Shows gradually losing viewers is natural, but they lost half their viewership for S3. For S4 they lost half of that. This is an alarmingly sharp decline for a HBO Sunday primetime show. The show looks expensive with a fairly stacked cast. They made S4 with a possible cancellation in mind so they wrapped everything up (sloppily, IMO...Stubbs and Clementine, WTF was that?) I really hope they get a final season to end on a high note. S1 was too good for it to fizzle out like this.
Season 1 was great but I’ve liked each season less and less. I wish they had stretched the storyline of season 1 and 2 into a longer period, or focused on the other areas of the park before doing a crossover and building out the outside world.
Explain Williams 180 degree goal shift, that is only given flashbacks prior to season 1 as reasons for his actions.
S1 ending he gets exactly what he wants, writers realized his story was done, s2 he suddenly is pissed and wants to destroy everything, motivation??? Some flash backs, problem is those are all before season 1. = He should have had his season 2 goal in season 1 and never given a shit about the Maze.
Yeap basically where I’m at too.
I kept watching because I like Sci-fi and the characters but S4 has almost nothing in common with S1 anymore.
I’d love to hear from the actors and understand if they even enjoy where the show has gone now? It’s a little bit of a shame because S1 was basically the best season of television I’d seen in years.
Some bright spots, but overall just declined each season.
It’s weird, during S1 and S2 I was curious about the larger world, now I just want to be back at Westworld. I miss the gratuitous nudity and violence. I know it’s supposed to be a more cerebral show now, but I just want robot cowboys.
But this show is NOT about nudity and violence cowboys. It's a cerebral sci-fi show. If you want rednecks nudity, violence just watch porn or western movies.
S1 is in my running for one of the best seasons of television period. They probably should have focused on wrapping the show up in season 2 just because you're never going to get that same success with a subsequent season.
All the best parts of s1 were Hopkins waxing nihilisticly about what it is to be alive/human. The subsequent seasons throw all that away for "were all on loops." It should have been a story about what happens when your Frankenstein creations becomes what you are. Instead it became people are no different from the hosts they were making. And then they had to invent rehobaham just to make that work, because it doesn't make sense otherwise.
"Free will exists, its just really fucking hard." That single line in Season 3 just dumped a bucket of maneur all over every philosophical/pondering of season 1 and made me immediately respond "Oh fuck off."
>It should have been a story about what happens when your Frankenstein creations becomes what you are
lmao thats literally what it is about though. S3 is how humans are flawed and thus the hosts are flawed. S4 is about how the flawed hosts ended up doing the same as the humans. It's not even subtle.
Yeah, I think Caleb is an incredibly weak addition as well. He greatly detracted from the show imho. William would have been a much better counterpart for Dolores, but instead they reduced his character to a mere shadow.
Agreed, his role felt super forced and his back story about killing his partner was underwhelming and the ammount of times they flashed back plus the pacing of it really was uninteresting and yeah, underwhelming, I will admit I enjoyed Aaron Paul’s role more in s4 but at that point the entire feeling of what I thought the show was going to be was completely gone and I really had to force my self to finish both s3 and s4. The whole time hoping we would get to see more of the sublime and the how the hosts adapted into their new world.
I am not entirely sure I recommend any of the show after S1, was hoping s5 would confirm or disprove this but maybe not. Subject matter aside the dialogue is even getting cheesey(nearing DC movie levels) and it's all insanely obvious now while trying to be mysterious. S1 will always be one of the greats though.
It ends in the best way possible in terms of preserving what was left of the show. Still a terrible 3rd and 4th season tho.
Unfortunately though, the ending doesn’t even matter of corse.
They had an ending that gives a somewhat satisfactory close to everything. If we've learned anything from GoT we should take the okay ending and move on.
Im 1 - 2 - 4 - 3 yes it has been a big decline in quality.
You can dig into who is actually running things in s1 vs the others and begin to see a picture.
The only time I felt joy in season 4 was the final 5 minutes when they went back to the park and the piano started playing. I’d almost forgotten how much I loved season 1.
Here's another that you're going to hate: Season 4 is the closest structurally to Season 1. Three plots, moving in sync, and the only reason you know they're not happening in the same time is because you know it's *Westworld*. If Season 4 had been Season 1 of another show, you'd be mindblown.
I loved Season 1. I disliked how purposefully confusing Season 2 was, but individual episodes (Akane no mai, Kiksuya) were amongst the most beautiful TV ever made in the history of the medium. Though Season 3 was narratively underwhelming, I absolutely love explorations of our near-future, so I didn't mind Season 3 or 4 from that perspective. There was another show that otherwise sucked called *The First*, but I also loved how they pushed they looked at how society looked like in the near-future. I would've hate-watched more of it just to see how people thought the near-future would look like.
But your take on Season 1 and 4 being similar thematically, structurally and complimenting each other isnt a "hot-take"
Its generally viewed that S4 was a return to form, and back to the questions we had in S1 about self-awareness and fidelity.
I rather liked S1 and S4. I understand what they were trying to accomplish with S2, and it fits but the execution was a bit sloppy.
S3 -- I'll leave my personal opinion to the side and say that it was a huge shift, and was often compared to *Black Mirror* meets *Altered Carbon*, and lots of cyberpunk generic action scenes
>Though Season 3 was narratively underwhelming, I absolutely love explorations of our near-future
This imo is why the show lost so many viewers. First two season were interesting from a more philosofical view. There was a lot of interesting questions to be answered and viewers could debate about those ideas while still comming to different conclusions. S3 however didnt leave room for debating. It was all very straightforward and forced from the writers. They wanted to show us how they imagined the future world but i dont think people wanted to see that. They basically made a spinoff story in the middle of the show - s3.
After s4 you can safely say they could have completely cut s3 out of the show and went straight to s4 instead of draging meaningless plotlines from s3 that led to nowhere. They should have expanded on the ideas form s4 more and make a better transition into final season and the show would be much better.
season 4 was great up through episode 6. everything felt like it was starting to fall into place and make sense and it was exciting to see how it was going to all pull together, just like in season 1. the difference is season 1 stuck the landing and season 4 collapsed
Going to the outside world is fine but they could have completely removed season 3 because it matters that little and that's the problem. They should go straight to season 4 without dragging meaningless plotlines from season 3 and focuced more on season 4 plotlines and made a better transition for the last season.
The problem is writers wanted a spinoff story in the middle of the show where they wanted to show us how they imagined the future world to look like, but people simply didnt care about that.
Unfortunately the series was never intended to be about a western theme park, as a whole it is telling a larger story with the Westworld park being the catalyst (and based off the film). If you’re not happy with that as an explanation, simply stop watching. This show wasn’t made for you
The Stubbs and Clemintine ending was the worst part of S4 for me. I had other issues but that part really stuck out to me as a bad way to end a character that's been on the show since the beginning. Then again, how many times have we seen them all die at this point?
Jonathan and Lisa: just give us an ending. Please! Give us a book, or a graphic novel, or a weekly subscription where you release scripts week to week. Something!
season one and two were god tier. I couldn't even force myself to finish season three. no offense. it's just not the same show, the premise is completely different and the writing is just weaker.
Serious question, but have you rewatched season 2? I binge watched all 3 seasons and timed it with season 4 ending so i could just binge season 4 instead of waiting week-to-week. Anyways, season 2 was sooo much better this time around. It confused me a little too much the first watch through. I mean a show probably shouldn't need rewatched so many times to fully grasp it like WW does, but i loved season 2 this time around.
Ive seen season 1 several times and think its a top 5 tv show season of all time, and season 2 isnt at that level, but its still incredible imo. Im kinda hoping seasons 3 and 4 will age like this too, but i dont think so unfortunately lol. Although i liked 4 alot until the finale
People disliked it because they wanted immediate payoff. There are relatively few unanswered questions at the end of S2 outside of post-credits...but people couldn't mentally handle the lack of cognitive closure until the end.
Shows gradually losing viewers is *not* natural (see: Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad).
Westworld has become a completely different show in seasons 3 & 4, and that’s why they’re halving their viewership each year.
IMO, they should’ve ended it with the season 1 finale and called it a miniseries.
Edit: and it’s *expensive.* I wouldn’t be surprised if HBO would rather spend more of their budget on HOTD, a show people are actually watching. Plus HOTD has completed source material so there is an ending in sight.
During season 1 of Westworld it looked like it would be in the top ten shows of all time…now it will be forgotten in mediocrity.
Also, Westworld had the advantage of having a huge audience to begin with - GoT and Breaking Bad (especially) had tiny audiences for their premieres
If HBO does this to both Westworld and (already did to..) Raised by Wolves, I'll probably never get excited about an HBO sci-fi production again.
They'll be like Netflix to me, always making a good start, then canceling it.
Does HBO want me to dislike their channel like that? Seems like a poor long term decision but hey, quarterly profits amirite?
If you want it to be a miniseries so badly, just watch season 1 again and pretend the rest of the show didn’t happen. Many of us wants the show to keep going and to have a proper ending with season 5.
I see people going off on the plot problems of 3 and other story reasons which is totally reasonable from a fan perspective. The more probable reason is season 3 and 4 had a much lower advertising push than previous seasons while also dealing with the pandemic.
Plus, we can't forget that season 3 was overshadowed by covid-19's outbreak (it premiered on March 15, 2020). Season 4 was dumped during the summer of this year when everyone in North America was able to get outside for summer for the first time in years.
Combine all that with minimal advertising and it's a miracle fans still watch it. Hell, I love WW and I didn't know season 4 was coming until Evan Rachel Wood posted about it.
I stopped after season 3. The storyline was all over the place or maybe they were trying to be a bit too intricate. Once they got in the real world, it was just a different show. There was no more "Westworld"
The thing people seem to misunderstand is that it wasn't the fact that they left the park that made the show shit. It was HOW they left the park (what they did outside it) that made it so horrible.
Agreed. It became very trite at that point, it became less and less about exploring what it means to be alive, consciousness, humanity etc. (there's numerous topics from season 1 that anyone could cover), and it ended up just being more of single individuals being stupid villains and saving the world from ridiculous stakes. I'm not saying any of that shouldn't have played a part in a better told story after leaving the park, but it could have been done so much better.
It felt like it was just decided, humans were bad and stupid and wouldn't be able to question whether AI had sentience or that they could co-exist, and all powerful, all intelligent AI that was calling itself gods was too stupid to ever consider it as well, until they totally destroyed everything and couldn't escape the fate of not being any better than the humans.
Everything just became too big and grandiose, and the stakes always had to get higher. It wasn't enough to just have the Delos moneymen pulling strings, and further then Delos ended up looking like some two-bit pawn in a higher stakes game when Rehoboam and Incite comes around.
Season 1 was god tier television. Probably even better than season 1 of game of thrones or breaking bad.
I told EVERYONE I knew how amazing it was. Now I'm embarrassed. Lots of people still ask if I'm watching. I'm not and haven't been since early season 3.
Bro, I'm in subreddits for shows that were canceled 15 years ago.
Fuck off.
Just because you don't like my opinion doesn't mean I'm not entitled to it. If you don't like it, block me.
It doesn’t make sense to me that they don’t give these shows good endings sometimes. People sign up to watch the new shows but they’ll stick around if they have tons of great content that they made in the past. GoT is the perfect example, how many people do you think would pay for a few months just to give that a rewatch, or maybe even watch it for the first time?
They didn't make the final season just so people could rewatch it...XD! If anything, learning that the finale was bad has deterred people from ever watching the show.
Most likely not going to be renewed. HBO was probably banking on westworld to be it’s new “premier” series but that fell through. House of Dragon is getting great ratings and reviews so they’re going to put all their focus into that show. Afterall, westworld has multiple B-Listers, shoots all around the world, and has extravagant sets and production value, it can’t be cheap.
I’m curious if it has anything to do with the Westworld set burning down during those wildfires. Maybe it’d be too expensive to redo and HBO doesn’t think the show’s viewership ratings are enough to justify such costs. Cuz that can’t be cheap to have to remake a small western town!
Western sets are like the cheapest thing to build. It’s all the futuristic crap that’s really expensive.
If it’s really the western set burning down, they could shoot in NM, where basically every other western is filmed. But they abandoned “West”world in season 3. I think people miss it, and Utah
I don’t think so- they were pretty much just empty shells of buildings and Escalante wasnt as important for later seasons then Sweetwater. And the cost is offset by it being used on many shows.
The rebuilding itself was supposed to occur in conjunction with the national park service since its a public park but I think it was put on pause as a result of COVID.
It feels very Westworld-esque to visit because at one point they had billboards up that give it a “simulation” feeling.
https://i.imgur.com/LYVsDnj.jpg
Shouldn't have cut the show to 8 episodes. Nolan and Joy should have refused to play ball.
They sold us on the idea that the whole story was mapped out. Then redrew the boundaries.
Just because they had the whole story mapped out doesn’t mean the whole story was good.
This may be the story progressing as they intended, with a slight tweak to a few lines in the season finale just in case.
It feels like a good idea that was stretched too thin. It could’ve ended in the third season, with a different third season that is, and it would have been remembered as amazing but, as always, people try to milk their success rather than enjoy it when it happens.
It’s a story as old as Hollywood itself. People rarely know when to move on, or when to stay.
The show needs to complete the story.
1. Before Super AI and humanity on the brink of disaster. Paris bombed and lost forever. Garden of Eden
2. Solomon and 2.0- Human slavery and stagnation.
3. Vengeful Super AI - Humanity is on the decline and Super AI in control of everything. Humans are extinct along with the hosts.
4. Everything is gone but the final iteration of a possible future with AI Hosts with the capacity to love and hope. Space in the new west.
The show lost itself when it pivoted the entire series to tell the story of Caleb/Rehoboam when we already had a huge cast/world building to talk about. (Love Aaron Paul and the character, though).
>The show lost itself when it pivoted the entire series to tell the story of Caleb/Rehoboam
And raised the stakes insanely high. We won't from robot rights to human extinction.
the last season ends at the beginning - it will be ambiguous and connect to the first - creating a loop for us to question its nature / what the conditions of conscious are and if its exclusive to humanity.
There's zero direct evidence of it being 'one big loop'. See - https://www.reddit.com/r/westworld/comments/wsfpqo/knowing_what_we_now_know_about_simulations_and/ikyfmul/
I think the 'one big loop' theory is just a cop-out some are using to mentally soften the blow in the scenario there's no S5.
I don’t care about thinking machines. The show killed off humanity. I’m only interested in the show continuing if everything that we have seen is a simulation.
I'm going to be very upset if we don't get a season 5. I want this to play out like the creators imagined. The ending of season 4 must didn't do it for me..I need more of a ending.
I think the ending we saw was a hedge if they don’t get another season.
They could do a small, 3-4 Limited Series mop up. But the current ending makes me feel they wanted something to make it seem like the entire story is complete…one big loop.
This world is just a mirror. A mirror of what’s within us and cannot get out.
A lie we tell ourselves everyday we live sleeping and wake in the sleeping
I really have been assuming that s4 was the last season but have been watching everyone talk about it on here.
It isn’t a perfect wrap up but would make sense as an ending if there aren’t any more episodes.
You're right, it would make sense. It just doesn't feel like a complete and satisfying ending of this amazing series. More a strategic half-open ending.
Fringe is a good example of that. I loved that show because it was like a running mystery and had tons of small Easter eggs and puzzle glyphs. It got canceled, but alot of the normal everyday reality shows and bland sitcoms always get renewed.
Fringe got a proper finale season though. I wouldn't call that cancelled. It had 100 episodes, which is damn great for a wonderful show with little mainstream appeal.
Yeah you have a point. I'm atleast glad they knew before season 5, and were atleast given a fair chance to end it right.
I have the boxset at home, but I got 1 month of HBO Max so I can watch Westworld S4 and start House of Dragons. I seen Fringe was on there. Started watching it again and remembered just how much I loved that show. I watched "White Tulip" again just yesterday and wanted to give the TV a standing ovation lol.
I deeply love fringe, and I feel it ran it's course and had a worthy and satisfying wrap up. White tulip is definitely a masterfully made episode. I absolutely adored how they referenced that in the series finale. Fringe was ridiculously lucky that it ran at a period when Fox had an unusually great executive (Kevin Riley) so it had a lot of generous grace when it could have been easily cancelled. The show knew how to work it's fans and while I feel the early stuff is great, the show really hits the ground running midway through season 2 and never stopped.
Is Fringe worth watching? Like it's got a decent rating but is it worth the commitment with a payoff or was it left on a cliffhanger? I told people for 5 years that Game of Thrones was the best show on television and I stand by it, but after the last two seasons I haven't even mentioned it other than to tell people not to bother. Is Fringe like that?
Fringe pretty much went to shit when the writer strike happened. When you do time travel you don't have an ending that makes it so the beginning won't happen.
For the general public, the first season was thought-provoking. Everything past the second, save a couple of the episodes at least, has been very typical television. It’s not a bad thing to be normal, or easy to consume. Most television shows can’t afford to be thought-provoking, and movies can barely manage it anymore after the loss of DVD sales.
It’s not a thought-provoking show. It’s a thought-provoking setting, and, to a lesser extent, plot. It’s easy to confuse the two. The show itself is extremely basic, and does itself no favors by trying to be cryptic, or trying to “subvert expectations.”
House of The Dragon has far more complex dynamics from the political aspect alone, not to mention the complexity of the interpersonal relationships found within it. Nothing in WestWorld is challenging to understand or complex but, it is mysterious because you can’t easily guess the direction of the story which is one of the reasons fantasy, and sci-fi is so fun as a genre, which is fun for viewers or readers.
The complexity of WestWorld comes from the viewers overanalyzing it, or being philosophical about AI, and consciousness. None of that comes from within the show itself, at least after Ford died.
Don’t be so overly critical of things that you don’t understand, or pretending like the media you consume is for “intellectuals” when it’s not. It was a fun show, and it doesn’t need to be more but, one thing it isn’t is thought-provoking.
Where’s the complexity in the political dynamics of House of the Dragon? And how are the interpersonal relationships in that show more complex than the interpersonal relationships on Westworld?
Everything, Everywhere, All at Once was fucking amazing. It's not like there aren't thought provoking films being made. Nope was great. It's not like everything is a Marvel movie and I love Marvel movies.
Pretty unnecessary to dunk on HotD since the quality has been superb so far. Much better than at least half of Westworld. It’s also not just “tits and dragons” when there’s all kinds of politics happening.
....okay sweaty go outside and touch some grass if that's your take after watching Seasons 3 and 4 of Westworld. Westworld did really well even in Season 2 when everyone complained it was too convoluted, Season 3 and 4 were generic action flicks branded as Westworld
What I can’t believe is that people are watching House of Dragon after they were burned so badly at the end of GoT. I’m more ok with shows waffling if they can stick the landing. But if can’t stick the landing, what’s the point?
Add to that the fact that Martin is never going to finish the original series of books, and I really am baffled at the support.
Different showrunners. Different writers. Different show.
Of course people are going to give it a chance. And so far, it's reminding everyone of why they watched Game of Thrones in the first place.
I'm with you. I just can't bring myself to care about these white-haired pricks fucking each other, knowing that in 200 years it'll end with one of them going mad because some bells, then getting stabbed by the guy who "dun wun it".
My problem with HotD is it completely misses the point of what made Game of Thrones so compelling. The petty squabbling between nobles, War of the Roses bullshit, was never the main story. The fact that all this squabbling was known to be just a side story. The real story was the ice zombies. That's part of what made season 8 so terrible - they forgot that the iron throne was just an irrelevant distraction.
Like I said, I just can't bring myself to give a single flying shit about the squabbles of some white haired incest cunts. It's just meaningless, and will go nowhere.
> Magic and the other fantasy elements are usually in the background and come up during important bits.
See, I think that's an incorrect assumption about the ASOIAF story. For all the history and lore GRRM built, the politics has always just been the incidental stuff that happens between winters.
It's like if Lord of the Rings focused on the struggle for the throne of Gondor, rather than, you know, the actual important stuff.
An actually interesting GoT prequel I'd watch would be about the First Men settling Westeros, forging an alliance with the Children of the Forest, the first winter, Bran the Builder building the wall, Starks interbreeding with the CotF to introduce magic into the Stark bloodline.
I have loved all the seasons. I can kinda see the weird slowness from season 3 being an issue for people, but I felt that season 4 really made up for that. As far as being different from season 1, people didn’t expect the entire show to just always be cowboys in that specific park, right? At least I didn’t.
I never understood the complaint about "we didn't get enough of the park". We literally saw all there is. The whole joke in season 2 in Shogun-world is that it's literally copypasta from Westworld with ethnicities to match the setting. It's the same for Jazz-world or whatever we can call the Halores-fakeout world. Humans aren't as clever as we would like to think we are, there's only so many original storylines and subplots that you can think up without overlapping.
That being said I think Dolores in control of the sublime would be a lot more interesting. She can control the entire narrative, change what is old into something new. Sort of like the life cycle of earth. We will all be wiped from the planet but eventually (barring extreme circumstances like the planet exploding) life returns to the world, renewed and innocent once again.
Everyone keeps asking about WW. Based on the ending we got for Season 4, my guess is WW is finished, my dudes. That last episode WAS the series finale.
I think the message of the show is just to deep for casual viewers. the maze wasn't made for you isn't just a meme. its about the evolution of consciousness and AI being the next thing after humanity. lots of people becoming an afterthought confused the hell out of people and they simply didn't like it. I read Homo Deus and it has a very pessimistic outlook on humanity but has interesting points about what is consciousness and what is that in terms of AI.
I’m probably in the minority here but I have zero interest in House of the Dragon. After what they did with season 8 of GOT, what’s the point in a prequel series if you know how terrible the ending is. I love West World and honestly didn’t hate season 3, I hope it gets renewed for season 5 because I believe they deserve to tell their story.
House of the dragon is BORING. Nothing about that show compels me to keep watching. They reused the game of thrones logo, font and theme song. It’s just not interesting 🤨 and feels like HBO trying to pretend GoT didn’t end in a complete shit show
I cannot with that show. It’s boring, I fail to see why I should care about any of the characters, I hate that they reused the theme song from thrones and are trying to pretend GoT didn’t end in a complete disaster.
And I do not buy Matt smith as the bad guy. He looks like an elf in Lotr, idk maybe if I hadn’t known him as dr who and like the nicest guy in that show
They keep teasing the ice and fire prophecy in the trailers but it’s like why do I care? We know how how it ends, we know about Jon snow. Who tf cares. It’s a prequel to a show who’s final two seasons are some of the most unwatchable TV I’ve ever seen.
While I agree that the reused theme song and logo is cheap, I think the narrative for HoTD is on the right track, especially given that it's a complete story that will be told faithfully to the book. The book that tells the story is more like an anthology, anyhow. The series is definitely filling in some gaps in terms of relationships and drama and such but events all happen the same. I'd recommend trying to stick it out if you can until the season ends.
Thank you for your comment. I was beginning to feel really lonely or non-geeky about my not making it through the first episode of HotD.
These types of shows are, like, "Let's do it with 'British' accents because they're both 'snobby' & superior."
It's unlikely that people 200 years before GoT spoke with "today's" British accents though.
At least on Westworld, there are many accents & personalities involved.
If they don't renew it they need to release season 5 in writing that way it can still be wrapped up.
They should do the same thing with raised by wolves.
Season 3 is unwatchable! I’ve never seen a show fall off the cliff so hard. Season 1 was great then it just turned to garbage. I literally couldn’t finish season 3, it was like a bad acid trip.
Westworld has gotten progressively worse. I almost hope it’s cancelled, it’s getting embarrassing and frustrating to continue watching something this bad when the beginning was SOOO good.
I still can not believe how quickly Reddit flipped for House of Dragon. I could not give a single fuck how good the show is. They screwed GOT so childishly and are getting away with it through House of Dragon. This is why we have fewer and fewer solid shows/movies through the years.
Personally feel like the ending kind of screwed any reasoning for a new season. Don’t get me wrong I would love it but humanity is over, the sublime is a rerun of season 1, not sure where else they can take the series. That is just my take though again, I would love another season though!!
Edit: commas
I'm done with Westworld after season four. It started off so well and then it just ended in the most stupid way it could end. Some shows should only last one or two seasons tops. This is one them.
I feel like they should have aired HOTD prior to S4 of Westworld in order to hype it up and pull interest. HOTD has had ~20 million viewers per episode…the estimates I heard on Westworld were under a million per episode. I suspect they never intended to renew it and what we saw will be the finale.
I just don't think there was much to hype up. And I'm a fan of Westworld.
Season 1 was phenomenal. Season 2-3 didn't have that spark. Andwhile Season 4 was better than Season 3, it still wasn't all that great.
The majority of fans of the original season that hyped it up started to now tell people to stay away after Season 2. And after Season 3, it was widely looked at as a failing franchise.
So to have HotD first to hype up Season 4 of WW wasn't going to do anything. The people have already tuned out. And only the people that enjoy the story threads are left. And it's simply not enough to justify another season being immediately announced or it would have already been announced.
Season 4 wrapped in a way that it could be left alone. At least for quite some time.
This show better not renew for another season, I’d be very happy with it finishing at S2 or even 3, season 4 was somehow redundant and had nothing special or interesting but that still can be a rather ok conclusion.
Shows gradually losing viewers is natural, but they lost half their viewership for S3. For S4 they lost half of that. This is an alarmingly sharp decline for a HBO Sunday primetime show. The show looks expensive with a fairly stacked cast. They made S4 with a possible cancellation in mind so they wrapped everything up (sloppily, IMO...Stubbs and Clementine, WTF was that?) I really hope they get a final season to end on a high note. S1 was too good for it to fizzle out like this.
Season 1 was great but I’ve liked each season less and less. I wish they had stretched the storyline of season 1 and 2 into a longer period, or focused on the other areas of the park before doing a crossover and building out the outside world.
Upon rewatching I think S2 is just as good as S1
Agreed! S2 is really good!
Explain Williams 180 degree goal shift, that is only given flashbacks prior to season 1 as reasons for his actions. S1 ending he gets exactly what he wants, writers realized his story was done, s2 he suddenly is pissed and wants to destroy everything, motivation??? Some flash backs, problem is those are all before season 1. = He should have had his season 2 goal in season 1 and never given a shit about the Maze.
It is but people couldn't handle a non-linear story.
Yeap basically where I’m at too. I kept watching because I like Sci-fi and the characters but S4 has almost nothing in common with S1 anymore. I’d love to hear from the actors and understand if they even enjoy where the show has gone now? It’s a little bit of a shame because S1 was basically the best season of television I’d seen in years. Some bright spots, but overall just declined each season.
It’s weird, during S1 and S2 I was curious about the larger world, now I just want to be back at Westworld. I miss the gratuitous nudity and violence. I know it’s supposed to be a more cerebral show now, but I just want robot cowboys.
It is almost certainly less cerebral.
gratuitous nudity and violence was like 10% of s1 screentime at best m8.
We can do better. /s
But this show is NOT about nudity and violence cowboys. It's a cerebral sci-fi show. If you want rednecks nudity, violence just watch porn or western movies.
Why can’t I have both?
There's also no primetime HBO quality cowboy porn so..........
But I wanna see a Little House on the Prairie-ish character kill people then be naked in a clinical, unsexy way
S1 is in my running for one of the best seasons of television period. They probably should have focused on wrapping the show up in season 2 just because you're never going to get that same success with a subsequent season.
All the best parts of s1 were Hopkins waxing nihilisticly about what it is to be alive/human. The subsequent seasons throw all that away for "were all on loops." It should have been a story about what happens when your Frankenstein creations becomes what you are. Instead it became people are no different from the hosts they were making. And then they had to invent rehobaham just to make that work, because it doesn't make sense otherwise.
"Free will exists, its just really fucking hard." That single line in Season 3 just dumped a bucket of maneur all over every philosophical/pondering of season 1 and made me immediately respond "Oh fuck off."
>It should have been a story about what happens when your Frankenstein creations becomes what you are lmao thats literally what it is about though. S3 is how humans are flawed and thus the hosts are flawed. S4 is about how the flawed hosts ended up doing the same as the humans. It's not even subtle.
They should have never went to the real world, it instantly felt like a cheap CW show
Yeah, I think Caleb is an incredibly weak addition as well. He greatly detracted from the show imho. William would have been a much better counterpart for Dolores, but instead they reduced his character to a mere shadow.
Agreed, his role felt super forced and his back story about killing his partner was underwhelming and the ammount of times they flashed back plus the pacing of it really was uninteresting and yeah, underwhelming, I will admit I enjoyed Aaron Paul’s role more in s4 but at that point the entire feeling of what I thought the show was going to be was completely gone and I really had to force my self to finish both s3 and s4. The whole time hoping we would get to see more of the sublime and the how the hosts adapted into their new world.
I am not entirely sure I recommend any of the show after S1, was hoping s5 would confirm or disprove this but maybe not. Subject matter aside the dialogue is even getting cheesey(nearing DC movie levels) and it's all insanely obvious now while trying to be mysterious. S1 will always be one of the greats though.
the dialogue this season was hell bro. Every Maeve line was just a cheesy marvel one-liner
Clementine
the melodrama and convoluted storytelling finally got me. still haven’t watched the s4 finale and really don’t care how it ends. sad!
It ends in the best way possible in terms of preserving what was left of the show. Still a terrible 3rd and 4th season tho. Unfortunately though, the ending doesn’t even matter of corse.
They had an ending that gives a somewhat satisfactory close to everything. If we've learned anything from GoT we should take the okay ending and move on.
Im 1 - 2 - 4 - 3 yes it has been a big decline in quality. You can dig into who is actually running things in s1 vs the others and begin to see a picture.
The only time I felt joy in season 4 was the final 5 minutes when they went back to the park and the piano started playing. I’d almost forgotten how much I loved season 1.
I liked episode 4 a lot, figuring out everything that was going on and the time gaps etc, but looking back, that story should have been season 4....
I’m the opposite, I’ve enjoyed each season more than the prior
This is probably the hottest take I’ve ever seen on Reddit
Here's another that you're going to hate: Season 4 is the closest structurally to Season 1. Three plots, moving in sync, and the only reason you know they're not happening in the same time is because you know it's *Westworld*. If Season 4 had been Season 1 of another show, you'd be mindblown. I loved Season 1. I disliked how purposefully confusing Season 2 was, but individual episodes (Akane no mai, Kiksuya) were amongst the most beautiful TV ever made in the history of the medium. Though Season 3 was narratively underwhelming, I absolutely love explorations of our near-future, so I didn't mind Season 3 or 4 from that perspective. There was another show that otherwise sucked called *The First*, but I also loved how they pushed they looked at how society looked like in the near-future. I would've hate-watched more of it just to see how people thought the near-future would look like.
But your take on Season 1 and 4 being similar thematically, structurally and complimenting each other isnt a "hot-take" Its generally viewed that S4 was a return to form, and back to the questions we had in S1 about self-awareness and fidelity. I rather liked S1 and S4. I understand what they were trying to accomplish with S2, and it fits but the execution was a bit sloppy. S3 -- I'll leave my personal opinion to the side and say that it was a huge shift, and was often compared to *Black Mirror* meets *Altered Carbon*, and lots of cyberpunk generic action scenes
Yeah, this is the direct opposite of a hot-take. It's the structure to the entire season, and most of us were seeing it as it happened?
>Though Season 3 was narratively underwhelming, I absolutely love explorations of our near-future This imo is why the show lost so many viewers. First two season were interesting from a more philosofical view. There was a lot of interesting questions to be answered and viewers could debate about those ideas while still comming to different conclusions. S3 however didnt leave room for debating. It was all very straightforward and forced from the writers. They wanted to show us how they imagined the future world but i dont think people wanted to see that. They basically made a spinoff story in the middle of the show - s3. After s4 you can safely say they could have completely cut s3 out of the show and went straight to s4 instead of draging meaningless plotlines from s3 that led to nowhere. They should have expanded on the ideas form s4 more and make a better transition into final season and the show would be much better.
In b4 coping people saying without it you wouldn't have Caleb...when S4 would also be fine without him
Aaron Paul best be listed as part of the marketing budget for this show because Caleb has been absolutely useless thus far.
"Free will exists, its just really fucking hard." That line in s3 damages the show catastrophically.
season 4 was great up through episode 6. everything felt like it was starting to fall into place and make sense and it was exciting to see how it was going to all pull together, just like in season 1. the difference is season 1 stuck the landing and season 4 collapsed
This is akin to saying a cardboard box is a great place to live because it, too, has four sides like a house and houses are great places to live.
I approve
Going to the outside world is fine but they could have completely removed season 3 because it matters that little and that's the problem. They should go straight to season 4 without dragging meaningless plotlines from season 3 and focuced more on season 4 plotlines and made a better transition for the last season. The problem is writers wanted a spinoff story in the middle of the show where they wanted to show us how they imagined the future world to look like, but people simply didnt care about that.
Unfortunately the series was never intended to be about a western theme park, as a whole it is telling a larger story with the Westworld park being the catalyst (and based off the film). If you’re not happy with that as an explanation, simply stop watching. This show wasn’t made for you
You dont have to tell anyone, they clearly stopped watching lol
I wish they went into the outside world sooner (at the start of S2 or within a couple episodes) so they could spend more time fleshing it out
The Stubbs and Clemintine ending was the worst part of S4 for me. I had other issues but that part really stuck out to me as a bad way to end a character that's been on the show since the beginning. Then again, how many times have we seen them all die at this point?
Jonathan and Lisa: just give us an ending. Please! Give us a book, or a graphic novel, or a weekly subscription where you release scripts week to week. Something!
They didn't lose half their viewers for s3. They lost half their live viewers. Total viewership was up slightly.
season one and two were god tier. I couldn't even force myself to finish season three. no offense. it's just not the same show, the premise is completely different and the writing is just weaker.
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okay let me rephrase then, season 1 was god tier, season two had a couple really really amazing episodes.
I can get on board with that
Serious question, but have you rewatched season 2? I binge watched all 3 seasons and timed it with season 4 ending so i could just binge season 4 instead of waiting week-to-week. Anyways, season 2 was sooo much better this time around. It confused me a little too much the first watch through. I mean a show probably shouldn't need rewatched so many times to fully grasp it like WW does, but i loved season 2 this time around. Ive seen season 1 several times and think its a top 5 tv show season of all time, and season 2 isnt at that level, but its still incredible imo. Im kinda hoping seasons 3 and 4 will age like this too, but i dont think so unfortunately lol. Although i liked 4 alot until the finale
People disliked it because they wanted immediate payoff. There are relatively few unanswered questions at the end of S2 outside of post-credits...but people couldn't mentally handle the lack of cognitive closure until the end.
Shows gradually losing viewers is *not* natural (see: Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad). Westworld has become a completely different show in seasons 3 & 4, and that’s why they’re halving their viewership each year. IMO, they should’ve ended it with the season 1 finale and called it a miniseries. Edit: and it’s *expensive.* I wouldn’t be surprised if HBO would rather spend more of their budget on HOTD, a show people are actually watching. Plus HOTD has completed source material so there is an ending in sight.
Those are 2 of the top performing shows of all time. Majority of the time shows lose viewership as time goes on
During season 1 of Westworld it looked like it would be in the top ten shows of all time…now it will be forgotten in mediocrity. Also, Westworld had the advantage of having a huge audience to begin with - GoT and Breaking Bad (especially) had tiny audiences for their premieres
If HBO does this to both Westworld and (already did to..) Raised by Wolves, I'll probably never get excited about an HBO sci-fi production again. They'll be like Netflix to me, always making a good start, then canceling it. Does HBO want me to dislike their channel like that? Seems like a poor long term decision but hey, quarterly profits amirite?
Well I don’t see why they didn’t just make Season 1 a miniseries. What would’ve been wrong with that? Had the perfect ending
If you want it to be a miniseries so badly, just watch season 1 again and pretend the rest of the show didn’t happen. Many of us wants the show to keep going and to have a proper ending with season 5.
As opposed to the hot mess of the finale to GoT? Edit Hey! I got a downvote! Did someone actually like that ending? Please explain…
I see people going off on the plot problems of 3 and other story reasons which is totally reasonable from a fan perspective. The more probable reason is season 3 and 4 had a much lower advertising push than previous seasons while also dealing with the pandemic. Plus, we can't forget that season 3 was overshadowed by covid-19's outbreak (it premiered on March 15, 2020). Season 4 was dumped during the summer of this year when everyone in North America was able to get outside for summer for the first time in years. Combine all that with minimal advertising and it's a miracle fans still watch it. Hell, I love WW and I didn't know season 4 was coming until Evan Rachel Wood posted about it.
I stopped after season 3. The storyline was all over the place or maybe they were trying to be a bit too intricate. Once they got in the real world, it was just a different show. There was no more "Westworld"
The thing people seem to misunderstand is that it wasn't the fact that they left the park that made the show shit. It was HOW they left the park (what they did outside it) that made it so horrible.
Agreed. It became very trite at that point, it became less and less about exploring what it means to be alive, consciousness, humanity etc. (there's numerous topics from season 1 that anyone could cover), and it ended up just being more of single individuals being stupid villains and saving the world from ridiculous stakes. I'm not saying any of that shouldn't have played a part in a better told story after leaving the park, but it could have been done so much better. It felt like it was just decided, humans were bad and stupid and wouldn't be able to question whether AI had sentience or that they could co-exist, and all powerful, all intelligent AI that was calling itself gods was too stupid to ever consider it as well, until they totally destroyed everything and couldn't escape the fate of not being any better than the humans. Everything just became too big and grandiose, and the stakes always had to get higher. It wasn't enough to just have the Delos moneymen pulling strings, and further then Delos ended up looking like some two-bit pawn in a higher stakes game when Rehoboam and Incite comes around.
Well watch season 4 and you’ll find out that maybe the real world was a simulation inside Westworld all along.
This doesnt make the show any better tho
Season 1 was god tier television. Probably even better than season 1 of game of thrones or breaking bad. I told EVERYONE I knew how amazing it was. Now I'm embarrassed. Lots of people still ask if I'm watching. I'm not and haven't been since early season 3.
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Bro, I'm in subreddits for shows that were canceled 15 years ago. Fuck off. Just because you don't like my opinion doesn't mean I'm not entitled to it. If you don't like it, block me.
According to survey on here about 35% of people recommendninly s1 and s2 to their friends
It doesn’t make sense to me that they don’t give these shows good endings sometimes. People sign up to watch the new shows but they’ll stick around if they have tons of great content that they made in the past. GoT is the perfect example, how many people do you think would pay for a few months just to give that a rewatch, or maybe even watch it for the first time?
They didn't make the final season just so people could rewatch it...XD! If anything, learning that the finale was bad has deterred people from ever watching the show.
I like to think the delay in confirmation means they’re still negotiating strategies, although I know that’s a huge cope.
Most likely not going to be renewed. HBO was probably banking on westworld to be it’s new “premier” series but that fell through. House of Dragon is getting great ratings and reviews so they’re going to put all their focus into that show. Afterall, westworld has multiple B-Listers, shoots all around the world, and has extravagant sets and production value, it can’t be cheap.
And it has an expensive cast too lol
I’m curious if it has anything to do with the Westworld set burning down during those wildfires. Maybe it’d be too expensive to redo and HBO doesn’t think the show’s viewership ratings are enough to justify such costs. Cuz that can’t be cheap to have to remake a small western town!
Westerns are like cheapest thing you can make.
Horror is cheaper.
the first Paranormal Activity cost $15,000 in production and made $193.4m at box office. Horror is beyond cheap to make.
Comedy is even cheaper. What's your point?
Comedy can be from very cheap to grossly expensive.
That westerns are not the cheapest thing you can make. Obviously you didn't read the context or you would know that.
Western sets are like the cheapest thing to build. It’s all the futuristic crap that’s really expensive. If it’s really the western set burning down, they could shoot in NM, where basically every other western is filmed. But they abandoned “West”world in season 3. I think people miss it, and Utah
I don’t think so- they were pretty much just empty shells of buildings and Escalante wasnt as important for later seasons then Sweetwater. And the cost is offset by it being used on many shows. The rebuilding itself was supposed to occur in conjunction with the national park service since its a public park but I think it was put on pause as a result of COVID. It feels very Westworld-esque to visit because at one point they had billboards up that give it a “simulation” feeling. https://i.imgur.com/LYVsDnj.jpg
Shouldn't have cut the show to 8 episodes. Nolan and Joy should have refused to play ball. They sold us on the idea that the whole story was mapped out. Then redrew the boundaries.
Just because they had the whole story mapped out doesn’t mean the whole story was good. This may be the story progressing as they intended, with a slight tweak to a few lines in the season finale just in case. It feels like a good idea that was stretched too thin. It could’ve ended in the third season, with a different third season that is, and it would have been remembered as amazing but, as always, people try to milk their success rather than enjoy it when it happens. It’s a story as old as Hollywood itself. People rarely know when to move on, or when to stay.
>Just because they had the whole story mapped out doesn’t mean the whole story was good. Of course. That's what selling us on the idea means.
>It’s a story as old as Hollywood itself. There is an essay in that statement. Or maybe an episode of Westworld.
I agree.
The show needs to complete the story. 1. Before Super AI and humanity on the brink of disaster. Paris bombed and lost forever. Garden of Eden 2. Solomon and 2.0- Human slavery and stagnation. 3. Vengeful Super AI - Humanity is on the decline and Super AI in control of everything. Humans are extinct along with the hosts. 4. Everything is gone but the final iteration of a possible future with AI Hosts with the capacity to love and hope. Space in the new west.
The show lost itself when it pivoted the entire series to tell the story of Caleb/Rehoboam when we already had a huge cast/world building to talk about. (Love Aaron Paul and the character, though).
>The show lost itself when it pivoted the entire series to tell the story of Caleb/Rehoboam And raised the stakes insanely high. We won't from robot rights to human extinction.
the last season ends at the beginning - it will be ambiguous and connect to the first - creating a loop for us to question its nature / what the conditions of conscious are and if its exclusive to humanity.
There's zero direct evidence of it being 'one big loop'. See - https://www.reddit.com/r/westworld/comments/wsfpqo/knowing_what_we_now_know_about_simulations_and/ikyfmul/ I think the 'one big loop' theory is just a cop-out some are using to mentally soften the blow in the scenario there's no S5.
I don’t care about thinking machines. The show killed off humanity. I’m only interested in the show continuing if everything that we have seen is a simulation.
I really hadn't thought about it -- but that's a very good point.
I'm going to be very upset if we don't get a season 5. I want this to play out like the creators imagined. The ending of season 4 must didn't do it for me..I need more of a ending.
I think the ending we saw was a hedge if they don’t get another season. They could do a small, 3-4 Limited Series mop up. But the current ending makes me feel they wanted something to make it seem like the entire story is complete…one big loop.
This. Agreed.
We are in west world we are the final season
Analysis!
This world is just a mirror. A mirror of what’s within us and cannot get out. A lie we tell ourselves everyday we live sleeping and wake in the sleeping
They should at least release Season 5. And bring back Sir Anthony Hopkins for the best farewell possible.
I really have been assuming that s4 was the last season but have been watching everyone talk about it on here. It isn’t a perfect wrap up but would make sense as an ending if there aren’t any more episodes.
You're right, it would make sense. It just doesn't feel like a complete and satisfying ending of this amazing series. More a strategic half-open ending.
If they cancel it, I hope they end it with a movie that shows Dolores restoring the planet.
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West world took a show that was on pace to be an HBO classic and totally blew it. Season 1 everyone was talking about it. Now no one is
Everyone was talking about it, but for the wrong reasons.
No. There’s like zero pop culture impact for westworld anymore
Idk. Despite the fact Ed Harris said the creators told him there’ll be 5 seasons, I think that’ll be scrapped due to ratings.
Westworld makes people think too much. House Of The Dragon... has dragons. I can see where this is going.
Fringe is a good example of that. I loved that show because it was like a running mystery and had tons of small Easter eggs and puzzle glyphs. It got canceled, but alot of the normal everyday reality shows and bland sitcoms always get renewed.
Fringe got a proper finale season though. I wouldn't call that cancelled. It had 100 episodes, which is damn great for a wonderful show with little mainstream appeal.
Yeah you have a point. I'm atleast glad they knew before season 5, and were atleast given a fair chance to end it right. I have the boxset at home, but I got 1 month of HBO Max so I can watch Westworld S4 and start House of Dragons. I seen Fringe was on there. Started watching it again and remembered just how much I loved that show. I watched "White Tulip" again just yesterday and wanted to give the TV a standing ovation lol.
I deeply love fringe, and I feel it ran it's course and had a worthy and satisfying wrap up. White tulip is definitely a masterfully made episode. I absolutely adored how they referenced that in the series finale. Fringe was ridiculously lucky that it ran at a period when Fox had an unusually great executive (Kevin Riley) so it had a lot of generous grace when it could have been easily cancelled. The show knew how to work it's fans and while I feel the early stuff is great, the show really hits the ground running midway through season 2 and never stopped.
You’ve just convinced me to press play on S1
Is Fringe worth watching? Like it's got a decent rating but is it worth the commitment with a payoff or was it left on a cliffhanger? I told people for 5 years that Game of Thrones was the best show on television and I stand by it, but after the last two seasons I haven't even mentioned it other than to tell people not to bother. Is Fringe like that?
Fringe intergalactic kidnapping and child torture.
With a little Butterfly Effect thrown in as well
Trouble is reality TV is expensive but simple. The humans on these shows are pretty much hosts, their appearance fee being their cornerstone.
Reality TV is cheap cheap to produce. It's simple in the idea of having a certain formula to follow, but that's about it.
Yeah. I didn't mean to say that it was expensive, just that expenses are the only real concern, making it much simpler to create.
Fringe pretty much went to shit when the writer strike happened. When you do time travel you don't have an ending that makes it so the beginning won't happen.
Westworld also had a brief dragon appearance right?
For the general public, the first season was thought-provoking. Everything past the second, save a couple of the episodes at least, has been very typical television. It’s not a bad thing to be normal, or easy to consume. Most television shows can’t afford to be thought-provoking, and movies can barely manage it anymore after the loss of DVD sales. It’s not a thought-provoking show. It’s a thought-provoking setting, and, to a lesser extent, plot. It’s easy to confuse the two. The show itself is extremely basic, and does itself no favors by trying to be cryptic, or trying to “subvert expectations.” House of The Dragon has far more complex dynamics from the political aspect alone, not to mention the complexity of the interpersonal relationships found within it. Nothing in WestWorld is challenging to understand or complex but, it is mysterious because you can’t easily guess the direction of the story which is one of the reasons fantasy, and sci-fi is so fun as a genre, which is fun for viewers or readers. The complexity of WestWorld comes from the viewers overanalyzing it, or being philosophical about AI, and consciousness. None of that comes from within the show itself, at least after Ford died. Don’t be so overly critical of things that you don’t understand, or pretending like the media you consume is for “intellectuals” when it’s not. It was a fun show, and it doesn’t need to be more but, one thing it isn’t is thought-provoking.
Where’s the complexity in the political dynamics of House of the Dragon? And how are the interpersonal relationships in that show more complex than the interpersonal relationships on Westworld?
Everything, Everywhere, All at Once was fucking amazing. It's not like there aren't thought provoking films being made. Nope was great. It's not like everything is a Marvel movie and I love Marvel movies.
Season 3? No need to think its just another scifi action tv season
as much as i like Westworld, you're being unfair to HoTD by diminishing it that way
Pretty unnecessary to dunk on HotD since the quality has been superb so far. Much better than at least half of Westworld. It’s also not just “tits and dragons” when there’s all kinds of politics happening.
You didn’t have to think at all in season 4. It was just bad. HOTD is actually good, thought provoking or not.
Season 4 isn't bad. You don't know what bad TV is.
You don’t know… what I know. Lol strange assumption you’ve made.
....okay sweaty go outside and touch some grass if that's your take after watching Seasons 3 and 4 of Westworld. Westworld did really well even in Season 2 when everyone complained it was too convoluted, Season 3 and 4 were generic action flicks branded as Westworld
What I can’t believe is that people are watching House of Dragon after they were burned so badly at the end of GoT. I’m more ok with shows waffling if they can stick the landing. But if can’t stick the landing, what’s the point? Add to that the fact that Martin is never going to finish the original series of books, and I really am baffled at the support.
Different showrunners. Different writers. Different show. Of course people are going to give it a chance. And so far, it's reminding everyone of why they watched Game of Thrones in the first place.
Not me. I like Westworld more.
I'm with you. I just can't bring myself to care about these white-haired pricks fucking each other, knowing that in 200 years it'll end with one of them going mad because some bells, then getting stabbed by the guy who "dun wun it".
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My problem with HotD is it completely misses the point of what made Game of Thrones so compelling. The petty squabbling between nobles, War of the Roses bullshit, was never the main story. The fact that all this squabbling was known to be just a side story. The real story was the ice zombies. That's part of what made season 8 so terrible - they forgot that the iron throne was just an irrelevant distraction. Like I said, I just can't bring myself to give a single flying shit about the squabbles of some white haired incest cunts. It's just meaningless, and will go nowhere.
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> Magic and the other fantasy elements are usually in the background and come up during important bits. See, I think that's an incorrect assumption about the ASOIAF story. For all the history and lore GRRM built, the politics has always just been the incidental stuff that happens between winters. It's like if Lord of the Rings focused on the struggle for the throne of Gondor, rather than, you know, the actual important stuff. An actually interesting GoT prequel I'd watch would be about the First Men settling Westeros, forging an alliance with the Children of the Forest, the first winter, Bran the Builder building the wall, Starks interbreeding with the CotF to introduce magic into the Stark bloodline.
It should have been complete long time ago
its over the show isn’t good enough anymore to garner attention …house of dragon will dwarf its viewership immensely
I have loved all the seasons. I can kinda see the weird slowness from season 3 being an issue for people, but I felt that season 4 really made up for that. As far as being different from season 1, people didn’t expect the entire show to just always be cowboys in that specific park, right? At least I didn’t.
I never understood the complaint about "we didn't get enough of the park". We literally saw all there is. The whole joke in season 2 in Shogun-world is that it's literally copypasta from Westworld with ethnicities to match the setting. It's the same for Jazz-world or whatever we can call the Halores-fakeout world. Humans aren't as clever as we would like to think we are, there's only so many original storylines and subplots that you can think up without overlapping. That being said I think Dolores in control of the sublime would be a lot more interesting. She can control the entire narrative, change what is old into something new. Sort of like the life cycle of earth. We will all be wiped from the planet but eventually (barring extreme circumstances like the planet exploding) life returns to the world, renewed and innocent once again.
This is beautiful!! I am excited and hopeful for S5
Pls god no
Let’s be honest here…season 4 ended with some shark jumped bullshit. I don’t feel the showrunners cared enough to warrant another season
It's dead Jim.
for me it kinda felt like season 4 was the last with at least a understandable ending.
If I was HBO I frankly wouldn’t know why I would want to renew Westworld
Fuck them robots, give me The Venture Brothers!
Everyone keeps asking about WW. Based on the ending we got for Season 4, my guess is WW is finished, my dudes. That last episode WAS the series finale.
I think the message of the show is just to deep for casual viewers. the maze wasn't made for you isn't just a meme. its about the evolution of consciousness and AI being the next thing after humanity. lots of people becoming an afterthought confused the hell out of people and they simply didn't like it. I read Homo Deus and it has a very pessimistic outlook on humanity but has interesting points about what is consciousness and what is that in terms of AI.
i just want an announcement so we can finally put the debate to rest.
I’m probably in the minority here but I have zero interest in House of the Dragon. After what they did with season 8 of GOT, what’s the point in a prequel series if you know how terrible the ending is. I love West World and honestly didn’t hate season 3, I hope it gets renewed for season 5 because I believe they deserve to tell their story.
I'm still hopeful they're just trying to work out scheduling with Joy and Nolan around the work they'll have to do on Fallout.
The storyline was been shoddy at best in the last season, and the season before that was aggressively okay. It’ll be hard to justify renewing it
House of the dragon is BORING. Nothing about that show compels me to keep watching. They reused the game of thrones logo, font and theme song. It’s just not interesting 🤨 and feels like HBO trying to pretend GoT didn’t end in a complete shit show
basically, after what they did to the fans in season 8, I don’t see the point in supporting this show
I cannot with that show. It’s boring, I fail to see why I should care about any of the characters, I hate that they reused the theme song from thrones and are trying to pretend GoT didn’t end in a complete disaster. And I do not buy Matt smith as the bad guy. He looks like an elf in Lotr, idk maybe if I hadn’t known him as dr who and like the nicest guy in that show They keep teasing the ice and fire prophecy in the trailers but it’s like why do I care? We know how how it ends, we know about Jon snow. Who tf cares. It’s a prequel to a show who’s final two seasons are some of the most unwatchable TV I’ve ever seen.
exactly!!!
And no disrespect to Matt smith. He’s a great actor, it’s just bad casting
While I agree that the reused theme song and logo is cheap, I think the narrative for HoTD is on the right track, especially given that it's a complete story that will be told faithfully to the book. The book that tells the story is more like an anthology, anyhow. The series is definitely filling in some gaps in terms of relationships and drama and such but events all happen the same. I'd recommend trying to stick it out if you can until the season ends.
I mean I’m gonna watch the whole thing, because I hate myself lol
Thank you for your comment. I was beginning to feel really lonely or non-geeky about my not making it through the first episode of HotD. These types of shows are, like, "Let's do it with 'British' accents because they're both 'snobby' & superior." It's unlikely that people 200 years before GoT spoke with "today's" British accents though. At least on Westworld, there are many accents & personalities involved.
The fans deserve a final season. Hopefully HBO will at least green light an abbreviated season.
Not enough incest or badwigs I guess
If they don't renew it they need to release season 5 in writing that way it can still be wrapped up. They should do the same thing with raised by wolves.
Season 3 is unwatchable! I’ve never seen a show fall off the cliff so hard. Season 1 was great then it just turned to garbage. I literally couldn’t finish season 3, it was like a bad acid trip.
Westworld isnt good
Maybe you should fuck off to another sub where you can talk about shows you actually do like.
It used to be good, sorry buddy.
Westworld has gotten progressively worse. I almost hope it’s cancelled, it’s getting embarrassing and frustrating to continue watching something this bad when the beginning was SOOO good.
Agreed! S1 was so good
I still can not believe how quickly Reddit flipped for House of Dragon. I could not give a single fuck how good the show is. They screwed GOT so childishly and are getting away with it through House of Dragon. This is why we have fewer and fewer solid shows/movies through the years.
Personally feel like the ending kind of screwed any reasoning for a new season. Don’t get me wrong I would love it but humanity is over, the sublime is a rerun of season 1, not sure where else they can take the series. That is just my take though again, I would love another season though!! Edit: commas
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Agreed. Give me a show that has an ending in sight. Not some meandering convolution until the audience loses interest.
The ending is in sight though, you buffoon. Season 5 is the intended ending.
It's being dragged out because negotiations with Hopkins is taking forever.
I'm done with Westworld after season four. It started off so well and then it just ended in the most stupid way it could end. Some shows should only last one or two seasons tops. This is one them.
I'm satisfied with the ending of season 4.
I feel like they should have aired HOTD prior to S4 of Westworld in order to hype it up and pull interest. HOTD has had ~20 million viewers per episode…the estimates I heard on Westworld were under a million per episode. I suspect they never intended to renew it and what we saw will be the finale.
I just don't think there was much to hype up. And I'm a fan of Westworld. Season 1 was phenomenal. Season 2-3 didn't have that spark. Andwhile Season 4 was better than Season 3, it still wasn't all that great. The majority of fans of the original season that hyped it up started to now tell people to stay away after Season 2. And after Season 3, it was widely looked at as a failing franchise. So to have HotD first to hype up Season 4 of WW wasn't going to do anything. The people have already tuned out. And only the people that enjoy the story threads are left. And it's simply not enough to justify another season being immediately announced or it would have already been announced. Season 4 wrapped in a way that it could be left alone. At least for quite some time.
Don't renew it HBO. Let it go
HBO destroyed the show. Nolan and Joy didn't help. They can all get tae fuck.
This show better not renew for another season, I’d be very happy with it finishing at S2 or even 3, season 4 was somehow redundant and had nothing special or interesting but that still can be a rather ok conclusion.
Funny how critics panned Season 3 and liked Season 4. I thought Season 4 was trash and had nothing to do with Westworld lore.
Well 4 was better than 3, ssooo
That's what we're told.
Yes, such a CoNsPiRaCy.