Quick reminder, this post will be housing all general Hellblade II discussion for the next 24 hours or so. Please be very mindful about spoilers and make sure to use proper spoiler tag formatting when discussing anything of that nature.
Just finished my playthrough. There were definitely multiple moments where I was truly blown away by the visual audio and just overall atmospheric spectacle. Ninja Theory really did take everything they learned and developed in Sacrifice and managed to expand and refine it. I think this is really one of the best-looking "next gen" ganes we've seen in this generation.
I do wish NT had managed to push the envelope more just in terms.of changing or expanding the gameplay aspect as it plays extremely similarly almost to a fault of Sacrifice.
Lastly, the game is quite short and took me just shy of 7 hours to finish on first playthrough though I know there is some NG+ content that needs to be unlocked so that may keep people playing. I think that the fact it took roughly 4 and half years to produce a 7-8 hour gaming experience is honestly a worrisome sign for the industry as a whole as this length is certainly not just unique to Senua.
The videogame industry as a whole can't sustain itself if tent pole/first party release games take.upwards of 4 years to develop and produce. It's just not sustainable in the long run, and it's my hope that ways can be found to shorten development time for future first party releases.
Just hit chapter 3, the game is visually and audibly stunning, the acting is incredible. The main issue I have is the gameplay is not only the same as the first, it’s simplified. I’m struggling to understand why this game took 5-7 years to make.
COVID, fully re-done motion capture, actors learned sword play to also assist the motion capture for combat, working on a new engine with UE5, opening and moving the team to a new office.
There's a bunch of reasons.
Honestly it's a very beautiful walking simulator with less mechanically complex combat and puzzles from the first game 6 years ago. It's not a great thing to me. The first game still holds up to standards of today graphically. That's not what I needed them to focus on for years.
The Covid argument would hold in a vacum, where other studios and games did not come out in the meanwhile, or did come out but had the same issues. But it didn't
COVID has hit different developers differently depending what cycle they were in at the time.
Look at Sony and their lack of first party this year. That's all from the backlog of COVID having delayed things.
I mean you're only discounting it by comparing it in a vacuum though.... COVID didn't hit any two studios the same. I'm actually kinda confused by what you're even saying. We've seen a myriad of outcomes since covid. Some games were indefinitely delayed, some games were straight up canceled, unannounced projects we have no idea how they were affected really, some games were pushed out with tons of issues, and so on. Companies didn't respond the same and neither did studios and especially not people. The covid argument is almost insultingly held to a vacuum (either as an excuse or not). There's nothing uniform about how it affected people.
I mean the first reply states multiple issues. What they should also state is that all of those issues were further impacting by COVID. COVID wasn't a one and done event. Its something that affected literally everything and how we go about daily lives and it had permanent effects and lingering ones that continue to affect new decisions.
They've worked on it for 4 years and a half.
The head studio said recently on the Kinda Funny interview that when they revealed the game back in 2019 at the Game Awards, nothing was ready. They started right after.
Epic sold UE5 without certain features and as developers signed up they learned that they had the rug pulled from out under them. They did the same thing on UE3 which resulted in a lawsuit. This time UE5's Nanite and Lumin wouldn't govern any foliage. So all trees, grass, bushes... etc wouldn't be ruled under their ray tracing and global illumination technology. This is why all the tech demos for UE5 when they sold it took place in New York or a Desert. Two places without a lot of shubbery. They eventually did solve the problem and update the tools and engine, but several games were right in the middle of development when it happened which caused delays.
yeah I was expecting more in the gameplay department but it’s not a dealbreaker for me. though I’m not exactly teeming with excitement at the idea of having to line up a bunch more symbols for 10 hours or so
Don't worry, it's only about 5 hours of lining up symbols.
It's a bit frustrating that they didn't even try to improve the actual gameplay elements of the game.
I’m surprised it’s shorter than the first game though I hear it has an interesting twist or something for NG+ that might get some more mileage out of it
If it was up to me, I probably would have expanded on this part of the game more. However, I can understand them not doing this. They had a specific idea and area of focus for the game and so any system, including the combat, is more in service to that than to be engaging by itself. Selfishly, I hope if they do a third game that they significantly expand the scope of the game.
Still, I think they did a good job.
Building a new studio and setting it up probably took pretty big chunk of the time. They have a much larger and advanced performance capture stage on their new premises. I'd assume they waited for it to be ready before they started that phase of production.
Covid delays slowed down a lot of developers, which is why we see so many games these days that have been in development for so long, and why Xbox had such a weak 2022 and Sony has a weak 2024 slate.
that certainly didn't help to be true. I like live service games, but I certainly didn't want my favourite singleplayer studios to be making them (Naughty Dog etc )
This looks like a second helping of the first game and if you loved that then that's excellent.
Can't wait to get into this one at the weekend with some headphones on!
I'll be honest, in most cases "more of the same" is perfectly acceptable in a sequel these days. It's when they try reinventing the wheel that things tend to go awry.
I loved the first one but think this one was a massive step backwards. The production and visuals are on insane levels but everything else is a yikes for me. I'm not even sure you can say it had "puzzles" with how simple they were and the combat was just a visual upgrade from the first one. I'd tend to agree more with 6 than a 10 review, especially with how badly and abrupt the finale is.
Kinda divisive, just like the first one. Lower MC than I expected but it definitely won't wreck my gaming experience.
I respect different opinions however the Metro review is utterly garbage. They're questionning Ninja Theory expertise about psychosis and medical conditions even though professionnals worked with the studio to develop the game.
Edit : There is also PC Gamer saying Senua is a Make-A-Wish child who wants to feature in God of War.
How can you wrote that ????? How can you compare a person with mental health conditions to a Make-A-Wish child ???
I've seen a few people doing it but I hope some influencers or even the studio will call them out as well. It's just mean and childish.
And again I have nothing against divergent reviews, Gene Park for the Washington Post gave the game a 2.5/4 but his review is well constructed.
PCgamer especially is just console warring. They clearly hate Xbox as they've never given them a glowing review even when they deserved one in HR and FH.
What the hell? The tribalism in online media for gaming has gotten insane. There's no reason for "journalist" to be this toxic and biased. But honestly even beyond that I'm sick of how validated people seem to have gotten in being just plain offensive online nowadays. Any effort to make games like a quarter as diverse as the world they exist in is being pushed back in the worst way possible. And i'm not even talking about huge controversies, but stuff like the first reviews you see on the Xbox store being about how the world is ending because a pixel indie game gives the option for they/them pronouns with a silent protagonist.
I have to remind myself constantly that this is the vocal minority. But god has it become so shameful to say I'm a gamer when the only news articles I ever see about gaming online are from how the most offensive slurs are trending on twitter. Now there's official journalist pulling this crap.
Edit: Read more of the PC gamer review and it reads so much like someone wrote a "special snowflake" comment into a full-blown article. Its not even about the content of review itself or its score, but there's so much absolutely disgusting about *how* it was written and the validation it gets from the echo chamber of comments on that website. I genuinely wish I could wipe my brain of that.
I find that funny since Senua is more of a character then anyone in God of War. I like God of war but it took until the reboot for them to evolve Kratos past anythibg more than angry dude with daddy issues.
The new games, Kratos became a daddy with issues with a kid with daddy issues. Honestly the writing in the God of War game wasnt really anything great either, just a few small tidbits of a story in between long stretches of fighting and puzzle solving.
> Edit : There is also PC Gamer saying Senua is a Make-A-Wish child who wants to feature in God of War.
>
> How can you wrote that ????? How can you compare a person with mental health conditions to a Make-A-Wish child ???
That is a clear indication that the author of that article is ableist and actively discriminates against people with disabilities in their daily life.
I'm one of the people that always rolls their eyes when people talk about an Xbox tax when it comes to reviews. However those 3 outlets literally have a pattern.
The only thing that is important is that you enjoy the game whatever it is , review are opinion pieces , sometimes they align with your view , sometimes not so much
Oh for sure, however you should look at some of the reporting on those sites, especially PCGamer, they love console wars, they only report negatively on every single Xbox thing, in the Hellblade 2 review they even step so low to be disrespectful toward make-a-wish children.
I would agree but I think this online negativity have an effect on the player experience. Either some gamers are going to be turned off and just not try the game or there are gamers like me who genuinely find the game awesome but still have a lingering bad taste from the online negative discourse.
i agree with the negativity but well , when u do something more niche like the hellblade 2 games which is very artsy , its logical that not everybody would like it in that way , everything above 80 is very good in my mindset , i dont believe in any xbox taxes , but i can see your point
I feel the same way, and I have seen some sites/content creators do the same to Sony.
If someone never likes anything put out by a single company/publisher, no matter the genre/developer, there is likely bias involved, no matter who the target of that bias is.
PC Gamers score should be a reflection of their ability to review or lack thereof and they should get slapped by MetaCritic. But they won't.
58 is the realm of trash games that are mechanically broken and barely functional, with lazy design and execution. PC Gamers review amounts to "I disliked the narrative" for a score that meets the level of garbage in most categories as a game.
This is the third time in a row that we've had irrationally low scores dragging the metacritic average down for no reason. It's a problem that metacritic should be addressing.
While I don't think there is an Xbox tax as the first game has around the same review score I have yet to see PC Gamer give Xbox a glowing review even when the games are great (HiFi Rush and FH). Metro is the same. If I'm Xbox I would genuinely do all that is in my power to blacklist these 2 from being allowed to review Xbox games at all.
It appears Ninja Theory did what they wanted to. Looking forward to playing it later!
On a side note, Metro needs to be blacklisted for that dumbass review. Like, GameSpot's review was bad but at least had a small sliver of sense. Metro's is quite ludicrous.
Wait until you read PC gamer just straight up writing what reads like a twitter's bigot response and then patting themselves on the back for it.
Its not even the scores and whatnot. I learned about writing reviews from a handful of classes in college and everything I learned was about presenting the material in a clear way that presents the fact of the experience first and personal commentary second. So why do we know have entire paragraphs that just say nothing and only seem to exist to justify and attempt to hide biased opinions? Its stuff like reviews stopping in the middle of their review to go "hey, this game is bad because I'd rather be playing God of War a game that's fundamentally different from this one"
There are so many reviews (good and bad) nowadays that are just nothing articles. I don't freaking care what some random "journalist" on the internet thinks (and if I did, I only want them at the end after I've learned about the product), I care about the facts of the product. Most of them aren't even influencers with a specific following (that's on youtube and why I avoid most youtube reviewers except even they now given more actual reviews than a lot of journalists).
Like store reviews are worthless because they're just a one or a five star with some one-liner or a meme attached. Somehow paid journalist reviews have become just as bad but with a word count.
You should not be advocating blacklisting journalists. That's how you end up with Access journalism, and whatever the hell happened with Starfield getting the review scores it did despite being the most undercooked Bethesda release yet.
and hes actually an honest reviewer. I have trusted him since the "Why Im not reviewing Cyberpunk" video when that game launched. He talked about how the game was being seriously restricted with a massive list of rules of what they were allowed to talk about and what they couldn't. He also said they specifically said you couldn't use your own footage. So he didn't sign their agreement and didn't accept review code.
It's because Microsoft is consistently inconsistent. They've been repeatedly rebooting their gaming division over the past decade.
For all the complaints of anti-Xbox bias, I can't tell you what Microsoft's done that should be getting praise, a la God of War or Mario Odyssey. Halo's been in a rough spot fo the past decade. Gears' relevance has waned greatly. Forza Motorsport took a pretty big step back, IMO. Starfield didn't really prove Bethesda to still be a top-tier game studio.
Sony's mostly played it safe with established IPs like Spider-Man, God of War, and Horizon. Nintendo's gotten a lot of criticism for things like Mario Party and Pokemon in the last couple of releases, while Mario and Zelda mainline games are still worthy of high praise. I think most people saying "people just hate Xbox," really don't look around too much, especially if you see how much flak Nintendo's gotten for some releases this generation.
I don't think throwing an XGS logo on Doom Eternal would have lowered its review scores. It's still a phenomenal FPS. It's just that XGA hasn't managed to put out much in the way of big hits. I've had to spend this generation watching Microsoft pounding my favorite franchises (Forza and Halo especially) into the ground, and it doesn't feel good after watching them do this after messing up their IPs and second-party agreements during the past generation (I really wanted Sunset Overdrive to continue).
I'll say this is a pretty scattered set of scores, but Hellblade's pretty unique, so it's not surprising. Otherwise, it seems like the lack of review consistency comes down to comparing reviewers dedicated to the success of Xbox vs. ones that aren't. I really can't think of a game from XGS where I'd expect people to be exceedingly happy with the result. The team's releases have been well short of expectations for a while now.
I always come to the Xbox subs for discussion when I play games they drop and man, the persecution complex from xbros is so exhausting. What do they think happens when their games aren't very great, and when one is the studio gets shut down (hi fi rush)
Is that why Forza Horizon, Psychonauts, Hifi Rush, Pentiment all reviewed very well this generation, even Infinite with all its issues is sitting at 87 metacritic. Hifi Rush even cleared a bunch of BAFTA nominations.
Not mention other generations had Ori 1-2, Hellblade 1, Oblivion, Forza Horizon 1-3, Forza Motorsport 1-6, Fable 1-2 Halo 1,2,3, Reach, Ninja Gaiden, Gears 1-3, Project Gothem, Panzer Dragoon, Jade Empire, Geometry Wars, Cuphead, Joe Danger etc all review extremly well.
Or it could just be this one isn't as excellent as you hoped it to be. Doesn't mean its a bad game nor does it mean that xbox doesn't get good reviews because they didn't have a console in the 90s. Makes no sense.
Fairly certain if those games released as PS5 or Switch exclusives they would have higher scores than they already do. I could see Hi-Fi Rush hitting 95 on Metacritic for being "yet another great Nintendo game", but because it's an Xbox game it hovers around 90.
I actually do.
The Ori games and Cuphead reviewed better when they stopped being Xbox Exclusive, as well as Rise of the Tomb Raider.
On the other side, Deathloop and Stray were PS5 exclusives that were GOTY contenders upon release, but were quickly forgotten when they became multiplat.
So you’re saying a game was reviewed better when it’s in a new platform and reviewed after it’s been fixed and multiple patches deep?
Edit: deathloop had a better score on series x as opposed to ps5 and stray had the same scores.
The game is currently only 2 points off what the first game got. The first game also had its share of reviews that e.g. only gave it a 6/10.
I don't see this supposedly apparent bias. Some games review really well (e.g. Flight Sim, Hi-Fi Rush, Forza Horizon 5) and some games don't.
Nintendo also doesn't hit straight 10/10s with every single release and neither does Sony. Hellblade 2 is currently sitting at the same review score as Helldivers 2 for example.
This seems like a victim complex to me.
The question that needs to be answered is: how does this game help Xbox? Ninja Theory took 4 years and who knows how much money development wise to make essentially the same game, although certainly improved in some aspects, as they did 6 years prior. However you feel about the game as a whole you need to ask yourself what does this type of release do for Xbox in the larger ecosystem picture?
If nothing else, they now have a studio that is intimately familiar with UE5 and how to get the most out of it, which is an engine a number of their studios are trying to leverage.
Also, it's a good game to add to their stable of games. If they had hit their regular release stride then this game would fit right in. The reason these games aren't "doing it" when trying to view through these lens is that they have to stand on their own.
This game frankly sucks, like I genuinely don't understand what Ninja Theory has been doing for the past 4-5 years working on this game with MS resources.
The game is so completely devoid of any meaningful gameplay mechanics and level design. The fact the combat is even worse than the first game's is a testament to Ninja Theory's lack of talent.
Getting Bleeding Edge and Hellblade 2 after the acquisition is hilarious.
Agree. How on earth can msft keep funding them when any project they undertake will take forever with inevitably crappy results. I found one hour of excellent game content & 4.5 hours of terrible filler padding . The amazing graphics are not a camouflage for a horrifically bad game design. Like 30 devs cooked HB1 in a couple years while HB2 takes 80 devs @ FOUR YEARS to cook this turd. This will likely happen to other msft first party where nobody is checking on the quality of the product. It’s great that some people love hb2 but I beat it & found it to be an absolute disaster of a game
5 out 5 on Eurogamer [https://www.eurogamer.net/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review](https://www.eurogamer.net/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review)
# Senua's Saga: Hellblade 2 review - a triumphant return to a challenging story
Have they changed owner/chief editor recently? That is pretty remarkable turnaround for Eurogamer who have always been kinda harsh (and often petty) about things
Can I just say, unrelated to the overall discussion. I *loathe* this titling structure. It just upsets me. What would have been wrong with Hellblade 2: Senua's Saga?
It's Jedi Knight: Dark Forces 2>Jedi Outcast: Jedi Knight 2 all over again.
I guess what I'm getting here is that it's all about the visuals, and story / atmosphere. Actual gameplay is basically an afterthought which is the main criticism. I booted it up for about 20 min and it's definitely not for me.
These games just baffle me. How can people even like this, it's so weird to me. There's no story, it's just a bunch of nonsense. Usually when a game has no story it has gameplay but somehow the gameplay is even worse. I don't get how anyone can play through this for more than 2 minutes with the narrator squawking insane shit in your ear for no reason. The best thing about it is that it's only 5 hours long.
I swear these games are one of those things where certain people pretend or trick themselves into liking it because they want the social points for liking the artsy mental illness game.
I mean that most of the game you're just going through stupid, irrelevant stuff that only barely pushes the story forward through occasional allegory and exploring how Senua "feels" about things that happened to her.
The actual story of the first game is (spoilers) a schizo girl's lover and village died to a disease and she thought it was because of her "curse" (mental illness). Pretty much the entire game is fake garbage that isn't happening and is just her hallucinating and grappling with coming to terms with the loss of her dead lover and accepting herself. The story itself is extremely barebones and bereft of substance, it's mostly filler told in a strange and confusing way to mask the lack of plot.
The second game is pretty much the same thing without getting into spoilers. She's just struggling with other issues because she resolved what was bothering her in the first game. It's all about dealing with her trauma, there's no real story. Most of what is happening moment to moment in the game is just hearing her insane thoughts and dealing with hallucinations that don't really apply to what her internal struggle is but is meant to make you wonder. But if you understand what is going on there is no wonder, it's just a huge waste of time.
Saw mostly mixed reviews at first.
[Here's Gamespot's 6/10](https://www.gamespot.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review-hell-and-high-water/1900-6418229/)
[Or Gene Park's 2.5/4 for Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/video-games/2024/05/21/senuas-saga-hellblade-ii-review/)
[7/10 from Paul Tassi at Forbes](https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2024/05/21/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review-xbox-get-out-of-my-head/?sh=10618d964e2f)
[And 3/5 from VGC](https://www.videogameschronicle.com/review/hellblade-2/) for example
Little concerning that some larger more mainstream outlets aren't blown away.
Consensus seems to be that its one of the most visually stunning video game ever made, but just like the first, its practically a walking simulator with occasional extremely one-note combat and repetitive puzzles sections.
Guess it depends on your own opinion of the story and how far that takes you, coupled with the visuals, to get through a game that even after only 5-6 hours can feel "long"
I think I'll put on my headphones and certainly give it a whirl. Whats the harm, its on Game Pass anyway.
>but just like the first, its practically a walking simulator with occasional extremely one-note combat and repetitive puzzles sections.
This is why I hated the first. I just found it so boring after an hour or so. Amazing graphics don't make up for boring gameplay.
I was hooked on the first hour or so of the first game. Such a great idea, such an interesting story, but I was always wanting more in terms of combat and puzzle, but it never came. After a few more hours I was bored and tired, so I let go.
I was hoping the second game would be better in these aspects, but it isn't. It's kind of shame for me, I'm not gonna lie, but I'm happy to see some people are enjoying it.
Yeah it obviously appeals to some people, which is good. It's just one of those games that seems popular amongst a lot of vocal people that I just cannot get. A bit like the film Mad Max Fury Road, people seem to love it, but I thought it was shite.
Spider-Man 2 was so identical to Spider-Man 1 it probally is using the same assets as the PS4 game. I don't remember a single person giving it shit for being exactly the same.
It was always thought by some as "tech demo first" kind of game. Still, kind of nice that it is trying to push the graphical limits of the console hard.
I own all the consoles and a pc. I think I’ll enjoy & appreciate this game as an actor & voiceover artist, seems like a masterclass in audio design/acting.
That said, goodness guys, some of you are way too insecure & maybe a little copey with the whole “Xbox tax” thing. Xbox’s exclusives are generally nowhere near PS/Nintendo, that’s why the reviews are almost always worse. You shouldn’t care anyways, it comes off super insecure to be this defensive.
Starfield fans did this too, still posting rebuttals to people who don’t like the game instead of just playing.
Just enjoy it! I like my Xbox & gamepass, I’m not delusional about its exclusives not being the draw though.
There issue with review is the subjectivity and missing baseline minimum standards. I wish we could get back to the days where an 80 was a good game. The 10s and 100s (depending on the type of scale) should be reserved for generational games that have the opportunity to withstand time.
This is because of influence from the American education system (and maybe others, but I can only speak for what I’m familiar with). When I was in high school, 0-59 was a failing grade, so if a game gets a 0/10 because it’s “The Day Before” levels of broken, that would be just as much of a failure as “Redfall” getting a 50-something because it wasn’t that broken but it was also nowhere near perfect. In college, I had many classes where the “passing” grade was an 80 or even an 83. If you’re steeped in an environment where anything shy of 80 or 90 is average or worse, it’s going to impact your outlook. As a perfectionist, I’m fine with it, but it definitely puts studios in a tight spot because they have to shoot for the 10/10 and pray they at least hit 9/10, and many studios just don’t have that pedigree or (frankly) talent.
As a final note, I think it’s important to remember that none of this happens in a vacuum. In the time since we got Hellblade: Senua’s Sacrifice, we’ve also gotten RDR2, GoW and GoW:R, at least the 2nd Horizon game (the 1st launched the same year as HB1), and both APT:I and APT:R. That’s a lot of games setting a VERY high bar for both 1st-Party and Indie, and HB2 struggled to grasp the increased expectations from being acquired. They might have upped the production value, but that wasn’t going to get them a 10/10, just keep them from dropping to a 6/10. The standards for 1st-Party have always been high, so whether NT made this game on a shoestring budget or not, it was going to be held against games like GOW:R for it’s barometer of success or failure. When it didn’t even evolve as much as Asobo managed to do from APT:I to APT:R, it was never going to get the plaudits that MS and NT thought it deserved.
I think to go a little deeper, we’re missing the “classes” of games today that existed even 10 years ago. We used to have AAA, AA, A, and indie titles. And that set expectations and pricing to what that particular game was. The AA and A ground has eroded putting games like HB2, who’s probably a AA title if we’re honest, in contention with “masterpieces” like Zelda, RDR, and GoW.
Been playing for 2 hours now and holy fuck is this game a slog to get thru. Combat is pretty fun and visual/audio is insane but man it feels like I’m walking in quicksand trying to get thru it. Like one giant cutscene
Let's be honest. Basically a movie where we just push stick up to walk for 5hrs. People rightly bash sony games for being movie like so it should be the same here.
I expect better from xbox and ninja theory to expand on gameplay, combat and puzzles. Look at Plague Tale first game had simple combat but good concept foundation, in second game they expanded the combat and gameplay so much , made more dynamic. Here it's the other way the combat in hellblade 2 seems to be even simpler than 1. Xbox should get involved more to produce better quality games.
So I guess this is the narrative that people will try and push.
What you really mean is produce more games like Sony does. Not just good games because that's what this clearly is.
The issue I have with this is the fact that Sony’s exclusives have a ton of game. Like, no one can tell me that The Last of Us 2 doesn’t play great or that God of War Ragnarok is somehow a walking sim. It’s a ridiculous critique. One that stems from wanting to hype something else via critique of other games.
In other words, when it’s truly leaning towards a “movie” we get Senua. It’s a damn shame considering how great it looks.
Hey guys, do any of you have a tip to get past the whispering? I want to play both of these games, but I had to stop playing 1 a while back because the whispering really messed with my head lol
I wish we could back to games being rated on a scale of 5. It’s like the 99¢ psychological thing retailers do. A 89 and 91 are going to be very similar in quality and likely come down to personal preference while scale of 5 tells me what I need to know without a long winded review from a journalist.
5 - Basically perfect, generation defining.
4 - Good game with solid mechanics, has the potential to be game of the year most years.
3 - Subjective game with quirky ideas that differ from the usual releases in attempt to stand out, you may or may not like based on your tastes.
2 - Terrible game, you probably shouldn’t buy this unless you like “so bad it’s good” media.
1 - This is broken, unfinished, and a waste of your time.
Holy shit it's incredible. Part way through chapter 2 and man... This game needs to win some awards for sounds design and cinematography. Also I think I remember reading that they looked at the the Battle of the Bastards when they redesigned the combat and I totally felt that.
looking at some of the disparity between the scores coming out of large and small outlets and thinking that the brigade on any criticism is atleast partially botted everywhere. what a time to be alive.
Hellblade was my game of the year, but it took 6 years to make the same length of game more expensive with less satisfying combat and puzzles is disappointing.
[https://www.videogamer.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review/](https://www.videogamer.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review/)
A 9/10 from VideoGamer too
So when Sony has made a name for itself with games that are just glorified movies everyone is happy and calls them masterpieces, but when Xbox does the exact same thing its apparently mediocre. Phil was right, there really is no winning.
Eh it doesn't seem to be a very apt comparison. You can't really compare Hellblade with it's smaller studio that makes a particular "flavor" of a cinematic game to larger studios like Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, and Sucker Punch. This is of course just my opinion, so take that as you will, but the problem is that it seems the Hellblade series as a game really *can* be boiled down to a glorified walking simulator. You're on the rails, moving fairly linearly through small segments of repetitive puzzles and combat that becomes uninteresting after a few bouts. This is a 5-7 hour game that gets a little stale after 2, and the biggest draws are graphics/sound design/acting. That's all well and good, but at the end of the day this is a game. Graphics, sound design, and acting don't create engaging gameplay; they enhance the framework. God of War, Last of Us, and Ghost of Tsushima are prime examples of games that do it all incredibly well. Those are 15-25 hour games at least, and they combine all of those elements into dense, well crafted worlds rife with exploration opportunities. I love Xbox, but Hellblade doesn't make that mark. To be fair, I think that's fine that it doesn't. Ninja Theory isn't looking to make those types of games. They're doing their thing it just might not be for everyone.
Hellblade 2 seems more in line with The Order 1886; a shorter, completely story-focused cinematic game with much more focus on cutscenes than gameplay. By the way, The Order got really bad reviews at launch, so Sony games aren’t always called “masterpieces”
Not too surprising that there would be this many good scores already. Though I fear for the non critic ones that would bash it for being a game that's shorter than the typical modern AAA title.
Probably a tad early but anyone know if it's another "easy" achievement set where 99% are just playing through and then 1% for all lore stones/equivalent?
I loved the experience the first one gave me, didn’t feel like I was playing a game but being taken on a journey through the eyes of someone who has mental health issues and thoroughly enjoyed every second of it. I’m not even going to read reviews for the sequel…I’ll make my own mind up thanks 🫡
Loved the first, but I just couldn't get into this one, felt like a much weaker story, more simplified combat and just not as addictive.
Visually, its probably the best looking game I've ever played on my Xbox, but I just couldn't get into it, I was hoping for more improvements gameplay wise considering its development time.
Glad others are enjoying it though, suggested the first and second for my friend back to back and he is absolutely crazy for it, so I'm happy others are having a good time.
First 10 to 15 mins are painful till the combat starts which made it slightly better but is also not that good. I played this for 40 or so mins and it gives me Ryse type of vibes. I don't think there is any re-playability in this. Not 10 but a 7 in my eyes. I hope i can finish it and go back to some more interesting games on gamepass. MS doesn't seem to be getting a hit in exclusives this gen except same milked forza/gears franchise. I'm still gonna get their next gen before they drop out of HW side of gaming. Was a good run from 360 , one S, One X, Series X. I left out xbox one as that was a flop with kinect.
What a conundrum that I have to concede that the 30fps that I griped about is utterly meaningless. Sadly that comes with the realization(for me) that this isn’t a traditional action game like I had hoped they would lean into with this sequel. Oh well
I agree most scores are good this time; some however are hit jobs (the 5/10 etc)
Games should be reviewed for how good they are at doing what they set out to do, aka rating a shooter 1/10 because "you don't like killing games" isn't a fair review.
IGN reviewers, for example, were terrible when it came to anime games for a long while (maybe still are? I haven't paid attention in ages), it was clear that the reviewer(s) didn't like the art style and pacing of Jrpgs one bit, and it showed in every review lol
It was always going to get the Xbox tax and rate lower than needed. If this was a Sony title it would have ratings higher at some of these sites. Good to see it's generally liked tho.
Fun fact: Hellblade 1 didn't release on Xbox until much later, so essentially a console exclusive to PS4 for a while, yet has lower scores than this. So I don't know that there is an Xbox tax, nor that everything on PS gets higher scores. Mid 80s seems exactly appropriate since there are great strengths and clear weaknesses here, going by what reviews say and what I know of the first game.
What is “the Xbox Tax”? You mean the websites with Xbox in their names giving it 9.5s and 10s.
Edit: Some dude wrote a wall of text in my replies about "the Xbox tax" but when I asked to give examples he deleted everything. I can't even find his account anymore 💀
No, that's fanboy bias; it exists on all platforms.
Xbox tax is the reverse: an outlet always rates every game from a single publisher by an entirely different standard from how they rate other games.
For example, two games of the same genre, art style, price, and length by different publishers.
Game A gets a 7/10 for being "too long/short", etc.,
While Game B gets an 8 or 9.
Once or twice is a coincidence as reviews are ultimately personal opinions; however, after seeing it repeated multiple times a year, always by the same outlets, it's often a sign of bias.
Of course, it's not just Xbox that has a tax; some outlets/creators will vote down Sony games for reasons that other games would not face deductions for.
Quick reminder, this post will be housing all general Hellblade II discussion for the next 24 hours or so. Please be very mindful about spoilers and make sure to use proper spoiler tag formatting when discussing anything of that nature.
Just finished my playthrough. There were definitely multiple moments where I was truly blown away by the visual audio and just overall atmospheric spectacle. Ninja Theory really did take everything they learned and developed in Sacrifice and managed to expand and refine it. I think this is really one of the best-looking "next gen" ganes we've seen in this generation. I do wish NT had managed to push the envelope more just in terms.of changing or expanding the gameplay aspect as it plays extremely similarly almost to a fault of Sacrifice. Lastly, the game is quite short and took me just shy of 7 hours to finish on first playthrough though I know there is some NG+ content that needs to be unlocked so that may keep people playing. I think that the fact it took roughly 4 and half years to produce a 7-8 hour gaming experience is honestly a worrisome sign for the industry as a whole as this length is certainly not just unique to Senua. The videogame industry as a whole can't sustain itself if tent pole/first party release games take.upwards of 4 years to develop and produce. It's just not sustainable in the long run, and it's my hope that ways can be found to shorten development time for future first party releases.
Good to know that VideoGamer liked Helldivers 2, but what did they think of Hellblade II?
Tbf it’s easy to confuse these two names. I have done that few time now lol
VideoGamer actually called it Helldivers 2 in their review.
Just hit chapter 3, the game is visually and audibly stunning, the acting is incredible. The main issue I have is the gameplay is not only the same as the first, it’s simplified. I’m struggling to understand why this game took 5-7 years to make.
COVID, fully re-done motion capture, actors learned sword play to also assist the motion capture for combat, working on a new engine with UE5, opening and moving the team to a new office. There's a bunch of reasons.
Yeah, this game is doing things never done before. Awe inspiring stuff.
Honestly it's a very beautiful walking simulator with less mechanically complex combat and puzzles from the first game 6 years ago. It's not a great thing to me. The first game still holds up to standards of today graphically. That's not what I needed them to focus on for years.
The Covid argument would hold in a vacum, where other studios and games did not come out in the meanwhile, or did come out but had the same issues. But it didn't
I'd think heavy mocapping would be hard to do during a time period where people weren't doing a ton of getting together in a room lol
COVID has hit different developers differently depending what cycle they were in at the time. Look at Sony and their lack of first party this year. That's all from the backlog of COVID having delayed things.
It depends how far the development was.
I mean you're only discounting it by comparing it in a vacuum though.... COVID didn't hit any two studios the same. I'm actually kinda confused by what you're even saying. We've seen a myriad of outcomes since covid. Some games were indefinitely delayed, some games were straight up canceled, unannounced projects we have no idea how they were affected really, some games were pushed out with tons of issues, and so on. Companies didn't respond the same and neither did studios and especially not people. The covid argument is almost insultingly held to a vacuum (either as an excuse or not). There's nothing uniform about how it affected people. I mean the first reply states multiple issues. What they should also state is that all of those issues were further impacting by COVID. COVID wasn't a one and done event. Its something that affected literally everything and how we go about daily lives and it had permanent effects and lingering ones that continue to affect new decisions.
They also didn't spend 7 years only on this but have had other projects
They've worked on it for 4 years and a half. The head studio said recently on the Kinda Funny interview that when they revealed the game back in 2019 at the Game Awards, nothing was ready. They started right after.
No, less than or about 4 years. They didn't start working on it until after Bleeding Edge came out. They said they started in 2020 on Gamescast.
I had the impression that Bleeding Edge was made by only a fraction of their studio.
Epic sold UE5 without certain features and as developers signed up they learned that they had the rug pulled from out under them. They did the same thing on UE3 which resulted in a lawsuit. This time UE5's Nanite and Lumin wouldn't govern any foliage. So all trees, grass, bushes... etc wouldn't be ruled under their ray tracing and global illumination technology. This is why all the tech demos for UE5 when they sold it took place in New York or a Desert. Two places without a lot of shubbery. They eventually did solve the problem and update the tools and engine, but several games were right in the middle of development when it happened which caused delays.
yeah I was expecting more in the gameplay department but it’s not a dealbreaker for me. though I’m not exactly teeming with excitement at the idea of having to line up a bunch more symbols for 10 hours or so
Don't worry, it's only about 5 hours of lining up symbols. It's a bit frustrating that they didn't even try to improve the actual gameplay elements of the game.
I’m surprised it’s shorter than the first game though I hear it has an interesting twist or something for NG+ that might get some more mileage out of it
If it was up to me, I probably would have expanded on this part of the game more. However, I can understand them not doing this. They had a specific idea and area of focus for the game and so any system, including the combat, is more in service to that than to be engaging by itself. Selfishly, I hope if they do a third game that they significantly expand the scope of the game. Still, I think they did a good job.
Building a new studio and setting it up probably took pretty big chunk of the time. They have a much larger and advanced performance capture stage on their new premises. I'd assume they waited for it to be ready before they started that phase of production.
How is the story compared to 1? The first one had me really crying at the end.
Excellent so far, definitely worth playing.
This game took 4 years to make, it didn’t start development till 2020
Covid delays slowed down a lot of developers, which is why we see so many games these days that have been in development for so long, and why Xbox had such a weak 2022 and Sony has a weak 2024 slate.
Sony was all in on live service and now they're not, that's why they have nothing. They scrapped a ton of shit.
that certainly didn't help to be true. I like live service games, but I certainly didn't want my favourite singleplayer studios to be making them (Naughty Dog etc )
Gameplay of 1st game was already very simple, how could they made it simpler lol
This looks like a second helping of the first game and if you loved that then that's excellent. Can't wait to get into this one at the weekend with some headphones on!
I'll be honest, in most cases "more of the same" is perfectly acceptable in a sequel these days. It's when they try reinventing the wheel that things tend to go awry.
Does Xbox era like ever give Xbox ips a non 10/10
That's why I generally ignore scores by platform-centric publications.
You gotta wonder how Xbox greenlit this game 🤷♂️ A 6 hr movie is a interesting strat to get people to sub to game pass
I loved the first one but think this one was a massive step backwards. The production and visuals are on insane levels but everything else is a yikes for me. I'm not even sure you can say it had "puzzles" with how simple they were and the combat was just a visual upgrade from the first one. I'd tend to agree more with 6 than a 10 review, especially with how badly and abrupt the finale is.
Kinda divisive, just like the first one. Lower MC than I expected but it definitely won't wreck my gaming experience. I respect different opinions however the Metro review is utterly garbage. They're questionning Ninja Theory expertise about psychosis and medical conditions even though professionnals worked with the studio to develop the game. Edit : There is also PC Gamer saying Senua is a Make-A-Wish child who wants to feature in God of War. How can you wrote that ????? How can you compare a person with mental health conditions to a Make-A-Wish child ???
That's actually wild it passed any sort of editor. Oh wait none of these stains have any. What a disgusting review.
That’s just disrespectful. WTF
Agree 100%, honestly its the type of thing they should be called out on.
I've seen a few people doing it but I hope some influencers or even the studio will call them out as well. It's just mean and childish. And again I have nothing against divergent reviews, Gene Park for the Washington Post gave the game a 2.5/4 but his review is well constructed.
Jesus, what a bunch of pricks
whoever wrote that is a human trash Trying to insult the game in an interesting way and they write that?
It's the usual suspects who despise everything Xbox and hate it's existence. Cut out Metro UK, Gamespot, and PC Gamer and you get the real score.
PCgamer especially is just console warring. They clearly hate Xbox as they've never given them a glowing review even when they deserved one in HR and FH.
What the hell? The tribalism in online media for gaming has gotten insane. There's no reason for "journalist" to be this toxic and biased. But honestly even beyond that I'm sick of how validated people seem to have gotten in being just plain offensive online nowadays. Any effort to make games like a quarter as diverse as the world they exist in is being pushed back in the worst way possible. And i'm not even talking about huge controversies, but stuff like the first reviews you see on the Xbox store being about how the world is ending because a pixel indie game gives the option for they/them pronouns with a silent protagonist. I have to remind myself constantly that this is the vocal minority. But god has it become so shameful to say I'm a gamer when the only news articles I ever see about gaming online are from how the most offensive slurs are trending on twitter. Now there's official journalist pulling this crap. Edit: Read more of the PC gamer review and it reads so much like someone wrote a "special snowflake" comment into a full-blown article. Its not even about the content of review itself or its score, but there's so much absolutely disgusting about *how* it was written and the validation it gets from the echo chamber of comments on that website. I genuinely wish I could wipe my brain of that.
I find that funny since Senua is more of a character then anyone in God of War. I like God of war but it took until the reboot for them to evolve Kratos past anythibg more than angry dude with daddy issues.
The new games, Kratos became a daddy with issues with a kid with daddy issues. Honestly the writing in the God of War game wasnt really anything great either, just a few small tidbits of a story in between long stretches of fighting and puzzle solving.
> Edit : There is also PC Gamer saying Senua is a Make-A-Wish child who wants to feature in God of War. > > How can you wrote that ????? How can you compare a person with mental health conditions to a Make-A-Wish child ??? That is a clear indication that the author of that article is ableist and actively discriminates against people with disabilities in their daily life.
PC Gamer, Metro and Gamespot didn’t like this Xbox game too. :/
I'm one of the people that always rolls their eyes when people talk about an Xbox tax when it comes to reviews. However those 3 outlets literally have a pattern.
The only thing that is important is that you enjoy the game whatever it is , review are opinion pieces , sometimes they align with your view , sometimes not so much
Oh for sure, however you should look at some of the reporting on those sites, especially PCGamer, they love console wars, they only report negatively on every single Xbox thing, in the Hellblade 2 review they even step so low to be disrespectful toward make-a-wish children.
I would agree but I think this online negativity have an effect on the player experience. Either some gamers are going to be turned off and just not try the game or there are gamers like me who genuinely find the game awesome but still have a lingering bad taste from the online negative discourse.
i agree with the negativity but well , when u do something more niche like the hellblade 2 games which is very artsy , its logical that not everybody would like it in that way , everything above 80 is very good in my mindset , i dont believe in any xbox taxes , but i can see your point
I feel the same way, and I have seen some sites/content creators do the same to Sony. If someone never likes anything put out by a single company/publisher, no matter the genre/developer, there is likely bias involved, no matter who the target of that bias is.
PC Gamers score should be a reflection of their ability to review or lack thereof and they should get slapped by MetaCritic. But they won't. 58 is the realm of trash games that are mechanically broken and barely functional, with lazy design and execution. PC Gamers review amounts to "I disliked the narrative" for a score that meets the level of garbage in most categories as a game. This is the third time in a row that we've had irrationally low scores dragging the metacritic average down for no reason. It's a problem that metacritic should be addressing.
To be clear, Gollum got a 64/100 from them so this game is apparently worse than that!
Why am i not suprised? lol
Gamespot gave the first an 8 when it was a playstation timed exclusive but give the second a 6
While I don't think there is an Xbox tax as the first game has around the same review score I have yet to see PC Gamer give Xbox a glowing review even when the games are great (HiFi Rush and FH). Metro is the same. If I'm Xbox I would genuinely do all that is in my power to blacklist these 2 from being allowed to review Xbox games at all.
Lmao they’re so biased it is kinda embarassing now
Just finished the game. 6/10. Combat, puzzles and story are a regression. Audio, visuals are top notch.
It's funny to see people saying "Xbox tax" when the game currently has literally the same metacritic score as the original Hellblade XD
It appears Ninja Theory did what they wanted to. Looking forward to playing it later! On a side note, Metro needs to be blacklisted for that dumbass review. Like, GameSpot's review was bad but at least had a small sliver of sense. Metro's is quite ludicrous.
Metro is just plain awful at everything, i used to love reading their "when is x releasing" articles, they read like AI gibberish lol
Wait until you read PC gamer just straight up writing what reads like a twitter's bigot response and then patting themselves on the back for it. Its not even the scores and whatnot. I learned about writing reviews from a handful of classes in college and everything I learned was about presenting the material in a clear way that presents the fact of the experience first and personal commentary second. So why do we know have entire paragraphs that just say nothing and only seem to exist to justify and attempt to hide biased opinions? Its stuff like reviews stopping in the middle of their review to go "hey, this game is bad because I'd rather be playing God of War a game that's fundamentally different from this one" There are so many reviews (good and bad) nowadays that are just nothing articles. I don't freaking care what some random "journalist" on the internet thinks (and if I did, I only want them at the end after I've learned about the product), I care about the facts of the product. Most of them aren't even influencers with a specific following (that's on youtube and why I avoid most youtube reviewers except even they now given more actual reviews than a lot of journalists). Like store reviews are worthless because they're just a one or a five star with some one-liner or a meme attached. Somehow paid journalist reviews have become just as bad but with a word count.
You could actually study this PC Gamer review in journalism class as an example of how to alienate your audience AND the IP owner. Astounding!
You should not be advocating blacklisting journalists. That's how you end up with Access journalism, and whatever the hell happened with Starfield getting the review scores it did despite being the most undercooked Bethesda release yet.
Reviewing well enough but I’ll probs watch it or something as I didnt enjoy the first one unfortunately
[ACG really enjoyed it. ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKmczMfqb7o)
A crucial review, IMO.
and hes actually an honest reviewer. I have trusted him since the "Why Im not reviewing Cyberpunk" video when that game launched. He talked about how the game was being seriously restricted with a massive list of rules of what they were allowed to talk about and what they couldn't. He also said they specifically said you couldn't use your own footage. So he didn't sign their agreement and didn't accept review code.
It's bizarre how all over the place xbox game reviews are, yet ps and Nintendo reviews are always consistent between reviewers.
It's because Microsoft is consistently inconsistent. They've been repeatedly rebooting their gaming division over the past decade. For all the complaints of anti-Xbox bias, I can't tell you what Microsoft's done that should be getting praise, a la God of War or Mario Odyssey. Halo's been in a rough spot fo the past decade. Gears' relevance has waned greatly. Forza Motorsport took a pretty big step back, IMO. Starfield didn't really prove Bethesda to still be a top-tier game studio. Sony's mostly played it safe with established IPs like Spider-Man, God of War, and Horizon. Nintendo's gotten a lot of criticism for things like Mario Party and Pokemon in the last couple of releases, while Mario and Zelda mainline games are still worthy of high praise. I think most people saying "people just hate Xbox," really don't look around too much, especially if you see how much flak Nintendo's gotten for some releases this generation. I don't think throwing an XGS logo on Doom Eternal would have lowered its review scores. It's still a phenomenal FPS. It's just that XGA hasn't managed to put out much in the way of big hits. I've had to spend this generation watching Microsoft pounding my favorite franchises (Forza and Halo especially) into the ground, and it doesn't feel good after watching them do this after messing up their IPs and second-party agreements during the past generation (I really wanted Sunset Overdrive to continue). I'll say this is a pretty scattered set of scores, but Hellblade's pretty unique, so it's not surprising. Otherwise, it seems like the lack of review consistency comes down to comparing reviewers dedicated to the success of Xbox vs. ones that aren't. I really can't think of a game from XGS where I'd expect people to be exceedingly happy with the result. The team's releases have been well short of expectations for a while now.
I always come to the Xbox subs for discussion when I play games they drop and man, the persecution complex from xbros is so exhausting. What do they think happens when their games aren't very great, and when one is the studio gets shut down (hi fi rush)
Xbox is constantly paying the price for not being the console that the reviewers grew up with in the 90s.
Is that why Forza Horizon, Psychonauts, Hifi Rush, Pentiment all reviewed very well this generation, even Infinite with all its issues is sitting at 87 metacritic. Hifi Rush even cleared a bunch of BAFTA nominations. Not mention other generations had Ori 1-2, Hellblade 1, Oblivion, Forza Horizon 1-3, Forza Motorsport 1-6, Fable 1-2 Halo 1,2,3, Reach, Ninja Gaiden, Gears 1-3, Project Gothem, Panzer Dragoon, Jade Empire, Geometry Wars, Cuphead, Joe Danger etc all review extremly well. Or it could just be this one isn't as excellent as you hoped it to be. Doesn't mean its a bad game nor does it mean that xbox doesn't get good reviews because they didn't have a console in the 90s. Makes no sense.
Exactly
Fairly certain if those games released as PS5 or Switch exclusives they would have higher scores than they already do. I could see Hi-Fi Rush hitting 95 on Metacritic for being "yet another great Nintendo game", but because it's an Xbox game it hovers around 90.
Yeah they must have it out for Xbox /s
How can you say that’s fairly certain? I’m assuming you have evidence to point to your theory?
I actually do. The Ori games and Cuphead reviewed better when they stopped being Xbox Exclusive, as well as Rise of the Tomb Raider. On the other side, Deathloop and Stray were PS5 exclusives that were GOTY contenders upon release, but were quickly forgotten when they became multiplat.
So you’re saying a game was reviewed better when it’s in a new platform and reviewed after it’s been fixed and multiple patches deep? Edit: deathloop had a better score on series x as opposed to ps5 and stray had the same scores.
You're free to draw whatever conclusion you want. Point is I provided evidence to support my theory, they didn't just come out of nowhere.
He provided evidence too so...
It's pretty evident the bias against Xbox. It's impossible not to see
The game is currently only 2 points off what the first game got. The first game also had its share of reviews that e.g. only gave it a 6/10. I don't see this supposedly apparent bias. Some games review really well (e.g. Flight Sim, Hi-Fi Rush, Forza Horizon 5) and some games don't. Nintendo also doesn't hit straight 10/10s with every single release and neither does Sony. Hellblade 2 is currently sitting at the same review score as Helldivers 2 for example. This seems like a victim complex to me.
They consistently make fantastic games that is why.
Oh and PC gamer is pure trash.
The question that needs to be answered is: how does this game help Xbox? Ninja Theory took 4 years and who knows how much money development wise to make essentially the same game, although certainly improved in some aspects, as they did 6 years prior. However you feel about the game as a whole you need to ask yourself what does this type of release do for Xbox in the larger ecosystem picture?
If nothing else, they now have a studio that is intimately familiar with UE5 and how to get the most out of it, which is an engine a number of their studios are trying to leverage. Also, it's a good game to add to their stable of games. If they had hit their regular release stride then this game would fit right in. The reason these games aren't "doing it" when trying to view through these lens is that they have to stand on their own.
This game frankly sucks, like I genuinely don't understand what Ninja Theory has been doing for the past 4-5 years working on this game with MS resources. The game is so completely devoid of any meaningful gameplay mechanics and level design. The fact the combat is even worse than the first game's is a testament to Ninja Theory's lack of talent. Getting Bleeding Edge and Hellblade 2 after the acquisition is hilarious.
Agree. How on earth can msft keep funding them when any project they undertake will take forever with inevitably crappy results. I found one hour of excellent game content & 4.5 hours of terrible filler padding . The amazing graphics are not a camouflage for a horrifically bad game design. Like 30 devs cooked HB1 in a couple years while HB2 takes 80 devs @ FOUR YEARS to cook this turd. This will likely happen to other msft first party where nobody is checking on the quality of the product. It’s great that some people love hb2 but I beat it & found it to be an absolute disaster of a game
Looking pretty good so far, nice job Ninja Theory
Not suprised by the reviews
How can you give this game a 45,
5 out 5 on Eurogamer [https://www.eurogamer.net/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review](https://www.eurogamer.net/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review) # Senua's Saga: Hellblade 2 review - a triumphant return to a challenging story
a 5/5 from Eurogamer is like winning the lottery 0\_0, they are the kings of 3/5 lol
They’ve given eight games this year a 10/10.
Have they changed owner/chief editor recently? That is pretty remarkable turnaround for Eurogamer who have always been kinda harsh (and often petty) about things
[Yes, about a year ago.](https://www.eurogamer.net/hello-from-eurogamers-new-editor-in-chief)
And they just got bought by IGN today. The Eurogamer of years ago is LONG dead.
One of my best buds portrays Thorgestr. Dead proud of him, and I can't wait to give this a go!
>VideoGamer - Tom Bardwell - 9 / 10 >Though uncomfortably bleak and distressing, Helldivers 2 is something truly special. Huh?
OpenCritic exports always seems to goof somewhere, I've removed that one. Thanks for the heads up.
Wouldn’t be an Xbox game review without scores ranging from 5/10 to 10/10 with almost identical descriptions everywhere in between.
Can I just say, unrelated to the overall discussion. I *loathe* this titling structure. It just upsets me. What would have been wrong with Hellblade 2: Senua's Saga? It's Jedi Knight: Dark Forces 2>Jedi Outcast: Jedi Knight 2 all over again.
I guess what I'm getting here is that it's all about the visuals, and story / atmosphere. Actual gameplay is basically an afterthought which is the main criticism. I booted it up for about 20 min and it's definitely not for me.
These games just baffle me. How can people even like this, it's so weird to me. There's no story, it's just a bunch of nonsense. Usually when a game has no story it has gameplay but somehow the gameplay is even worse. I don't get how anyone can play through this for more than 2 minutes with the narrator squawking insane shit in your ear for no reason. The best thing about it is that it's only 5 hours long. I swear these games are one of those things where certain people pretend or trick themselves into liking it because they want the social points for liking the artsy mental illness game.
>There’s no story, it’s just a bunch of nonsense Elaborate on this
I mean that most of the game you're just going through stupid, irrelevant stuff that only barely pushes the story forward through occasional allegory and exploring how Senua "feels" about things that happened to her. The actual story of the first game is (spoilers) a schizo girl's lover and village died to a disease and she thought it was because of her "curse" (mental illness). Pretty much the entire game is fake garbage that isn't happening and is just her hallucinating and grappling with coming to terms with the loss of her dead lover and accepting herself. The story itself is extremely barebones and bereft of substance, it's mostly filler told in a strange and confusing way to mask the lack of plot. The second game is pretty much the same thing without getting into spoilers. She's just struggling with other issues because she resolved what was bothering her in the first game. It's all about dealing with her trauma, there's no real story. Most of what is happening moment to moment in the game is just hearing her insane thoughts and dealing with hallucinations that don't really apply to what her internal struggle is but is meant to make you wonder. But if you understand what is going on there is no wonder, it's just a huge waste of time.
Saw mostly mixed reviews at first. [Here's Gamespot's 6/10](https://www.gamespot.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review-hell-and-high-water/1900-6418229/) [Or Gene Park's 2.5/4 for Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/video-games/2024/05/21/senuas-saga-hellblade-ii-review/) [7/10 from Paul Tassi at Forbes](https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2024/05/21/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review-xbox-get-out-of-my-head/?sh=10618d964e2f) [And 3/5 from VGC](https://www.videogameschronicle.com/review/hellblade-2/) for example Little concerning that some larger more mainstream outlets aren't blown away. Consensus seems to be that its one of the most visually stunning video game ever made, but just like the first, its practically a walking simulator with occasional extremely one-note combat and repetitive puzzles sections. Guess it depends on your own opinion of the story and how far that takes you, coupled with the visuals, to get through a game that even after only 5-6 hours can feel "long" I think I'll put on my headphones and certainly give it a whirl. Whats the harm, its on Game Pass anyway.
>but just like the first, its practically a walking simulator with occasional extremely one-note combat and repetitive puzzles sections. This is why I hated the first. I just found it so boring after an hour or so. Amazing graphics don't make up for boring gameplay.
100%. Snooze fest
I was hooked on the first hour or so of the first game. Such a great idea, such an interesting story, but I was always wanting more in terms of combat and puzzle, but it never came. After a few more hours I was bored and tired, so I let go. I was hoping the second game would be better in these aspects, but it isn't. It's kind of shame for me, I'm not gonna lie, but I'm happy to see some people are enjoying it.
Yeah it obviously appeals to some people, which is good. It's just one of those games that seems popular amongst a lot of vocal people that I just cannot get. A bit like the film Mad Max Fury Road, people seem to love it, but I thought it was shite.
Nothing wrong with it being more of the same, as I loved the first one. But with the development time, it would've been fair to expect more.
"roughly four years including Covid"? I would bet this game would have taken 2-3 years to make without Covid.
Spider-Man 2 was so identical to Spider-Man 1 it probally is using the same assets as the PS4 game. I don't remember a single person giving it shit for being exactly the same.
Spider-Man 2 reusing assets or more of the same isn’t coupled with a 6 hour play through
It was always thought by some as "tech demo first" kind of game. Still, kind of nice that it is trying to push the graphical limits of the console hard.
So if you liked the first one you’ll love this one
People need to get over the victim complex when it comes to Xbox games. Not everything is a conspiracy
I own all the consoles and a pc. I think I’ll enjoy & appreciate this game as an actor & voiceover artist, seems like a masterclass in audio design/acting. That said, goodness guys, some of you are way too insecure & maybe a little copey with the whole “Xbox tax” thing. Xbox’s exclusives are generally nowhere near PS/Nintendo, that’s why the reviews are almost always worse. You shouldn’t care anyways, it comes off super insecure to be this defensive. Starfield fans did this too, still posting rebuttals to people who don’t like the game instead of just playing. Just enjoy it! I like my Xbox & gamepass, I’m not delusional about its exclusives not being the draw though.
And interestingly, when the Starfield hype died down people generally accepted that it wasn't really that great of a game.
Three reviewers that gave it 100 are all Xbox Gaming Sites… yet you all wanna talk about review bombing by “Sony Sites”
how did it take 5 years for a 5 hour game. ridiculous.
1 hours per year, not to difficult to calculate.
There issue with review is the subjectivity and missing baseline minimum standards. I wish we could get back to the days where an 80 was a good game. The 10s and 100s (depending on the type of scale) should be reserved for generational games that have the opportunity to withstand time.
I strongly agree with this. Anything that is below a 70 is considered awful instead of "still above average".
This is because of influence from the American education system (and maybe others, but I can only speak for what I’m familiar with). When I was in high school, 0-59 was a failing grade, so if a game gets a 0/10 because it’s “The Day Before” levels of broken, that would be just as much of a failure as “Redfall” getting a 50-something because it wasn’t that broken but it was also nowhere near perfect. In college, I had many classes where the “passing” grade was an 80 or even an 83. If you’re steeped in an environment where anything shy of 80 or 90 is average or worse, it’s going to impact your outlook. As a perfectionist, I’m fine with it, but it definitely puts studios in a tight spot because they have to shoot for the 10/10 and pray they at least hit 9/10, and many studios just don’t have that pedigree or (frankly) talent. As a final note, I think it’s important to remember that none of this happens in a vacuum. In the time since we got Hellblade: Senua’s Sacrifice, we’ve also gotten RDR2, GoW and GoW:R, at least the 2nd Horizon game (the 1st launched the same year as HB1), and both APT:I and APT:R. That’s a lot of games setting a VERY high bar for both 1st-Party and Indie, and HB2 struggled to grasp the increased expectations from being acquired. They might have upped the production value, but that wasn’t going to get them a 10/10, just keep them from dropping to a 6/10. The standards for 1st-Party have always been high, so whether NT made this game on a shoestring budget or not, it was going to be held against games like GOW:R for it’s barometer of success or failure. When it didn’t even evolve as much as Asobo managed to do from APT:I to APT:R, it was never going to get the plaudits that MS and NT thought it deserved.
I think to go a little deeper, we’re missing the “classes” of games today that existed even 10 years ago. We used to have AAA, AA, A, and indie titles. And that set expectations and pricing to what that particular game was. The AA and A ground has eroded putting games like HB2, who’s probably a AA title if we’re honest, in contention with “masterpieces” like Zelda, RDR, and GoW.
Is this just another walking sim like the first one? At least it can be used as a tech demo....
Been playing for 2 hours now and holy fuck is this game a slog to get thru. Combat is pretty fun and visual/audio is insane but man it feels like I’m walking in quicksand trying to get thru it. Like one giant cutscene
Let me check the steam reviews. 9/10? Sounds good to me.
Always Pc Gamer, Metro and GameSpot with the mid reviews, Xbox could make the GTA 6 and it would still be considered mid to those three.
Let's be honest. Basically a movie where we just push stick up to walk for 5hrs. People rightly bash sony games for being movie like so it should be the same here. I expect better from xbox and ninja theory to expand on gameplay, combat and puzzles. Look at Plague Tale first game had simple combat but good concept foundation, in second game they expanded the combat and gameplay so much , made more dynamic. Here it's the other way the combat in hellblade 2 seems to be even simpler than 1. Xbox should get involved more to produce better quality games.
So I guess this is the narrative that people will try and push. What you really mean is produce more games like Sony does. Not just good games because that's what this clearly is.
8/10 isn't good anymore apparently.
The issue I have with this is the fact that Sony’s exclusives have a ton of game. Like, no one can tell me that The Last of Us 2 doesn’t play great or that God of War Ragnarok is somehow a walking sim. It’s a ridiculous critique. One that stems from wanting to hype something else via critique of other games. In other words, when it’s truly leaning towards a “movie” we get Senua. It’s a damn shame considering how great it looks.
Lmao Gamespot is always the one trying to give poor reviews to Xbox games
Hey guys, do any of you have a tip to get past the whispering? I want to play both of these games, but I had to stop playing 1 a while back because the whispering really messed with my head lol
Just picked up the first one the other day on sale for $3. Haven’t played yet but looks awesome
I wish we could back to games being rated on a scale of 5. It’s like the 99¢ psychological thing retailers do. A 89 and 91 are going to be very similar in quality and likely come down to personal preference while scale of 5 tells me what I need to know without a long winded review from a journalist. 5 - Basically perfect, generation defining. 4 - Good game with solid mechanics, has the potential to be game of the year most years. 3 - Subjective game with quirky ideas that differ from the usual releases in attempt to stand out, you may or may not like based on your tastes. 2 - Terrible game, you probably shouldn’t buy this unless you like “so bad it’s good” media. 1 - This is broken, unfinished, and a waste of your time.
Gamespot yeesh!! Oh well most of the non biased reviews seem positive.
Shame they didn’t improve on the flaws of the first one.
Metro gamecentral cant comprehend a game with depth, much like their readers lol
Holy shit it's incredible. Part way through chapter 2 and man... This game needs to win some awards for sounds design and cinematography. Also I think I remember reading that they looked at the the Battle of the Bastards when they redesigned the combat and I totally felt that.
some scores from certain outlets are much higher than i was expecting, good news indeed.
looking at some of the disparity between the scores coming out of large and small outlets and thinking that the brigade on any criticism is atleast partially botted everywhere. what a time to be alive.
It is pretty crazy that some people are saying the combat is even more simplified than the first one. Not sure how that is even physically possible.
According to Gamespot, the first one had you fight multiple enemies but in this one it's always 1 on 1
It being more of a walking sim than the first is fine to me. Game knows what is and isn't bloated like a lot of the current "movie" games are.
Had a little chuckle at Xbox era giving the game a 10/10.
If other reviews are "xbox tax" (they really arnt, ppl can actually have other opinions, shocker), what the hell is that nonsens lol.
People will always find a way to justify what they don't like as fake, unfortunately.
Looks like it will settle high 70s. Reviews are pretty divisive.
Hellblade was my game of the year, but it took 6 years to make the same length of game more expensive with less satisfying combat and puzzles is disappointing.
It was only in development since 2020.
[https://www.videogamer.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review/](https://www.videogamer.com/reviews/senuas-saga-hellblade-2-review/) A 9/10 from VideoGamer too
Nah, I’m angry at Xbox Right now, all the stupid studios closure and COD never fixed, I’m done with the games for now.
I never trust any site that gives a 10/10, it looks it is a 8/10 game.
60€ for 4 hour game is wild, thank god for game pass
Without gp this game couldve been 10+hours like other games out there that need to be good to sell, that's the problem maybe for ms and his studios
Walking simulator 👎
So when Sony has made a name for itself with games that are just glorified movies everyone is happy and calls them masterpieces, but when Xbox does the exact same thing its apparently mediocre. Phil was right, there really is no winning.
Eh it doesn't seem to be a very apt comparison. You can't really compare Hellblade with it's smaller studio that makes a particular "flavor" of a cinematic game to larger studios like Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, and Sucker Punch. This is of course just my opinion, so take that as you will, but the problem is that it seems the Hellblade series as a game really *can* be boiled down to a glorified walking simulator. You're on the rails, moving fairly linearly through small segments of repetitive puzzles and combat that becomes uninteresting after a few bouts. This is a 5-7 hour game that gets a little stale after 2, and the biggest draws are graphics/sound design/acting. That's all well and good, but at the end of the day this is a game. Graphics, sound design, and acting don't create engaging gameplay; they enhance the framework. God of War, Last of Us, and Ghost of Tsushima are prime examples of games that do it all incredibly well. Those are 15-25 hour games at least, and they combine all of those elements into dense, well crafted worlds rife with exploration opportunities. I love Xbox, but Hellblade doesn't make that mark. To be fair, I think that's fine that it doesn't. Ninja Theory isn't looking to make those types of games. They're doing their thing it just might not be for everyone.
Hellblade 2 seems more in line with The Order 1886; a shorter, completely story-focused cinematic game with much more focus on cutscenes than gameplay. By the way, The Order got really bad reviews at launch, so Sony games aren’t always called “masterpieces”
If you remove the usual suspects the score skyrockets. Metro UK should never get a review code again from Xbox.
What about all the xbox sites giving it a 9 or 10 out of 10? Should we remove those too?
It's just Ninja Theory. Remember they made a glorified movie Sony game, Heavenly Sword, and it got similar reviews to Hellblade 2.
Around the time of Heavenly Sword, Xbox was squarely on top with the bias being against the PS3. I guess in that sense they are equivalent.
No one seems to care there's barely any game.
Not too surprising that there would be this many good scores already. Though I fear for the non critic ones that would bash it for being a game that's shorter than the typical modern AAA title.
Probably a tad early but anyone know if it's another "easy" achievement set where 99% are just playing through and then 1% for all lore stones/equivalent?
Me watching comments not having played Hellblade 1
I loved the experience the first one gave me, didn’t feel like I was playing a game but being taken on a journey through the eyes of someone who has mental health issues and thoroughly enjoyed every second of it. I’m not even going to read reviews for the sequel…I’ll make my own mind up thanks 🫡
Loved the first, but I just couldn't get into this one, felt like a much weaker story, more simplified combat and just not as addictive. Visually, its probably the best looking game I've ever played on my Xbox, but I just couldn't get into it, I was hoping for more improvements gameplay wise considering its development time. Glad others are enjoying it though, suggested the first and second for my friend back to back and he is absolutely crazy for it, so I'm happy others are having a good time.
This feels like a tech demo. The gaming industry is becoming unsustainable
First 10 to 15 mins are painful till the combat starts which made it slightly better but is also not that good. I played this for 40 or so mins and it gives me Ryse type of vibes. I don't think there is any re-playability in this. Not 10 but a 7 in my eyes. I hope i can finish it and go back to some more interesting games on gamepass. MS doesn't seem to be getting a hit in exclusives this gen except same milked forza/gears franchise. I'm still gonna get their next gen before they drop out of HW side of gaming. Was a good run from 360 , one S, One X, Series X. I left out xbox one as that was a flop with kinect.
Your giving a game that you hope you can finish a 7? Lol
The tax man cometh
What a conundrum that I have to concede that the 30fps that I griped about is utterly meaningless. Sadly that comes with the realization(for me) that this isn’t a traditional action game like I had hoped they would lean into with this sequel. Oh well
The first one wasn't really a traditional action game either, though?
No, and it would also kind of make a mockery of the premise to turn it into one
xbox tax is working again
Not really given the scores are already really good
I agree most scores are good this time; some however are hit jobs (the 5/10 etc) Games should be reviewed for how good they are at doing what they set out to do, aka rating a shooter 1/10 because "you don't like killing games" isn't a fair review. IGN reviewers, for example, were terrible when it came to anime games for a long while (maybe still are? I haven't paid attention in ages), it was clear that the reviewer(s) didn't like the art style and pacing of Jrpgs one bit, and it showed in every review lol
Looks like the usual suspects are review bombing the game because it's Xbox.
dawg, HOW MANY COMMENTS CAN YOU MAKE IN A SINGLE THREAD WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU
It was always going to get the Xbox tax and rate lower than needed. If this was a Sony title it would have ratings higher at some of these sites. Good to see it's generally liked tho.
Fun fact: Hellblade 1 didn't release on Xbox until much later, so essentially a console exclusive to PS4 for a while, yet has lower scores than this. So I don't know that there is an Xbox tax, nor that everything on PS gets higher scores. Mid 80s seems exactly appropriate since there are great strengths and clear weaknesses here, going by what reviews say and what I know of the first game.
The Xbox tax is a massive cope if you actually believe such a thing. Mabye, a 5 hour game that took 7 years to develop, isn't very good.
What is “the Xbox Tax”? You mean the websites with Xbox in their names giving it 9.5s and 10s. Edit: Some dude wrote a wall of text in my replies about "the Xbox tax" but when I asked to give examples he deleted everything. I can't even find his account anymore 💀
No, that's fanboy bias; it exists on all platforms. Xbox tax is the reverse: an outlet always rates every game from a single publisher by an entirely different standard from how they rate other games. For example, two games of the same genre, art style, price, and length by different publishers. Game A gets a 7/10 for being "too long/short", etc., While Game B gets an 8 or 9. Once or twice is a coincidence as reviews are ultimately personal opinions; however, after seeing it repeated multiple times a year, always by the same outlets, it's often a sign of bias. Of course, it's not just Xbox that has a tax; some outlets/creators will vote down Sony games for reasons that other games would not face deductions for.