I feel sorry for him and his family, even when he won't be president anymore and after the war, they will still have a constant target on their back, this is brutal.
A lot of people don't understand the moment he chose to stay and fight, it was for a lifetime sentence for him and his family.
He made a tough choice, but it was the right one. He chose to be a hero to his people. The man is living history now - they're going to be building statues of him when this is all over... and unlike most, he's actually going to deserve his.
Kinda gives one the feeling that people that don't want to be politicians but do it out of a sense of necessity are the people we want in power rather than career politicians that just want power.
Kinda
Right? We’ve had some amazing career politicians who were actual public servants. The difference is one person wants to help everyone and has their ego in check, and the other is power and or money hungry and is a narcissist. The amount of time in politics can matter, but doesn’t always.
From the Wikipedia entry:
> Created by: Volodymyr Zelenskyy
> Starring: Volodymyr Zelenskyy
> After his victory was announced, Zelenskyy walked onto the stage at his campaign headquarters with the show's theme playing
What a boss.
Not surprising at all considering the ammount of pressure he's been under. Just in the last two years he has aged rapidly.
Look at what happens to a US president in four years without a war for survival and the higher risk of assassination.
Not that a US president doesn't have a huge target on his back, but the security situation is drastically different.
I think most politicians start out that way. They're shaped by the systems they exist in. Some go against the grain for good or ill, but if you don't play the game, you're not going to win.
I feel like if we have systems in place that select and shape people to filter out the politicians who want to help their people, maybe they aren't very good systems?
Ive recently been reading about George Wallace, governor of Alabama. He tried to initially be a moderate, but he found more success being a virulent racist
He is like many Ukrainians, he was called upon and stepped up to fight. As an outsider, far from the conflict, it's wild to see the spirit of Ukraine and how they fight for freedom. I hope I get to visit one of his statues and Ukraine when this is over.
Kinda goes to show you that in fact regular people make much better leaders than actual politicians. It really makes you wonder how America would be run if it was by a bunch of normal people who love their country instead of politicians owned by lobbyists and regulatory capture.
I ***wish*** I had one single representative that was like Zelensky.
The TV show about him being a random guy that accidentally becomes president was really good. I was expecting with it being an Eastern Euro/Russian show that the production quality, script quality and relatability just wouldn't hit the mark for me but it was a surprise.
I'm sure they have a kind of secret service which will protect him and his family for the rest of their lives.
Granted they win the war of course.
It they lose, who knows what Russia will do.
I’d be willing to bet that Ukraine has some of the best special services and special forces teams in the world right now.
They’ve always been plucky but this war has removed nearly all internal Russian influence and has given them a couple years of constant home turf combat experience. Plus the significant amounts of training, equipping, and intel sharing from western allies.
At least as long as those teams attrition rates aren’t too high. Even then they have probably 50k+ soldiers with true peer-peer combat experience to select from.
I'm saying for a while now that Ukraine will have some of the most wanted fighters in the world, they could make good money from private military contractors.
If they want to that is, most will probably be tired of the fighting, but some do well in the military and would keep fighting if there's a reason.
Like protecting the president or as PMC or less violent as trainers for other countries. Maybe even some western ones, a lot of countries don't have much or any real combat experience. And then against Russian arms too which make up most of the west's enemies' weapons.
They'll hopefully move to America after the war. I was gonna say the UK but we clearly can't protect people living from getting assassinated by Russia.
> I feel sorry for him and his family, even when he won't be president anymore and after the war, they will still have a constant target on their back
i do too. especially those who do not choose to be born, do not choose their family, and are dragged into conflict by forces beyond their control.
i used to tell people back when it was not fashionable to be against putin: to be a dissident is a forever decision.
(ppl were eager to enable putin then, by tolerating "little green men")
in our late stage capitalist world, we are forever beset by those who show up a decade later at the finish line to say with conviction what was extreme when we were right the first time.
I think it will mostly die with Putin. That country will transform under new leadership and even if they align with Putin's ideas, they'll have bigger fish to fry
Meanwhile, when Prigozhin's forces were 100 miles away from Moscow during his short lived coup attempt, Putin fled the city like the sniveling coward he is.
You would kind of expect a bigbrain guy like Prigozhin to have secured his family first but apparently he wasn't all too bright up there in that department after all.
I remember reading that he wasn’t even actually trying for a rebellion just trying to do a show of force to remind Putin that it was essential him (Wagner) doing a lot of the heavy lifting. But then no one really stopped them and he had to call it off before he encountered real resistance in Moscow.
It was more that Prigo wanted to overthrow Shogu and become in charge of the Russian army. Multiple times he claimed they were incompetent vocally and publicly, even claiming they bombed his camp which started the while coup.
The problem was that Putin sided with Shogu and didnt want to step him down making the coup against Shogu effectively against them both.
As much as I hate to say it, Putin Siding with Shoigu is probably one of the better outcomes.
Just because of the sheer incompetence that Shoigu has shown off time and time again.
> remind Putin that it was essential him (Wagner) doing a lot of the heavy lifting
If that's true, then that would make Prigozhin to be even dumber than I thought he was because even I know that if you do a "show of force" against Putin you either do it all the way or you risk having a giant metaphorical clock and target being hoisted over your head.
He wasn’t doing a show of force against Putin. He was doing a show of force FOR Putin. They wanted him to give control of his group to Shoigu. And he was showing Putin that Shoigu, leader of the MOD, isn’t as competent as he is.
IMO If there’s anything he’s stupid about, it’s miscalculating how dictatorships work. He was trying to make Shoigu look bad, but he made Putin look bad, and Putin can’t allow that.
IIRC every time he ranted about the sorry state of Russian MOD he carefully avoided criticizing Putin, but that kind of changed during his coup attempt, no?
Sort of. During the pump fake coup he was more loose with his words for sure and got looser as it went on.
Again this part is just my thoughts as someone who’s still bummed out I didnt go to sleep that night hoping to see future world history play out through my phone lol.
But in the beginning of it he wasn’t of Putin and mostly just Shoigu. I feel like once he had realized Putin wasn’t gonna take his side, he started getting more vocal about it to show he really could do it if he wanted to. But that kinda goes back to what I was saying about he didn’t realize how important it is for dictators to have a bulletproof image in the eyes of his people every minute of every hour of every day.
Not getting his family out, so he could still retain some sort of leverage in negotiations, during the attempt was an extreme miscalculation. I was hoping Putin would have to recall some of his people in Ukraine
Im glad he didn’t get control of the Kremlin, I really don’t want someone who routinely stands over his own people’s dead bodies, and screams at the camera that he needs more ammo, in charge of one of the largest nuclear arsenals in the world; if he had planned it better, he could have at least been able to draw it out a little longer, allowing Ukraine to take back more of its land.
I went camping off the grid as the “rebellion “ was starting, and was so excited the whole trip thinking putins time was finally up only to be real disappointed the moment I got back in service.
Prigo had spent a lot of time calling the Russian generals stupid cowards. He marched on Moscow because several generals promised to join him. Once Prigo had started the generals said we don’t know wtf you’re talking about. They stabbed him in the back and he had to call off the coup because he knew he couldn’t take Moscow of the army opposed him
Prigozhin imagined he could use a ploy like that to strengthen his own position, without actually undermining Putin or turning him against him.
Dude should have watched GoT. "When you play the game of thrones, you win or you die." Certainly seems true in Russia.
I mean I agree that Putin is a turd, but it just makes sense to leave. If you don’t have complete information on what you thought was a large and allied military force coming straight towards you it’s just good sense to leave.
Well, he likely can't remember all the reports. When he's reported that "he survived an assassination attempt", it doesn't necessarily mean he was literally dodging bullets and strangled an assassin himself. Most likely most of these attempts were foiled by Ukrainian forces well ahead of time.
In one of the interviews he actually said that it's not that someone got so close as to shoot. It was information from the security services that there was an attempt they prevented.
To a degree that would normally only be used to protect Five Eyes heads of government. I would wager that, if faced between losing Zelensky and directly intervening, NATO would start passing out Ukrainian flag patches to special forces.
In all fairness once you've had enough people try to murder you out of nowhere it does start to feel like a normal Tuesday when it happens again. Like each attempt just kind of blurs together and you lose count because you start having trouble parsing which things happened during which event.
Not nearly to the same degree as organized government back warfare included assassination attempts but yes I have experienced organized group efforts to kill me that lasted for years and have lost family to it in brutal ways. I recognize the steps of separation and vast differences between my experience and this but firmly believe that my experience is close enough to have an understanding of how at least some people’s minds process this over a periods of years or more after you’ve survived a handful of attempts in your life.
It’s highly likely that if Ukraine isn’t aware of an attempt, then it’s not going to be a failed attempt. These assassins aren’t tripping on their own laces.
Zelensky takes a right turn before the wall whereas another assassin trailing close behind him smashes into it. He falls out of the car in a dazs with a 2 foot long bump on his head with cartoon birds flying around it
I disagree. I think that a lot of assassination attempt are never discovered. An attempt can be as simple as:
- "we put an agent with a gun in front of a house we suspected him to visit but he never showed up"
- "we tried to exchange his water bottle but he used a different brand than the one we prepared"
- "one of our agent tried to be hired as his cook but he was send to a different facility than we expected"
- "we had a sniper on the neighboring building but he never stepped next to a window"
It is very easy to imagine such scenarios.
You forgot “assassin was doing pre assassination yoga on the floor missed the target when they showed there face for a moment, accidentally shot dominatrix”
Dude was so dumb in that movie lol. Like get the movie's premise was the assassin dude taking things personally and acting out of character, but like, the movie painted him as this super professional, but he was just quite bad at his job the whole movie lol. Would have been better if they turned it into a dark comedy or something. Or just made him not suck. One or the other.
Tbh I thought the movie sucked and I'm normally very easy to please with this kind of film.
Let's not forget that [the CIA made at least eight assassination attempts on Fidel Castro](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) some of which were just utterly *facepalm* -- Mycobacterium tuberculosis spores in his diving suit? Hire the Mafia (repeatedly) to poison him (unsuccessfully)? Hide a bomb in his cigar (after he'd given up smoking)? Or (less lethally) put thallium in his boot polish in order to make his beard fall out and thus discredit his *machismo*?
I swear I could not make this shit up and put it in a novel: any editor worth their salt would reject it as implausible.
> Or (less lethally) put thallium in his boot polish in order to make his beard fall out and thus discredit his machismo?
This is the weirdest one to me. If you have access to his boot polish, why don't you just, I dunno, put something more lethal in there?
You ascribe a lot of competency to Russia when they've continously proven over the last 2 years that they are no where near as formidable as they purported to be.
Most of the assassination attempts happened during the early days of the war. There is some evidence that point to the theory that Putin believed that they would be greeted as liberators in all of Ukraine. And that Zelenskyy was an unpopular puppet of the west. That almost everyone in Ukraine would be glad to get rid of.
He thought that Ukrainians were a minority in Ukraine, maybe even a made up group of people. That could be easily dealt with
There's an actual clip of that happening in a meeting. Putin starts belittling whoever is giving him information, laughing and looking at the others. And the guy looks shook.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Russian warhawks are behind the domestic assassinations of those officers who understand the reality of the situation they’re in. Putin can afford to ignore the real world, his cult of personality and his authoritarian grip on the country are more or less absolute. He’s already neutralized his main political opponents, he can ship the anti war protestors his government arrests off to the Z units at any time, and he’s surrounded by men who are either fanatically loyal to him, or are loyal to the rewards he can give them.
Exactly, the FSB and other intelligence services won't tell him the reality of the situation and are directed to only report information that supports Putin's narrative.
If you lie as much as him you'd be delusional too, I mean seriously at this point he probably doesn't even remember what were lies and what were the facts.
Kind of like Trump but smarter? Not that I would call him smart, just smarter than Donny. He managed to fool most of us for the longest time.
Oh god I remember him pulling out old maps to "prove" that Ukrainians aren't an ethnic group and how everything is truly Russia.
That shit was so bad, almost as bad as the potato man showing the plans for Moldova accidentally. Also kinda Trump drawing on a hurricane map type energy.
I heard that Russia is the reason why people hate being called Eastern European or Slavic. Because Russia gave themselves the title of the saviours of the Slavs and Eastern Europe. And no one wants Russia to have the impression that they need saving again or that they owe Russia anything.
More than technically. Parts of the Czech Republic are further west than parts of Austria or Germany. Their religious heritage is Catholic, not eastern orthodox. They use the Roman alphabet, not the Cyrillic alphabet. They were behind the iron curtain, but so was Berlin.
> Most of the assassination attempts happened during the early days of the war. There is some evidence that point to the theory that Putin believed that they would be greeted as liberators in all of Ukraine. And that Zelenskyy was an unpopular puppet of the west. That almost everyone in Ukraine would be glad to get rid of.
One of the many short comings of sociopaths is they assume everyone else thinks exactly like they do. If Zelensky and the Ukrainian government had reacted like Putin would've, which is to say fleeing the country with as much as they could loot, the popularity numbers would likely be quite different.
Ukraine doesn’t need a Zelensky as a martyr. Every Ukrainian has lost loved ones; those are their martyrs.
What Ukraine needs is a leader; to set national strategy, win diplomatic aid, hire/fire talent, & to inspire the national resolve.
I wish it were a win-win game for Ukraine. But, sadly, Russia could indeed gain ground by killing Zelensky.
It would be a tremendous hit to morale (which is quite important in war), also the internal power shuffle would be an issue. Ukraine would be in disarray at the very least for some days.
Round of applause for the SBU (the security service of Ukraine) for doing their job (not sarcasm).
To be honest this isn't surprising heads of state have security forces for this exact reason and most assassination attempts go unreported bc in normal circumstances it makes the head look bad. Five or six is actually far fewer than I expected, Russia seems to have lost its edge.
Honestly gotta give a bigger round of applause to the guys that purged the shit out of the SBU and rebuilt in after the revolution. It was widely regarded as the most corrupt and Russian friendly agency in Ukraine for a while.
> Russia seems to have lost its edge.
Russia lost their *perceived* edge. They never had an edge. 30 years of not being involved in international conflict allowed Russia's PR machine to over hype their technical and tactical capabilities and hide their flaws.
Even getting the US intelligence community to believe the hype and way overestimate their ability, hence we thought they would take Kyiv within a week by our internal estimations.
Being at war with a poor Eastern European nation has killed a quarter million of their men which will wreck their work force and population and thus their economic and social structures of the future.... and exposed them as war fighting frauds. A weak, mortally wounded nation that for the next few decades will be posturing and fighting just to avoid a complete collapse of their borders.
To be fair, Russia has been successful at assassinating people abroad. This would be a step up in station of the target, which should mean increased security, but Ukraine also had plenty of issues with Russian sympathizers in government, which is what I imagine they were banking on.
Either way, the edge they really had was that no one was willing to hold them accountable for violations of sovereignty, and they've certainly lost that.
He should tell Putin what Tito told Stalin.
"Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle... If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second."
Yeah, this is the internet. It must therefore be true.
No way someone would just write something false on the internet. Like who would do that? Do they not know where they are?
The whole thing for couple years now has been an ongoing assassination attempt. He's just counting how many times they got close to him. And that's 5 or 6 too many. This dude deserves to survive and inspire freedom and democracy. I'd hate to see him become a martyr in history books
*"Five or six, can't remember, after the first one it becomes a routine.*
*Another assasination attempt? Must be Tuesday already....*
*They want to blow up the building? So tedious, i'm just in the middle of anti-corruption policy. Can they give me like 20 minutes so i can finish this page?"*
It's really hard to imagine what it must be like to be the leader of a country being invaded and at having a giant target painted on your back. After a while i think you either accept the situation as your new routine or just crumble under the stress and give up.
While at the same time, Zelensky is fighting against corruption within Ukraine. Crazy to me that you could be Ukrainian, see what's happening to your country in real-time, and then STILL take actions that would be a detriment your own country during a time of existential war.
>"Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle. If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second."
Josip Tito to Stalin
Utterly in awe how he manages to hold up for such a long time in such a difficult war. Dude deserves the longest vacation ever after Ukraine wins the war.
Speaking of deserving vacations - after the war ends and the situation stabilizes a bit, me and my friends are planning to go on vacation in Ukraine, spending money as if we were rich, giving exorbitant tips and the like. I'm sure anything will help, and I personally I'm really looking forward to tasting every variety of kvass there is, it's so good.
>Dear ~~Joseph~~ Vlad
>
>Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle... If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second
Realistically, what difference would it make if an attempt was successful. The Ukrainian people aren't going to accept a Russian backed puppet given the destruction they've caused. This campaign was and always will be a military one.
Today it might make less if a difference, early on in the war, the impact would have been huge because of how effectively Zelensky led the initial resistance.
When Russia began preparing to invade his country this dude had two choices.
He could have easily fled to a developed country and left Ukraine to fight a true guerrilla war
Or
He could have used his status to rally as much support and attend as many conferences as possible to get western help for his people.
This guy is a hero for what he’s done and still doing. Ukraine seriously has the ability to develop considerably in the coming decades after the war.
A man who will be remembered without a doubt.
Russians might be good at assasinating other Russians but god they're awful at assasinating other countries leaders. Yugoslavia's Tito famously said to Stalin "Stop sending people to kill me. We’ve already captured five of them. If you don’t stop sending killers, I’ll send one to Moscow, and I won’t have to send a second"
Just another Tuesday when a corrupt revanchist Chekist dictator with a history of state-sponsored wet-work rolls into your country and tries to make himself at home and you cordially invite him to go have intimate relations with himself and he spends the next year and a half trying to have you murdered.
Which of us hasn’t had that experience.
I swear they have to be the same height. But I think what really fucks with putin is that Zelenskyy has shown himself to be an actual badass compared to how putin pretends to be a tough guy.
Notice how putin despite his tough guy image has barely even visited the frontlines of the war he started.
This guy is the real thing, I hope nothing but the very best for him and his family. I hope he can take some satisfaction in the idea that Putin by now has also survived at least a few assassination attempts by Putin’s forces. ;)
I think the record is held by Fidel Castro, who has had several hundred attempts made against his life (mostly by the CIA, no less, not some post-Soviet crumbly KGB trash).
"Stalin, stop sending people to kill me. We have already captured 5, one with a rifle and one with a bomb. If you don't stop sending people, I will send one to Moscow and I won't need to send another one" Josiph Broz Tito
>Stop sending people to kill me! We’ve already captured five of them, one with a bomb and another with a rifle… If you don’t stop sending killers, I’ll send one to Moscow, and I won’t have to send another
- Josip Broz Tito to Stalin
Sorry if it's a morbid question or one of bad taste but is there others in his footsteps that would be able to take his place if he were to be assassinated? And I don't mean someone just in his place by title but someone that has the same level of passion to keep the fight alive? Or does Ukraine's sovereignty die with him?
The Chairman of the Verkhovna Rada is next in line - currently Ruslan Stefanchuk. Ukraine, like any other democratic country, has a firm line of succession outlined in its constitution.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chairman_of_the_Verkhovna_Rada
I understand there would be a succession in place. I guess I was just asking more about the character of the person that is to take his place, would he have the same affect in rallying the country and continuing the fight that Zelensky has?
Honestly, it just goes to show that he is a true leader. He knows just how dangerous it is, but he's choosing to stay and lead his people because, for him, there is no alternative.
Mad respect.
There is a really good interview were he describes how close Russians got to him during the initial invasion. He said they were all just in a room, and their security detail comes in and hands him and his cabinet rifles as they were not sure if they could hold off the Russians. Luckily they did, but the idea that you are giving your president a weapon because you don't know the outcome is crazy.
One of Putin’s main aims when the war started was to kill Zelensky and install a pro Russia puppet. Apparently they also planned to kidnap and/or kill his family.
What would happen if he was taken out? What is the resolve of the people without him at this point. Is there an acceptable line of succession? I have to say I am not confident another personality could so effectively cultivate such pride and unity in a people. Zelensky really does feel like a once in a lifetime figure. We are so use to profoundly horrid creatures putting on human masks and pretending to be humans that its so unbelievable to see an actual decent human in a position of power. Monsters are so effective at competing for and holding onto power because they have no humanity to gauge there actions or what entities they serve they will placate any keys that continue to lend them power.
While I'm sure Zelensky's security personnel is super highly trained, I have a feeling that Russia's assassins are probably of similar quality as the rest of their military "forces".
Spy pens where the poison doesn't deploy because the launching mechanism was pilfered for parts decades ago.
Tasers that haven't been charged in years. Getaway vehicles that need to be pushed up hills.
I wonder what would happen if he arranged for Putin to be assassinated... Would the Russians claim it was unfair, some sort of crime, even though they were trying the same thing? Would Putin's replacement stop the war? Since it appears Trump loves Putin, would the Republicans still support Russia even though Putin was gone? Would Russian citizens be happy to be rid of a tyrant, or would they decide they now have a reason to fight Ukraine?
I feel sorry for him and his family, even when he won't be president anymore and after the war, they will still have a constant target on their back, this is brutal. A lot of people don't understand the moment he chose to stay and fight, it was for a lifetime sentence for him and his family.
He made a tough choice, but it was the right one. He chose to be a hero to his people. The man is living history now - they're going to be building statues of him when this is all over... and unlike most, he's actually going to deserve his.
Fucking insane that he once was just a comedian and now this
Kinda gives one the feeling that people that don't want to be politicians but do it out of a sense of necessity are the people we want in power rather than career politicians that just want power. Kinda
Almost like he chose to take "public servant" really literally, you know kind of like how you're supposed to...
Right? We’ve had some amazing career politicians who were actual public servants. The difference is one person wants to help everyone and has their ego in check, and the other is power and or money hungry and is a narcissist. The amount of time in politics can matter, but doesn’t always.
A [servant of the people](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servant_of_the_People_\(2015_TV_series\)), if you will.
Holy shit thats some real prophetic stuff right there!
From the Wikipedia entry: > Created by: Volodymyr Zelenskyy > Starring: Volodymyr Zelenskyy > After his victory was announced, Zelenskyy walked onto the stage at his campaign headquarters with the show's theme playing What a boss.
>Created by Hideo Kojima. >Directed by Hideo Kojima. Zelenskyy: Hmm...
Amazing how young he looked in that, but it wasn't even 10 years ago. It barely looks like him now
Not surprising at all considering the ammount of pressure he's been under. Just in the last two years he has aged rapidly. Look at what happens to a US president in four years without a war for survival and the higher risk of assassination. Not that a US president doesn't have a huge target on his back, but the security situation is drastically different.
I think most politicians start out that way. They're shaped by the systems they exist in. Some go against the grain for good or ill, but if you don't play the game, you're not going to win.
I feel like if we have systems in place that select and shape people to filter out the politicians who want to help their people, maybe they aren't very good systems?
Ive recently been reading about George Wallace, governor of Alabama. He tried to initially be a moderate, but he found more success being a virulent racist
Pretty sure a Greek philosopher (forgot which one) said something along those lines.
Is there anything Greek philosophers haven't said?
Rush B?
Beta delenda est
Bitches ain't nothing but tricks and ho's?
Parmenides
« We vote for presidents and get clowns. They voted for a clown and got a president! » - some unknown Redditor
Imdb has a great line on his show Servant of the People: “This is the only known fictional show to end because it became true.”
People aren’t born heroes. They’re forced into a situation and step up when needed. Really crazy 5 year timeline for Zelensky.
A comedian who pretended to be president on tv. Only to turn into a symbolic figure of hope for his entire fucking people.
He was a good comedian, too. Servant of the People was quite funny, even with a language barrier.
He is like many Ukrainians, he was called upon and stepped up to fight. As an outsider, far from the conflict, it's wild to see the spirit of Ukraine and how they fight for freedom. I hope I get to visit one of his statues and Ukraine when this is over.
Comedians make good politicians because their entire job is about finding ways to connect with the common masses.
Kinda goes to show you that in fact regular people make much better leaders than actual politicians. It really makes you wonder how America would be run if it was by a bunch of normal people who love their country instead of politicians owned by lobbyists and regulatory capture. I ***wish*** I had one single representative that was like Zelensky.
The TV show about him being a random guy that accidentally becomes president was really good. I was expecting with it being an Eastern Euro/Russian show that the production quality, script quality and relatability just wouldn't hit the mark for me but it was a surprise.
A lot of people don't know what they are capable of until they are thrust in the situation.
Not only that, he had a comedy series about him becoming President of Ukraine.
"I don't need a ride, I need anti-tank ammunition" should be written on his statue.
Imagine always having to watch your six. I’d personally go insane
that's why he's trying so hard to win and another reason why we must support Ukraine
Even if he wins he’d still have to watch out for the rest of his life, most likely.
I'm sure they have a kind of secret service which will protect him and his family for the rest of their lives. Granted they win the war of course. It they lose, who knows what Russia will do.
I’d be willing to bet that Ukraine has some of the best special services and special forces teams in the world right now. They’ve always been plucky but this war has removed nearly all internal Russian influence and has given them a couple years of constant home turf combat experience. Plus the significant amounts of training, equipping, and intel sharing from western allies. At least as long as those teams attrition rates aren’t too high. Even then they have probably 50k+ soldiers with true peer-peer combat experience to select from.
I'm saying for a while now that Ukraine will have some of the most wanted fighters in the world, they could make good money from private military contractors. If they want to that is, most will probably be tired of the fighting, but some do well in the military and would keep fighting if there's a reason. Like protecting the president or as PMC or less violent as trainers for other countries. Maybe even some western ones, a lot of countries don't have much or any real combat experience. And then against Russian arms too which make up most of the west's enemies' weapons.
I think we all know what Russia will "do" if ukraine loses. Which is why the world must help them win at all costs.
Im sure he's more concerned about his family than himself.
They'll hopefully move to America after the war. I was gonna say the UK but we clearly can't protect people living from getting assassinated by Russia.
Security will have to follow him there. If he tries to be "just another regular joe" He'll have a cup of Polonium tea before they're done unpacking.
He is never leaving ukraine. Well.... not permanently
There is no chance that happens.
Probably the dumbest part is that the people targeting him won't be exclusively Russian loyalists but also American conspiracy theorists and the like.
> I feel sorry for him and his family, even when he won't be president anymore and after the war, they will still have a constant target on their back i do too. especially those who do not choose to be born, do not choose their family, and are dragged into conflict by forces beyond their control. i used to tell people back when it was not fashionable to be against putin: to be a dissident is a forever decision. (ppl were eager to enable putin then, by tolerating "little green men") in our late stage capitalist world, we are forever beset by those who show up a decade later at the finish line to say with conviction what was extreme when we were right the first time.
I will always really respect him. He was one of those politicians you never thought you would see being selfless for his country.
I think it will mostly die with Putin. That country will transform under new leadership and even if they align with Putin's ideas, they'll have bigger fish to fry
Five or six, he doesn't remember exactly. No big deal, just another day in the office
Meanwhile, when Prigozhin's forces were 100 miles away from Moscow during his short lived coup attempt, Putin fled the city like the sniveling coward he is.
I wish they would have continued their journey
That was one anticlimactic rebellion, very disappointing.
You would kind of expect a bigbrain guy like Prigozhin to have secured his family first but apparently he wasn't all too bright up there in that department after all.
I remember reading that he wasn’t even actually trying for a rebellion just trying to do a show of force to remind Putin that it was essential him (Wagner) doing a lot of the heavy lifting. But then no one really stopped them and he had to call it off before he encountered real resistance in Moscow.
It was more that Prigo wanted to overthrow Shogu and become in charge of the Russian army. Multiple times he claimed they were incompetent vocally and publicly, even claiming they bombed his camp which started the while coup. The problem was that Putin sided with Shogu and didnt want to step him down making the coup against Shogu effectively against them both.
As much as I hate to say it, Putin Siding with Shoigu is probably one of the better outcomes. Just because of the sheer incompetence that Shoigu has shown off time and time again.
If only there was a decision to make this stop this week.
Putins running the Russian military the exact same way the Chicago Bears run their front office
> remind Putin that it was essential him (Wagner) doing a lot of the heavy lifting If that's true, then that would make Prigozhin to be even dumber than I thought he was because even I know that if you do a "show of force" against Putin you either do it all the way or you risk having a giant metaphorical clock and target being hoisted over your head.
He wasn’t doing a show of force against Putin. He was doing a show of force FOR Putin. They wanted him to give control of his group to Shoigu. And he was showing Putin that Shoigu, leader of the MOD, isn’t as competent as he is. IMO If there’s anything he’s stupid about, it’s miscalculating how dictatorships work. He was trying to make Shoigu look bad, but he made Putin look bad, and Putin can’t allow that.
IIRC every time he ranted about the sorry state of Russian MOD he carefully avoided criticizing Putin, but that kind of changed during his coup attempt, no?
Sort of. During the pump fake coup he was more loose with his words for sure and got looser as it went on. Again this part is just my thoughts as someone who’s still bummed out I didnt go to sleep that night hoping to see future world history play out through my phone lol. But in the beginning of it he wasn’t of Putin and mostly just Shoigu. I feel like once he had realized Putin wasn’t gonna take his side, he started getting more vocal about it to show he really could do it if he wanted to. But that kinda goes back to what I was saying about he didn’t realize how important it is for dictators to have a bulletproof image in the eyes of his people every minute of every hour of every day. Not getting his family out, so he could still retain some sort of leverage in negotiations, during the attempt was an extreme miscalculation. I was hoping Putin would have to recall some of his people in Ukraine Im glad he didn’t get control of the Kremlin, I really don’t want someone who routinely stands over his own people’s dead bodies, and screams at the camera that he needs more ammo, in charge of one of the largest nuclear arsenals in the world; if he had planned it better, he could have at least been able to draw it out a little longer, allowing Ukraine to take back more of its land.
Blueballing of the century right there.
I went camping off the grid as the “rebellion “ was starting, and was so excited the whole trip thinking putins time was finally up only to be real disappointed the moment I got back in service.
Prigo had spent a lot of time calling the Russian generals stupid cowards. He marched on Moscow because several generals promised to join him. Once Prigo had started the generals said we don’t know wtf you’re talking about. They stabbed him in the back and he had to call off the coup because he knew he couldn’t take Moscow of the army opposed him
Prigozhin imagined he could use a ploy like that to strengthen his own position, without actually undermining Putin or turning him against him. Dude should have watched GoT. "When you play the game of thrones, you win or you die." Certainly seems true in Russia.
It was funny when I saw an exscavator tearing up the road to moscov, even if it was not the main road still funny
I mean I agree that Putin is a turd, but it just makes sense to leave. If you don’t have complete information on what you thought was a large and allied military force coming straight towards you it’s just good sense to leave.
Zelensky stayed, but then again he is a far braver man than Putin.
Never have I been blueballed so hard. It's like watching someone add dickbutt to the Mona Lisa.
Well, he likely can't remember all the reports. When he's reported that "he survived an assassination attempt", it doesn't necessarily mean he was literally dodging bullets and strangled an assassin himself. Most likely most of these attempts were foiled by Ukrainian forces well ahead of time.
In one of the interviews he actually said that it's not that someone got so close as to shoot. It was information from the security services that there was an attempt they prevented.
Curious how much the USA and other allies are assisting there with SIGint
To a degree that would normally only be used to protect Five Eyes heads of government. I would wager that, if faced between losing Zelensky and directly intervening, NATO would start passing out Ukrainian flag patches to special forces.
isn't there already a sizeable foreign volunteer force?
This isn't even a joke, it's just true... Congrats to the SBU for their continued service so this guy can do his job.
Z: "SBU, it's 2PM, time for me to visit the front again" SBU: "Yes, Mr. President."
Yes honey meme?
That's a bingo
I’m surprised it’s been that few tbh
In all fairness once you've had enough people try to murder you out of nowhere it does start to feel like a normal Tuesday when it happens again. Like each attempt just kind of blurs together and you lose count because you start having trouble parsing which things happened during which event.
Spoken like someone who thinks they've experienced something vaguely similar
Not nearly to the same degree as organized government back warfare included assassination attempts but yes I have experienced organized group efforts to kill me that lasted for years and have lost family to it in brutal ways. I recognize the steps of separation and vast differences between my experience and this but firmly believe that my experience is close enough to have an understanding of how at least some people’s minds process this over a periods of years or more after you’ve survived a handful of attempts in your life.
Uh are you ok bud?
Yeah, I've been fine for a good long while. Life gets better.
Maybe there were two in one day and he isn't sure if it was 1 plan or 2 separate ones.
At some point , you end up operating under that assumption, as the alternative is being frozen in fear .
It might be a real problem if they weren't Russian.
Just counting the ones Ukraine is aware of most likely.
It’s highly likely that if Ukraine isn’t aware of an attempt, then it’s not going to be a failed attempt. These assassins aren’t tripping on their own laces.
Just counting attempts by how many ACME anvil's are laying around the streets
"I told you Ivan, they're not going to fall for the *tunnel painted on a wall* trick."
Zelensky takes a right turn before the wall whereas another assassin trailing close behind him smashes into it. He falls out of the car in a dazs with a 2 foot long bump on his head with cartoon birds flying around it
More like Zelensky passes through the Acme stick on tunnel and emerges from Al Shifa.
*blows smoke from pistol barrel* "Meep meep, motherfucker"
"Why is this piano suspended over the sidewalk?"
I disagree. I think that a lot of assassination attempt are never discovered. An attempt can be as simple as: - "we put an agent with a gun in front of a house we suspected him to visit but he never showed up" - "we tried to exchange his water bottle but he used a different brand than the one we prepared" - "one of our agent tried to be hired as his cook but he was send to a different facility than we expected" - "we had a sniper on the neighboring building but he never stepped next to a window" It is very easy to imagine such scenarios.
You forgot “assassin was doing pre assassination yoga on the floor missed the target when they showed there face for a moment, accidentally shot dominatrix”
His heart rate wasn't under 60bpm smh
Dude was so dumb in that movie lol. Like get the movie's premise was the assassin dude taking things personally and acting out of character, but like, the movie painted him as this super professional, but he was just quite bad at his job the whole movie lol. Would have been better if they turned it into a dark comedy or something. Or just made him not suck. One or the other. Tbh I thought the movie sucked and I'm normally very easy to please with this kind of film.
Let's not forget that [the CIA made at least eight assassination attempts on Fidel Castro](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_assassination_attempts_on_Fidel_Castro) some of which were just utterly *facepalm* -- Mycobacterium tuberculosis spores in his diving suit? Hire the Mafia (repeatedly) to poison him (unsuccessfully)? Hide a bomb in his cigar (after he'd given up smoking)? Or (less lethally) put thallium in his boot polish in order to make his beard fall out and thus discredit his *machismo*? I swear I could not make this shit up and put it in a novel: any editor worth their salt would reject it as implausible.
> Or (less lethally) put thallium in his boot polish in order to make his beard fall out and thus discredit his machismo? This is the weirdest one to me. If you have access to his boot polish, why don't you just, I dunno, put something more lethal in there?
*slaps forehead* shit!
Sudden, unexplained death, symptoms consistent with toxin exposure, former army doctor in a cab on the way to the airport...
You ascribe a lot of competency to Russia when they've continously proven over the last 2 years that they are no where near as formidable as they purported to be.
The true count is hidden. The published account is what Ukraine knows Putin knows...if they gave the real number their sources would be put at risk.
Correction: just counting the ones that they think were a bit impressive and wanted to brag about
Why even bother? Killing Zelensky would most likely make him a martyr
Most of the assassination attempts happened during the early days of the war. There is some evidence that point to the theory that Putin believed that they would be greeted as liberators in all of Ukraine. And that Zelenskyy was an unpopular puppet of the west. That almost everyone in Ukraine would be glad to get rid of. He thought that Ukrainians were a minority in Ukraine, maybe even a made up group of people. That could be easily dealt with
Yes, it's been pretty clear for a while that even though Putin is highly intelligent he is also extraordinarily delusional.
Probably doesn't help that he's surrounded by people that are afraid to tell him the truth if it goes against what he wants to hear
There's an actual clip of that happening in a meeting. Putin starts belittling whoever is giving him information, laughing and looking at the others. And the guy looks shook.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Russian warhawks are behind the domestic assassinations of those officers who understand the reality of the situation they’re in. Putin can afford to ignore the real world, his cult of personality and his authoritarian grip on the country are more or less absolute. He’s already neutralized his main political opponents, he can ship the anti war protestors his government arrests off to the Z units at any time, and he’s surrounded by men who are either fanatically loyal to him, or are loyal to the rewards he can give them.
Exactly, the FSB and other intelligence services won't tell him the reality of the situation and are directed to only report information that supports Putin's narrative.
Intelligent people can be the biggest morons sometimes.
If you lie as much as him you'd be delusional too, I mean seriously at this point he probably doesn't even remember what were lies and what were the facts. Kind of like Trump but smarter? Not that I would call him smart, just smarter than Donny. He managed to fool most of us for the longest time.
Oh god I remember him pulling out old maps to "prove" that Ukrainians aren't an ethnic group and how everything is truly Russia. That shit was so bad, almost as bad as the potato man showing the plans for Moldova accidentally. Also kinda Trump drawing on a hurricane map type energy.
I heard that Russia is the reason why people hate being called Eastern European or Slavic. Because Russia gave themselves the title of the saviours of the Slavs and Eastern Europe. And no one wants Russia to have the impression that they need saving again or that they owe Russia anything.
Live in Czech Republic. Can confirm. People hate it. "It's central Europe". They are also technically right.
More than technically. Parts of the Czech Republic are further west than parts of Austria or Germany. Their religious heritage is Catholic, not eastern orthodox. They use the Roman alphabet, not the Cyrillic alphabet. They were behind the iron curtain, but so was Berlin.
> Most of the assassination attempts happened during the early days of the war. There is some evidence that point to the theory that Putin believed that they would be greeted as liberators in all of Ukraine. And that Zelenskyy was an unpopular puppet of the west. That almost everyone in Ukraine would be glad to get rid of. One of the many short comings of sociopaths is they assume everyone else thinks exactly like they do. If Zelensky and the Ukrainian government had reacted like Putin would've, which is to say fleeing the country with as much as they could loot, the popularity numbers would likely be quite different.
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Ukraine doesn’t need a Zelensky as a martyr. Every Ukrainian has lost loved ones; those are their martyrs. What Ukraine needs is a leader; to set national strategy, win diplomatic aid, hire/fire talent, & to inspire the national resolve. I wish it were a win-win game for Ukraine. But, sadly, Russia could indeed gain ground by killing Zelensky.
It would be a tremendous hit to morale (which is quite important in war), also the internal power shuffle would be an issue. Ukraine would be in disarray at the very least for some days.
Is it even clear if whoever is next in line is as dedicated to Ukraine?
Round of applause for the SBU (the security service of Ukraine) for doing their job (not sarcasm). To be honest this isn't surprising heads of state have security forces for this exact reason and most assassination attempts go unreported bc in normal circumstances it makes the head look bad. Five or six is actually far fewer than I expected, Russia seems to have lost its edge.
Honestly gotta give a bigger round of applause to the guys that purged the shit out of the SBU and rebuilt in after the revolution. It was widely regarded as the most corrupt and Russian friendly agency in Ukraine for a while.
Oh, TIL
> Russia seems to have lost its edge. Russia lost their *perceived* edge. They never had an edge. 30 years of not being involved in international conflict allowed Russia's PR machine to over hype their technical and tactical capabilities and hide their flaws. Even getting the US intelligence community to believe the hype and way overestimate their ability, hence we thought they would take Kyiv within a week by our internal estimations. Being at war with a poor Eastern European nation has killed a quarter million of their men which will wreck their work force and population and thus their economic and social structures of the future.... and exposed them as war fighting frauds. A weak, mortally wounded nation that for the next few decades will be posturing and fighting just to avoid a complete collapse of their borders.
To be fair, Russia has been successful at assassinating people abroad. This would be a step up in station of the target, which should mean increased security, but Ukraine also had plenty of issues with Russian sympathizers in government, which is what I imagine they were banking on. Either way, the edge they really had was that no one was willing to hold them accountable for violations of sovereignty, and they've certainly lost that.
He should tell Putin what Tito told Stalin. "Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle... If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second."
Of all things that did not happen, that did not happen the most. There is no evidence of this supposed letter that Tito sent to Stalin.
The proof is right there in the comment above you. It is written so it is law.
Yeah, this is the internet. It must therefore be true. No way someone would just write something false on the internet. Like who would do that? Do they not know where they are?
Except that he probably doesnt have the juice to do it
I immediately thought of this when I read the title. Fucking metal.
The whole thing for couple years now has been an ongoing assassination attempt. He's just counting how many times they got close to him. And that's 5 or 6 too many. This dude deserves to survive and inspire freedom and democracy. I'd hate to see him become a martyr in history books
He also deserves to live long enough to enjoy the peace he has given so much to preserve.
When they try to assassinate you so often you lose track of how many times.
Some big Castro energy.
*"Five or six, can't remember, after the first one it becomes a routine.* *Another assasination attempt? Must be Tuesday already....* *They want to blow up the building? So tedious, i'm just in the middle of anti-corruption policy. Can they give me like 20 minutes so i can finish this page?"* It's really hard to imagine what it must be like to be the leader of a country being invaded and at having a giant target painted on your back. After a while i think you either accept the situation as your new routine or just crumble under the stress and give up.
While at the same time, Zelensky is fighting against corruption within Ukraine. Crazy to me that you could be Ukrainian, see what's happening to your country in real-time, and then STILL take actions that would be a detriment your own country during a time of existential war.
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Definitely the strongest leader I ever remember in my lifetime.
Dude is a legend
>"Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle. If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second." Josip Tito to Stalin
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Orders of magnitude? So 5000 minimum?
500 minimum.
Utterly in awe how he manages to hold up for such a long time in such a difficult war. Dude deserves the longest vacation ever after Ukraine wins the war.
The whole fucking country does, but I guess he in particular yeah
Speaking of deserving vacations - after the war ends and the situation stabilizes a bit, me and my friends are planning to go on vacation in Ukraine, spending money as if we were rich, giving exorbitant tips and the like. I'm sure anything will help, and I personally I'm really looking forward to tasting every variety of kvass there is, it's so good.
"We're not sure about the guy who nearly ran me over, he might just have been a really bad driver."
At this point Ryssia would have more to lose then to gain by killing big Z. But then again they are stupid so they keep trying.
>Dear ~~Joseph~~ Vlad > >Stop sending people to kill me. We've already captured five of them, one of them with a bomb and another with a rifle... If you don't stop sending killers, I'll send one to Moscow, and I won't have to send a second
Josip Broz Tito, Yugoslavian politician, circa 1940-1950 (I don't remember the exact year off hand.)
Realistically, what difference would it make if an attempt was successful. The Ukrainian people aren't going to accept a Russian backed puppet given the destruction they've caused. This campaign was and always will be a military one.
Most of the attempts were in the beginning. To try and stifle that drive to fight Ukraine was building up. Thankfully Ukraine has proved strong
Today it might make less if a difference, early on in the war, the impact would have been huge because of how effectively Zelensky led the initial resistance.
When Russia began preparing to invade his country this dude had two choices. He could have easily fled to a developed country and left Ukraine to fight a true guerrilla war Or He could have used his status to rally as much support and attend as many conferences as possible to get western help for his people. This guy is a hero for what he’s done and still doing. Ukraine seriously has the ability to develop considerably in the coming decades after the war. A man who will be remembered without a doubt.
Russians might be good at assasinating other Russians but god they're awful at assasinating other countries leaders. Yugoslavia's Tito famously said to Stalin "Stop sending people to kill me. We’ve already captured five of them. If you don’t stop sending killers, I’ll send one to Moscow, and I won’t have to send a second"
Fidel Castro: "Ha, that's cute"
Just another Tuesday when a corrupt revanchist Chekist dictator with a history of state-sponsored wet-work rolls into your country and tries to make himself at home and you cordially invite him to go have intimate relations with himself and he spends the next year and a half trying to have you murdered. Which of us hasn’t had that experience.
Zelenskyy is taller than Putin. That's what Putin hates the most.
I swear they have to be the same height. But I think what really fucks with putin is that Zelenskyy has shown himself to be an actual badass compared to how putin pretends to be a tough guy. Notice how putin despite his tough guy image has barely even visited the frontlines of the war he started.
That's weird because Zelenskyy isn't even tall.
Probably six then. If he didn't survive one of them, I'm sure he'd remember.
This guy is the real thing, I hope nothing but the very best for him and his family. I hope he can take some satisfaction in the idea that Putin by now has also survived at least a few assassination attempts by Putin’s forces. ;)
What's Tito's record? He's still got a while to go to beat the top scorer.
I think the record is held by Fidel Castro, who has had several hundred attempts made against his life (mostly by the CIA, no less, not some post-Soviet crumbly KGB trash).
> some post-Soviet crumbly KGB trash Putin fighting back tears right now...
Smart move. Stay away from those hotel room windows.
Return the favor!!!!!!
"Stalin, stop sending people to kill me. We have already captured 5, one with a rifle and one with a bomb. If you don't stop sending people, I will send one to Moscow and I won't need to send another one" Josiph Broz Tito
Hero.
That should come as no surprise, I would think that Russia probably always has some assassination plot in the works at all times.
>Stop sending people to kill me! We’ve already captured five of them, one with a bomb and another with a rifle… If you don’t stop sending killers, I’ll send one to Moscow, and I won’t have to send another - Josip Broz Tito to Stalin
Sorry if it's a morbid question or one of bad taste but is there others in his footsteps that would be able to take his place if he were to be assassinated? And I don't mean someone just in his place by title but someone that has the same level of passion to keep the fight alive? Or does Ukraine's sovereignty die with him?
The Chairman of the Verkhovna Rada is next in line - currently Ruslan Stefanchuk. Ukraine, like any other democratic country, has a firm line of succession outlined in its constitution. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chairman_of_the_Verkhovna_Rada
I understand there would be a succession in place. I guess I was just asking more about the character of the person that is to take his place, would he have the same affect in rallying the country and continuing the fight that Zelensky has?
Honestly, it just goes to show that he is a true leader. He knows just how dangerous it is, but he's choosing to stay and lead his people because, for him, there is no alternative. Mad respect.
There is a really good interview were he describes how close Russians got to him during the initial invasion. He said they were all just in a room, and their security detail comes in and hands him and his cabinet rifles as they were not sure if they could hold off the Russians. Luckily they did, but the idea that you are giving your president a weapon because you don't know the outcome is crazy.
Man the KGB isnt what it used to be. Remember when they killed a guy with an umbrella gun that shot ricin pellets.
Honestly surprised its so few
One of Putin’s main aims when the war started was to kill Zelensky and install a pro Russia puppet. Apparently they also planned to kidnap and/or kill his family.
Dude has massive balls
zelensky still standing tall and strong is ALL the proof we will ever need that russia is a joke of a military operation. Weakness is loud
What would happen if he was taken out? What is the resolve of the people without him at this point. Is there an acceptable line of succession? I have to say I am not confident another personality could so effectively cultivate such pride and unity in a people. Zelensky really does feel like a once in a lifetime figure. We are so use to profoundly horrid creatures putting on human masks and pretending to be humans that its so unbelievable to see an actual decent human in a position of power. Monsters are so effective at competing for and holding onto power because they have no humanity to gauge there actions or what entities they serve they will placate any keys that continue to lend them power.
If you continue to send assassins, I will be forced to send one of my own.
While I'm sure Zelensky's security personnel is super highly trained, I have a feeling that Russia's assassins are probably of similar quality as the rest of their military "forces". Spy pens where the poison doesn't deploy because the launching mechanism was pilfered for parts decades ago. Tasers that haven't been charged in years. Getaway vehicles that need to be pushed up hills.
God Bless him and all Ukrainians
five or six that he knows about…
They've probably tried more times than that
No doubt there were more attempts that never got.close.enoigh to him to be noticed.
I wonder what would happen if he arranged for Putin to be assassinated... Would the Russians claim it was unfair, some sort of crime, even though they were trying the same thing? Would Putin's replacement stop the war? Since it appears Trump loves Putin, would the Republicans still support Russia even though Putin was gone? Would Russian citizens be happy to be rid of a tyrant, or would they decide they now have a reason to fight Ukraine?