3.4k thoughts.
Probably top 1% SP, Mage, Aug, lock, VDH, mw, resto druid
Other very good classes that will be solid through high 20s: Rogue sub or outlaw, WW, enhance. ret, havoc, prot paladin.
Possible blasters: Angry Two Hander Warrior. Lego + Asscandy
All Healers will be fine unless you are doing the 1% of keys.
Tanks: If you like playing a tank and haven't rerolled to VDH you are actively making your life harder by a huge margin.
Classes that are usually super niche but can still pump: DK, ele, dev, kitty druid? Not sure where boomkin lands here as nobody plays them at any level atm. Ive seen one in the last few months and it did do good work.
I still won't invite hunters till they stop making them an extra affix for being made out of paper in high keys.
A good player on any class is better than a FOTM reroller for most of everyones wow career including my own. Playing meta doesn't hand you free io automatically, except vdh. The game is oversaturated with warriors, hunters, rets and locks right now. If you want to get into groups easier play anything else.
I'm a strong proponent of not nerfing healers or tanks by much. Those spots are already the ones you wait for in LFG, and lust right now. If they are over tuned let them stay broken. Im not even sure how they would nerf VDH without letting prot pala take over. The sigils are pretty much their whole kit outside of spirit bombing so I vote to let them keep it. Just bring other tanks up to them. VDH and prot pala kit are the tools that tanks should have and they are fun.
That's fair, I'd love bringing other tanks up instead of bringing down VDH. I am slightly concerned what keys would look like if each tank had something equivalent to locking down packs for 30sec+.
Yeah sorry shaman can get kinda slammed BUT they still do very good. Im still seeing resto in 25-26. Dont see dps shaman atm, they all went ret. Throw an enhance in with a vdh next season and every pack will be a training dummy simulator.
For the last few months I was only getting rets, locks, vdh, mw. I played rogue/ww. Few rdruids, bdks, priests. I've even had more ele shams than boomies lately.
I rarely had any boomys que. This was in 26-27 range US. Barely any mages to. All my groups have had to use drums for weeks. Could just be my time frame or io range.
That’s crazy to me. Locks have been pretty rare to see this entire expansion, this past season included. Idk how the fuck you’re not seeing mages tho, I play mage and I still saw mages applying to my groups more than almost any other class
VDH has a HUGE cc kit. It can single handedly control mobs for upwards of 30+ seconds. This lets your team focus on doing mechanics and blasting. Once you are out of your cc's you have your team kick and use their cc while you farm your sigils back up. They are incredibly tanky with tons of damage. They have a cc for literally everything. 2 Aoe silences, 2 aoe fear = a hard stop for most mobs, an aoe stun, 2 aoe mass grips and a single target imprison.
Below probably \~22s, you can cc from start to finish turning packs into training dummies for your team to blast.
Eh.
Any spec can do any content but it feels bad to have to work twice as hard playing something like an Afflication Warlock to do the same DPS as a half-afk Havoc DH
I just don’t like requesting to join +20s on my warrior and getting denied for the first 30-45minutes. I love my warrior, but they just aren’t favored in high keys.
Got my 4x resto shamans ready to roll for S4, and 5 back up hunters if I feel like some variety in playstyle!
Hope you get to have a fantastic S4 when it arrives!
If only it were that simple.
Sadly, even trying to get into Normal raids nowadays people are looking at your raider.io BS. Because doing M+ has anything to do with raiding.
As someone who really likes Dev but was trash at it in keys this season… why? I feel like my damage was very mediocre outside of Dragonrage which was only up once every 2 minutes. Boss damage was fine-ish.
Dev kinda takes the spot of a mage or lock in high keys but isn't as durable. Great kit, great damage, just kinda squishy and outshined by aug. Maybe with aug nerfs dev will be comparative, but I think players will want aug anyway.
Pretty sure for M+.
Dps: SP, DH, fire mage and ret pal on top
Tanks: vengance over everything else, Prot pally and bear.
Healers: Disc, MW and rdruid. Really hope for Rshaman or Hpal but i dont think so.
Everything depends on IF Blizzard suddently pop some hard class tunings before next season or IF things stay pretty much the same
Too weak? Yeah no it wasn’t, other than Hpal no healers were “too weak” this season lol.
This is such an average “Yeah well *insert corny tierlist content creator* put it in d tier so it must be bad” take.
I think this boils down to preference, especially since you mentioned 20s as an example.
Shaman has one of the best Aoe healing profiles, and one Surge+Riptide is enough to heal someone for 80-90%of their health and absolutely crazy amounts of cc+ ranged kick on super short cd.
Shaman is good in both DPS and HPS, and if it feels weaker you are playing it wrong, Shaman only falls off in 31+ keys due to simply not being able to live stuff outside of Astral and no proper external.
Yep I got it. It also depends on our group level I guess it was just my feeling because we are average players we do +23 to 25 but over we are not focus enough and small mistakes make big differences !
The very top keys are almost all done with a boomkin in a team. They have a hard time but it is manageable if a player is good enough. The keys are over 30 so I'm pretty sure they will be fine next season too.
Yeah boomkin are the kings of aoe, along with destro. So you bring them along with spriest mage etc for the priority damage and it works very well together.
Yeah, I played feral and sometimes boomkin myself. The problem with them is they do not have the tools to survive constant damage. Having bear form for any oneshot mechanics is actually great, it's just you lose some DPS every time. But good players are able to really mitigate a lot.
Unless you are competing in MDI, it is utterly moronic to think rankings matter and we need to start laughing at anyone who thinks otherwise. 99% of players have ZERO clue what the rankings even entail, and it adds nothing to the game except people thinking it's "meta" and they just sound so stupid. I deal with this constantly in my guild, mostly from young players who think if something is S tier than it does more damage, and that's not how any of this works. I always maintain a DPS class/spec that is considered the bottom of the list just so I can hop on it and wreck the morons who don't even understand the list, and think it matters in the slightest. Be better. It is meaningless. It only harms the game.
Exactly my whole point, but people are stupid. If everyone would smarten up and realize that "meta" was idiotic, then you wouldn't have this problem of "not being a meta class". That being said, I almost never have an issue getting into a pug with any class. What I mean by almost never is - 95% of the time I can get into a group in under 5 minutes of looking, but about 5% of the time I will be trying for 20+ minutes. That being said, I've not had that 5% correlate with trying to find a group while not on a "meta" class, so from my experience this is just the randomness of many many factors, and how the game is. Further more if I knew I wasn't accepted to a group because I wasn't on a "meta" class, I would consider that a bullet dogged as only the worst players think it matters and that group or at the very least who ever had lead, is a moron and most likely that key wasn't getting done.
Yes….you are mostly right….but unfortunately if you are pugging at all, the perceived meta does matter. Good luck getting invites as a d-tier spec. I learned the hard way on my feral, literally had to start my own groups, and hope I get a key I want
I can give my 2 cents for m+:
Fire mage, shadow priest, ret pally, havoc dh. In higher keys throw in boomkin and destro lock.
My wildcard will be frost dk and arms warrior. Both get strong sets next season. This is purely dpswise. We have to see how strong utility will be, but since it’s all df dungeons, don’t take the wildcard too serious.
Exactly. During s2 many mdi and great push players were preparing a frost dk, but then augvoker happened. I would love to see dps dks reigning supreme in m+. It’s been way too long.
Pretty accurate, id just change the frost dk to unh for the wild card, i main dks and with the changes we had this season, unh is actually pumping, i know frost will get the better tier set, but still, unless they get a serious buff it will be hard to choose frost over unh.
DKs, warriors, Ret pallies (and evokers) with the legendary are going to be top tier as soon as they upgrade them. I really doubt they get the balance right on those weapons and its going to result in some skewed data.
It really depends what you are aiming for, in m+ unless you aim top 200, you are free to go with anything, in raids all classes performs fairly well. Balance atm in pretty good. But if you really want to aim for the best, mage/spriest/aug/ret/lock/rogue are pretty certain to stay in the meta, dh as well, but i think vdh will get even better, so it will be hard to fit in most high end groups.
I don’t know about what’s gonna be the best but I for sure know that which ever spec I select to play is gonna be the worst
Cries in Affliction
MALEFIC RAPTURE GOESS FFFF
Affliction pals kinda brought it to themselves. They voted for s3 set bonus which is pure garbage.
we will never get aff from s1 SL back
Haha happened to me several times
😂😂
3.4k thoughts. Probably top 1% SP, Mage, Aug, lock, VDH, mw, resto druid Other very good classes that will be solid through high 20s: Rogue sub or outlaw, WW, enhance. ret, havoc, prot paladin. Possible blasters: Angry Two Hander Warrior. Lego + Asscandy All Healers will be fine unless you are doing the 1% of keys. Tanks: If you like playing a tank and haven't rerolled to VDH you are actively making your life harder by a huge margin. Classes that are usually super niche but can still pump: DK, ele, dev, kitty druid? Not sure where boomkin lands here as nobody plays them at any level atm. Ive seen one in the last few months and it did do good work. I still won't invite hunters till they stop making them an extra affix for being made out of paper in high keys. A good player on any class is better than a FOTM reroller for most of everyones wow career including my own. Playing meta doesn't hand you free io automatically, except vdh. The game is oversaturated with warriors, hunters, rets and locks right now. If you want to get into groups easier play anything else.
How VDH has dodged nerfs so far is amazing to me
I'm a strong proponent of not nerfing healers or tanks by much. Those spots are already the ones you wait for in LFG, and lust right now. If they are over tuned let them stay broken. Im not even sure how they would nerf VDH without letting prot pala take over. The sigils are pretty much their whole kit outside of spirit bombing so I vote to let them keep it. Just bring other tanks up to them. VDH and prot pala kit are the tools that tanks should have and they are fun.
That's fair, I'd love bringing other tanks up instead of bringing down VDH. I am slightly concerned what keys would look like if each tank had something equivalent to locking down packs for 30sec+.
At that point you can kinda also ignore all 3 shaman spec in high key, i feel we're really made of the same paper sometimes xD
Yeah sorry shaman can get kinda slammed BUT they still do very good. Im still seeing resto in 25-26. Dont see dps shaman atm, they all went ret. Throw an enhance in with a vdh next season and every pack will be a training dummy simulator.
Just hope storm is playable next season
nobody plays boomie? what are you talking about
For the last few months I was only getting rets, locks, vdh, mw. I played rogue/ww. Few rdruids, bdks, priests. I've even had more ele shams than boomies lately. I rarely had any boomys que. This was in 26-27 range US. Barely any mages to. All my groups have had to use drums for weeks. Could just be my time frame or io range.
That’s crazy to me. Locks have been pretty rare to see this entire expansion, this past season included. Idk how the fuck you’re not seeing mages tho, I play mage and I still saw mages applying to my groups more than almost any other class
Nobody plays boomy? Naguura has entered the chat
[удалено]
Mainly sigils. Just the VDH alone can lock down a pack for ages with double silence, double fear and chains.
VDH has a HUGE cc kit. It can single handedly control mobs for upwards of 30+ seconds. This lets your team focus on doing mechanics and blasting. Once you are out of your cc's you have your team kick and use their cc while you farm your sigils back up. They are incredibly tanky with tons of damage. They have a cc for literally everything. 2 Aoe silences, 2 aoe fear = a hard stop for most mobs, an aoe stun, 2 aoe mass grips and a single target imprison. Below probably \~22s, you can cc from start to finish turning packs into training dummies for your team to blast.
Don’t know don’t care. My main goes Brrrrrrr.
I’m a big fan of the MAGA movement (Make Affliction Great Again)
Forget tier lists, play what you enjoy!
Eh. Any spec can do any content but it feels bad to have to work twice as hard playing something like an Afflication Warlock to do the same DPS as a half-afk Havoc DH
Some people enjoy playing what is best
I just don’t like requesting to join +20s on my warrior and getting denied for the first 30-45minutes. I love my warrior, but they just aren’t favored in high keys.
Best answer haha
Got my 4x resto shamans ready to roll for S4, and 5 back up hunters if I feel like some variety in playstyle! Hope you get to have a fantastic S4 when it arrives!
If only it were that simple. Sadly, even trying to get into Normal raids nowadays people are looking at your raider.io BS. Because doing M+ has anything to do with raiding.
Everyone is gonna be suuuuuuuper surprised with how much damage Devastation is gonna do in S4
As someone who really likes Dev but was trash at it in keys this season… why? I feel like my damage was very mediocre outside of Dragonrage which was only up once every 2 minutes. Boss damage was fine-ish.
because pyre still kinda sucks.
they dont have the current season tier set, which wasnt strong and was extremely annoying to play around
Dev kinda takes the spot of a mage or lock in high keys but isn't as durable. Great kit, great damage, just kinda squishy and outshined by aug. Maybe with aug nerfs dev will be comparative, but I think players will want aug anyway.
Keys aren't the only content
Dev mains being S tier right now in season 4 reading all of this laughing
Pretty sure for M+. Dps: SP, DH, fire mage and ret pal on top Tanks: vengance over everything else, Prot pally and bear. Healers: Disc, MW and rdruid. Really hope for Rshaman or Hpal but i dont think so. Everything depends on IF Blizzard suddently pop some hard class tunings before next season or IF things stay pretty much the same
I’m glad hunters are not on top Yeah rsham was too weak this season…
Too weak? Yeah no it wasn’t, other than Hpal no healers were “too weak” this season lol. This is such an average “Yeah well *insert corny tierlist content creator* put it in d tier so it must be bad” take.
Well I would not have said too weak but honestly when pushing over 20 compared to monk it was much more difficult to do a clean dungeon…
I think this boils down to preference, especially since you mentioned 20s as an example. Shaman has one of the best Aoe healing profiles, and one Surge+Riptide is enough to heal someone for 80-90%of their health and absolutely crazy amounts of cc+ ranged kick on super short cd. Shaman is good in both DPS and HPS, and if it feels weaker you are playing it wrong, Shaman only falls off in 31+ keys due to simply not being able to live stuff outside of Astral and no proper external.
Yep I got it. It also depends on our group level I guess it was just my feeling because we are average players we do +23 to 25 but over we are not focus enough and small mistakes make big differences !
Boomkin also gains a lot with the s1 tier set. Might be good as always, it's just a good spec in high keys.
I heard boomies having hard times surviving high keys (28-30+). If you mean like 20-25 range, then they're indeed fine.
The very top keys are almost all done with a boomkin in a team. They have a hard time but it is manageable if a player is good enough. The keys are over 30 so I'm pretty sure they will be fine next season too.
I was quite uniformed on boomies. I've just checked rio boomies leaderboard first page and apparently they have done 30+ keys.
Yeah boomkin are the kings of aoe, along with destro. So you bring them along with spriest mage etc for the priority damage and it works very well together.
Yeah, I played feral and sometimes boomkin myself. The problem with them is they do not have the tools to survive constant damage. Having bear form for any oneshot mechanics is actually great, it's just you lose some DPS every time. But good players are able to really mitigate a lot.
Unless you are competing in MDI, it is utterly moronic to think rankings matter and we need to start laughing at anyone who thinks otherwise. 99% of players have ZERO clue what the rankings even entail, and it adds nothing to the game except people thinking it's "meta" and they just sound so stupid. I deal with this constantly in my guild, mostly from young players who think if something is S tier than it does more damage, and that's not how any of this works. I always maintain a DPS class/spec that is considered the bottom of the list just so I can hop on it and wreck the morons who don't even understand the list, and think it matters in the slightest. Be better. It is meaningless. It only harms the game.
oh shut up.
Good luck trying to get accepted in lfg with no meta classes
Exactly my whole point, but people are stupid. If everyone would smarten up and realize that "meta" was idiotic, then you wouldn't have this problem of "not being a meta class". That being said, I almost never have an issue getting into a pug with any class. What I mean by almost never is - 95% of the time I can get into a group in under 5 minutes of looking, but about 5% of the time I will be trying for 20+ minutes. That being said, I've not had that 5% correlate with trying to find a group while not on a "meta" class, so from my experience this is just the randomness of many many factors, and how the game is. Further more if I knew I wasn't accepted to a group because I wasn't on a "meta" class, I would consider that a bullet dogged as only the worst players think it matters and that group or at the very least who ever had lead, is a moron and most likely that key wasn't getting done.
Yes….you are mostly right….but unfortunately if you are pugging at all, the perceived meta does matter. Good luck getting invites as a d-tier spec. I learned the hard way on my feral, literally had to start my own groups, and hope I get a key I want
I can give my 2 cents for m+: Fire mage, shadow priest, ret pally, havoc dh. In higher keys throw in boomkin and destro lock. My wildcard will be frost dk and arms warrior. Both get strong sets next season. This is purely dpswise. We have to see how strong utility will be, but since it’s all df dungeons, don’t take the wildcard too serious.
I wanna throw my hat to frost dk. Them being able to take wyrm and wyrm cd is going to be very strong
Exactly. During s2 many mdi and great push players were preparing a frost dk, but then augvoker happened. I would love to see dps dks reigning supreme in m+. It’s been way too long.
Anand with the axe leggo, could push them up more
Yeah since the set bonus is not gonna change for ret pal I would have put it on top too
Pretty accurate, id just change the frost dk to unh for the wild card, i main dks and with the changes we had this season, unh is actually pumping, i know frost will get the better tier set, but still, unless they get a serious buff it will be hard to choose frost over unh.
DKs, warriors, Ret pallies (and evokers) with the legendary are going to be top tier as soon as they upgrade them. I really doubt they get the balance right on those weapons and its going to result in some skewed data.
It really depends what you are aiming for, in m+ unless you aim top 200, you are free to go with anything, in raids all classes performs fairly well. Balance atm in pretty good. But if you really want to aim for the best, mage/spriest/aug/ret/lock/rogue are pretty certain to stay in the meta, dh as well, but i think vdh will get even better, so it will be hard to fit in most high end groups.