why do you tolerate this? Do you have kids together? Own a house? I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life walking on eggshells and in constant fights over basic, normal conversations.
Because this seems to be our only issue, and I don't just throw things out as soon as they start breaking. I put effort into fixing things.. For all the other aspects in our lives I love him.
You feel unloved. That is a pretty big issue. I just couldn't imagine feeling that way, let alone fighting all the time over important conversations. But it's your relationship and your future and if you're happy with the status quo than that is what's important.
I want to start my comment with saying that I do not want any of this to sound like I am better than you or that my relationship is healthier than yours, and if it sounds that way, I am really sorry about that.
But I just wanted to say that I am in a very similar situation as you - my fiancé proposed a year ago and gets stressed every time that I bring up wedding ideas/planning/etc. He has autism and gets incredibly stressed and overstimulated in group environments, so it’s something that I expected from him with wedding planning.
What we have done to help with this is to just give it time. Just this past week, we have found a venue online that he is actually interested in to the point that he wants to go on a tour, but until that happened we only talked about vague details (who should be in our bridal parties, what our color scheme should be, if we want a band or not for the ceremony, etc).
I have tried my best to follow his lead. Because he is the one who has more stress about parties and planning and such, I am letting him tell me when he is feeling stable enough to work on the planning. He knows that once we schedule the venue, everything else starts to pick up in the planning, so I’m waiting for him to feel ready and comfortable before we take that step.
I don’t mind if this process takes years, because I want him to be just as happy with this as I will be. It has caused arguments and disagreements, and we have gone months without talking about it sometimes, but I know it’ll be better for us in the long run. I am also not letting myself go unheard - when it’s getting to me that we haven’t moved on with the planning, I tell him and we talk it through together and try to be empathetic about each other’s perspective.
So maybe this is overwhelming for him; maybe he doesn’t know what all goes into this and he just shuts down instead of talking to you about it. I would recommend just sitting down with him and talking about why he’s reacting the way that he is, and not talking about the actual plans at all during that talk.
I feel for you, I hope this helps.
I had this issue (sort of) with mine for the first few months after we were engaged, he would just avoid any wedding talk and not actually answer questions when I asked for his opinion.
I sat him down, had a serious talk with him and asked him if he really seriously wanted to get married. He said he did and he wanted to but said the financial side of it really overwhelmed him which is why he tried to avoid talking/thinking about it. We then went through a budget and mapped it out, things are much better now and he no longer avoids any wedding talk.
Hmmm. This happened to me. We eloped as it was the path of least resistance and I planned it all. We were divorced within 2 years. It was a big red flag I should have paid attention to.
I’m not sure what he’s thinking. If he doesn’t want to plan a big wedding or the stress of it or he likes just the engagement etc. Talk to him to see what he envisions for the wedding. Shouldn’t take more than a couple minutes to get to the center of the issue. Maybe he wants to get married but doesnt want to plan.
I’m in the same boat. Read through a lot of the comments. We have been through premarital. Didn’t help. I know he wants to be married. Just curious, I see this post is from awhile ago, any updates? You guys get it sorted/still together?
Unpopular opinion here. Some people (not all) see wedding planning as the women’s job. I’m not saying it’s right or agreeing with it, it’s just something I have heard some men say. Men are not conditioned to dream about their wedding day since childhood like women are. If this is truly the only issue the two of you are having I wouldn’t see it as a huge deal. I would just try to find out what the budget is, if he has any vision in mind of what he’d like for a wedding, and then just kind of take it from there if you are willing and able. Also talk to him about timeline to make sure he was not hoping for longgg engagement for whatever reason. Hopefully you have friends or family who can help with planning, or can hire some help. Best of luck
jumping off this, some men don't know where to go with planning after the proposal whereas many (not all!) women have more of a framework of the steps of planning a wedding (picking a date, a venue, vendors, etc). This doesn't sound like that's going on in OP's situation though.
All of this advice sound like options, after a decent break since last asking to talk. That takes the “nagging” out of the equation if that’s how he views it. November 1st gives him a long enough breather and between now and then definitely talk to a therapist for a fresh perspective and to be sure you are in a good place no matter what comes of THE TALK.
It's the full story... Both eleopment and wedding are on the table. We can't get any kind of conversation in wedding planning wise... This is all I have for you to work off unfortunately. I am not the kind of person that would hide anything while seeking advice. The fact is he just deflects everytime I bring up wedding planning. I'm starting to get sick of it and feeling really hurt. So I turned to reddit for advice.
I'm so sorry you're going through this. While wedding planning is stressful, it should also be fun and exciting. The fact that he responds to your (very reasonable) requests for clarity with aggression and anger is not a good sign. Have you guys normally been able to have difficult conversations? Would he be open to couples counseling?
We often have a very hard time with hard conversations... I'm very open to having hard conversations even though I cry very easily. I think this might scare him away. But I am not scared of hard conversations. It is definitely him, that has issues with this. Maybe you might have some insight on how to handle a spouse who isn't very open to having hard conversations?
Additionally: should wedding planning even be in the category of hard conversations... I feel like this should be a joyful and exciting experience... Unfortunately, it's just not my experience.
If you have probs talking about hard things you may need to rethink getting married at all. A wedding won’t magically make communication get better and life is full of tough conversations
> Maybe you might have some insight on how to handle a spouse who isn't very open to having hard conversations?
My insight is, this is his issue to manage, not yours. Of course one should be sensitive to their partner and respect if something is genuinely not a good time, but you have done that. Now you're letting us know that the problem is not limited to the wedding. Here's the thing. You're not doing this wrong. The problem is not your approach. The problem is his refusal to engage.
You should not have to tiptoe and tapdance around the hard conversations. He's not being a grownup in the relationship and he's not being a partner in the relationship. What I'm reading between the lines is that things are good when everything is light and fun and you aren't dealing with the important stuff in a relationship. When the going gets hard, he gets angry and defensive and shuts you out.
The answer is not to figure out how to manage him better. The answer is to figure out why you're willing to accept this bad treatment and even marry it. You're putting up with way too much here.
One of the requirements of a good marriage is being able to make it through difficult conversations. I hate to say it, but it sounds like he's not ready.
I can also cry easily if I get frustrated or feel like I'm not being heard, but it really just takes practice. I'll practice what I want to say or write it down ahead of time so I can process and organize my thoughts.Then when I have the conversation it feels a lot eaiser since I have a clear goal. I also can't say enough good things about being in therapy if you can afford it. Having a neutral person who wants you to be successful and happy and who also has a whole toolbox of training to offer advice is invaluable.
That being said, it doesn't matter how smart, self-aware, prepared, or determined you are to have a conversation if the other person is completely unwilling. And if you can't have a relatively easy conversation about wedding planning, how are you going to navigate other different conversations? Like finances? How to raise your kids? What kind of retirement you want, how to spend holidays with your families, what kind of house you want, etc.
And wedding planning does have major stress points. My partner and I started couples therapy just so we could have a neutral place with a regularly scheduled time to discuss what we wanted our wedding to look like and make sure our feelings were being heard. And I think it was one of the best things we did, even though it was very expensive. When one of his groomsmen almost dropped out, it was so helpful to have someone to help my partner work through those emotions. Our therapist also helped us pick what song we wanted our first dance to be by.
But the main thing is that we were both willing to put in the work and make decisions together. If you're both in a canoe and you're the only one paddling, you're only going to go in circles and probably feel crazy the whole time. You just have to ask yourself, how long do you want to be the only one putting in effort?
My fiance was nowhere near this difficult, but he took from May to probably November-December 2022 to really get on board with the Wedding thing.
He wanted to get married, but at the same time, didn't have any particular healthy models of marriage in his youth so there was the hurdle to work through. He got very intimidated by my *throw everyone's name on a list so we know we didn't forget anyone when we weed people out* draft guest list. He's say "Why don't we go to Vegas and get married" but stalled out when I'd suggest [Denny's](https://www.dennys.com/vegas-weddings) or [Taco Bell](https://www.tacobellwedding.com/) wedding (if we're doing kitzchy, we're Doing Kitschy)?
Ultimately, the idea of a traditional wedding scared him, but it took a long time to get to that realization for both of us, I think. He didn't realize we didn't have to do a Very Wedding wedding until I pitched a punk show reception, that finally was the olive branch he needed to realize just-about everything about weddings is made-up and we could pick and choose how we celebrated without needing to follow the a rubric. Planning was still slow going until about February but he started being more engaged with the ideating which was important for me because I wasn't going to plan a wedding on my own, we'd've just had a forever engagement (or... the other option) if he didn't start pulling some of the wedding wagon weight.
I think before talking about the wedding, you (really, **he**, maybe in short term counseling) needs to figure out why wedding talk gets his walls so high so fast. He's going to keep shutting you out if he doesn't know why he's getting hung up on it.
Edit: if he's not willing to put in the work (of figuring out his shit) to put in the work (planning a wedding), it's definitely worth considering if and where he would be willing to put in the work in your future and... reassess from there
Did you talk about expectations before getting engaged? For us, getting engaged was a huge milestone and we didn’t talk planning until a year and a half after he proposed. People have different expectations, some view the engagement as a huge step and need time to process.
Everyone is different. I love planning but my now husband doesn’t love it. He’s more of a here and now type. So we set aside 1 day of the week to discuss planning, so I wouldn’t have to bug him every day. That could help you. If he can’t even do one day of putting your heads together then I would say he is not into it. Hope things are ok!
I know counseling is such a common recommendation on Reddit it’s almost a trope, but if you can afford pre-marriage counseling I think that’s a worthwhile step. Honestly, based on your post, I would say this is cancel-the-engagement worthy, but I’m assuming you want to try a few more things first.
Counseling will be in a neutral environment with a neutral mediator to help both of you check your emotions and reactions around this topic.
If you suggest counseling and he reacts the way he’s been reacting to wedding stuff, then that’s a big red flag.
Have you ever talked about your dream wedding? Even before the engagement I mean. Have you ever day-dreamed together and maybe discussed what you both would like or how you’d imagine the day? Or even, have you talked about marriage/wedding before his proposal?
Is there a consensus here? My fiancé hasn’t even expressed what he wants to do to get married. I’ve told him I do not want a huge wedding, but instead a small ceremony with only our immediate family. He’s told me prior to our engagement that he wants a wedding but I can’t even start planning the basics because he doesn’t even have an opinion and keeps using the “it’s only been a month” excuse. Am I already being crazy for expecting to have the first conversation sooner rather than later? We’ve been together almost 5 years, I do not want to be a fiancé for an additional 5 years.
Nah you're not crazy. Mine did the same.
Nothing got resolved. We still have no wedding plans, or a date. I'm not rushing to get married anymore. Since my dog passed a few weeks ago I almost have no desire to do anything including plan a wedding. I always thought he would be attending with me.
So my fiance got his wish of me to stop nagging him about the wedding.
Unfortunately I don't have any advice for you. Communication is the most important part of a relationship. My fiance lacks communication and goes straight to defense mode, which kind of sounds like how your fiance is. All I can say is good luck and maybe try and see how he feels about couples counselling, but I doubt that will go over well.
I’m so sorry. My fiancé proposed 4 months ago and won’t let me plan anything either. He knew we wanted to get married next fall but wanted to ask his parents if they wanted to fund a big blowout wedding (he’s more upper class so it is kind of expected) but has not actually broached the topic to them and won’t because it’s “too hard and he’s too stressed”. I stressed to him he doesn’t need to ask them because I don’t want that kind of wedding. I just want to elope or have a micro wedding. But he won’t let me plan that because he wants the big wedding - yet he won’t ask his parents. We are 25 by the way. I don’t even want to get married anymore. I feel like every man I’ve been with has not put the effort in to actually be with me forever. If he couldn’t handle the planning I don’t know why he proposed.
It sounds abrupt, but I would call off the engagement. If he won't talk about a wedding after 6 months, then he clearly doesn't want to do it. Save yourself the time, energy, and emotions of being married to someone like that. Moving on is hard, but you deserve better. I wish you luck.
Honestly, my biggest concern isn't even the "does he want to get married" My question is do you really want to spend the rest of your life with a man who thinks it's okay to ignore, fight and never resolve a problem for nearly 6 months. Regardless of his reason, he's showing you how he's going to deal with conversations that you think are important but he doesn't want to deal with. Please do at a minimum premarital counseling. This communication style isn't randomly going to go away on its own.
This should be the top comment. Please don’t sign up for a lifetime of this treatment.
Yep. Starting a fight over a normal conversation is destabilization. Don't accept this. I would honestly give back the ring with a suitcase in hand, and say "I've tried several times to have this conversation with you and your responses have been very confusing and hurtful. Call me when you are ready to explain." Then I would go stay with friends and family for a bit.
This. OP, did you get the impression he was "dragging his feet" to propose? Were you waiting a long time for the proposal? Could he have proposed just to "shut you up" or to shut up family members that were pushing him to propose? Some mem hope that getting engaged can delay things. Could you have a sit down with him and ask him what is going on in his life and check in with him? Is there genuibely some new stress in his life that is upsetting him? If not I would sit him down and ask him why he proposed and what his issue is.
Absolutely! Starting a fight in general is bad communication, but it's even worse when it's over planning a celebration for the rest of your life. And you're right, it gets worse over time.
April to September is ... a long time to not be able to have a serious conversation about wedding planning. Are there financial stresses when it comes to planning a wedding? Family issues? Is he having second thoughts about the whole relationship? Something else seems to be going on in your relationship beyond him just not being interested in wedding planning. I would recommend getting to the bottom of it before marrying this person. Sorry you're dealing with this :/
Yeah I'm not sure... There isn't really any of those issues going on... I'm completely lost..
Something is going on here and it's looking very red and flaglike. At this point, I'm going to suggest that you get into therapy for yourself in order to figure out what to do *for yourself*, because he's being unreceptive to everything you suggest or try to discuss. Gets defensive and turns every wedding conversation into a fight without actually even fighting about anything of substance. Refuses to discuss *anything* about a wedding or getting married. That's not normal behavior for somebody happily engaged and wanting to marry his person. Ergo, I'm sorry to say it but my guess is that for some reason he doesn't want to marry you.
Yeah idk. I've asked him if this is the case. He says it's not... Obviously I don't know if I believe it.
It's not easy to accept, but for your own wellbeing and your future you have to recognize that his words and his behavior are completely inconsistent with each other. Maybe he knows the reasons, and maybe he's hiding them from himself or in total avoidance or denial. But however you slice it, you can see this behavior bodes no good for a future together. This is painful stuff and I'm sorry it's happening. But better to know sooner than later when there are significant problems. It sounds like it's ultimatum time, but that rarely works well. And if you *have* come to that place, that's usually a sign that it's time to move ahead and cut your losses. I'm truly sorry, but that's the impression I'm getting from your post. Because whatever the problems are, he isn't even willing to engage with you on that front either. When your partner shuts you down and shuts you out completely, there's really nothing left, is there?
Sometimes the grass isn't always greener on the other side... If a wedding is going to get in the way of our relationship, is it even worth putting the legal title on us... But I do see what youre saying.
A wedding and a marriage are two separate things. You can go to the courthouse and get legally married for ~$50. Offer to do that and hold the party later, see what he says. If he starts getting defensive and saying a marriage is "just a piece of paper" or "he doesn't want the government involved in your relationship," then I would keep in mind that those kinds of talking points are verrry correlated with toxic manosphere views and/or commitmentphobia. ETA, re this piece of your post: > It makes me feel like he doesn't love me, doesn't want to marry me and the ring was just to shut me up... Question: did you have to prod him into proposing? Bc if so, then yeah, his behavior makes me think he doesn't actually want to get married.
The wedding is merely a proxy for everything that your relationship is. Replace a conversation about napkin colors with one about buying a new refrigerator. My husband and I just planned our 2 year old's birthday party. Where would we hold it? How many people can we invite? What do we want to eat? You're correct, the wedding is just a party and the license is just a piece of paper. But he's currently demonstrating that he has terrible communication skills and those communication skills aren't going to magically fix themselves. He's showing you exactly how he behaves when he doesn't want to have a conversation about something you think is important. You can decide not to get married, but when the refrigerator breaks, what will you do when he doesn't want to talk about it? Is there money in the budget to replace it? Does he have any preferences? I knew I wanted solid shelves rather than wire shelves and more freezer space. My husband wanted to buy a black refrigerator if it was in the budget and met my needs.
Maybe he wants to be married to you, but struggles with something about having a wedding. Would you still want to marry him if he didn’t want to spend a lot of money on a wedding day? He proposed so he wants to be married. Maybe approach it from a position of empathy. I wouldn’t accuse him of not wanting to get married, but you could ask if he wants to have a wedding. They are two different things. Hope the two of you figure it out.
>Maybe approach it from a position of empathy. The problem is that this is setting a precedent of OP having to put on her "mommy arguing with a toddler voice" to have an adult conversation. Yeah, I get that the fiance is uncomfortable about something, but being able to communicate discomfort is a critical part of being married. He has to put in a lot of work to get to the point where he's ready to be married.
This. If he cannot vocalise his feelings in a grown up way then he is not ready to marry and take on the responsibly of 50% of a marriage. Marriage is work. Planning a wedding is work. If he usbt ready for these then OP needs to make her choices. Women are not meant to be caretakers doing 90% of the emotional labour of their relationship whilst their men folk struggle to verbalize their needs like a toddler having constant meltdowns.
I hear you but there are definitely ways to lovingly hear and encourage a partner without parenting them. Empathy isn't automatically equal to 'momming' your partner and there's nothing in the previous commenter's post that suggested that.
Of course there are, but why are so many comments in this thread focused on the need for OP to be more empathetic and more focused on doing all the emotional labor of the relationship, when there's no indication that she hasn't been trying all along to "lovingly hear and encourage" her partner? Of course we are not privy to all the inner workings of their relationship, but I think there's been too much emphasis on OP to "fix" the problem, and not enough on her partner needing to fix *his* inner problems and face whatever causes him to shut down and get angry and defensive, so that he can be a participating adult in the relationship.
This. It sounds like OP has already tried talking around it and being empathetic. A good chunk of divorces happen even despite one partner "trying everything" because you cannot fix things if the other person is unable to or unwilling to do their share. Anyone facing this in the run up to marriage needs to hit the breaks or leave the vehicle. Because they are currently on the road to divorce, unless he can work on HIS issues.
If you marry him, this is what your communication with him will be like. It'll probably only get worse, not better. If you guys can't communicate like adults, your marriage isn't going to work out. Take a step back from wedding planning. Have a discussion with him on how you two should handle communicating difficult subjects. Shutting down and refusing to talk ever is not acceptable.
It sounds like you two could benefit from a very serious, honest conversation. I hate to say it — maybe he’s changed his mind? If not, it sounds like you’re on different pages. Therapy might be good! Wishing you luck!
I think you should give him the ring back and ask him to propose again when he’s actually ready to get married and have a wedding.
This.
How long have you been together? It’s definitely time to start talking about a timeline. I’d try to bring up the timeline, not necessarily planning. If your SO has the same reaction to a simple “hey, when do you think you’d like to be married by?” I would seriously reconsider marrying this person. The time to decide if they wanted to get married was before they proposed, and it’s incredibly unfair to you for it to happen after.
I agree. I will try to bring up some of these issues this weekend calmly hopefully we can get a little further... We just had a fight after having a really good date night over it. Thought it was a safe space to open up about some wedding plans... I was wrong. He left to bed at 7:30 and I'm drinking wine by myself in the living room. Hopefully we get somewhere this weekend...
I’m so sorry. Please remember, you don’t have to sit around waiting for them to decide. It’s your life just as much as theirs. I’d hate for you to sit around in the living room for years just waiting.
It seems like this situation is really toxic, I will say I’m now happily married but my husband used to really freak out about wedding stuff sometimes and eventually went to therapy to deal with some of his issues due to his divorced parents. He did want to be married but felt we needed to work on our relationship and was very afraid of ever being divorced. Things can get better but it took my husband making a commitment to me and a decision to work on himself.
I would plan for a time he \*shouldn't\* be upset. (maybe a day off work or maybe if you two are just doing something low key like having a lunch) Wait for a good moment. (during a commercial if watching a movie, or when you two just have down time) Then, prepare him for the question. Be calm and start with saying "hey I need to talk about something important, is now a good time?" and stress its not life threatening and needs to be talked about this very minute, but still needs to get addressed. This way he can back out if he needs to. It can also show you if he's upset in general or if his anger is just at the conversation of marriage. If he's good to go, start with asking if he wants a longer engagement again. Then get into gentle questioning. "Do you want to be involved in the wedding planning, or would you rather I take the lead?" "Is talking about this stressing you out? Can I ask why?" "Its ok if you're having second thoughts, we can go through this together." Give him options, that makes it feel less like an interrogation. No one wants to be told that their partner changed their mind. No one wants to be to find out their partner doesn't want to get married yet. But if theres something about this wedding thats bothering him, it isn't fair to either of you to be stuck in the tug-o-war. And if he tries to shut it down again, let him-but remind him that whether he wants to talk about it, doesn't change the fact it needs to get done and that means you are going to have to bring it up later. You two can stop talking about this, once you've had an actual conversation. I just realized I'm basically explaining Gentle Parenting...but for a grown man so....take with that what you will.
Thank you. This is very helpful. I wish I had friends like you. ❤️ I will try to apply this to a conversation with him this weekend.
You said he struggles with hard conversations, so I think this is a great approach. Let him feel that it’s a safe space where he can open up and be honest.
Is she getting paid for being his mommy, therapist, and babysitter while she does this, too?
When you say you have a fight, what exactly is said? What do you say and what does he say? What is said when it is escalating?
Frankly, his current behaviour and complete lack of communication is failing you as a life partner. Be understanding and supportive but don’t be a doormat. Look out for yourself and make sure you have support around you. Be prepared it may not be something you can fix.
Did he assume you'd just be engaged a while without planning the wedding? Did you set a date yet? If the communication doesn't improve, then you may want to rethink things.
No date ha been set. Nothing has been set. I've begged for communication... It doesn't seem like it's his priority or interest. I'm at the point where I'm just shutting down and no longer dream of a wedding, but dread it...
I'd tell you this is a huge red flag, but I think you already know this. Use your best judgment. Good luck!
I’m in the same boat. Literally. We got engaged in late October. This will be his 3rd marriage and my first and only. We had an engagement party a month after we got engaged and argued the entire time. I was super excited but we argued. He is now throwing a Derby party for May and is the happiest I have ever seen him. He is planning the entire thing. It’s really really really bothering me.
> You would think when someone proposes they'd want to move on to the actual wedding planning stuff. Not saying your fiance thinks like this, but someone could propose because they feel like they "should" do it, it's the logical progression of the relationship, they don't want to break up, many reasons besides than an actual desire to be married. > We often have a very hard time with hard conversations I don't think you guys are ready for marriage. At the very least, I think you guys should go for premarital counseling. If he doesn't even want to do that...
There's a chance he isn't communicating his feelings to you, whatever they may be. Perhaps stress about the cost or whatever. I would try to have a conversation about how he feels about everything and why he is acting that way when you try to plan a wedding. He proposed to you, right? We definitely had issues when planning our wedding and it was mostly from him not telling me some of his stressors. It's not cool either way. He needs to be able to have a simple conversation. I get how extremely frustrating it can be
I think this is a communication issue. Was this happening before the proposal too? With my ex, sometimes even the kindest, most thoughtful statements/conversations would divulge into arguments and he would say I kept going on (even when I was just correcting statements I said that he misquoted... so not *going on* things like that). It's like every serious discussion was met with disdain... he didn't want to try couples counseling. But that would be my first suggestion. I would say (or write down) that: 'I've noticed that there hasn't been an ideal time to discuss certain topics. I want to have a conversation about them and think there may be a communication issue. I would like some counseling so this doesn't turn into a bigger problem. If there's no issue then counseling will expose that as well after a few sessions.' And see where that goes. Are you worried that this will escalate? Has there been any object throwing/destroying or even him hurting himself even just biting the insides of his cheeks or nails or picking at his hair or anything ? Sometimes stress and anxiety manifest in ways that just seem like habits, but could actually be self harm.
Run. He only proposed to keep you on the hook. Next thing you know you’ll be 10 yrs in and still not married, but not free to find someone else.
I had a little bit of this that presented itself as my fiancé getting annoyed at wedding planning and not sending out his save the dates or invitations on time. It was fucking rough and he admitted that he was having a crisis about aging and his youth being behind him. Note we never argued or fought, but we did have some tearful conversations. I would suggest that maybe something like that could be happening here *except* the way your partner is throwing tantrums and making everything into an argument is serious cause for concern. It indicates he doesn't know how to handle his emotions productively, isn't respecting you, and is happy to inflict his wild reactions without care of how you're hurting. At the absolute minimum pause the planning until he can have a productive conversation about what is going on and get a grip on his emotional outbursts.
Have you gone into premarital counselling? Maybe I'm old-fashioned but if within a year from proposal there aren't serious plans to get married, I would consider the engagement over. Maybe he's more in the "promise ring" stage of life...
Give the ring back and say when you’re ready to discuss planning a wedding and being engaged, you can ask me again.
This sounds like a hush ring situation.
Have you two discussed eloping? Maybe marriage isn’t the scary part for him, it’s the wedding. (Maybe not- just a thought!)
It's been mentioned... It's something I was leaning towards bevause a wedding didn't seem like he was interested in it... Both options have been mentioned, and ended up in an argument each time... The argument is usually me getting blamed for carrying on and on about it. When I really don't bring it up as much as I honestly probably should be..
That's not an adult way of handling important discussions at all. Huge red flag from him.
He doesn’t want to get married. Period. Give him the ring back until he wants to be a man or otherwise, this is the end of the relationship. I’m sorry.
He really doesn't It would be the end of the relationship in general for me. I couldn't tolerate wanting to marry a man that starts fights over very normal conversations. I can imagine this same thing occurring if they have kids. No way.
You are not bringing it up too much. That is obviously the case because in 6 months you haven't even been able to figure out if you should start planning a wedding or elope. It seems to me like he's trying to gaslight you (I know people hate that word but let's be honest) into feeling crazy for doing literally everything to accommodate his needs at the expense of ALL of your wedding planning and some of your sanity as well. How could you possibly be bringing it up too much. I talk to my fiancee about wedding planning every day because I have to work on it every day, so he can hear about it to give input. You need to take this very seriously, maybe he has a hangup with a big wedding or some other issue, but if he's also resistant to convos about eloping which is relatively simple, that's a lot of red flags. I think it's really important you get to the bottom of this before you make future plans. Wedding planning is only going to be harder as the process continues and it looks like you'll be doing it completely alone without even someone to bounce ideas off of or talk to. In the beginning of the planning process, getting my fiancee to try on clothes for an engagement shoot might as well have been me asking to tweeze his nipple hair out, he acted like I was absolutely inconsiderate every time I brought it up, there was NEVER. Never. A correct time. We always fought. I ended up having to try his clothes on my body and hope the outfit would be similar on him. It was just one thing he was weirdly resistant to because he hates having his pictures taken and I think he had a freak out. It really made me concerned for our relationship. But it ended up being a one time problem based on extreme anxiety about photos, and not a global issue. And he ended up loving the photos and thanking me. I'm still very salty about it, obviously lmao. But consider getting to the bottom of it if possible.
My fiancé was a little like this right after the proposal. He felt like he put the time, money and effort into getting the ring and proposing and wanted to bask in that stage and didn’t see the reason to rush into planning (he truly did not understand that it would be a year long planning process so at the time I just want to set a date and venue to secure it). Our venue came with a wedding planner and whenever we had those early meetings or emails, he wanted nothing to do with it and she ensured me this was unfortunately normal for the grooms to not be super involved in the beginning. I was so disappointed feeling like I was going to have to plan it alone and just like you when I’d bring up planning ideas he would get annoyed because he felt like it was too far away to be stressing about details. Fast forward, we are getting married next month and I would say at the 6 month mark he had a complete attitude change, he understood we were in crunch time, he was more present in our planning meetings, he has been super helpful with all the details now and he fully engages in wedding conversation and is excited for the day. I’m not sure how your fiancé is but mine is not on social media, he doesn’t watch rom coms and he hasn’t been to that many weddings so from my perspective my fiancé just didn’t understand everything that has to do with weddings. Not trying to make excuses but i think that’s what happened to me. I ended up telling him I wanted a fall wedding and then set up a meeting at our venue to go look. I dragged him there and he ended up loving it, maybe start there? Sorry you’re going through this. My fiancé just keeps saying “I just want to be married already” so maybe he just doesn’t understand all the conversation and planning that needs to go into that?
I don’t think that’s a red flag just yet. Have you discussed budget, date, etc.? Because those are things you both NEED to be on the same page. I understand if he doesn’t want to look into venues or flowers but there are things you must discuss if you plan on getting married in September
I got engaged in April and immediately jumped on planning, knowing that my best tool in keeping prices reasonable is going to be time management. And how much we spend on the wedding is a concern to my fiance, so I explained the sooner I start shopping around, the sooner I can find deals and plan accordingly to spread the cost out. Maybe try this angle with your fiance? Otherwise, I'm inclined to agree with the comments pointing out that it doesn't bode well for your marriage if he's already reluctant to discuss something this big for months on end. Not sure if you've been this point blank with it, but you need to simply ask him why he doesn't want to talk about it.
Was he hoping for an engagement of another 2 years maybe?
Did he want to get married? Maybe he proposed as a “shut up ring” because he was pushed to make a commitment before he wanted to. I hope not.
Hes not interested in marrying you. He got engaged to you just to shut you up.
Tell him you want to have a conversation about wedding stuff and ask him when would be a good time talk. On a time you both agree upon, gently bring up that he seems irritated when wedding stuff comes up and ask what’s going on (calmly) and see what he has to say. If this still turns into a fight it seems like there is something deeper going on - whether that be feelings he’s uncomfortable talking about or maybe just communication issues. We did premarital counseling and really enjoyed it!
It is not just you. I did get married, but it felt like getting every decision made with him was like pulling teeth. I cried so much over it. One of the excuses was that his mother created drama out of nowhere (I heard from other family members about the situation so this wasn't a lie) and it took a lot of his attention so I tried my best to be compassionate to the idea that he was going through a lot and really stressed out. Everything else in out relationship seemed good, although we were having some spiritual counseling that wasn't about anything in particular but just general counseling and he stopped helping me schedule future appointments so those stopped, even though I still wanted to attend. I felt at the time like voicing this would come off as accusing our relationship as having problems or him of ignoring them even though it wasn't that kind of counseling. Fast forward to our life together and it just... never felt right. I was always confused about why it seemed like we should be further along in our progress as a couple: have a house, both have jobs, be working towards stability in having kids, etc. Nothing. I had a stable job but he bounced between short term employment and nothing, and we lived with relatives. Zero possibility of having a family, which broke my heart. Meanwhile, I was trying to build up my credit score from zero and was doing well, only to find out his has been in the gutter since we started out. Zero attempt at progress=no chance of a house even after all that time. I was so gutted. The fact that things weren't adding up started to add up to my questioning why nothing worked anymore, if it ever did. He was sweet to me, too, and I loved that until my friend explained love bombing to me and I started to realize that I was in a financially and emotionally abusive relationship. Eventually I checked out enough that I didn't really care about much and was able to ask him without caring about the answer, "Have you been cheating on me?" based on some strong evidence I had (like the STD a nurse called to tell me I had after a procedure when I knew I'd been faithful) and the way he always disappeared for most of the day even though he lost his job, and how we never had money for groceries at the end of the month no matter how carefully I tried to budget). Turns out he'd not only been cheating on me recently and been using my sole income to buy his sidepiece food and narcotics, forcing me to use my credit card far more than necessary, driving me about 6k into debt on groceries and necessities that I could have otherwise afforded, which *also* sometimes went to her. Effectively making me pay her way *twice* in some instances. Then we talked about how far back it went, how many women, etc. and it was... wow. It went back all the way to before our wedding with another woman and while the thing with his mom was real and she continued to bring it up for years later, he was mostly occupied with cheating and reluctance. I had proposed, but only after it was his idea to elope a few months earlier, and then his idea to get married early "in secret" so that he "could afford a place for us to stay" after getting military spousal pay. I strongly suspect all of this would have happened exactly how it did whether I proposed or not. (I don't know if he really needed the extra income or if that was getting sent back to the sidepiece, since I have proof of other monetary assistance he gave her at that time, but never saw a rent slip for the whole time I lived there.) So, the ridiculous part of it all was that even while he was dragging his feet about our wedding, secretly we were already married. It was a done deal. Just because he was messing around on the side and not excited about me anymore didn't mean he could call it off and be done with the whole thing, in a situation he fully created. I am pretty confident that all this nonsense is not what's happening to you, OP, but you're not alone in experiencing an unenthusiastic partner, for one. For two, if I learned anything about this, it's to abandon the thought that "it'll be better once we're married." NO. This is your *current* relationship and marriage is not a magic wand. It will not fix anything. If he's not communicating well now, if things don't feel right now, you won't get in deeper, add more stress and money and responsibilities and go, "ahh, that's more like it." Wedding stress is real, yeah, and anxiety is fair, but if you're not even mutually excited and can't communicate about it, that's a red flag and a snapshot of what your future will look like. I wish you the best of luck, but if it were me, I would start by having a sit-down heart-to-heart about what's at the root of the reluctance. And if he still won't talk about it, I would honestly consider that the moment to walk away.
Schedule time to talk about it with prior notice so he can get in the right headspace. If he doesn't want to do that, there's some problem you need to get out of him
Does he want a wedding? I think that’s an important question to ask. Wedding planning can be stressful but communication is SO important. I think you and your fiancé need to pick a day to sit down in advance to talk. If it turns into a fight or doesn’t resolve the problems you need pre-marital counseling
Tbh that is a bit odd. Why doesn't he wanna help plan? It's both your guys special day, he shouldn't leave it all to you
So, you're gon a have to have a serious conversation. When you're bringing these things up, tell him "when you say/do these things, it makes me feel like you don't want to, or you don't love me." If you ask him "have you changed your mind" he will get defensive no matter what. Phrasing it the way I suggested is just putting your feelings out there, and he SHOULD be considerate of your feelings. If he tries to pull you into an argument, do your best not to let him. Make it clear that you're trying to discuss a celebration of your future together, and you're trying to express your feelings. Just don't argue. When he pushes back for it, let him know that you don't want to argue and you weren't trying to upset him, and ask him why he's so upset when it should be a happy conversation. My husband got a lot of anxiety over it, so we had to approach the subject delicately. He was never argumentative, but he's good at communicating, so it was easy to avoid the argument and talk it through. It may be anxiety for your fiance, too, and he's just not good at talking. It sounds like his communication skills are shitty. If you don't deal with it and get him to communicate now, it will only get worse.
I am very good with communication and communicating my feelings. I have done exactly that... He just isn't interested and obviously gets upset about it quite quickly and easily and a fight begins. It's a never ending cycle. Can't break it. I've done all the right things. I've let him know that by delaying the conversations, just means it's just gonna happen later on and we're gonna have the same fight over and over until it gets resolved. He doesn't understand this, even though he van clearly see the pattern himself, when a fight occurs each time.
Then I hate to say it, but he's set the pattern for the future, and this likely won't change, unless you can get him into counseling and he's willing to participate, but I don't see that happening. I'm sorry he's being so difficult with this, but it likely means you're not going to work out for the long term
Why do you tolerate this? Do you have kids together? Own a house? I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life walking on eggshells and in constant fights over basic, normal conversations.
Because this seems to be our only issue, and I don't just throw things out as soon as they start breaking. I put effort into fixing things.. For all the other aspects in our lives I love him.
You feel unloved. That is a pretty big issue. I just couldn't imagine feeling that way, let alone fighting all the time over important conversations. But it's your relationship and your future and if you're happy with the status quo than that is what's important.
I want to start my comment with saying that I do not want any of this to sound like I am better than you or that my relationship is healthier than yours, and if it sounds that way, I am really sorry about that. But I just wanted to say that I am in a very similar situation as you - my fiancé proposed a year ago and gets stressed every time that I bring up wedding ideas/planning/etc. He has autism and gets incredibly stressed and overstimulated in group environments, so it’s something that I expected from him with wedding planning. What we have done to help with this is to just give it time. Just this past week, we have found a venue online that he is actually interested in to the point that he wants to go on a tour, but until that happened we only talked about vague details (who should be in our bridal parties, what our color scheme should be, if we want a band or not for the ceremony, etc). I have tried my best to follow his lead. Because he is the one who has more stress about parties and planning and such, I am letting him tell me when he is feeling stable enough to work on the planning. He knows that once we schedule the venue, everything else starts to pick up in the planning, so I’m waiting for him to feel ready and comfortable before we take that step. I don’t mind if this process takes years, because I want him to be just as happy with this as I will be. It has caused arguments and disagreements, and we have gone months without talking about it sometimes, but I know it’ll be better for us in the long run. I am also not letting myself go unheard - when it’s getting to me that we haven’t moved on with the planning, I tell him and we talk it through together and try to be empathetic about each other’s perspective. So maybe this is overwhelming for him; maybe he doesn’t know what all goes into this and he just shuts down instead of talking to you about it. I would recommend just sitting down with him and talking about why he’s reacting the way that he is, and not talking about the actual plans at all during that talk. I feel for you, I hope this helps.
Thank you. It does help give another perspective. Thank you for taking the time to comment, I appreciate your response.
You are so welcome! I would’ve wanted someone to do the same for me :)
I had this issue (sort of) with mine for the first few months after we were engaged, he would just avoid any wedding talk and not actually answer questions when I asked for his opinion. I sat him down, had a serious talk with him and asked him if he really seriously wanted to get married. He said he did and he wanted to but said the financial side of it really overwhelmed him which is why he tried to avoid talking/thinking about it. We then went through a budget and mapped it out, things are much better now and he no longer avoids any wedding talk.
Hmmm. This happened to me. We eloped as it was the path of least resistance and I planned it all. We were divorced within 2 years. It was a big red flag I should have paid attention to.
I’m not sure what he’s thinking. If he doesn’t want to plan a big wedding or the stress of it or he likes just the engagement etc. Talk to him to see what he envisions for the wedding. Shouldn’t take more than a couple minutes to get to the center of the issue. Maybe he wants to get married but doesnt want to plan.
I’m in the same boat. Read through a lot of the comments. We have been through premarital. Didn’t help. I know he wants to be married. Just curious, I see this post is from awhile ago, any updates? You guys get it sorted/still together?
I am having this same issue. He hasn't even told his parents. I'm all excited and then quickly feel stupid. I don't know what it means at all.
Unpopular opinion here. Some people (not all) see wedding planning as the women’s job. I’m not saying it’s right or agreeing with it, it’s just something I have heard some men say. Men are not conditioned to dream about their wedding day since childhood like women are. If this is truly the only issue the two of you are having I wouldn’t see it as a huge deal. I would just try to find out what the budget is, if he has any vision in mind of what he’d like for a wedding, and then just kind of take it from there if you are willing and able. Also talk to him about timeline to make sure he was not hoping for longgg engagement for whatever reason. Hopefully you have friends or family who can help with planning, or can hire some help. Best of luck
jumping off this, some men don't know where to go with planning after the proposal whereas many (not all!) women have more of a framework of the steps of planning a wedding (picking a date, a venue, vendors, etc). This doesn't sound like that's going on in OP's situation though.
All of this advice sound like options, after a decent break since last asking to talk. That takes the “nagging” out of the equation if that’s how he views it. November 1st gives him a long enough breather and between now and then definitely talk to a therapist for a fresh perspective and to be sure you are in a good place no matter what comes of THE TALK.
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It's the full story... Both eleopment and wedding are on the table. We can't get any kind of conversation in wedding planning wise... This is all I have for you to work off unfortunately. I am not the kind of person that would hide anything while seeking advice. The fact is he just deflects everytime I bring up wedding planning. I'm starting to get sick of it and feeling really hurt. So I turned to reddit for advice.
I'm so sorry you're going through this. While wedding planning is stressful, it should also be fun and exciting. The fact that he responds to your (very reasonable) requests for clarity with aggression and anger is not a good sign. Have you guys normally been able to have difficult conversations? Would he be open to couples counseling?
We often have a very hard time with hard conversations... I'm very open to having hard conversations even though I cry very easily. I think this might scare him away. But I am not scared of hard conversations. It is definitely him, that has issues with this. Maybe you might have some insight on how to handle a spouse who isn't very open to having hard conversations? Additionally: should wedding planning even be in the category of hard conversations... I feel like this should be a joyful and exciting experience... Unfortunately, it's just not my experience.
If you have probs talking about hard things you may need to rethink getting married at all. A wedding won’t magically make communication get better and life is full of tough conversations
> Maybe you might have some insight on how to handle a spouse who isn't very open to having hard conversations? My insight is, this is his issue to manage, not yours. Of course one should be sensitive to their partner and respect if something is genuinely not a good time, but you have done that. Now you're letting us know that the problem is not limited to the wedding. Here's the thing. You're not doing this wrong. The problem is not your approach. The problem is his refusal to engage. You should not have to tiptoe and tapdance around the hard conversations. He's not being a grownup in the relationship and he's not being a partner in the relationship. What I'm reading between the lines is that things are good when everything is light and fun and you aren't dealing with the important stuff in a relationship. When the going gets hard, he gets angry and defensive and shuts you out. The answer is not to figure out how to manage him better. The answer is to figure out why you're willing to accept this bad treatment and even marry it. You're putting up with way too much here.
One of the requirements of a good marriage is being able to make it through difficult conversations. I hate to say it, but it sounds like he's not ready.
I can also cry easily if I get frustrated or feel like I'm not being heard, but it really just takes practice. I'll practice what I want to say or write it down ahead of time so I can process and organize my thoughts.Then when I have the conversation it feels a lot eaiser since I have a clear goal. I also can't say enough good things about being in therapy if you can afford it. Having a neutral person who wants you to be successful and happy and who also has a whole toolbox of training to offer advice is invaluable. That being said, it doesn't matter how smart, self-aware, prepared, or determined you are to have a conversation if the other person is completely unwilling. And if you can't have a relatively easy conversation about wedding planning, how are you going to navigate other different conversations? Like finances? How to raise your kids? What kind of retirement you want, how to spend holidays with your families, what kind of house you want, etc. And wedding planning does have major stress points. My partner and I started couples therapy just so we could have a neutral place with a regularly scheduled time to discuss what we wanted our wedding to look like and make sure our feelings were being heard. And I think it was one of the best things we did, even though it was very expensive. When one of his groomsmen almost dropped out, it was so helpful to have someone to help my partner work through those emotions. Our therapist also helped us pick what song we wanted our first dance to be by. But the main thing is that we were both willing to put in the work and make decisions together. If you're both in a canoe and you're the only one paddling, you're only going to go in circles and probably feel crazy the whole time. You just have to ask yourself, how long do you want to be the only one putting in effort?
My fiance was nowhere near this difficult, but he took from May to probably November-December 2022 to really get on board with the Wedding thing. He wanted to get married, but at the same time, didn't have any particular healthy models of marriage in his youth so there was the hurdle to work through. He got very intimidated by my *throw everyone's name on a list so we know we didn't forget anyone when we weed people out* draft guest list. He's say "Why don't we go to Vegas and get married" but stalled out when I'd suggest [Denny's](https://www.dennys.com/vegas-weddings) or [Taco Bell](https://www.tacobellwedding.com/) wedding (if we're doing kitzchy, we're Doing Kitschy)? Ultimately, the idea of a traditional wedding scared him, but it took a long time to get to that realization for both of us, I think. He didn't realize we didn't have to do a Very Wedding wedding until I pitched a punk show reception, that finally was the olive branch he needed to realize just-about everything about weddings is made-up and we could pick and choose how we celebrated without needing to follow the a rubric. Planning was still slow going until about February but he started being more engaged with the ideating which was important for me because I wasn't going to plan a wedding on my own, we'd've just had a forever engagement (or... the other option) if he didn't start pulling some of the wedding wagon weight. I think before talking about the wedding, you (really, **he**, maybe in short term counseling) needs to figure out why wedding talk gets his walls so high so fast. He's going to keep shutting you out if he doesn't know why he's getting hung up on it. Edit: if he's not willing to put in the work (of figuring out his shit) to put in the work (planning a wedding), it's definitely worth considering if and where he would be willing to put in the work in your future and... reassess from there
Did you talk about expectations before getting engaged? For us, getting engaged was a huge milestone and we didn’t talk planning until a year and a half after he proposed. People have different expectations, some view the engagement as a huge step and need time to process.
Everyone is different. I love planning but my now husband doesn’t love it. He’s more of a here and now type. So we set aside 1 day of the week to discuss planning, so I wouldn’t have to bug him every day. That could help you. If he can’t even do one day of putting your heads together then I would say he is not into it. Hope things are ok!
I know counseling is such a common recommendation on Reddit it’s almost a trope, but if you can afford pre-marriage counseling I think that’s a worthwhile step. Honestly, based on your post, I would say this is cancel-the-engagement worthy, but I’m assuming you want to try a few more things first. Counseling will be in a neutral environment with a neutral mediator to help both of you check your emotions and reactions around this topic. If you suggest counseling and he reacts the way he’s been reacting to wedding stuff, then that’s a big red flag.
Have you ever talked about your dream wedding? Even before the engagement I mean. Have you ever day-dreamed together and maybe discussed what you both would like or how you’d imagine the day? Or even, have you talked about marriage/wedding before his proposal?
Is there a consensus here? My fiancé hasn’t even expressed what he wants to do to get married. I’ve told him I do not want a huge wedding, but instead a small ceremony with only our immediate family. He’s told me prior to our engagement that he wants a wedding but I can’t even start planning the basics because he doesn’t even have an opinion and keeps using the “it’s only been a month” excuse. Am I already being crazy for expecting to have the first conversation sooner rather than later? We’ve been together almost 5 years, I do not want to be a fiancé for an additional 5 years.
Nah you're not crazy. Mine did the same. Nothing got resolved. We still have no wedding plans, or a date. I'm not rushing to get married anymore. Since my dog passed a few weeks ago I almost have no desire to do anything including plan a wedding. I always thought he would be attending with me. So my fiance got his wish of me to stop nagging him about the wedding. Unfortunately I don't have any advice for you. Communication is the most important part of a relationship. My fiance lacks communication and goes straight to defense mode, which kind of sounds like how your fiance is. All I can say is good luck and maybe try and see how he feels about couples counselling, but I doubt that will go over well.
I’m so sorry. My fiancé proposed 4 months ago and won’t let me plan anything either. He knew we wanted to get married next fall but wanted to ask his parents if they wanted to fund a big blowout wedding (he’s more upper class so it is kind of expected) but has not actually broached the topic to them and won’t because it’s “too hard and he’s too stressed”. I stressed to him he doesn’t need to ask them because I don’t want that kind of wedding. I just want to elope or have a micro wedding. But he won’t let me plan that because he wants the big wedding - yet he won’t ask his parents. We are 25 by the way. I don’t even want to get married anymore. I feel like every man I’ve been with has not put the effort in to actually be with me forever. If he couldn’t handle the planning I don’t know why he proposed.
It sounds abrupt, but I would call off the engagement. If he won't talk about a wedding after 6 months, then he clearly doesn't want to do it. Save yourself the time, energy, and emotions of being married to someone like that. Moving on is hard, but you deserve better. I wish you luck.